Guild Wars 2

Hi,

I am level 50 on my thief now and my leveling partner is a mesmer. I was a condi build for most of the levels and it worked really well solo and in the group.

Since getting into the mid 40s though, he does so much damage I can barely get to the mobs before they die. We routinely fight stuff 4-5 levels above us because of this and it’s still an issue sometimes.

So I respecced for a crit build just to get more hits in and feel like I’m doing something. The thing is, from range, my mesmer friend is still making me look awful in the burst department. I’m sure sustained DPS over time on a dummy that doesn’t move or hit anyone, I would do better.

If I C&D to backstab, the mob immediately starts to sprint away. All of our snares are on crazy cooldowns or take too long to cast by the time the mob is engaged to make it useless for me to apply it… just for that, and for it to die really fast anyway.

C&D also misses constantly because of erratic mob behavior (randomly turning, walking in another direction for absolutely no reason) and I really have no idea what to do.

I am D/D and I’m at work so I can’t see my build, but can post the specifics when I get home. I focus on Power, and Precision since I rarely get hit and can dodge properly.

I guess I am asking is this just a leveling thing? What do I have to look forward to in dungeon PVE? From what I can tell it’s not friendly to melee, people seem to post that a lot as well.

Another question I have would be: are mesmers better at burst than we are and to what degree do we top them in DPS, and how?

I’m writing this because there have been times when we get adds, and inevitably I will die because I’m trying to melee and do damage… meanwhile he is at 1200 range doing pretty much more burst than I am and probably DPS. I know on my warrior, I’d be fine but bored as hell.

Confused,

Thanks

i am in the same boat mate, i have an 80 necro and that does bags of damage and at range to. win win situation. but i am trying to start out in thief and i dont want to do conditions build. so power and precision are for me aIso
I can see where you frustration is coming from but i am afraid i cant help, i just thought it would be nice to let you know you are not alone out there.

Thieves can do okay damage in PvE, nothing to write home about mind and with minimal ranged support (Ranged on trash revolves around using Cluster Bomb from Shortbow, which is higher DPS the closer you are to the targets…)

Melee in PvE, if I recall correctly, revolves around S/P since Sword does nice cleaving Auto-attack damage and with /P you have access to Pistol Whip which allows for moments of invulnerability combined with Black Powder can allow for decent survivability in melee.

As for Mesmer burst, yes they can get higher (I remember someone talking about getting 6k shatters or something) but they have larger build up (They need to get 3 illusions out) than for example CnD > Backstab (If someone else can facetank then it’s pretty easy to do)

I believe that Mesmers also have higher sustained damage than thieves (Since Thieves are designed around burst damage due to Initiative and lack of cooldowns) a Condition Thief might do more, but their damage is reduced by anyone else having bleeds (Reducing how much the thief can contribute to the max bleed stacks, my Condition Thief could regularly hit 25 stacks solo)

But at the end of it, Thieves in PvE are… Not that great (They lack survivability and decent sustained damage and provide little in terms of support) which is why a lot of thieves are making a note that they need looking at in PvE in the large feedback thread. (Also why it’s common to find groups that don’t want to invite or include thieves in their PvE groups)

I agree with Taril that S/P is a good choice for PvE, along with SB, since you’ll want to “bunch up and burn down” a lot of stuff at once.

That’s not to say d/d (what you seem to have) isn’t good as well, even in the AOE department with LDB, it’s just the swords auto attack is a small aoe so it’s free.

Other than Sword main hand, we are of course primarily single target damage.

I run my thief in PVE along with a friend who is a glass cannon ele. I feel competitive (not even in GC gear) but he certainly does more (I rez him a lot when he gets in over his head, too).

If you want to tune your d/d playstyle, I’d suggest you try to “seek” to mobs more, using things like steal, heartseeker, & infiltrators signet.

To easily land CnD in PvE (and pvp) learn to start your CnD, but then steal/infil signet before the animation finishes. Throw in Mug for extra burst.

If you want to facepwn (not backstab) then CnD/Steal/Mug/Autoattack/Heartseeker is a very popular single target kill combo. Pair this with quickness (from haste or other sources) and you will find you are suddenly much better than your friend at single target burst.

Also, usually in PvE against single targets you don’t even need to position yourself for backstab, their AI will do it for you. Like you complained about, the NPC returns to it’s spot when you stealth. Game that system by drawing agro, let him run to you, do the Steal/CnD combo, wait a sec for him to turn around, and nail him with backstab.

Also, in PvE (not recommended in PVP due to reflections + too predictable/dodgeable) go ahead and try P/P crit build. Stack quickness & fury from Crit Strikes line, put quickness on weapon, and put haste as a slot skill. It’s boring as all hell (all you do is stealth, sneak attack, unload, unload, unload…. stealth, sneak attack, unload) but you will be a beast in single target ranged damage, even if you slip in to a coma.

I have a level 65 thief that I’ve solo’d in pve all along. It will probably be my 4th lvl 80…or maybe my Guardian. Not sure as both are about that level. That said, I’ve been using sword / Pistol & dagger / dagger….gave up on my shortbow because its boring.

You just have to pick your battles, kite…pull one or two mobs at a time, if you can. Its challenging, but fun.

I have a 37 WAR, wondering if I should just go to it or Guardian. I love melee to death esp burst melee but thief is just falling so short for me right now. The funny part is my 55 mesmer buddy and I leveled until 37 together on my WAR, then i got on my THF and caught up. I never remember feeling this useless.

I realize thief has its rewards in wandering pvp in WvW (hard to encounter if im correct?) but it seems just like one big zerg to me more often than not. WARs seem to go well with the zerg.

sPVP sems like the only place we really shine and it just isn’t my thing 100%. i want versatility I guess? This was so poorly written, im sorry, but it was just my thoughts atm

If you want a breeze is PvE Leveling just grab a shortbow and Signet of Malice, pull all the mobs you can find, and spam Cluster bombs so they explode into the attacks at hit everything three times. You’ll never die and you’ll easily farm annoying hearts or kill events.

I would also like to add that if you are curious about other classes, just take them to sPvP and test them before you waste time leveling them. Like I did. >.>

Additionally, Thieves are amazing in WvW. Whether it’s a solo roaming GC d/d spec or a group oriented spec like tanky-power-bow-rezzers. They can provide huge support for a team. <3 me some Shadow Refuge Rezzing. If you’re ever curious about the various specs and variations of specs you can pst me in game and I’ll help you.

As said above…SB spam with Signet of Malice is really good for mobs. If you want to melee, S/P makes it really easy using pistol whip. Due to the way the game works…I find it terribly easy to BS my targets…since when you stealth they turn the other way and walk away. But with pistol off hand…specifically Black Powder…you can “tank” most stuff anyways…

I personally did run S/P, but I play with D/D or D/P now since all you do with S/P most of the time is pressing 3…

I only do pve, the thief can be a challenge I suppose, so fragile. My first toon was a thief, and really it taught me well as you have no margin of error really. Was rough going right at the start. Now, although it is the hardest one to play, it is my favorite really.

As was mentioned, there may be many groups who don’t want a thie., But for me it is OK, I play solo or with a friend.

Worst part is all the hysterical hatred towards thieves. I want everyone to have fun, but anything involving pvp generates this lunatic hatred….makes me wish there was no pvp. The animosity is just sad.

But, like I said, I have fun just solo in pve or with a friend. For others, pvp is thier thing.

Anyway, I find there is nothing quite like playing thief in pve. If you do not play it well, I doubt you can survive. My other toons seem very easy in comparison and some are downright dull to me.

Thief may be an aquired taste. 2 of my friends hate playing the thief, they die constantly and dropped the toons. On other toons they do fine.

I do s/d a lot, p/d…occasionaly s/p…p/p is fun for some things. SB has a lot of value. D/D I rarely do, sometimes for a change I toy with it. D/P I have not used much at all, not my taste really.