Guild Wars 2

Hi I’m just curious….I recently came back to the game after a long break and was going over some of the changes that I had missed in the recent patches and all I can say is….wow. Majorly nerfed damage…no added survival to account for it. Hard to Catch? Assassin’s Reward? wtf? Does anyone at anet even play a thief? I understand some players in wvw get frustrated fighting thieves because they don’t understand the class or how to counter so they QQ about stealth needing nerfed or more damage reductions etc. But wow Anet….ever try playing as a thief?
Anyone that seriously plays a thief realizes that stealth/dodge-evade is pretty much our sole means of survival. Limited condition removal, low hp/toughness. Lack of good utility choices (Shadowstep, SR, Blinds are basically it) forces us into a corner. We need high dps or we die or more survival/utility. How you gonna take both away? LOL
No wonder so many thieves stay cheese perma-stealthed or spam evades…..it’s all they can do.
Ele’s will say, well they have low HP and lower toughness. But come on, the utility Ele’s get are second to none. Cantrips, Auras, Chill, Knockbacks, Regen, Vigor, burst heals, condition removals, high mobility. All while doing good dps even without going full zerker.

Don’t get me started on pve……how many thieves you see running the harder pve dungeons/high level fractals??? ok, yeah, there is a reason for that.

I recently read you have some major changes coming for thieves “good” changes.
Well, I hope to god that supposed Elite skill is a troll cuz if its not you might as well make the new Assassin’s Reward trait an instant, free reroll to warrior.

kitten Anet…kitten

Ok, lol, im done QQing. Just needed to vent. Time to login and level my kitten y kitten warrior. <3 …….I cant even type kitten . without it being nerfed….

This post…put me to tears with how moving it is.

The problem is. Thiefs will not give up playing the class. Instead they come up with some gimmicky build that works well (as the last resort). And Anet nerfs it because its overused, so its got to be OP.

I know its probably not 100% true but it does feel like it.

Troublesome.5670:

Hi I’m just curious….I recently came back to the game after a long break and was going over some of the changes that I had missed in the recent patches and all I can say is….wow. Majorly nerfed damage…no added survival to account for it. Hard to Catch? Assassin’s Reward? wtf? Does anyone at anet even play a thief? I understand some players in wvw get frustrated fighting thieves because they don’t understand the class or how to counter so they QQ about stealth needing nerfed or more damage reductions etc. But wow Anet….ever try playing as a thief?
Anyone that seriously plays a thief realizes that stealth/dodge-evade is pretty much our sole means of survival. Limited condition removal, low hp/toughness. Lack of good utility choices (Shadowstep, SR, Blinds are basically it) forces us into a corner. We need high dps or we die or more survival/utility. How you gonna take both away? LOL
No wonder so many thieves stay cheese perma-stealthed or spam evades…..it’s all they can do.
Ele’s will say, well they have low HP and lower toughness. But come on, the utility Ele’s get are second to none. Cantrips, Auras, Chill, Knockbacks, Regen, Vigor, burst heals, condition removals, high mobility. All while doing good dps even without going full zerker.

Don’t get me started on pve……how many thieves you see running the harder pve dungeons/high level fractals??? ok, yeah, there is a reason for that.

I recently read you have some major changes coming for thieves “good” changes.
Well, I hope to god that supposed Elite skill is a troll cuz if its not you might as well make the new Assassin’s Reward trait an instant, free reroll to warrior.

kitten Anet…kitten

Ok, lol, im done QQing. Just needed to vent. Time to login and level my kitten y kitten warrior. <3 …….I cant even type kitten . without it being nerfed….

I wont comment about pvp side, cause it will always be countered by “Thief OP, pls nurf”. But speaking of pve… thief has 10805 default HP, warrior has 18372 HP while arguably doing better dps. While warrior brings close to perma if not perma fury and banners to support whole groups dps, thief brings … group stealth… which in pug runs usually gets completely ignored since every class has means to rush through most of skipable content on their own. Only “good” group support utility we have is smokescreen to reflect projectiles, but guardians do that better. Gw2 pve even if not intended has holy trinity and thief is not included. Its guardian(Defensive support), Elementalist(offensive support) and warrior(dps while running with 2x more hp then thief has).

I assure you, the utilities thieves have are second to none in terms of survivability, and comparing thief to Ele is not that wise atm. However, I must admit that warriors are definitely easier to play and Thieves get constant nerves every patch.

hihey.1075:

I assure you, the utilities thieves have are second to none in terms of survivability, and comparing thief to Ele is not that wise atm. However, I must admit that warriors are definitely easier to play and Thieves get constant nerves every patch.

Every dungeon speed run will take ele instead of thief in a blink of an eye. “READ FIRST: only Guardian/warrior/ele, others will be kicked” <—- looks familiar ? Yes thats how our LFG looks like.

Karolis.4261:

…
I wont comment about pvp side, cause it will always be countered by “Thief OP, pls nurf”…

Yup… And don’t know if you noticed but majority of QQ’s come from WvW’ers. The difference in (pvp) skill level between WvW’ers and sPvP’ers is very big. If you ever switched to sPvP’ing a lot and then switched back to WvW’ing, you would have noticed that in WvW there’s a metric kitten ton of people that literally can’t PvP in any sense.

Also to “Thief OP, pls nurf”… :| I can already tell you the winning argument that they will use down the road… Thief OP cuz STEALTH… if they mention stealth anywhere in their post, just let them win the argument… because trust me, you won’t (in your life time)… (look at all the QQ’ers posts, somewhere there’s some backup to their QQ that’s stealth related)

“I assure you, the utilities thieves have are second to none in terms of survivability, and comparing thief to Ele is not that wise atm. However, I must admit that warriors are definitely easier to play and Thieves get constant nerves every patch.”

I’m not sure if I’d go so far as to say thief’s utilities are second to none for survivability. Running away? Maybe. But survivability? Not so much. No stability. 1 condition removal skill and a signet that removes 1 condition on active. (not counting stealth skills). No regen or boons of any kind besides Shadow Trap (which is buggy as hell). Sure, we get swiftness in acrobatics….like I said, running away. I won’t list my all my alt’s utility skills that are far better, too many to list. Basically thieves were originally designed to attack hard fast and run away. All our skills are designed around this premise. ( Wont even comment on condition thief’s limited condition application and lackluster venom skills). What I’m saying is they have taken away the “attack hard and fast” part or at least severely hampered it, as well as making the “run away” part harder to do. So what are we left with? Prolonged engagements that thieves weren’t designed to handle. I’m not saying thieves are unplayable by any means, what I’m saying we need a serious reworking and not some troll changes or nerfs. An elite trap that knocks back? Don’t we already have a trap that knocks down that no one uses??? lol (I really hope that post was a joke). Anyways, that’s what im saying. Anet royally screwed thieves by nerfing what we were designed to be and giving us nothing to balance it out.

Troublesome.5670:

Don’t get me started on pve……how many thieves you see running the harder pve dungeons/high level fractals??? ok, yeah, there is a reason for that.

Do you even play GW2? Most experienced parties require a minimum of 1 thief. Its incredibly rare for my usual groups to not have at least 1 thief at all times during dungeon tours. And usually we have 2 just to boost group DPS through the roof.

And as for Anet playing thieves, they don’t. Awhile back there was a livestream for the fractured update. Anet had a group of 5 trying to do the story fractal. They had 1 thief. He camped p/p the entire run and didn’t use any of his utilities throughout the entire livestream. He was a prime example of Anet’s experience with their own dungeons/fractals.

Troublesome,

As it stands right now, (with the exception of certain builds, some in the meta and some not) there is a clear line between a bad thief and a good thief in spvp – this should be the standard for all classes imo. If played well, the thief is pretty much a staple class on a team. Knowing when to go in and when to go out, being very careful that people don’t have eyes on you at all times (at least against good players who pay attention), and not blowing your damage are all critical components to playing the thief atm. Not to mention knowing where you need to be and not wasting your team’s time. It’s not a faceroll class like warrior, but it’s still a very strong class to play.

Yeah, im not saying thieves aren’t a good class to play. What im saying is that in order to BE a good class the player skill level needs to be higher on average than most others simply because the lack of care in design/redesign. There is far less room for error playing thief than almost all other classes. And yes, most good statics want at least 1 thief but its almost always for SR rezzing/skipping mobs or tricks like running bombs or stealthing on door in dredge fractals. If a group wants melee dps 9/10 times they will request a warrior. But some good thieves are wanted in static groups simply because they are an above average player and would do just as well on almost any class they brought. This isn’t a QQ thread about thieves sucking. It’s a thread about Anet’s complete lack of understanding of a class they created to be one thing, then readjusting/nerfing it until they have the class cornered into a really tight spot.

Elite trap skill? How about an elite skill that gives us a mirror image clone that does 0 dmg but mimics our movements for a set amount of time like 30 seconds or something, 180 sec. CD, usable while stealthed. That might be interesting…..or iono. something different besides stuff no one uses. At the very least, no more nerfs….kitten .

Clumsy.6257:

Troublesome.5670:

Don’t get me started on pve……how many thieves you see running the harder pve dungeons/high level fractals??? ok, yeah, there is a reason for that.

Do you even play GW2? Most experienced parties require a minimum of 1 thief. Its incredibly rare for my usual groups to not have at least 1 thief at all times during dungeon tours. And usually we have 2 just to boost group DPS through the roof.

And as for Anet playing thieves, they don’t. Awhile back there was a livestream for the fractured update. Anet had a group of 5 trying to do the story fractal. They had 1 thief. He camped p/p the entire run and didn’t use any of his utilities throughout the entire livestream. He was a prime example of Anet’s experience with their own dungeons/fractals.

Sadly, but LFG pugging says different story (not saying that you are not correct about thiefs dps, since there are no dps calculators i will not argue). Most parties require warriors for dps, many times myself got kicked from party even before entering dungeon or asked to relog to warrior just because I play a thief. Lately was even kicked from fractal party after first boss kill, with a claim that I “don’t meet groups dps requirements” (while running full zerker 25/30/0/0/15 and ofc melee) when groups dps was much lower then average pug group dps, simply because thieves are widely considered as a weak link. Low dps ? must be because of thief.

Karolis.4261:

Clumsy.6257:

Troublesome.5670:

Don’t get me started on pve……how many thieves you see running the harder pve dungeons/high level fractals??? ok, yeah, there is a reason for that.

Do you even play GW2? Most experienced parties require a minimum of 1 thief. Its incredibly rare for my usual groups to not have at least 1 thief at all times during dungeon tours. And usually we have 2 just to boost group DPS through the roof.

And as for Anet playing thieves, they don’t. Awhile back there was a livestream for the fractured update. Anet had a group of 5 trying to do the story fractal. They had 1 thief. He camped p/p the entire run and didn’t use any of his utilities throughout the entire livestream. He was a prime example of Anet’s experience with their own dungeons/fractals.

Sadly, but LFG pugging says different story (not saying that you are not correct about thiefs dps, since there are no dps calculators i will not argue). Most parties require warriors for dps, many times myself got kicked from party even before entering dungeon or asked to relog to warrior just because I play a thief. Lately was even kicked from fractal party after first boss kill, with a claim that I “don’t meet groups dps requirements” (while running full zerker 25/30/0/0/15 and ofc melee) when groups dps was much lower then average pug group dps, simply because thieves are widely considered as a weak link. Low dps ? must be because of thief.

We do have DPS calculators. You just have to spend a lot of time and somewhat enjoy that kind of math. And your comparing pugs to the meta. Pugs like warriors because its literally impossible to screw up a zerker warrior. Unfortunately the average thief’s skill is so bad that most pugs kick all thieves. Its not a class problem, its a player skill problem.