Guild Wars 2

Just please.
Two seconds of stealth when low is not so life-changing.
It procs when your health is so low (for a thief) that you can get killed in a blow before you reach that %
When using D/X or X/D and you’re low HP you have to WAIT, doing NOTHING, until it procs (if you’re trying to escape or trying to time things around) otherwise you’ll end up screwing it all up.
Last I checked, it doesn’t blind your opponents (I could be wrong) so why bother?

That being said, since it’s unreliable, you can never count on it, you must just be careful NOT TO LET IT KILL YOU. Which is dumb, moronic and oxymoronic for an ability that pretends to save you.
It doesn’t have a timer either (visible one) so you don’t know if you should or not pop a C&D or BP combo in a long fight or mutiple ones.
You’re better off proc’ing it on purpose with a random NPC before you start a fight, honestly.

So I ask, please just disable this …. thing that you call minor trait until you figure out a trait that fits your likes (I’ve seen many good options but lets face it, ANET likes not to give us nice toys)

How many of these “this skill throws off my otherwise perfect combo timing” topics must we have? I play a pistol/pistol build, and those 2 seconds of stealth has saved me more times then I can remember.

“Dev: In these past eight months, we always look at it and we couldn’t do anything about it but…”

Kasama.8941:

How many of these “this skill throws off my otherwise perfect combo timing” topics must we have? I play a pistol/pistol build, and those 2 seconds of stealth has saved me more times then I can remember.

If you’re shooting with shortbow there is a high chance it will just make you pop revealed without even having a chance to stop it or even hitting the invisible shot. For P/P is the same just that the projectile is much faster. I don’t know you but it can as well proc in the middle of an unload or anything. P/P is not a stealth based build, unless you like burning your utilities for that so it doesn’t make much SENSE. Sure, it works for you, but tell me if I’m wrong that it doesn’t work as intended. And P/P is just one and maybe S/P might as well but then again, aren’t we talking about minorities here?

Kasama.8941:

How many of these “this skill throws off my otherwise perfect combo timing” topics must we have? I play a pistol/pistol build, and those 2 seconds of stealth has saved me more times then I can remember.

So they can make it a major trait so that you CHOOSE to use it. I can’t count how many times it’s gotten me killed instead of saving me, and I have no way of disabling it. Yet specing into that tree is mandatory for any CnD PVE build for “Infusion of Shadow”.

Or they can make it ignore “Revealed” debuff and make it an actual reliable trait.

Yeah I am all for this, doesn’t even need to be replaced with any thing for now, just get rid of it or make it a Major trait. Or as Okamakiri suggested have it bypass revealed.

Kasama.8941:

How many of these “this skill throws off my otherwise perfect combo timing” topics must we have? I play a pistol/pistol build, and those 2 seconds of stealth has saved me more times then I can remember.

Why are you investing in Shadow Arts as P/P?

Grimwolf.7163:

Kasama.8941:

How many of these “this skill throws off my otherwise perfect combo timing” topics must we have? I play a pistol/pistol build, and those 2 seconds of stealth has saved me more times then I can remember.

Why are you investing in Shadow Arts as P/P?

Probably for deception cd but it really doesn’t make sense.

I am 100% all for taking out this trait or disabling it or something. Not only does it throw off my timing but it actively gets me killed when I don’t have revealed and when I do, it does absolutely nothing. Worst.trait.ever.

Grimwolf.7163:

Kasama.8941:

How many of these “this skill throws off my otherwise perfect combo timing” topics must we have? I play a pistol/pistol build, and those 2 seconds of stealth has saved me more times then I can remember.

Why are you investing in Shadow Arts as P/P?

As a P/P with 20points in Shadow Arts you can welcome any BS and Vemon Thief any day.

The point is, he seemed to always run away when he is low on HP so it worked for him. But remember not all Thief plays like that.

i personally love it. however there are plenty of times it just procs revealed and no invis which is rather annoying. seems to have the same bug as blidning powder…..hrm oh wait arent they the same :? :P

Personally I’ve grown to like Last Refuge. I’m being aggressive, they took me low but I know I’ll still win? Hold off on my CnD and just HS (if they’re not below 50% and I am, I wouldn’t be staying there) – once they hit me and I proc Last Refuge, I’m now invisible and they’re blind – that is enough for their next to miss and let me dodge/run/port behind them for the finishing backstab. That, or I simply don’t care as it will trigger when I’m on reveal debuff anyways.

For running away is where it is actually a problem. You can start running away first in a straight line to purposely let them proc then cut off out of the general AoE/auto attack spam and get to safety. Judge sooner to know if you can be aggressive and stick a fight that lets you get that low or reset. Or as you said, most stealth builds are glass cannons as OP stealth is more than enough survival in PvP/WvW, so most people can hit you harder than 25% of your HP, so why does the skill even affect you?

Would I like a better skill? Yeah. But do I consider it broken? No. I’ve learned to either use it or not care if it happens.

With this thread you’re implying arena net will fix the thieves lol.. Look at the bug compilation thread, there’s at least 20+ bugs and issues lacking about the thief that still nothing’s been done. These threads are just here for us to vent; I’m beginning to think

Okamakiri.8746:

Kasama.8941:

How many of these “this skill throws off my otherwise perfect combo timing” topics must we have? I play a pistol/pistol build, and those 2 seconds of stealth has saved me more times then I can remember.

So they can make it a major trait so that you CHOOSE to use it. I can’t count how many times it’s gotten me killed instead of saving me, and I have no way of disabling it. Yet specing into that tree is mandatory for any CnD PVE build for “Infusion of Shadow”.

Or they can make it ignore “Revealed” debuff and make it an actual reliable trait.

Well, the stealth skill is tied into four out of the six adept traits, in Shadow Art, so it creates some problems if you just move it, as you need stealth in order for those traits to work. So if a player, who doesn’t use any stealth skills, adds ten trait points in Shadow Art because he want more toughness, he needs that stealth trigger from Last Refuge. That’s why it’s there.

Grimwolf.7163:

Why are you investing in Shadow Arts as P/P?

I play WvW, so I need the condition removal. People love snare skills in WvW.

Kasama.8941

Well, the stealth skill is tied into four out of the six adept traits, in Shadow Art, so it creates some problems if you just move it, as you need stealth in order for those traits to work. So if a player, who doesn’t use any stealth skills, adds ten trait points in Shadow Art because he want more toughness, he needs that stealth trigger from Last Refuge. That’s why it’s there.

… what? Also if you want more toughness, grab toughness on 1 item. That’s the same amount of tough you’d be getting from 10 points into that line. If that’s basically all you’re getting out of it (you are if you’re p/p), you’re far better off going somewhere else with your traits.

I play WvW, so I need the condition removal. People love snare skills in WvW.

You need the condition removal but you’re getting the removal from stealth… and you don’t have good access to stealth… Anyone else see the problem here? If you were p/d then it’d make complete sense… but you’re not.

randomfightfan.4091:

Kasama.8941

Well, the stealth skill is tied into four out of the six adept traits, in Shadow Art, so it creates some problems if you just move it, as you need stealth in order for those traits to work. So if a player, who doesn’t use any stealth skills, adds ten trait points in Shadow Art because he want more toughness, he needs that stealth trigger from Last Refuge. That’s why it’s there.

… what? Also if you want more toughness, grab toughness on 1 item. That’s the same amount of tough you’d be getting from 10 points into that line. If that’s basically all you’re getting out of it (you are if you’re p/p), you’re far better off going somewhere else with your traits.

I play WvW, so I need the condition removal. People love snare skills in WvW.

You need the condition removal but you’re getting the removal from stealth… and you don’t have good access to stealth… Anyone else see the problem here? If you were p/d then it’d make complete sense… but you’re not.

You totally missed the point. It doesn’t matter whether or not someone adds ten trait points in Shadow Art to get more toughness, or adds 30 trait points to get Venomous Aura. The point is, that if a player wants to add 10+ points in Shadow Art, and he doesn’t use any stealth skills in his build, he still needs a reliable stealth trigger to make the stealth traits in Shadow Art work. That is what Last Refuge is there for.

I have five stealth triggers in my build. Hide in Shadows, Blinding Powder, Last Refuge, Descent of Shadows, and steal.

Kasama.8941:

randomfightfan.4091:

Kasama.8941

Well, the stealth skill is tied into four out of the six adept traits, in Shadow Art, so it creates some problems if you just move it, as you need stealth in order for those traits to work. So if a player, who doesn’t use any stealth skills, adds ten trait points in Shadow Art because he want more toughness, he needs that stealth trigger from Last Refuge. That’s why it’s there.

… what? Also if you want more toughness, grab toughness on 1 item. That’s the same amount of tough you’d be getting from 10 points into that line. If that’s basically all you’re getting out of it (you are if you’re p/p), you’re far better off going somewhere else with your traits.

I play WvW, so I need the condition removal. People love snare skills in WvW.

You need the condition removal but you’re getting the removal from stealth… and you don’t have good access to stealth… Anyone else see the problem here? If you were p/d then it’d make complete sense… but you’re not.

You totally missed the point. It doesn’t matter whether or not someone adds ten trait points in Shadow Art to get more toughness, or adds 30 trait points to get Venomous Aura. The point is, that if a player wants to add 10+ points in Shadow Art, and he doesn’t use any stealth skills in his build, he still needs a reliable stealth trigger to make the stealth traits in Shadow Art work. That is what Last Refuge is there for.

I have five stealth triggers in my build. Hide in Shadows, Blinding Powder, Last Refuge, Descent of Shadows, and steal.

oh okay, in that case it’s just a wierd way to have easy access to stealth in my opinion. Just don’t see why you’d intentionally get yourself to 25% for the reliable stealth. Also what’s descent of shadows? And if you have steal gives you stealth then you have 20 points into SA not 10, so now I have no idea what your build is. So confused.

“Shadow Arts

Shadow Arts is a trait line for the thief that focuses on use of stealth."

Sounds like it would make perfect sense to have something that boons the player when they stealth would fit well and work great for the trait line. Pretty much any of the t1 traits would fit to replace the passive except deception cd and bleed removal. Just swap refuge with one of those 4 and the complaints would drop significantly. People who like last refuge would still have access to it and people who don’t would be getting killed daily by the skill.

randomfightfan.4091:

Kasama.8941:

You totally missed the point. It doesn’t matter whether or not someone adds ten trait points in Shadow Art to get more toughness, or adds 30 trait points to get Venomous Aura. The point is, that if a player wants to add 10+ points in Shadow Art, and he doesn’t use any stealth skills in his build, he still needs a reliable stealth trigger to make the stealth traits in Shadow Art work. That is what Last Refuge is there for.

I have five stealth triggers in my build. Hide in Shadows, Blinding Powder, Last Refuge, Descent of Shadows, and steal.

oh okay, in that case it’s just a wierd way to have easy access to stealth in my opinion. Just don’t see why you’d intentionally get yourself to 25% for the reliable stealth. Also what’s descent of shadows? And if you have steal gives you stealth then you have 20 points into SA not 10, so now I have no idea what your build is. So confused.

Last Refuge isn’t meant for spamming Backstab, it’s a skill meant to save you. And if you add ten trait points in Shadow Art, you can also get either regeneration (Shadow Protector), remove a condition (Shadow’s Embrace), 2 initiative (Infusion of Shadow), or blind nearby foes (Cloaked in Shadow), on top of the stealth from Last Refuge.

Descent of Shadows; “Release blinding powder when you take falling damage. Take 50% less damage from falling”. Falling damage is quite easy to get. I don’t mean stealth from the trait Hidden Thief, but from the steal skill Blinding Tuft. My build is 0/30/10/15/15 in case you are wondering =)

Kasama.8941:

randomfightfan.4091:

Kasama.8941:

You totally missed the point. It doesn’t matter whether or not someone adds ten trait points in Shadow Art to get more toughness, or adds 30 trait points to get Venomous Aura. The point is, that if a player wants to add 10+ points in Shadow Art, and he doesn’t use any stealth skills in his build, he still needs a reliable stealth trigger to make the stealth traits in Shadow Art work. That is what Last Refuge is there for.

I have five stealth triggers in my build. Hide in Shadows, Blinding Powder, Last Refuge, Descent of Shadows, and steal.

oh okay, in that case it’s just a wierd way to have easy access to stealth in my opinion. Just don’t see why you’d intentionally get yourself to 25% for the reliable stealth. Also what’s descent of shadows? And if you have steal gives you stealth then you have 20 points into SA not 10, so now I have no idea what your build is. So confused.

Last Refuge isn’t meant for spamming Backstab, it’s a skill meant to save you. And if you add ten trait points in Shadow Art, you can also get either regeneration (Shadow Protector), remove a condition (Shadow’s Embrace), 2 initiative (Infusion of Shadow), or blind nearby foes (Cloaked in Shadow), on top of the stealth from Last Refuge.

Descent of Shadows; “Release blinding powder when you take falling damage. Take 50% less damage from falling”. Falling damage is quite easy to get. I don’t mean stealth from the trait Hidden Thief, but from the steal skill Blinding Tuft. My build is 0/30/10/15/15 in case you are wondering =)

okay that’s why I didn’t know what descent was. No offence, but it’s a pretty terrible train in 90% of circumstances. Last refuge already blinds in an aoe when it procs… Blinding powder is what stealths u. If you want that condi removal there are significantly better ways and builds to get it. If you want that aoe blind, there are significantly better builds used to get it. Lastly, you’re nerfing yourself going 10 into sa with pistols because you’re traiting for something that you’re not using nearly as well as you could be. If you took those 10 points and put 5 into each of the bottom 2 you’d be getting significantly more use out of your traits. Ex. boon strip and aoe vigor on steal with 2 ini per 10 or 100ish healing per every point of ini you spend. Both are a LOT better for you than condi on stealth when you are barely using stealth. That isn’t the only build option ofc but it’s certainly a lot more useful than relying on almost dying just so you can clear 1 random condition or get 600ish healing from going stealth.