Guild Wars 2

There is so much hate for anet I have right now. I am not going to attack them because I can not afford any more infractions points but everyone knows what I am implying

Light’s Judgment trap is ridiculous. Why do thieves get such a hard counter to a WHOLE kitten TRAIT LINE. That is a 1 second reveal every second. If they lock us inside its going to be a disaster.

Tell me now, if I am stealth and run over it, do I get revealed or do I have to be out of stealth to trigger the revealed??

Either way, The only thing I do in this game is roam world vs world because I love it so much. It is fun and I like to 2v1 and 3v1 if I can because it feels good to outplay your opponents when the odds are against you.

Are you going to give us a skill that stops guardians form using their virtues?? Because that is what you are doing anet

GG, if this is as bad as it seems I am done with your game

You just killed thief and now I have no faith in you

Guild Wars 1 devs were much smarter than you… …

Update: these 2 posts really capture the truth and the pure disgust that The thief community has with the trap

by Lady Minuit.3186
“I just don’t see how this reveal trap fits with a Dragonhunter? I can’t imagine a dragon stealthing or any big game for that matter.
Thiefhunter would have been a more appropriate name.
Also it’s insulting they would go and implement this for another class, yet fail to fix our traits such as Concealed Defeat and Last Refuge (amongst other things).
If they’re going to do this, they should at least make sure our other traits are fine tuned. Give us a way out or something.”

and T raw.4658
The problem I have with this trap isn’t the trap per say but the fact anet is balancing based on whiny WvW players.
They are phasing out the Thief’s ability to roam in WvW but failing to give them the tools needed to do the other phases of the game.
I’m all for counterplay but at some point in time you need to give to the class you are indirectly nerfing.

BFMV.3198:

There is so much hate for anet I have right now. I am not going to attack them because I can not afford any more infractions points but everyone knows what I am implying

Light’s Judgment trap is ridiculous. Why do thieves get such a hard counter to a WHOLE kitten TRAIT LINE. That is a 1 second reveal every second. If they lock us inside its going to be a disaster.

Tell me now, if I am stealth and run over it, do I get revealed or do I have to be out of stealth to trigger the revealed??

Either way, The only thing I do in this game is roam world vs world because I love it so much. It is fun and I like to 2v1 and 3v1 if I can because it feels good to outplay your opponents when the odds are against you.

Are you going to give us a skill that stops guardians form using their virtues?? Because that is what you are doing anet

GG, if this is as bad as it seems I am done with your game

You just killed thief and now I have no faith in you

Guild Wars 1 devs were much smarter than you… …

The guardian could also place the trap in your SR. Lolz…

To be serious, they should separate reveal into two categories.

One is the reveal thief gets after attacking from stealth. Thief cannot enter stealth until reveal is gone.

The other from Sic Em and Light’s Judgement should be a unique debuff. This still allows the thief to stealth but everyone can see them. They gain full benefits from traits and class mechanics yet enemies can see and attack them.

First the reveal lasts for one second unless you continue to stand in the trap. Which means at most its a temporary OH kitten where you have to back off. Buying what is apparently going to be a much glassier version of guardian a second or two. Keep in mind range builds usually have to run glassier to get comparable damage. Meaning as a base there more vulnerable than most guardians.

Its a first line of defense against an ambush from stealth that they have to set up ahead of time. And now you know it exists so you can keep an eye out for it.

Also its on a respectably long cooldown.

Also..Its a trap. There SUPPOSED to kitten over the people that step in them. The fact that they havn’t up to this point theyv stated is something there hoping to address (making them require more forethought by giving them arming times. And in return giving them more potential oomph.)

From the look of it, this trap is the very first skill in gw2 that can actually reveal an enemy who is already in stealth. Think of the implications.

stealth and escape mechanik is broken for thiefs in wvw now you can enter and escape when you want ….. the trap is balanced and legit
now l2p without permastealth
lets see what elite spec, utilities and weapon we get next time

Arkantos.7460:

stealth and escape mechanik is broken for thiefs in wvw now you can enter and escape when you want ….. the trap is balanced and legit
now l2p without permastealth
lets see what elite spec, utilities and weapon we get next time

Kinda like nike wars and their healing signet sept there is no stealth or any chance to screw over the healing.

yolo swaggins.2570:

Arkantos.7460:

stealth and escape mechanik is broken for thiefs in wvw now you can enter and escape when you want ….. the trap is balanced and legit
now l2p without permastealth
lets see what elite spec, utilities and weapon we get next time

Kinda like nike wars and their healing signet sept there is no stealth or any chance to screw over the healing.

And the food that gives health every second + the amount of condi clear that profession has making poison a condi near impossible to keep on them to try and counter that heal.

To be honest the trap isnt a bad thing. It adds a bit of counter play to stealth and thiefs arnt the only profession that uses stealth. PU mesmers and some engineers do as well. And if i am not careful to notice a trap being placed and i trigger it, its my own fault.

The only point i would call it broken or op is if that lights judgement was constantly following you if you got hit so there was no way of escaping the full duration then we are screwed.

But i do see the potential of setting up a lockdown but again, they would need to go full trap specced to do that and use their cooldowns to do so.

I guess we will just have to wait and see how it goes. I am pretty sure anet isnt screwing anybody over.

Cronicle.5691:

yolo swaggins.2570:

Arkantos.7460:

stealth and escape mechanik is broken for thiefs in wvw now you can enter and escape when you want ….. the trap is balanced and legit
now l2p without permastealth
lets see what elite spec, utilities and weapon we get next time

Kinda like nike wars and their healing signet sept there is no stealth or any chance to screw over the healing.

And the food that gives health every second + the amount of condi clear that profession has making poison a condi near impossible to keep on them to try and counter that heal.

To be honest the trap isnt a bad thing. It adds a bit of counter play to stealth and thiefs arnt the only profession that uses stealth. PU mesmers and some engineers do as well. And if i am not careful to notice a trap being placed and i trigger it, its my own fault.

The only point i would call it broken or op is if that lights judgement was constantly following you if you got hit so there was no way of escaping the full duration then we are screwed.

But i do see the potential of setting up a lockdown but again, they would need to go full trap specced to do that and use their cooldowns to do so.

I guess we will just have to wait and see how it goes. I am pretty sure anet isnt screwing anybody over.

The trap by itself is managable. Its if the Guard stacks different different traps on top each other that things can get interesting. There is a trap that pulls you in and causes slow, or the other trap that locks you in place (dragons maw). Someone also mentioned that the Guard could also drop hammer #5 on you while in the trap to keep you there too.

To be honest thieves should be more worried about the 25 stacks of vuln that pulses every second along with reveal… that comes with that particular trap. One good WW on top of that can ruin your day.

Taking a trap means not taking a different utility. You’re most likely overreacting.

The trap will most likely be burst/lockdown based. That will be the thing you have to avoid. So in a fight with a trap DH, save your utilities for when you’re getting locked into a trap and longbow burst. At least, that’s what I’m thinking. My guess is that they’ll attempt to immob or stun you into a trap then burst, so this makes the most sense imo.

Every class will get revealed on a skill at some point even thief. It’s all good nothing game breaking.

I think you guys are missing the point. No other skill in the game hard counter class mechanics. Well maybe Moa. And for the record, stealth is part of the thief class mechanic, stealth attacks.

Gabriell.4856:

I think you guys are missing the point. No other skill in the game hard counter class mechanics. Well maybe Moa. And for the record, stealth is part of the thief class mechanic, stealth attacks.

Can we disable virtues, attunements, ranger pets, warrior burst skills, etc? No. So why should it apply to only thieves?

QQers because the thief will most likely reset negating the reveal and come back.

It worth pointing out that even as rangers/Engineers have skills that prevent stealth I rarely encounter them in WvW.

In spite of all the QQ about stealth one finds on the boards those two classes tend to feel they have other utilities that are better. This suggests to me that the complaints about stealth are overstated.

Now THIS counter is very different as it has upfront damage which is significant and loads up that vulnerability either of which can be worth taking on their own. This trap in game terms will make SR much more marginal as a utility as the USE of SR becomes even more a death sentence. A thief can counter the various means used to knock said thief out of SR before it ’takes" with well timed dodges , but this will prove impossible if this trap simply placed on that HOUSE symbol.

I think we will have to wait to see this all in pay in game terms before making a judgement that it `the end of thieves`. The people playing our class tend to be very adaptable .

I’m a bit more worried about their Heavy Light trait in combination with Dulled Sense and Zealot’s Aggression… A knockdown/push back every 7 seconds (because the guard could intentionally, say, dodge roll into you) then the target is crippled for 4 seconds, amplifying the damage as the guard rolls back a bit more (or walks back) to create 600 unit distance for Pure of Sight. All the guard needs to do is count out loud or in their head 7 seconds after the first knockdown, or watch the cripple + 3 more seconds, to rinse and repeat the combo.

Though who knows how that will work in practice.

:D Either way, I got a level 80 warrior and guarding, and probably going to make a revenant too.

It’s 1 second and only affects the radius of the trap. You can easily teleport away and go in to Stealth right after. The more traps a Guardian uses to try and keep you there, the less Meditations they have to pursue you and the less <skill type> they have to defend themselves against a counter-burst. Also, nobody pre-emptively places Traps, as much as Arenanet want you to believe. Rangers will just lob them right at you if they can, and any Trapper Thief in WvW usually runs AT you to plant them so they can easily grab the Stealth bonus without Revealing themselves. Combine that with the obvious plant animation AND the arming time, and you can very easily control a fight against a Guardian that attempts to trap you.

It’s all about trade-offs for them. It’s not the end of the world. Bear in mind that we have yet to see our own Elite Specialisation, on top of our trait reworks.

Meh. I’m not too worried about it. It’s one of these ‘wait and see’ deals. Personally, I don’t think it’s going to be too big of a problem. Skilled thieves should be just fine, and things like this will separate the truly good thieves from those just using stealth as a crutch for easy loot bags. The best thieves know how to survive without stealth. Let’s not forget all of our evades and teleports. To top it all off, we’ve yet to see what the Thief’s Specialization will be and what it will bring to the table for thieves.

Arkantos.7460:

stealth and escape mechanik is broken for thiefs in wvw now you can enter and escape when you want ….. the trap is balanced and legit
now l2p without permastealth
lets see what elite spec, utilities and weapon we get next time

LMAO

Thanks for the laugh dude.

Ok – then Theives should be Reveal’d upon a Block / Dodge / Missed attack.

I’m absolutely fine with the trap if they give the thief the ability to cleanse conditions in better ways via more trait lines.

You get revealed for every second you spend in the trap.
Shadowstep, Infiltrators’ Arrow, Infiltrators’ Return, a source that knocks you out of it or simply walking out of the trap will allow you to stealth again.

It was all explained pretty clearly…
It’s a bit like the Ring of Warding, but easier. Whereas that ring doesn’t allow you to walk out, you CAN port out of it. The same goes for the trap.

So yeah, get out, wait a second, happily re-enter stealth.
Sure you’ll have taken a bit of damage, but it’s not as bad as you make it out to be.

Just don’t be stupid and play in the trap.

be glad their cooldowns arent as short as the ranger traps currently.

also these guardians should be as glassy as you with no full bar of medi skills to sustain them and burst you with.

actually imho you should be happy to have these DHs instead of the standard medi guardian

DeceiverX.8361:

I’m absolutely fine with the trap if they give the thief the ability to cleanse conditions in better ways via more trait lines.

this ^ … revealed destroys our access to condi removal

caveman.5840:

DeceiverX.8361:

I’m absolutely fine with the trap if they give the thief the ability to cleanse conditions in better ways via more trait lines.

this ^ … revealed destroys our access to condi removal

Tell me about it. Acro … or even Critical Strikes, at this point. But some other method not linked to SA is desirable. Necessary, even.

Even though I main SA thief (who is getting a tasty indirect buff via stat cap bases rising), this will mean S/d shatters them xD.

Narcarsis.5739:

Taking a trap means not taking a different utility. You’re most likely overreacting.

Drop smite condition,Take Smiter’s boon trait take the trap. Still wouldn’t stop us from playing an acro build, but it certainly is annoying to have SA be almost entirely stealth based still with a revamp.

Stinja.9612:

Narcarsis.5739:

Taking a trap means not taking a different utility. You’re most likely overreacting.

Drop smite condition,Take Smiter’s boon trait take the trap. Still wouldn’t stop us from playing an acro build, but it certainly is annoying to have SA be almost entirely stealth based still with a revamp.

Smiter’s Boon isn’t a substitute to an on demand Smite Condition. Smite Condition is probably the last Meditation you can drop, it’s just too much damage, healing and cleanse because of the short cooldown.

JI is the only one I’d drop, but traps are just too easy to avoid in PvP, they’re not worth the slot imo.

Gabriell.4856:

I think you guys are missing the point. No other skill in the game hard counter class mechanics. Well maybe Moa. And for the record, stealth is part of the thief class mechanic, stealth attacks.

Uh-huh. Except Stealth, since it negates the ability to hit the Thief.

tbh i am more worried about trap pulsing for 4.5k burning dmg… and 2.5k bleed

Time for Thieves to permanently remove Shadow Refuge from their hotbar.

I expect ranger to get skills like this…
Why does Guardian’s traps more interesting than Ranger?
Doesn’t make sense…
Since each class will only get one type of skills, I don’t think ranger, the master of trap will get any new traps in HoD, what a shame -.-

I just can’t imagine this destroying Thieves any more than the reveal effect on Sic ’Em, or the way that stealth-busting traps were going to remove the profession from WvW.

Keitaro Dragonheart.9047:

Meh. I’m not too worried about it. It’s one of these ‘wait and see’ deals. Personally, I don’t think it’s going to be too big of a problem. Skilled thieves should be just fine, and things like this will separate the truly good thieves from those just using stealth as a crutch for easy loot bags. The best thieves know how to survive without stealth. Let’s not forget all of our evades and teleports. To top it all off, we’ve yet to see what the Thief’s Specialization will be and what it will bring to the table for thieves.

(I will not post that 2 years thread link again) I agree with you because if Arena net wanted to make thief a challenging profession to the other profession: would it make sense to make the changes to thief profession instead? Like fixing the main problem instead of fixing other problems that will never fix the real problem?

Example: You know that the main problem of your car is the engine. So instead of fixing the engine: you make adjustments and make fixes to other parts of the car to help the engine get better.

So 2 questions:

1. By fixing and making adjustments to other parts of the car, did it resolve the engine problem?

2. Why did you not just fix the engine: which is the main problem?

I hope you understand what i mean, as long Arena net do not re-design thief traits: engine car example, thieves players have nothing to worry about.

Like other players say, “put bandage on it”. They are correct!

So for 2years+ do you know how many bandage thieve profession have? Too many and many more will be added.

Even thief profession upcoming nerfs and future nerfs will add more bandage and more bandage unless Arena net make serious change and re-design thief profession traits.

Even other professions upcoming “counters” and future “counters” against thief profession will just add more bandage and more bandage: so why be worried at all?

" Worry is rust upon the blade "

" Put a Band-Aid on it (instead of fully treating the injury) "

" You cannot run away from your problems. A problem is a problem until you get to the root of the problem "

" Stop Fixing the Symptoms…Find the Root Cause Instead "

pretty sure i could spend the full duration in the trap and not die to a medi guard as long as i have enough ini for a black powder or two, and maybe a shadowshot.

Kousetsu.1627:

pretty sure i could spend the full duration in the trap and not die to a medi guard as long as i have enough ini for a black powder or two, and maybe a shadowshot.

That is not a problem. 1v1 it is not an issue.

It is more the 2v1 and 3v1 and the chance that a zerg or roaming party stomps you.

I am sure you may still be able to 2v1 but we will see

I just don’t see how this reveal trap fits with a Dragonhunter? I can’t imagine a dragon stealthing or any big game for that matter.

Thiefhunter would have been a more appropriate name.

Also it’s insulting they would go and implement this for another class, yet fail to fix our traits such as Concealed Defeat and Last Refuge (amongst other things).

If they’re going to do this, they should at least make sure our other traits are fine tuned. Give us a way out or something.

The problem I have with this trap isn’t the trap per say but the fact anet is balancing based on whiny WvW players.

They are phasing out the Thief’s ability to roam in WvW but failing to give them the tools needed to do the other phases of the game.

I’m all for counterplay but at some point in time you need to give to the class you are indirectly nerfing.

DarkSyze.8627:

" Worry is rust upon the blade "

Not sure what you mean by that…
But I guess if the blade is stuck in you, thus going to rust in you eventually, and you’re worried about pulling it out… Yeah I could agree…

DarkSyze.8627:

" Put a Band-Aid on it (instead of fully treating the injury) "

Well… It kind of works like that and kind of doesn’t. As in with enough nerfs, surely, 99% of the people will find the class “counterable” or easier to deal with… Though there still remains that 1%. Kind of like those antiseptic wipes you use to clean things with, kills 99% of the germs! (Leaves the 1% to kill you! – or maybe they’re harmless who knows, I haven’t died yet).

DarkSyze.8627:

" You cannot run away from your problems. A problem is a problem until you get to the root of the problem "

" Stop Fixing the Symptoms…Find the Root Cause Instead "

Oh man, couldn’t agree with you more man. Though sometimes when you’re trying too hard to find the problem, that very well may be the problem and is causing you not to see things clearly. That or you might not be looking at all the places.

DarkSyze.8627:

snip

Hey Darksyze, what is your native language? I’m pretty curious.

Turk.5460:

DarkSyze.8627:

snip

Hey Darksyze, what is your native language? I’m pretty curious.

French: European: -French-

Zero Day.2594:

DarkSyze.8627:

" Worry is rust upon the blade "

Not sure what you mean by that…
But I guess if the blade is stuck in you, thus going to rust in you eventually, and you’re worried about pulling it out… Yeah I could agree…

DarkSyze.8627:

" Put a Band-Aid on it (instead of fully treating the injury) "

Well… It kind of works like that and kind of doesn’t. As in with enough nerfs, surely, 99% of the people will find the class “counterable” or easier to deal with… Though there still remains that 1%. Kind of like those antiseptic wipes you use to clean things with, kills 99% of the germs! (Lives the 1% to kill you! – or maybe they’re harmless who knows, I haven’t died yet).

DarkSyze.8627:

" You cannot run away from your problems. A problem is a problem until you get to the root of the problem "

" Stop Fixing the Symptoms…Find the Root Cause Instead "

Oh man, couldn’t agree with you more man. Though sometimes when you’re trying too hard to find the problem, that very well may be the problem and is causing you not to see things clearly. That or you might not be looking at all the places.

Awesome! Well Done! Zero Day

Can you imagine just how much better his logic probably sounds in French? As English is not his native tongue, his English-arguments that sound borderline insane and poorly thought probably sound incredibly eloquent and well put in French.

Not joking or poking fun, as he knows +1 more languages than I do, and I definitely respect that.

Turk.5460:

Can you imagine just how much better his logic probably sounds in French? As English is not his native tongue, his English-arguments that sound borderline insane and poorly thought probably sound incredibly eloquent and well put in French.

Not joking or poking fun, as he knows +1 more languages than I do, and I definitely respect that.

Perhaps. But I think you’re writing off a little too much.

It’s not only his arguments, it’s also what he wants or sees as balanced/fixed, take for example his suggestions for trait remakes:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Nerf-Wish-list/page/10#post5034123

I don’t think a switch between languages would make them any better….

Every new nerf to thieves makes me stronger tbh consider it a new challenge if u r a really good thief u will prevail

Zero Day.2594:

Turk.5460:

Can you imagine just how much better his logic probably sounds in French? As English is not his native tongue, his English-arguments that sound borderline insane and poorly thought probably sound incredibly eloquent and well put in French.

Not joking or poking fun, as he knows +1 more languages than I do, and I definitely respect that.

Perhaps. But I think you’re writing off a little too much.

It’s not only his arguments, it’s also what he wants or sees as balanced/fixed, take for example his suggestions for trait remakes:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Nerf-Wish-list/page/10#post5034123

I don’t think a switch between languages would make them any better….

After reading the linked post I feel violated.

MOUED.6491:

Every new nerf to thieves makes me stronger tbh consider it a new challenge if u r a really good thief u will prevail

I wish I could say the same for necro, with thief’s inner design and it’s comparison to others it’s easier to adapt depending of the nerf that is, the trap is more of a nuisance.

Warkind.6745:

After reading the linked post I feel violated.

They tell you they can’t bother with a large % of the game because there isn’t challenge, and then you read what they would change to make challenge.

Kitten transcends all barriers and space-time.

With that drastic of traps I think that would mean that we are due for some pretty hella sweet buffs.

Odyssey.2613:

Warkind.6745:

After reading the linked post I feel violated.

They tell you they can’t bother with a large % of the game because there isn’t challenge, and then you read what they would change to make challenge.

Kitten transcends all barriers and space-time.

Well, the way I understand it is that he wants the thieves to have the challenge.
Actually, maybe this misunderstanding is due to the linguistic barrier…

Yup, if his changes went live tomorrow, you’re right. Thieves would have one heck of a challenge.

lol