Guild Wars 2

I’ve played a decent amount of sPvP both on my Ele and Ranger and had thought everything was okay- I didn’t get too many people whining when I had an off game and I didn’t get too many people complain when I killed them either.

I started playing my thief in sPvP and it’s horrible.
Use heartseeker any amount greater than 0? “HS noob, uninstall”
Fail to take down another class 1v1? “bad”
Fail to get the top of the score board? “lol can’t play ez class”

Playing the thief is definitely much more difficult than my ranger and about as hard as the Ele- what is it about thieves that make people want to whine?

They know thief is in a bad place so when they die to it, their ego suffers a fatal blow, usually leading to mini-tantrums. That and I’d be willing to bet a majority of the whiners have never even touched thief except for a few seconds of experimenting in hotjoin when they had the last straw after dying to another thief. Then they kill one or two random people and instantly take this as confirmation that thief is OP.

thief happend to rely on mechanic that tends to annoy any player the most aka stealth hence all the hate despite stealth being actually biggest weakness of the class in pvp

assassine type of class was always hated in any game (example WoW, LoL) despite how weak they may have been in the class balance

consistently disappearing target is annoying, so are the mind games that you have to play vs stealth type of class… most people want just to press their rotation and collect points, that usually doesn’t work with stealth classes hence why the hate imo

obviously not to mention the fact that stealth classes have good chance to get away and it irritates most players since they thought they had the kill yet couldn’t secure it; you can imagine how mad a hunter is when his prey gets away in front of his nose

so much hate is normal, “get used to it” is only advice i can give… i personally don’t respond to hating comments in matches, answering to those in any form accomplishes nothing really and is usually waste of time

^ Exactly that too. Stealth is not something that can be reliably countered the same way everytime. For example, if you see the thief is main hand dagger, you know that when they enter stealth they’’re gonna try and backstab you, but they won’t have to get close to you if they have main hand pistol.

The issue with this is that stealth was designed to be thief’s way of mitigating damage, coupled with evades. The problem is that stealth doesn’t actually mitigate or stop damage, it just makes it harder for someone to reliably deal that damage. With a bit of good guess work and some AoE, a player can still down you, stealth or no stealth, whereas other classes have more absolute ways of negating damage such as blocks, invulnerabilites or on demand access to protection. Thieves can’t really do any of those things because they are designed to use evades, mobility and stealth to negate damage. Telling a thief not to stealth would be like telling rangers to always fight in melee range or guardians not to block.

Gabe.6810:

what is it about thieves that make people want to whine?

The stealth abuse in WvW.
I believe now with ranger and engi revealed skills on 6 secs duration, things are much much better. But without those, stealth is a total joke in this game. Tbh I think there should be more classes with revealed skills, but it’s a good start.

Necrotize.2974:

Telling a thief not to stealth would be like telling rangers to always fight in melee range

Terrible example

Rangers build for melee combat with 6 points on BM and fern hound are very powerfull.

Thieves have control over when a fight starts and when it ends more so than any other profession. People don’t like feeling like they’re not in control. As a Thief you can engage and disengage much more easily than other professions can and you can leave people feeling paranoid by poking them then leaving in stealth.

When I first started playing GW2 I hated Thieves as well. They’re easy to hate because stealth feels unfair. But the good players, or the ones who take the time to understand it, shouldn’t be giving you a hard time.

I’ve only recently started playing Thief personally and I’m enjoying it quite a bit. I’m more than happy to receive any hate I get because I’m just going to troll anyone who takes the time to complain to me. Thief is just as balanced as any other profession, stealth is just difficult for people to deal with. It’s not OP but it is a very strong mechanic and Thieves can access it at will. I started using trapper runes on my Ranger and it makes a huuuge difference being able to disappear when ever I want. So no Thieves aren’t faceroll easy, they’re actually quite difficult to play, but their core mechanic is definitely very strong and frustrating to fight against. As long as you’re playing a Thief you’re probably going to get some hate. No one likes feeling like they have no control over the fight.

Yelloweyedemon.2860:

Necrotize.2974:

Telling a thief not to stealth would be like telling rangers to always fight in melee range

Terrible example

Rangers build for melee combat with 6 points on BM and fern hound are very powerfull.

Yeah, not the best, mainly directed at the surplus of LB rangers. It’d be like telling those LB rangers with super squishy defenses to always stay in melee range. But I also have like 0 experience with ranger so meh.

All that stealth abuse. Imagine if all classes were just out using the abilities available to them, willy-nilly. It would be chaos!

Dustfinger.9510:

All that stealth abuse. Imagine if all classes were just out using the abilities available to them, willy-nilly. It would be chaos!

Complete and utter chaos! There would be bodies everywhere! Blood flowing through the streets like great rivers of crimson! Arrows and blades left discarded in the gutter as ruffians and civilians alike clamor for the safety and shelter of higher ground! But it will all be in vain. There will be no survivors.

Yelloweyedemon.2860:

Gabe.6810:

what is it about thieves that make people want to whine?

The stealth abuse in WvW.
I believe now with ranger and engi revealed skills on 6 secs duration, things are much much better. But without those, stealth is a total joke in this game. Tbh I think there should be more classes with revealed skills, but it’s a good start.

Thieves should get skills with no cast time or obvious tell that shut down:
*Warrior’s Defense line for 6s
*Guardian’s Valor line for 6s
*Mesmer’s Inspiration line for 6s
*Necromancer’s Soul Reaping line for 6s
*Ranger’s Wilderness Survival line for 6s
*Engineer’s Inventions line for 6s
*Elementalist’s Water Magic line for 6s

What’s that? No? Too absurd you say?

Odyssey.2613:

Yelloweyedemon.2860:

Gabe.6810:

what is it about thieves that make people want to whine?

The stealth abuse in WvW.
I believe now with ranger and engi revealed skills on 6 secs duration, things are much much better. But without those, stealth is a total joke in this game. Tbh I think there should be more classes with revealed skills, but it’s a good start.

Thieves should get skills with no cast time or obvious tell that shut down:
*Warrior’s Defense line for 6s
*Guardian’s Valor line for 6s
*Mesmer’s Inspiration line for 6s
*Necromancer’s Soul Reaping line for 6s
*Ranger’s Wilderness Survival line for 6s
*Engineer’s Inventions line for 6s
*Elementalist’s Water Magic line for 6s

What’s that? No? Too absurd you say?

Yeah…no. Basically what Odyssey said. No other class has skills that specifically shut down another class’ defenses. Some things do it inadvertently, but none specifically say “You can’t block for 6 seconds” or “You can’t go invulnerable” for 6 seconds. Stealth(and evades) are thief’s damage mitigation. Giving all classes easy access to reveal basically means for 6 or so seconds, you shut down all benefits of an entire trait line. Revealed shuts down all minor traits of SA and 8 of the 13 traits in the line, 2 of them being grandmaster traits.

I think it’s similar to how car-drivers hate on motorcycle-drivers, for no reason.
(Excuse them for trying to stay alive harder then you are.)
(Metaphorically the root of all QQ’ing about thieves)

Zero Day.2594:

I think it’s similar to how car-drivers hate on motorcycle-drivers, for no reason.
(Excuse them for trying to stay alive harder then you are.)
(Metaphorically the root of all QQ’ing about thieves)

I hate on motorcycle drivers only when they weave in and out of traffic to get past people. Not only is that really dangerous, but if you get clipped by another car, the worst they’ll have is a broken mirror while the motorcycle rider could get seriously hurt.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

Thieves have control over when a fight starts and when it ends more so than any other profession. People don’t like feeling like they’re not in control. As a Thief you can engage and disengage much more easily than other professions can and you can leave people feeling paranoid by poking them then leaving in stealth.

When I first started playing GW2 I hated Thieves as well. They’re easy to hate because stealth feels unfair. But the good players, or the ones who take the time to understand it, shouldn’t be giving you a hard time.

I’ve only recently started playing Thief personally and I’m enjoying it quite a bit. I’m more than happy to receive any hate I get because I’m just going to troll anyone who takes the time to complain to me. Thief is just as balanced as any other profession, stealth is just difficult for people to deal with. It’s not OP but it is a very strong mechanic and Thieves can access it at will. I started using trapper runes on my Ranger and it makes a huuuge difference being able to disappear when ever I want. So no Thieves aren’t faceroll easy, they’re actually quite difficult to play, but their core mechanic is definitely very strong and frustrating to fight against. As long as you’re playing a Thief you’re probably going to get some hate. No one likes feeling like they have no control over the fight.

I hated thieves and always lost to them for a while but all the losses have eventually taught me how to deal with them (power necro player) still die to them really easily on a condi spec if nightmare and reapers have been activated. that steal+fear >.<..

anyway its not the no control that is the issue, its the fact that they do not follow the rules of this game act and react. you cant react to something you can’t see, it becomes a game of guess work and if you guess wrong then it can be game over. I don’t know how many times people call aoe a counter to thieves.. they just stand out of it and pew pew from the edge its not hard,

I would also say mesmers are a bigger problem with stealth abuse, they can still attack you while in stealth and imo some attacks really need to be looked at in conjunction with this, at least thief is one target. playing against a Mesmer with an abundance of stealth utilities it becomes a battle with the targeting system more so then a battle with the Mesmer =|..

Any class that uses stealth will be a hated class/build in any game with competition, it’s just how it is. PU mesmer, thieves here, etc. I have yet to see an exception :P

I guess it has to do with the upset of being ‘backstabbed’, be it literally or not. Personally i really like when games gives you ways to turn the tables, but I don’t think GW2 is the best here. Though, in turn it is also one of the more conservative games with stealth. It’s almost purely a short term thing, so you can sort of learn what people are most likely to do. Still as above posters have said it leaves you a little uncertain.

Necrotize.2974:

Zero Day.2594:

I think it’s similar to how car-drivers hate on motorcycle-drivers, for no reason.
(Excuse them for trying to stay alive harder then you are.)
(Metaphorically the root of all QQ’ing about thieves)

I hate on motorcycle drivers only when they weave in and out of traffic to get past people. Not only is that really dangerous, but if you get clipped by another car, the worst they’ll have is a broken mirror while the motorcycle rider could get seriously hurt.

That is true. While some value their own lives… some (including car drivers) seem to be in a rush towards their own grave.

Necrotize.2974:

Zero Day.2594:

I think it’s similar to how car-drivers hate on motorcycle-drivers, for no reason.
(Excuse them for trying to stay alive harder then you are.)
(Metaphorically the root of all QQ’ing about thieves)

I hate on motorcycle drivers only when they weave in and out of traffic to get past people. Not only is that really dangerous, but if you get clipped by another car, the worst they’ll have is a broken mirror while the motorcycle rider could get seriously hurt.

That is true. While some value their own lives… some (including car drivers) seem to be in a rush towards their own grave.

Thief hate, it’s all just human psychology.

A mesmer can down you from full health with one combo. Engi doesn’t even need to use wep skill to down a squishie. Guard gs 5,4 + 2 and few people are downed. The currently hated rapid fire can down you from full HP as well.

Most skills/combos show up in combat log as a bunch of small hits.

Killshot/evis that hit hard as a single skill are not as hated as backstab. You can see them, you can react to the actual attacks. It gives the target hope that he might be able to avoid those attacks. All his utitlies on cd, endurance low, HP low but still he can see the attack coming and try to avoid it.

Then there is backstab.

It’s the opposite of all the above.

Unseen, high damaging attack delivered into the target’s back. It’s creepy and feeds people’s paranoia.

A thief stealths up, you don’t know if he ran away, he could be harvesting a nearby node (I sometimes do while SR is up and that zerg failed to aoe bomb my SR. I don’t waste time). If I do that when fighting someone just as my stealth is about to wear off, ooooo that rage when they see me mining bronze ore while they try their best to kill me.

I stealth up. All that goes through my target’s mind is the backstab. I can tell from how widly he keeps turning around that he can feel my breath on his back. I can deliver my attack now or just wait a little longer or even CnD again.

It’s up to me to prolong the uncertainty.

Backstabbing someone is a play of no honour, of course thieves deserve to be hated.

Jayden Ennok.3687:

Thief hate, it’s all just human psychology.

A mesmer can down you from full health with one combo. Engi doesn’t even need to use wep skill to down a squishie. Guard gs 5,4 + 2 and few people are downed. The currently hated rapid fire can down you from full HP as well.

Most skills/combos show up in combat log as a bunch of small hits.

Killshot/evis that hit hard as a single skill are not as hated as backstab. You can see them, you can react to the actual attacks. It gives the target hope that he might be able to avoid those attacks. All his utitlies on cd, endurance low, HP low but still he can see the attack coming and try to avoid it.

Then there is backstab.

It’s the opposite of all the above.

Unseen, high damaging attack delivered into the target’s back. It’s creepy and feeds people’s paranoia.

A thief stealths up, you don’t know if he ran away, he could be harvesting a nearby node (I sometimes do while SR is up and that zerg failed to aoe bomb my SR. I don’t waste time). If I do that when fighting someone just as my stealth is about to wear off, ooooo that rage when they see me mining bronze ore while they try their best to kill me.

I stealth up. All that goes through my target’s mind is the backstab. I can tell from how widly he keeps turning around that he can feel my breath on his back. I can deliver my attack now or just wait a little longer or even CnD again.

It’s up to me to prolong the uncertainty.

Backstabbing someone is a play of no honour, of course thieves deserve to be hated.

This is exactly why I respect thieves.

Jayden Ennok.3687:

Thief hate, it’s all just human psychology.

A mesmer can down you from full health with one combo. Engi doesn’t even need to use wep skill to down a squishie. Guard gs 5,4 + 2 and few people are downed. The currently hated rapid fire can down you from full HP as well.

Most skills/combos show up in combat log as a bunch of small hits.

Killshot/evis that hit hard as a single skill are not as hated as backstab. You can see them, you can react to the actual attacks. It gives the target hope that he might be able to avoid those attacks. All his utitlies on cd, endurance low, HP low but still he can see the attack coming and try to avoid it.

Then there is backstab.

It’s the opposite of all the above.

Unseen, high damaging attack delivered into the target’s back. It’s creepy and feeds people’s paranoia.

A thief stealths up, you don’t know if he ran away, he could be harvesting a nearby node (I sometimes do while SR is up and that zerg failed to aoe bomb my SR. I don’t waste time). If I do that when fighting someone just as my stealth is about to wear off, ooooo that rage when they see me mining bronze ore while they try their best to kill me.

I stealth up. All that goes through my target’s mind is the backstab. I can tell from how widly he keeps turning around that he can feel my breath on his back. I can deliver my attack now or just wait a little longer or even CnD again.

It’s up to me to prolong the uncertainty.

Backstabbing someone is a play of no honour, of course thieves deserve to be hated.

i like this post

you should write a book

Gabe.6810:

I’ve played a decent amount of sPvP both on my Ele and Ranger and had thought everything was okay- I didn’t get too many people whining when I had an off game and I didn’t get too many people complain when I killed them either.

I started playing my thief in sPvP and it’s horrible.
Use heartseeker any amount greater than 0? “HS noob, uninstall”
Fail to take down another class 1v1? “bad”
Fail to get the top of the score board? “lol can’t play ez class”

Playing the thief is definitely much more difficult than my ranger and about as hard as the Ele- what is it about thieves that make people want to whine?

The short version is that a good Thief has complete or atleast quite a lot of control in any fight. People dont like that and they get frustrated leading to QQing.
They have the potential to burst the life out of enemies if you build and play right, other people think its just a innate thief thing (Thiefs naturally have massive amounts of burst/kill potential when that isnt exactly true) and figure “ez class gtfo”
Also blinding, steal, rolling/dodging and shadow stepping can be incredibly annoying but that falls under controlling the fight i suppose