Guild Wars 2

It feels like Warriors have both more damage and more survivability compared to Thieves.

What makes our class better than the others?
Besides stealth.

it’s not. warrior and guardian are overpowered. thief is the worst class or just about. if it wasn’t for stealth ANET could just delete this class.

Are you guys joking? Warrior is a baseline class. It means it’ll always be the weakest class in PvP because it’s what ANet uses to balance every other class off of. Thieves aren’t in a bad position. We’re right up there with guardians when it comes to survivability. Just because you die to X class doesn’t make it overpowered. It means that you as a player need to utilize your class in a smarter fashion or spec for more survivability in order to overcome situations you repeatedly fail. I haven’t lost a 1v1 to a warrior in months. If you want my analysis of the classes it goes as follows:

1. Guardian
2. Mesmer
3. Engineer
4. Thief
5. Ranger
6. Necro
7. Elementalist
8. Warrior

These are based on recent buffs and nerfs from each class and the overall community standing.

If you don’t have anything nice to say, don’t say it at all.

Your analysis is way off putting necro near the bottom. Here is a more accurate rating.

1. Necro
2. Guardian
3. Engineer
4. Ranger
5. Elementalist
6. Mesmer
7-8. Thief/Warrior

This is based on spvp/tpvp, where team usefulness and capping/holding points comes before mobility and single target dps. Mesmers only so low because the current meta is a all condi and mesmers get rolled by that even tho they have the highest aoe burst.

Thieves just suck because they can’t do aoe condis or aoe physical burst. They are all single target. IMO, this 4s reveal needs to be reverted and a strong hard look at all our weaponsetts needs to take place to bring then in line with d/p. we need burning as a condi to compete with the condi meta. Possibly more base damage on everything.

Viking Jorun.5413:

Are you guys joking? Warrior is a baseline class. It means it’ll always be the weakest class in PvP because it’s what ANet uses to balance every other class off of. Thieves aren’t in a bad position. We’re right up there with guardians when it comes to survivability. Just because you die to X class doesn’t make it overpowered. It means that you as a player need to utilize your class in a smarter fashion or spec for more survivability in order to overcome situations you repeatedly fail. I haven’t lost a 1v1 to a warrior in months. If you want my analysis of the classes it goes as follows:

1. Guardian
2. Mesmer
3. Engineer
4. Thief
5. Ranger
6. Necro
7. Elementalist
8. Warrior

These are based on recent buffs and nerfs from each class and the overall community standing.

If you don’t have anything nice to say, don’t say it at all.

well not everything revolves around sPvP and roaming which is where ANET always balances professions around…
Thief is the worst class for PvE, ZvZ, GvG. overall worst class.

AoE Condi: Caltrops. Good day; learn your class.

Lyru.9380:

It feels like Warriors have both more damage and more survivability compared to Thieves.

What makes our class better than the others?
Besides stealth.

Superior movement and single target burst. It might be that a Warrior has good damage and durability, but the Thief can take multiple single targets out a lot faster, and can pretty easily escape or catch any other profession in the game.

every class has their own role… it is just that no particular build/class can beat all builds and class, when u say 1 on 1 yea its not balance though, but anet didn’t built this game for 1 on 1 purpose

Coloxeus.3480:

every class has their own role… it is just that no particular build/class can beat all builds and class, when u say 1 on 1 yea its not balance though, but anet didn’t built this game for 1 on 1 purpose

colox is right abuot this. but there are builds that “CAN” beat every other build. mesmer has some …thief has some….engie has some.

Travlane.5948:

Coloxeus.3480:

every class has their own role… it is just that no particular build/class can beat all builds and class, when u say 1 on 1 yea its not balance though, but anet didn’t built this game for 1 on 1 purpose

colox is right abuot this. but there are builds that “CAN” beat every other build. mesmer has some …thief has some….engie has some.

so what happens when you put a “build that can beat every other build” vs another “build that can beat every other build”?

Excalibur.9748:

Viking Jorun.5413:

Are you guys joking? Warrior is a baseline class. It means it’ll always be the weakest class in PvP because it’s what ANet uses to balance every other class off of. Thieves aren’t in a bad position. We’re right up there with guardians when it comes to survivability. Just because you die to X class doesn’t make it overpowered. It means that you as a player need to utilize your class in a smarter fashion or spec for more survivability in order to overcome situations you repeatedly fail. I haven’t lost a 1v1 to a warrior in months. If you want my analysis of the classes it goes as follows:

1. Guardian
2. Mesmer
3. Engineer
4. Thief
5. Ranger
6. Necro
7. Elementalist
8. Warrior

These are based on recent buffs and nerfs from each class and the overall community standing.

If you don’t have anything nice to say, don’t say it at all.

well not everything revolves around sPvP and roaming which is where ANET always balances professions around…
Thief is the worst class for PvE, ZvZ, GvG. overall worst class.

agreed with this. also if u count 1 v 1. ele is amazing … s/d is op!!! if u look at it in a usefull spec of “lets pick a team of players lined up against the wall” for like 50v50 the choices would be in this order “roughly”….(in highest demand to lowest)

1) Guardian
2) Necromancer
3) Mesmer
4) Elementalist
5)Warrior
6) Engineer
7) Ranger
8) Thief

Only reason i put ranger over thief is bc they can do decent AOE …AND they can send in pets to soak up dmg…(many skills target 5 people max) which means that pets will get hit and keep players alive longer instead.

Excalibur.9748:

Travlane.5948:

Coloxeus.3480:

every class has their own role… it is just that no particular build/class can beat all builds and class, when u say 1 on 1 yea its not balance though, but anet didn’t built this game for 1 on 1 purpose

colox is right abuot this. but there are builds that “CAN” beat every other build. mesmer has some …thief has some….engie has some.

so what happens when you put a “build that can beat every other build” vs another “build that can beat every other build”?

when you say/read something you cant take it as a definitive/literally understanding. CAN and WILL beat every other build are 2 VERY different things. when you have 2 builds that CAN beat every other build it comes down to who makes the first mistake or who is better at what they do. not every person behind an amazing build is good. and not every amazing player behind and amazing build is going to play without making 1 mistake.

Swinsk, aren’t you forgetting the recent Dhuumfire nerf? And the fact terror damage was nerfed even before that to compensate for Dhuumfire existing in the first place?

I’d say necromancers are still better off than before the changes simply because of the fact power builds are now somewhat viable, but I wouldn’t place them first anymore. Anyway, enough off topic..

Thieves aren’t the biggest tPvP profession at the moment, but based on the few mist league games I’ve seen they’re doing OK. I admit I’ve only watched a handful of games, but there have always been one of two thieves running around, so nothing to complain about there.

For tPvP D/P offers some nice survivability with all the blinds and stealths combined with huge single target damage and S/D boon steal builds make life difficult for boon reliant builds, while all the evasion makes them hard to catch.

Thieves also have arguably the best mobility in the game and even after all the nerfs their burst is nothing to sneeze at. Finally there’s the fact a stealth builds can take on an entire zerg in WvW without too much of a problem.

So what’s all this complaining about?

What’s with me getting ninja’d every time I post something today? O.o

Travlane.5948:

8) Thief

What about those spammable blast finishers thieves have? Assuming there’s at least some degree of communication that’s pretty big deal in larger battles when combined with water or fire fields, to name a few.

yski.7642:

Thieves also have arguably the best mobility in the game and even after all the nerfs their burst is nothing to sneeze at. Finally there’s the fact a stealth builds can take on an entire zerg in WvW without too much of a problem.

True facts, Thieves are definitely the most mobile/easy-escape class in the game at the moment.

yski.7642:

So what’s all this complaining about?

Great question.

I play a mesmer and a thief, and I enjoy playing both in WvW, I use both to run with a zerg, solo roam, and run havoc with my guildies. I also find myself winning similar amounts of duels / 1vXs on both. I also know that I never really fear warriors…though I find their ability to run away slightly annoying…good thing I have access to perma-cripple.

A warrior trading blows with a thief will win – but a well played thief has so many advantages over a warrior in a 1v1 situation. Warriors are decent in zergs – and in that context are about in the middle of the pack….in PvP, I’m told that warriors are one of the worst classes.

Viking Jorun.5413:

AoE Condi: Caltrops. Good day; learn your class.

You think 1 condi that is aoe on a high cd counts as aoe condis? Please compare caltrops to grenades or marks. We have 1 ability that had already been nerfed once and it only applies 1 condition, 2 if you count the hinder. It’s hardly a spamable aoe and easily avoidable.

You need to learn this class IMO.

Bootzilla.4280:

yski.7642:

Thieves also have arguably the best mobility in the game and even after all the nerfs their burst is nothing to sneeze at. Finally there’s the fact a stealth builds can take on an entire zerg in WvW without too much of a problem.

True facts, Thieves are definitely the most mobile/easy-escape class in the game at the moment.

yski.7642:

So what’s all this complaining about?

Great question.

Thieves are the best solo/roamer in wvw.
Thieves are worst zvz in wvw.
Thieves are low tier in spvp, which is what this thread is about.

No one cares about wvw where 90% of your time is spent pveing 10% spent fighting other players.

Thieves may not be the greatest class for bunkering, sure. However, we do excel in roaming points, which is a valuable part of tPvP. Stop whining about the class before you devolve our subforum into the elitist pricks and constant QQ of the warrior forum.

it seems like the constant QQ of the warrior forum is working though, as they get buffed every patch while we get nerfed every patch.

swinsk.6410:

Thieves are the best solo/roamer in wvw.
Thieves are worst zvz in wvw.
Thieves are low tier in spvp, which is what this thread is about.

I agree that thieves aren’t the best ZvZ profession out there, but I disagree with them being the worst. We have spammable blast finishers and decent aoe, the only problem we really have is our fragile nature. But like you said, that’s not what this thread is about so let’s talk about sPvP.

The most competitive PvP we have at the moment is the Mist League, so by looking at the professions used we should get a general idea on the state of the said professions. I’ve only watched a handful of games, but in those games thieves were used just fine. I remember one game having two thieves on one side and two on the other, and most of the games I saw had a thief in it, usually more than one.

Feel free to correct me if you’ve watched more than I have, but based on that thieves are not in fact low tier.

Where do you get that idea from anyway? I see thieves wherever I look in PvP, whether we’re talking about WvW, hot joins or tPvP. Nothing I see indicates that thieves are doing particularly poorly, and based on my own experiences they’re fine as well.

What’s all this complaining about? What do you base it on?

Excalibur.9748:

it seems like the constant QQ of the warrior forum is working though, as they get buffed every patch while we get nerfed every patch.

i like this, i must go to worrior forum and demand more buffs !

how are professions balanced? well, it’s a long and complex process that requires a ton of technical expertise. here’s how it works.

see, first, they put all of every classes skills and traits onto individual post-it notes, then they stick them all on a big all. then they get a chimpanzee, and put a blindfold on the little fella. next, they give him a handful of darts, and let him chuck them at the post-it notes. whichever ones he hits, those are the things that need to be adjusted. that’s a complicated process too. what they do is they roll a d100 to determine the percentage it needs to be adjusted by, and then flip a coin to decide whether it’s a nerf or a buff. each month, they start the whole process over, and then package it all as “major improvements” and hype it up through good old fashioned shameless advertising (read: pimping). if people react well to the changes, the chimpanzee gets a banana. if people flock to the forums to complain, the poor little fella gets 70,000 volts pumped into his neck through his shock collar.

and that’s how professions are balanced.