Guild Wars 2

Okay. I’ve been playing a thief for well over a month in PvP now, and i’ve won a majority of my encounters.

I’ve started to run into more and more bunker eles recently, and I really have tried hard to take them down but I just can’t if they are decent.

Please note that I do not run full glass cannon build either..

TL;DR: How do you counter this?

I am not really experienced, but u can counter this by leaving the fight. Thieves are masters of entering/leaving combat and I see no point in wasting your time, fighting all-day long. An ally may need help somewhere else, meanwhile.

You might want to evaluate whether having an entire utility slot permanently sitting there doing nothing but giving you speed slower than his perma-swiftness is a utility slot well spent. You’re already running swiftness-on-dodge and you seem to be using a lot of range and the occasional immobilize, are you really getting the most out of SoS or is it habit?

You also spent a good amount of time using shortbow without really trying to stack poison up on him. Poison is a good counter to his constant heals.

Stealth is really nice when there’s a chance the opponent might lose focus on you. You didn’t take any heal-on-stealth though, so all it really means in this duel is that he gets a few seconds to stack up boons (really easy for combo field spamming elementalists) while you’re not doing anything productive.

Overall, he is just keeping the momentum for most of the fight, always putting on more boons while occasionally putting conditions on you while you try to position for that perfect opportunity that never comes. You aren’t tanky enough to survive his AEs long enough to put him down in melee and not enough of a threat at a range to harm him with his heals up.

I’m surprised you lived as long as you did, although that probably has more to do with the SB and (player) skill, you have a better chance to kill a bunker ele in melee range because of the higher damage output but that’s the range they also do greater damage to you.

The best option for killing a bunker elementalist is with a dazelock build so that they can’t actually DO anything… worthwhile at any rate.

^ exactly.

have u tried a 1v1 dueling a balanced build guardian? lol good luck.

back on topic: you have to kite, thief shines in initiation and leaving for a reset. If a thief fight somone head on, if they are decent they will outlast any thieves.

Wilhelmryan.9203:

If a thief fight somone head on, if they are decent they will outlast any thieves.

With his build, yes. You can build a thief to be sustainably powerful, but the best option for him in a non-duel situation would likely have been to disengage and re-engage when the elementalist didn’t have six boons and a lock on his location.

Tulisin.6945:

You might want to evaluate whether having an entire utility slot permanently sitting there doing nothing but giving you speed slower than his perma-swiftness is a utility slot well spent. You’re already running swiftness-on-dodge and you seem to be using a lot of range and the occasional immobilize, are you really getting the most out of SoS or is it habit?

You also spent a good amount of time using shortbow without really trying to stack poison up on him. Poison is a good counter to his constant heals.

Stealth is really nice when there’s a chance the opponent might lose focus on you. You didn’t take any heal-on-stealth though, so all it really means in this duel is that he gets a few seconds to stack up boons (really easy for combo field spamming elementalists) while you’re not doing anything productive.

Overall, he is just keeping the momentum for most of the fight, always putting on more boons while occasionally putting conditions on you while you try to position for that perfect opportunity that never comes. You aren’t tanky enough to survive his AEs long enough to put him down in melee and not enough of a threat at a range to harm him with his heals up.

SoS is an addiction of mine, and I figured it can be handy to get out of an ele’s AE’s quicker, especially when my endurance is depleted. I also like it to stay on top of the ele when I go into melee.

Poison, yeah, I should’ve threw more fields down…I would imagine the ele just curing it off and getting out of the field ASAP though.

Duckzor.4327:

Poison, yeah, I should’ve threw more fields down…I would imagine the ele just curing it off and getting out of the field ASAP though.

This, right here. This is a shift in momentum. If he has to use a combo or skill to achieve condition removal he has begun to play reactively. If he has to move out of a field you’re achieving control over his movement. Forcing him to expend resources and become reactive is how you’re going to create the opening you need to seal the deal, not running around and letting him build momentum while you try not to die.

The weakness of stealth is that it lets the enemy think ahead to “what do I need to do to prepare for when the fight starts again” instead of keeping them in the here-and-now or (ideally) a move behind you.

Bunker eles can remove a lot of conditions.

Staff Eles:
Water 5 (healing rain) continuously provides regen, see the trait related in the list below.
Traits:

• Most important one: regen removes 1 full stack of conditions when applied by self
• Cantrips grant regen (most take 2 cantrips, some take auto armour of earth)
• Switching to water removes a condition and grants regen
• Dodge roll in water is a blast finisher and cleansing wave (removes condition and heals)
• And their glyph heal in water grants 1 x regen (2 x regen if they are wearing dwayna gear).

Look for the water attunement swap (big burst of water coming out of them), shortly after will be a water field. You will have to immobilize them after the change to water and before they can dodge into this field as they will likely get a chunk of their health back and remove your conditions. Apply pressure with your other conditions if you have any, chill and bleed maybe some immobilize and possibly weakness. I would hold off on poison and weakness till you know they need to heal, then I would try to apply a quick bleed to try to shield your weakness, and weakness to try to shield your poison. The conditions will work against his geyser heal, but healing rain will remove all of your conditions quite quickly, so when that is up, don’t blow your cds, it will be on quite a long cd when used (bout 30-40sec from memory).

Not 100% sure which order conditions are removed, you may want to do some testing or research here but you don’t want the poison removed and you don’t want the weakness removed if he is going to dodge (double recharge on endurance, reduces the amount he can dodge combo field (for heal or might)). Repeat this strat till he is low, then go for imob to backstab to finisher move.

There are some other things you could do, such as chill but I believe your class lacks chill, also hitting him hard at the start will force his reaction into healing, putting the healing rain on cd. Geyser will still be available to him but the field size is much smaller and rolling into it is harder, an immobilize when you see that up will stop a good deal of healing. He may also keep his rain for a “rainy day” (see what I did their) as it removes a lot of conditions, so starting with short cd conditions (a fair few different ones if possible) would also help to put HR on cd.

Once Geyser and HR are on cd and he switches attunement (noted by a blast looking effect that isn’t blue in colour) he will have only his heal skill left (and the cantrips, watch for mist form) and you can proceed to kick his but for 9 seconds (6 if he uses mist form and as long as you can interrupt the heal). Note: he will also probably have a lot of regen on him, 5 sec of double regen (water effect last 5 sec on attune switch) and most likely protection and vigor as well as 2 dodges up his sleeve.

Don’t try to outlast a bunker spec in prolonged fights when playing a burst spec.
Burn all your initiative on a burst, run if it fails>repeat.
Or get a teammate to help you.
Or cap another point.
You have the luxury of being able to pick your fights, use that ability.

TGSlasher.1458:

Bunker eles can remove a lot of conditions.

Staff Eles:
Water 5 (healing rain) continuously provides regen, see the trait related in the list below.
Traits:

• Most important one: regen removes 1 full stack of conditions when applied by self
• Cantrips grant regen (most take 2 cantrips, some take auto armour of earth)
• Switching to water removes a condition and grants regen
• Dodge roll in water is a blast finisher and cleansing wave (removes condition and heals)
• And their glyph heal in water grants 1 x regen (2 x regen if they are wearing dwayna gear).

Look for the water attunement swap (big burst of water coming out of them), shortly after will be a water field. You will have to immobilize them after the change to water and before they can dodge into this field as they will likely get a chunk of their health back and remove your conditions. Apply pressure with your other conditions if you have any, chill and bleed maybe some immobilize and possibly weakness. I would hold off on poison and weakness till you know they need to heal, then I would try to apply a quick bleed to try to shield your weakness, and weakness to try to shield your poison. The conditions will work against his geyser heal, but healing rain will remove all of your conditions quite quickly, so when that is up, don’t blow your cds, it will be on quite a long cd when used (bout 30-40sec from memory).

Not 100% sure which order conditions are removed, you may want to do some testing or research here but you don’t want the poison removed and you don’t want the weakness removed if he is going to dodge (double recharge on endurance, reduces the amount he can dodge combo field (for heal or might)). Repeat this strat till he is low, then go for imob to backstab to finisher move.

There are some other things you could do, such as chill but I believe your class lacks chill, also hitting him hard at the start will force his reaction into healing, putting the healing rain on cd. Geyser will still be available to him but the field size is much smaller and rolling into it is harder, an immobilize when you see that up will stop a good deal of healing. He may also keep his rain for a “rainy day” (see what I did their) as it removes a lot of conditions, so starting with short cd conditions (a fair few different ones if possible) would also help to put HR on cd.

Once Geyser and HR are on cd and he switches attunement (noted by a blast looking effect that isn’t blue in colour) he will have only his heal skill left (and the cantrips, watch for mist form) and you can proceed to kick his but for 9 seconds (6 if he uses mist form and as long as you can interrupt the heal). Note: he will also probably have a lot of regen on him, 5 sec of double regen (water effect last 5 sec on attune switch) and most likely protection and vigor as well as 2 dodges up his sleeve.

Thanks man, this is some really useful stuff. I’ve never played as an ele so this is all new information to me.

My main sPvP toon is ele, the staff build I’m talking about is the general support/bunker one. I don’t use that build, I use a similar variant with dagger dagger and super protection duration. That build is my friends staff build, so I know most of its ins and outs, helped him build it pre beta (of course they changed some things, no more free mist form). Just watch for those heals, and try to poison at the right time, 33% less healing for him. But if its removed, its a waisted cd or init