Guild Wars 2

with the inc changes, they made invigorating precision and ricochet on the same trait line. I’ve been using those two together to sustain better. Maybe add a damage reduction while channeling unload? I just want p/p to be a little more viable lol.

I’ve played a lot of p/p in both WvW and sPvP. You don’t need IP. Ricochet is far superior. I’m excited about the idea of either DA/SA/Trick or DA/Acro/Trick. Before, you had to choose between damage and survivability, now you dont have to. I might even go for the troll SA/Acro/Trick since you still have high damage without Crit Strikes.

Running CS/Acro/Trick … prolly swapping to DA/Acro/Trick, depending on how the specialization’s trait line works out.

P/P has some intriguing possibilities now and will be easier to train for as they put the most important p/p traits in one line.

To IP over Ricochet. Ricochet is a very good skill but only rewards when fighting in larger groups. In small scale battles it can be a detriment.

I am intrigued by the possibility of IP with Guarded initiation. there a number of combos that provide for different possibilities but this one would be x/6/x/6/x.

IP along with a few other sources of heal (som as example) does help to keep your health near high. If one plays with low vitality you can keep your health near 100 percent.

Now I am speculating traiting for boon duration in some manner so as to get that resistance up to 8 seconds.

P/P was always susceptible to conditions and for 8 of ten seconds you can be immune to them. IP is key here as it helps keep that health up. Of all the sets I think P/P benefits most by having attributes taken away from traitlines . You can now focus on the build you want rather then worry about lack of crits/vitality and the like.

P/P will be awesome post patch as a condition weapon. Headshot interrupts cause torment, Steal has confusion, Sneak attacks, Needle Trap on Withdraw, Immob spam and maybe venoms. The possibilities!

Rome.3192:

P/P will be awesome post patch as a condition weapon. Headshot interrupts cause torment, Steal has confusion, Sneak attacks, Needle Trap on Withdraw, Immob spam and maybe venoms. The possibilities!

Yep this too. These changes will go a long ways towards diversifying builds. Roll more thieves!!

Unfortunately I to was rubbing IP and Ricochet, both combined with 100% crit chance and Signet of Malice. Out was something I loved, as on an average unload I could be healing 4.5k or more. I think I’ve accepted my fate however, and I might end up going to venom share if nothing else changes. Perhaps condi p/p might be worth looking into.

I struggle to see why Ricochet has been moved to a Grandmaster trait. Hasn’t there been enough rumbling about P/P being week and now to take one of the traits we can get to help it and moving it to GM level seems crazy. It isn’t even being buffed, just moved up and in a place where you have to choose between it and IP which it did go well with.

I’m not too excited for the future of P/P. Maybe conditions will be improved, but in general open world play it is worthless today.

Condi P/P perplexity will be terrifying in WvW.
Confusion AND torment on interrupts… AND more confusion on steal, with long-lasting blind potential? I’m dreading this happening.

VShare is also getting nerfed hard in this change. Leeching Venoms is getting a 1s ICD, meaning you can only optimize venoms by attacking only once per second…

Ekhetrima.9651:

I struggle to see why Ricochet has been moved to a Grandmaster trait. Hasn’t there been enough rumbling about P/P being week and now to take one of the traits we can get to help it and moving it to GM level seems crazy. It isn’t even being buffed, just moved up and in a place where you have to choose between it and IP which it did go well with.

I’m not too excited for the future of P/P. Maybe conditions will be improved, but in general open world play it is worthless today.

I suggested to increase the bonus range from Ricochet to 300 to make up for it but that didn’t seem popular.

What about add something in the trait line which makes you take less damage from crippled foes? Maybe to Ricochet or Ankle Shot.

I think they are going to rework PP to be either full power or full condi, and then make rifle whatever PP isn’t.

Snakebyte.2804:

I think they are going to rework PP to be either full power or full condi, and then make rifle whatever PP isn’t.

Let’s hope for that (and for 1200).

P/P will definitely have to take DA, here’s why;

Trapper’s Respite — this trait is a great complement for Withdraw, which more than likely place the trap at the end of the roll securing your distance with a Needle Trap.

Revealed Training — this trait is a great choice for Rune of Trapper builds where traps will consistently place the Thief with +200 power.

Exposed Weakness — this is a trait that I’ve picked as a staple in my build since Pistol AA consistently applies bleeding.

Potent Poison — this is the default choice for the DA traitline since the other GM trait depends on the build.

Why not Executioner? This is mainly due to the fact that this trait does nothing when target is at > 50% HP (mainly personal choice).

CS offers very little to P/P. Ankle Shot is nice only because of cripple but as far as damage, DA’s Exposed Weakness already gives that bonus as a minor trait.

Taking both DA and CS would be really risky, but might bring a lot of fun. As for me, it’s either DA or CS, not both, and I pick DA for my 60066 build.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

CS offers very little to P/P. Ankle Shot is nice only because of cripple but as far as damage, DA’s Exposed Weakness already gives that bonus as a minor trait.

Ankle shot actually gives you also 10% damage increase.
They merged Pistol Mastery and Ankle Shot in 1, so for a DPS build with P/P, you should probably roll with it in the future.

Lady Minuit.3186:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

CS offers very little to P/P. Ankle Shot is nice only because of cripple but as far as damage, DA’s Exposed Weakness already gives that bonus as a minor trait.

Ankle shot actually gives you also 10% damage increase.
They merged Pistol Mastery and Ankle Shot in 1, so for a DPS build with P/P, you should probably roll with it in the future.

I did acknowledge that. That’s why I said;

Taking both DA and CS would be really risky, but might bring a lot of fun.

Since we’d probably want to go into CS anyways since that is where all the pistol traits are being hosted, maybe we could use SoM for our heal and pick up the 5 might stacks on signet use? I know Withdraw will be better for using normally with trapper runes + Trapper’s Respite, but SoM has the same cooldown and nothing else in the Adept tier for CS is any good. This would give us passive healing in-between activating the signet, and when we active we get 5 might stacks + stealth + trap.

My main concern is condi removal without taking SA (trickery is a must). Perhaps since we want a signet we can also take signet of agility, along with shadowstep maybe that would provide enough condi removal.

It’s an interesting idea. Honestly I feel like it won’t work for pvp though because you really need the condi removal from somewhere. I just don’t see how you can fit that into the build without sacrificing CS for SA, and at that point you may as well just go p/d since you aren’t using the pistol specific traits.

I want a Sigil of Generosity as a trait in CS, that would make it possible.

Quinci.5968:

Since we’d probably want to go into CS anyways since that is where all the pistol traits are being hosted, maybe we could use SoM for our heal and pick up the 5 might stacks on signet use? I know Withdraw will be better for using normally with trapper runes + Trapper’s Respite, but SoM has the same cooldown and nothing else in the Adept tier for CS is any good. This would give us passive healing in-between activating the signet, and when we active we get 5 might stacks + stealth + trap.

The advantage of Withdraw over SoM is that Withdraw removes Immobilization, which is one of the most hated condition because if you don’t cleanse that, more than likely you’ll die.

My main concern is condi removal without taking SA (trickery is a must). Perhaps since we want a signet we can also take signet of agility, along with shadowstep maybe that would provide enough condi removal.

This part depends on what rune and sigil you take. With CS, you can take advantage of “on crit” sigil to heal and remove conditions. There are runes that reduce the effect of conditions. You don’t necessarily have to pick a trait to deal with conditions. SA is nice but it needs more polish. As it was previewed, SA is not worth taking.

It’s an interesting idea. Honestly I feel like it won’t work for pvp though because you really need the condi removal from somewhere. I just don’t see how you can fit that into the build without sacrificing CS for SA, and at that point you may as well just go p/d since you aren’t using the pistol specific traits.

I highly doubt that the new specs will make P/P viable in PvP. The problem of P/P lies within its weapon skills.

I want a Sigil of Generosity as a trait in CS, that would make it possible.

This is unnecessary. If you are really concern about conditions, then try to build around Guarded Initiation. That trait might even complement SoM P/P builds.

EDIT: Forgot to mention. Trickster makes all Tricks a condition removal.

One issue I see with the CS line is the lack of precision or fury. Thieves did in fact lose a number of boons with the proposed patch and will now only source fury from trickery line.

Unlike other professions none of our weapon sets OR utilities offer fury outside that short one on shadow trap and with this change we lose Furious retaliation. That loss in game terms is some 34 percent crit chance when considering the precision we used to get in CS. (A net loss of 34 percent from training that line also makes IP less appealing as precision and crit chance will have to be sourced elsewhere instead of being inherent to the traitline)

Given precision is being pulled out of the CS line someone wanting a high rate of crits will no longer go down that trait line. This means the thief wanting a high crit rate will trend towards trickery.

A thief with p/p going 6/6/0/0/6 will not have a lot in the way of survival so either DA or CS will need to be dropped and I just do not see CS having enough to carry p/p even as the pistol traits in that line. Traits adding a higher Critical hit chance are distinctly inferior to fury and are predicated upon having full health or to the side.