Guild Wars 2

Edit: Well, this got moved to the Thief forum, where only thieves who believe their class is Underpowered and totally fine will come and bash and give me “advise” on how I failed to swing my weapon to the air and spam all my AoE and put it in CD in the hope that one tick will tickle their hp similar to mine in which case I have no skill that could put out 8k of damage to counter his 8k backstabds and 6-7k HS, while resseting the fights at will.

How in the world is it balanced to just die to a backstab that hits you for 8.5k out of the blue, wearing PVT/valk accesories and weapons, with no way of blocking it, with no counterplay involved, followed by two 3k HS (pray none crits., because then you are looking at 6-7k HS easily). Where is the counterplay to that? Dont tel me that zerg because I was in a zerg, the guy came in backstab, HS, stealth on top of me, nobody could do shiznit about it, stomped me and walked away with 50% hp.

Stealth is out of control, I understand its good to get the jump on people, but I have been hit by 11k backstabs with my squishy equipment, I was wearing PVT/valk weapon and accessories, yet it hit me for 8.5k. EDIT: 10.5khp for berzerker, we have the lowest hp pool in the game, have I been full zerker I would have literally died in one hit, with zerker I get hit with 11k backtabs all the time.

Either you need to reworkout the whole hp from eles or move the damage from backstab to something that ACTUALLY GIVE THE THIEF SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT, A RISK, right now it is incredibly dumb how they can pop out of stealth, kill you in literally less than a sec with Backstab HS HS and there is no counter to this unless you have stealth of your own or have aegis to save your butt.

I used arcane shield, it blocked two attacks, none revealed the thief, he kjust backed away until it disappeared, so no, thats not the counter, a good counter would be IF IT REVEALED THEM , but NOOooooo, we cant have a thief having to do any thinking on enemies CD, he could’ve ignored the shield anyways, the damage isnt enough to kill him if it explodes anyways.

EDIT Wow people, do you mind if you read before you post? You guys just assumed all I said was “wahh wahh thief OP nerf damage”. All I said is they need some countering, some counterplay, its pretty stupid they are the only class with access to the most uncounterable mechanic, been able to spam it and get the hardest hitting spell in the game which not even aegis can save you from.
But its ok, i guess at the end of the day we all just gotta roll guardians and mesmers.

Picts related

There simply is no balance, to assume there is was your mistake.

There is no reason to play anything other than Warrior for PvE or Guard in WvW

Anything else and you’re automatically gimping yourself, just look at the numbers.

Sure you can “like” other classes, but we’re talking about numbers and balance. Nothing self-heals as much or deals as much damage than the warrior in PvE and nothing brings as much or lives as long as a guard in zerg WvW. Its not even a close call either, we’re talking DOUBLE the values most of the time.

Its just silly how a select few classes get the tools for the job and the rest get shafted. Buff everybody else to be on par? Nope, not in my game!

Sorry but it is completely impossible to be using PTVitality armor and only have 12.5k health…even for an ele.

L2P, it’s that simple.

If you actually spent some time thinking about how to counter the thief instead of complaining that it should be nerfed, you wouldn’t be having a problem.

DargorV.8571:

There simply is no balance, to assume there is was your mistake.

There is no reason to play anything other than Warrior for PvE or Guard in WvW

Anything else and you’re automatically gimping yourself, just look at the numbers.

Sure you can “like” other classes, but we’re talking about numbers and balance. Nothing self-heals as much or deals as much damage than the warrior in PvE and nothing brings as much or lives as long as a guard in zerg WvW. Its not even a close call either, we’re talking DOUBLE the values most of the time.

Its just silly how a select few classes get the tools for the job and the rest get shafted. Buff everybody else to be on par? Nope, not in my game!

Yet again more false information. Warrior is not even the highest DPS if you actually read the spreadsheets. Stop making wrong assumptions.

http://youtu.be/PWQ-39_C8LI

Tell me again how warriors are just double damage than everything. You are wrong.

sirflamesword.3896:

Sorry but it is completely impossible to be using PTVitality armor and only have 12.5k health…even for an ele.

read, only the acc and weapons, some of them valk though, nonetheless, 12.5k hp DOES have PVT on it, if you dont believe me make one yourself, they have 10.5k hp base.

Then why are you even posting? A thief did the only thing he can do, he ganked you.

Dog.1472:

L2P,

Oh look, another “l2p” reply, because having a game where you have skills so telegraphed that even a cripple grandma can get out of it before it goes off is ok (ALL of staff skills, seriously, you can see them coming a mile away) but we have skill that are LITERALLY uncouterable such as backstabs that leave you near dead and that is if you are at full health, cuz it it hits you anywhere below 70-80% hp you are a as dead as a possum on a expressway, the other one being stealth, which I dont know if you have ever bothered to sue the"traps" in WvW but they take time setting down, resources and are aline at your feet, so no, this is NOT a coutnerplay.

In PvP in the same deal. Im sorry but I will judge that you are a thief player (and if you arent then you play them quite often). I hav played thief myself, I felt disgusted and deleted it as soon as I realized poorly balanced it is

The proper way to react is to use mist form not that shield or you will die.

Next go to ele forum and ask for help about how to fight paper thieves aka berserker thieves. Finally, how can u only have 12k with ptv armor?

Also the fact that you let him attack you fast enough to burn through your shield says more about you than than the balance.

sirflamesword.3896:

Then why are you even posting? A thief did the only thing he can do, he ganked you.

How about this? he can also cap points, follow in a zerg, secure objectives, scout, give mass stealth to an entire party, carry resources, carry resources without been seeing.

“all he can do is gank” Wrong, just wrong. He can do jsut about everything everyone else can, minus sieging walls in WvW, but then again, only a couple of classes can do it anyways, so this is not a big deal.

All I ask is a fair chance for fighting back, but right now you HAVE to go in zerg because fear of thieves (no, there arent a few of them, they are freaking everywhere, they have quite the amount in WvW, and all thanks to the uncounterable stealth which gives them perma safety) because seen one is sure-death if you arent a guardian or have stealth.

No, this is porly designed and I will keep complaining until it gets fixed, this is the mayor deterrent in WvW and sPvP for people, along with having to not only deal with death but the fee of having to repair your euipment

I’ve played every class. You shouldn’t have deleted your thief. If you played it longer, you would know that you are not untouchable in stealth. You are invisible, that’s it. Knowing that you can assume where the thief is going to be and what they’re doing. You can lay down attacks and kill them, you can use mist form so they can’t backstab you and their stealth wears out. You can even dodge it.

Now, if I was using a staff, I’d probably be dead. Plain and simple, some builds don’t work in 1v1, like a staff Ele. That isn’t unbalance. That’s rock being better than scissors.

I’ve been killed by thieves and I’ve killed plenty of them too. If you think there’s nothing you can do, the problem is you, not the class.

Small suggestion: Cloak and Dagger is relatively telegraphed and costs quite a lot of energy. Dodging it will mess up the thief combo as they now have to blow a CD to get in stealth or try to cast it again further draining their energy.

If he does that when you are wearing a couple of pieces of PVT gear(or a few points into toughness traitline) then you can come on here and whine about it, till then no one should really care.

silvermember.8941:

The proper way to react is to use mist form not that shield or you will die.

Cant attack using the mist form, cant heal using mist form, cant use regular skills using it, it has been nerfed to the ground, right now in WvW you use it for gfetting into keeps, because while it gives you an effective 3 seconds of invul it also makes you completely worthless for 3 secs and only delay your imminent death since you did nothing to help yourself

silvermember.8941:

Next go to ele forum and ask for help about how to fight paper thieves aka berserker thieves. Finally, how can u only have 12k with ptv armor?

Please, I ask of you and everyone else who keeps posting without fully reading;
READ, kitten , PVT accs and weapon, rest in zerker because I need the DPS to come from somewhere.
And no thank on the ele forums we are also fed up with thieves, we know they are OP and we are trying to make that change, bother to check it every now and then and stop laying thieves and you will see why we complain.

silvermember.8941:

Also the fact that you let him attack you fast enough to burn through your shield says more about you than than the balance.

Yah, please tell me more about how Backstab and HS have internal cooldowns…..

Fortus.6175:

How about this? he can also cap points, follow in a zerg, secure objectives, scout, give mass stealth to an entire party, carry resources, carry resources without been seeing.

A level one Eng in whites can do 4/7 of those :P Try a bunker Ele in WvW, they tend to laugh at my thief. Granted, he’s not a zerker, nor D/D.

sirflamesword.3896:

If he does that when you are wearing a couple of pieces of PVT gear(or a few points into toughness traitline) then you can come on here and whine about it, till then no one should really care.

really, just really? Did you even bother to read the OP?

There should be an option to delete this stuff, why do people bother to post things without reading first?!

Fortus.6175:

sirflamesword.3896:

If he does that when you are wearing a couple of pieces of PVT gear(or a few points into toughness traitline) then you can come on here and whine about it, till then no one should really care.

really, just really? Did you even bother to read the OP?

There should be an option to delete this stuff, why do people bother to post things without reading first?!

I’m talking actual armor not just the ~200-300 toughness you get from a weapon and a piece or 2 of jewelry. And read the stuff about trait lines please.

This is why thieves keep getting nerfed. I’m tired of it. You can all complain about how “OP” thieves are, but in reality you don’t understand them. When I tell you to learn to play one to learn to beat one, I mean it. We don’t need anymore of these “thief OP nerf plz omg” threads. Our name as thieves is already soiled by people who play the class solely for the stupid high burst damage, and every nerf to backstab thieves is a nerf to every other thief build. Please learn to play a thief before you make your next post about us in this forum.

Tired of it,
~Kid Legacy, Team Legacy [TL]

EDIT: Balance is an illusion. Zacchary.6183, a fellow thief made an excellent post not a few days ago describing the difference between true imbalance and cyclical imbalance. It really is a matter of L2P. Get over it.

ALSO: Your screenshot shows the result of combat over 1 minute, not 1 second.

I wonder how many times do we have to say that it’s not kittening fun to fight a cheesy thief before they finally balance it?

The game’s PvP is poorly balanced, period.

Thieves are the mayor offenders, most of the “counterplays” Im giving are general and rely on the thief making a mistake, implying that you would have to play perfectly and wait for an enemy mistake to have a fighting chance, that is a flawed logic right there. True balance is achieved when skills level are the same, regardless of whether high or low the out come of the battle is decided by good plays, forcing the enemy to make a “mistake”, having an equal chance of retaliation for both parties.

Right now I think most thieves have learned not to deviate too much from this near fool-proof strategy;

8 9 1 222 6, if; target not dead: 1 222, 8 if out of CD, 5 if enough initiative.

Im sorry, but thats dumb. Move the damage awa from backstab onto other skills, have HS have a internal CD of 1 sec, backstab have a internal CD of 15-20 secs

How many times do we have to say, you can’t go full kitten and still win every fight until people finally get the picture and L2P?

You need to get over yourself and come to the realization that you are a bad player and some people are better than you. Now get better yourself.

Fortus.6175:

backstab have a internal CD of 15-20 secs

I’d like to use [Sneak Attack] more than once every 15-20 seconds, thanks. Not all thieves are D/D….. seriously.

Also I don’t s/t-pvp, but from what I’ve read they don’t exist in the higher tiers.

Thief’s can not cap while stealthed. Also a mesmer does a better job at party stealths.

Viking Jorun.5413:

This is why thieves keep getting nerfed. I’m tired of it. You can all complain about how “OP” thieves are, but in reality you don’t understand them. When I tell you to learn to play one to learn to beat one, I mean it. We don’t need anymore of these “thief OP nerf plz omg” threads. Our name as thieves is already soiled by people who play the class solely for the stupid high burst damage, and every nerf to backstab thieves is a nerf to every other thief build. Please learn to play a thief before you make your next post about us in this forum.

Tired of it,
~Kid Legacy, Team Legacy [TL]

EDIT: Balance is an illusion. Zacchary.6183, a fellow thief made an excellent post not a few days ago describing the difference between true imbalance and cyclical imbalance. It really is a matter of L2P. Get over it.

ALSO: Your screenshot shows the result of combat over 1 minute, not 1 second.

" WAHHHHH I cant stand the thought of my class getting balanced!!" Face it, they do their job of kill too darn well, too well, uncouterably well. Its not fun to fight them, even if they were to be “balanced”, which they arent.

At the “ALSO”, were you droped as a…….ahh forget it. Look at the time, there is such as a thing called CLOCK KEEPS GOING, the fight happened at the end of 7:00, hence why it goes all the way to 7:01, if you look closer at the CD of the shield and look it up, look at the current time on the mini you will see that it says 7:02, you make the math, 75 secs CD on the shield and used it right before the backstab wich is when he went into stealth for 1 sec

Tamaki Revolution.3548:

Fortus.6175:

backstab have a internal CD of 15-20 secs

I’d like to use [Sneak Attack] more than once every 15-20 seconds, thanks. Not all thieves are D/D….. seriously.

I’m D/D, but not some burst build. I run my own condition D/D point control build.

at this time it is obvious thief is the faceroll class all the noobs will have it and tell others to l2p since their class requires no skill at all

even on pure toughness builds thiefs will land up to 7k damage thats 3.5k armor average

if anythign it is not the thief’s fault but how poorly armor scales and the fact theres no damage reduction against conditions.

Viking Jorun.5413:

I’m D/D, but not some burst build. I run my own condition D/D point control build.

There’s that also :P OP’s rage just seems mainly directed at D/D’s, main reason I brought it up.

Tamaki Revolution.3548:

Also I don’t s/t-pvp, but from what I’ve read they don’t exist in the higher tiers.

Nah they exist and are in a good spot I’d say. The recent EU qualifiers had plenty of them.

Fortus.6175:

Viking Jorun.5413:

This is why thieves keep getting nerfed. I’m tired of it. You can all complain about how “OP” thieves are, but in reality you don’t understand them. When I tell you to learn to play one to learn to beat one, I mean it. We don’t need anymore of these “thief OP nerf plz omg” threads. Our name as thieves is already soiled by people who play the class solely for the stupid high burst damage, and every nerf to backstab thieves is a nerf to every other thief build. Please learn to play a thief before you make your next post about us in this forum.

Tired of it,
~Kid Legacy, Team Legacy [TL]

EDIT: Balance is an illusion. Zacchary.6183, a fellow thief made an excellent post not a few days ago describing the difference between true imbalance and cyclical imbalance. It really is a matter of L2P. Get over it.

ALSO: Your screenshot shows the result of combat over 1 minute, not 1 second.

" WAHHHHH I cant stand the thought of my class getting balanced!!" Face it, they do their job of kill too darn well, too well, uncouterably well. Its not fun to fight them, even if they were to be “balanced”, which they arent.

At the “ALSO”, were you droped as a…….ahh forget it. Look at the time, there is such as a thing called CLOCK KEEPS GOING, the gith happened at the end of 7:00, hence why it goes all the way to 7:01, if you look closer at the CD of the shield and look it up, loo at the current time on the mini you will see that it says 7:02, you make the math, 75 secs CD on the shield and used it right before the backstab wich is when he went into stealth for 1 sec

That doesn’t mean that the thief did it in less than 1 second. I highly doubt that he was at full health when he was attacked by the thief. A smart backstab thief never goes after an enemy with full health (unless they’re up leveled) just as a lion never goes after a fully-grown gazelle. It goes after the injured and the young. We only see a small portion of the combat log, and judging by his claim to be wearing PTV, I’d say that he had just stepped away from his zerg while a roaming thief was picking off stragglers and injured. Just because a thief can burst you down doesn’t mean they’re OP. A warrior can deal 33k damage with 100 Blades and combined with a stun lock there’s nothing you can do about it. Nobody ever says, “OMG WARRIORS OP.” There’s plenty you can do about a backstab thief. Learn it.

Wolfheart.1938:

Tamaki Revolution.3548:

Also I don’t s/t-pvp, but from what I’ve read they don’t exist in the higher tiers.

Nah they exist and are in a good spot I’d say. The recent EU qualifiers had plenty of them.

yeah, people will believe anything that is convinient to them. To all those who think there arent thieves in high tiers, bother to watch some of those games, play yourself sPvP and you will see how much they actually are in there. Stop tinking they suck, there is a reason they are so strong in PvP, an d thats because they are too effective at killing even in 2v2 and 3v3 scenarios.

Viking Jorun.5413:

Fortus.6175:

Viking Jorun.5413:

This is why thieves keep getting nerfed. I’m tired of it. You can all complain about how “OP” thieves are, but in reality you don’t understand them. When I tell you to learn to play one to learn to beat one, I mean it. We don’t need anymore of these “thief OP nerf plz omg” threads. Our name as thieves is already soiled by people who play the class solely for the stupid high burst damage, and every nerf to backstab thieves is a nerf to every other thief build. Please learn to play a thief before you make your next post about us in this forum.

Tired of it,
~Kid Legacy, Team Legacy [TL]

EDIT: Balance is an illusion. Zacchary.6183, a fellow thief made an excellent post not a few days ago describing the difference between true imbalance and cyclical imbalance. It really is a matter of L2P. Get over it.

ALSO: Your screenshot shows the result of combat over 1 minute, not 1 second.

" WAHHHHH I cant stand the thought of my class getting balanced!!" Face it, they do their job of kill too darn well, too well, uncouterably well. Its not fun to fight them, even if they were to be “balanced”, which they arent.

At the “ALSO”, were you droped as a…….ahh forget it. Look at the time, there is such as a thing called CLOCK KEEPS GOING, the gith happened at the end of 7:00, hence why it goes all the way to 7:01, if you look closer at the CD of the shield and look it up, loo at the current time on the mini you will see that it says 7:02, you make the math, 75 secs CD on the shield and used it right before the backstab wich is when he went into stealth for 1 sec

That doesn’t mean that the thief did it in less than 1 second. I highly doubt that he was at full health when he was attacked by the thief. A smart backstab thief never goes after an enemy with full health (unless they’re up leveled) just as a lion never goes after a fully-grown gazelle. It goes after the injured and the young. We only see a small portion of the combat log, and judging by his claim to be wearing PTV, I’d say that he had just stepped away from his zerg while a roaming thief was picking off stragglers and injured. Just because a thief can burst you down doesn’t mean they’re OP. A warrior can deal 33k damage with 100 Blades and combined with a stun lock there’s nothing you can do about it. Nobody ever says, “OMG WARRIORS OP.” There’s plenty you can do about a backstab thief. Learn it.

Wrong, was full health, off CD, we were doing a 7vs7 fight, fight had started at our doors, he came in, did cloack, stealth, backstab and HS, stealth stomp, moved away, as simple as that, no extra fights, no nothing, just that, there was an ele attacking me as well and which was my target, I had just moved into his range, as you can probably see from the stray 1k lightings. The major offendor was thief, plain and simple.

Fortus.6175:

Wolfheart.1938:

Tamaki Revolution.3548:

Also I don’t s/t-pvp, but from what I’ve read they don’t exist in the higher tiers.

Nah they exist and are in a good spot I’d say. The recent EU qualifiers had plenty of them.

yeah, people will believe anything that is convinient to them. To all those who think there arent thieves in high tiers, bother to watch some of those games, play yourself sPvP and you will see how much they actually are in there. Stop tinking they suck, there is a reason they are so strong in PvP, an d thats because they are too effective at killing even in 2v2 and 3v3 scenarios.

Never said they sucked, I was just misinformed. Like I said, I don’t pvp, I just like to read random forum sections sometimes :P

I have seen and have experienced both sides of the argument here, as long as one runs around with the mindset and focus of “omg theres a thief around here, let me be ready to D up” then you will not be blown up, on the other hand if you are just playing the game doing your part in the war effort a thief will stealth to you, drop an incredible amount of hp off your health bar before you can react, no matter what gear you are wearing, there is nothing you can do about it, I do this all the time on my thief, I will perma stealth to the back of the pack and drop at least 4-5 players into downstate before they can react and run away scratch free. When I am on my Necro I play very defensively, so I do not get bursted down in a second, I very rarely get killed by thieves now but its my main focus when roaming or back of the pack. Thief is squishy overall they will drop to aoes very fast, but its a big guessing game of trying to find where they are when they start blinking around in stealth.

To me playing against and with a thief feels a bit broken, every other class you see coming so you can counter properly, a thief the only way to counter their opener is by guessing, you time your guess wrong and watch your hp bar disappear, but if you are able to see a thief coming you can kill them very easily with almost any build fairly quickly. Right now thieves do not have many viable/strong builds, you nerf their stealth and burst abilities to much and all you will have is an auto attacking thief waiting to die.

just reduce the damage so they cant down you but they can still hurt you and run away. I dont play thief and i hate getting killed by them but if they nerf thief theres not much else they can do. Thats what a thief is. A stealthy assassinator who steals your money right before he downs you.

There is a group of thieves, I call them a wolf pack, running WvW in our current matchup. Four of them to be exact. Now I will give them credit as they did put me down a few times but with the proper counter party we have utterly destroyed them. As a Guardian one thief will very seldom put me down and on occasion I have had all 4 focus on me to get me out of the way because spamming #1 with the staff tends to hurt them. With the wifes necro dropping wells and marks it only takes one or two more and those four thieves are looking for greener pastures or pushing up daisies as a part of the pasture.
When you understand how the stealth mechanic works and use that knowledge to coordinate against thieves they are not that scary at all. Frustrating at times but never scary.

Theftwind.8976:

There is a group of thieves, I call them a wolf pack, running WvW in our current matchup. Four of them to be exact. Now I will give them credit as they did put me down a few times but with the proper counter party we have utterly destroyed them. As a Guardian one thief will very seldom put me down and on occasion I have had all 4 focus on me to get me out of the way because spamming #1 with the staff tends to hurt them. With the wifes necro dropping wells and marks it only takes one or two more and those four thieves are looking for greener pastures or pushing up daisies as a part of the pasture.
When you understand how the stealth mechanic works and use that knowledge to coordinate against thieves they are not that scary at all. Frustrating at times but never scary.

Thieves are just another dynamic in wvw. honestly in wvw there are some OP classes but in general if you are smart about it you can defend yourself from anything. And its not like getting one shotted by thieves happens all the time. Happens to me every so often but not enough to get me too bothered just annoyed for a few seconds. Also thieves dont have enough to down you and continue attacking others so you will usually be revived. The only really annoying part about thieves is when they stealth and then finish you off. Because then you cant do anything to stop them. I was being revived by four people and a thief finished me out of nowhere.

Think CoD sniper: you’re on a 30 kill streak when BOOM. Headshot. Do you scream, “AMG SADFACE SNIPERS OP”?

The thief is the same way, if you build for it.

champ.7021:

Theftwind.8976:

There is a group of thieves, I call them a wolf pack, running WvW in our current matchup. Four of them to be exact. Now I will give them credit as they did put me down a few times but with the proper counter party we have utterly destroyed them. As a Guardian one thief will very seldom put me down and on occasion I have had all 4 focus on me to get me out of the way because spamming #1 with the staff tends to hurt them. With the wifes necro dropping wells and marks it only takes one or two more and those four thieves are looking for greener pastures or pushing up daisies as a part of the pasture.
When you understand how the stealth mechanic works and use that knowledge to coordinate against thieves they are not that scary at all. Frustrating at times but never scary.

….. if you are smart about it……

…..and there’s the actual problem.

Thief stomps in cardboard 7. Nothing to see here.

Mist Form is your friend. They aren’t going to one shot you unless you’re already down on health. After that you know he’s there and there is no excuse for you to lose the fight as an ele. If anything you should at least make them withdraw. If they shadow refuge pull off your combo inside of it. They are still there you just can’t see them. But after they come out of stealth you’ve got them. Earth attunement and Protection are your friends. Water Attunement and Chill are your friends. I suggest doing some sPvP until you learn how to play your class effectively. And if you still can’t beat a thief then go play a thief in sPvP. The best chance you have at defeating your enemy is to know exactly what they are capable of.

sirflamesword.3896:

Then why are you even posting? A thief did the only thing he can do, he ganked you.

^ That.

Thieves are a profession meant to gank people. That’s pretty much all they are good for. Remove it, and you end with, well, nothing.

As much as I don’t like the profession and think it has a negative impact on the game, it’s rather obvious that ArenaNet is not going to remove thieves from the game. Removing their ability to gank would effectively means removing them from the game. Ergo, it won’t happen.

Just don’t walk alone in WvW, and make sure your team has some strategy to deal with thieves.

Viking Jorun.5413:

EDIT: Balance is an illusion. Zacchary.6183, a fellow thief made an excellent post not a few days ago describing the difference between true imbalance and cyclical imbalance. It really is a matter of L2P. Get over it.

Your post is extremelly ironic, considering how strongly he was trying to make the point that his topic was not just trying to find an excuse for ArenaNet to not nerf thieves. In the context of your post, that’s exactly what you are claiming his topic was about.

Fortus.6175:

silvermember.8941:

The proper way to react is to use mist form not that shield or you will die.

Cant attack using the mist form, cant heal using mist form, cant use regular skills using it, it has been nerfed to the ground, right now in WvW you use it for gfetting into keeps, because while it gives you an effective 3 seconds of invul it also makes you completely worthless for 3 secs and only delay your imminent death since you did nothing to help yourself

silvermember.8941:

Next go to ele forum and ask for help about how to fight paper thieves aka berserker thieves. Finally, how can u only have 12k with ptv armor?

Please, I ask of you and everyone else who keeps posting without fully reading;
READ, kitten , PVT accs and weapon, rest in zerker because I need the DPS to come from somewhere.
And no thank on the ele forums we are also fed up with thieves, we know they are OP and we are trying to make that change, bother to check it every now and then and stop laying thieves and you will see why we complain.

silvermember.8941:

Also the fact that you let him attack you fast enough to burn through your shield says more about you than than the balance.

Yah, please tell me more about how Backstab and HS have internal cooldowns…..

The point of mist form is to stave off his burst THEN heal and counter attack. Backstab thieves generally are generally one shot attacks once if they fail, they go on the defense.

That’s what you get for playing Guild Wars 2 pvp, or GW2 in general. There was never any balance to the classes in GW2. Anet seriously needs to fix the classes in this game before they focus on expanding the class skills or anything of that sort.

Meh, I think the worst part is that they keep ruining pve just to balance their stupid pvp. What you get are just nerfs every time someone complains.

WvW isn’t balanced for 1v1. Well to be fair, it isn’t balanced for anything, but whatever.

I found the problem. He’s a Staff Ele.

Don’t expect to be a tank when you’re a Light Armor class, you can get hit for a lot from any class that’s specced for damage. If you see a Thief running D/D, don’t let him get close and if he does, dodge his CnD’s. Each CnD costs a LOT of initiative, if he misses twice with CnD (you’ve got 2 DODGES), he’s dead or will have to back out of the fight.

Rushing to Conclusion make the result worthless; especially to those who blindly missed what the OP Main statements are.

Once More

And Again,

I’ll Mention 1 of them

“ACTUALLY GIVE THE THIEF SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT, A RISK”

How many Sincere Thieves Agree with that?

If to sum all the “QQ’rs”..

Designing a class/Prof. with no Risk Factors’ whatsoever is suicidal for class balance.

Let me put this in a Realistic example..

A. Thief with HeavyBody Armor/Perma-Stealth— equipped with Machine Gun
B. Any Class without any Body Armor— equipped with a Handgun

Dueling 1vs1

Who has a Risk Factor of dying quick?

Anyone?

So Please!

Don’t tell me that it’s the other classes fault for not winning the quick death draw dual match.

Than after what?

You Put Blame on the Other Classes for not ’Learning or Out-Smarting the theif"

How can you?

Where is the Possiblitlies?

Any Child can tell you who has the advantage and will always have the advantage (no-matter what) without using any of thier brains.

Than why many here can’t figure this out using their full brains?

(This is to me how i compare theives with other classes)..

So

‘I call out for full-Nerf in the Name Of Class Balance (Remove Perma-Stealth, Reduce all Stats including abilities, traits, skills and weapon skills’ all across board by 30%.. and make 5 second more,,, stealths, counterable to all attacks and Remove Exploits from Stealthing from objects.

Fortus.6175:

How in the world is it balanced to just die to a backstab that hits you for 8.5k out of the blue, wearing PVT/valk accesories and weapons, with no way of blocking it, with no counterplay involved, followed by two 3k HS (pray none crits., because then you are looking at 6-7k HS easily). Where is the counterplay to that? Dont tel me that zerg because I was in a zerg, the guy came in backstab, HS, stealth on top of me, nobody could do shiznit about it, stomped me and walked away with 50% hp.

Stealth is out of control, I understand its good to get the jump on people, but I have been hit by 11k backstabs with my squishy equipment, I was wearing PVT/valk weapon and accessories, yet it hit me for 8.5k.

Either you need to reworkout the whole hp from eles or move the damage from backstab to something that ACTUALLY GIVE THE THIEF SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT, A RISK, right now it is incredibly dumb how they can pop out of stealth, kill you in literally less than a sec with Backstab HS HS and there is literally no counter to this unless you have stealth of your own or have aegis to save your butt.

I used arcane shield, it blocked two attacks, none revealed the thief, he kjust backed away until it disappeared, so no, thats not the counter, a good counter would be IF IT REVEALED THEM , but NOOooooo, we cant have a thief having to do any thinking on enemies CD, he could’ve ignored the shield anyways, the damage isnt enough to kill him if it explodes anyways.

Picts related

Your picture also demonstrates another bug the thief is abusing and they all know it… On crit sigils if activated from cnd or backstab (will say Unknown attacker) See the Lightning damage, it will immediately go off again without the internal cooldown. We all know how fast thieves attack and u can see 2 procs in under 9 seconds easily.

I suck at PvP and I kill thieves quite frequently.

Burnfall.9573:

Rushing to Conclusion make the result worthless; especially to those who blindly missed what the OP Main statements are.

Once More

And Again,

I’ll Mention 1 of them

“ACTUALLY GIVE THE THIEF SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT, A RISK”

How many Sincere Thieves Agree with that?

If to sum all the “QQ’rs”..

Designing a class/Prof. with no Risk Factors’ whatsoever is suicidal for class balance.

Let me put this in a Realistic example..

A. Thief with HeavyBody Armor/Perma-Stealth— equipped with Machine Gun
B. Any Class without any Body Armor— equipped with a Handgun

Dueling 1vs1

Who has a Risk Factor of dying quick?

Anyone?

So Please!

Don’t tell me that it’s the other classes fault for not winning the quick death draw dual match.

Than after what?

You Put Blame on the Other Classes for not ’Learning or Out-Smarting the theif"

How can you?

Where is the Possiblitlies?

Any Child can tell you who has the advantage and will always have the advantage (no-matter what) without using any of thier brains.

Than why many here can’t figure this out using their full brains?

(This is to me how i compare theives with other classes)..

So

‘I call out for full-Nerf in the Name Of Class Balance (Remove Perma-Stealth, Reduce all Stats including abilities, traits, skills and weapon skills’ all across board by 30%.. and make 5 second more,,, stealths, counterable to all attacks and Remove Exploits from Stealthing from objects.

THis is prety much the whole point of this thread. The risk factor for thieves is just not there. There is nothing to counter because you can see anything cant do anything about it. All other classes/skills take casting time, they are telegraphed, usually there is more than one way of countering it, but thieves, all you have is spray and pray it hits them or run away, or waste 3 90 secs CD to sruvive 5 seconds longer before they repeat the burst. That is not balance.

Agree with the op always have thieves are broken and need hard counters, its a serious reason i gave up bothering in wvw.