Guild Wars 2

Before anyone explodes, I’m not saying the 3 dodges are bad, but I feel Anet could’ve made something more unique than just adding a dodge. For example, look at the other classes, Warrior, Ranger, and Necro got new states, Rev got a new legend, Mesmer got a new shatter, etc. While I don’t know what Anet could’ve done,but, like I stated earlier, they could’ve given us something newer and more unique.

I also know this is really late, but I started after HoT was released and have been giving it a lot more thought lately with all the DHs running around.

Please, if you leave a suggestion or response, try to keep it constructive, because the purpose of this thread isn’t to hate on what we have, but rather wonder what we could’ve had.

Happy Thieving!

you are not wrong, that dare devil is poorly designed, but don’t mistake that for me agreeing with you. ALL Elite Specializations are poorly designed. Just because some got entirely new forms means jack all. The reasons Elite Specializations are horribly designed are far more base than the individual changes each class got.

Problems with Elite Specs

• you have to spec into them in order to use the skills. What? I bought HoT, just let me use the skills like any other skill!
• you have to spec into the elite specialization to use the weapon? WHAT? DUDE, we’ve been over this. I bought your expansion. let me use the weapon. there’s no reason to gate skills or weapons behind a specialization.
• Elite specializations, do not change the class, they stack on top of the existing class like at tumor.
• Anything that Anet does to improve the base mechanics of the game, just makes Elite specializations stronger.
• Elite specializations don’t change how the class is played. elementalists still memorize a very specific rotation, necromancers still have a shroud they depend on which means they still depend on Life Force, Warriors still depend on adrenaline, engineers still rotate through utility skills and kits (they just have an extra one), Guardians still depend on their virtues, Thief, still relies on stealth , speed, and evasion (but now we have more access to the evasion and speed)

• Finally, Elite specializations were purposefully created to make the game unbalanced. Anet got greedy. they thought that by creating specializations that overpowered each core class, that people would HAVE to buy HoT. Some Developer probably had a great concept for Elites, but then the money guys got involved and just rushed it out because “hell, players will have to buy this!!”

Anet must have forgotten that we bought three expansions for GW1, not because they made the core game nonviable anymore, but because we wanted the new content. you delivered new content without destroying the old. and you expect any sane human being not to notice that you just threw together some ideas, specifically designed to force players to pay money. Anet, we’d have bought the content anyway, seriously, we would have payed $50 for less content, if it had been well implemented.

Okay that’s enough ranting for me.

@emkelly I definitely see where you’re coming from, and I think my post was awkwardly worded, I’m not just saying that DrD is poorly designed, I’m also trying to say that we got less than other classes did in terms of elite specs.
Other than that, I completely agree with your position on the problems the elite specs bring, I honestly never noticed them until you pointed them out.
Thanks for the constructive response anyhow.

It’s because you can make good use of a 3rd dodge bar (any time your endurance is over 100, it’s helping you) so we have a much larger capacity for evades, which, coupled with the amount of endurance-regening traits/skills we have, is very helpful, although it seems like a useless upgrade to have at times. We technically also got modified dodges, so that’s there too.

So it’s not as flashy or cool as some other upgrades, but it’s used just as much, if not more, as it’s a passive boost and not another ability, like berserker stance or continuum shift.

The three different dodges are the unique feature and choosing one decides a good deal of your build, role, and how you’re going to play and use the terrain. I have my own gripes with the game and class, anyone will with any game, but those dodges were done well. You can start us off by giving your suggestion of a change that you think should get us on track.

It not the extra dodge, Ity hpw you can trait your dodge to enhance your combat ability.

Unhindered Combat, Lotus training and Bounding Dodger are significant and unique enhancements.

We had long discussions about it already. Yes, dodges are boring and lazy solution. Yes, wasting all grandmaster traits for actually making dodges something special is another lazy design.

If i recall correctly a lot of people wanted rifle spec because we are clearly lacking in ranged department (PP is a joke).

I personally hoped that staff would be something what druids have became – support tank.

Specs were supposed to bring new variety to the class. But Anet just nerfed acro to the ground so they can re-introduce it as DD in HoT. They actually went as far as (directly and indirectly) nerfing all core specs as well. Bleh. Devs may say/claim all they want but patches just scream “we hate thieves”, “we have no clue”.

Oh took me a while to find it, but i present you my awesome photoshop skills from last year (if i only knew back then how right i was):

Yup; it’s lazy, and does nothing except add cheesy powercreep to match that of what came from HoT.

The only well-executed Elite imho is the reaper. It fundamentally changes how necromancer plays, does it well, and doesn’t really add a lot of power over the core necro; it just changes where its power lies.

Chronomancer is almost there, but it feels more along the lines of mesmer with shield and wells than a new way of playing. It just added CS as an additional shatter, rather than changing how the class plays.

DH is different, but poorly-executed and just straight power-creep.

The rest, imho, are poorly done and executed, like the daredevil.

Realistically, given all the ways Thieves can buff Steal, there was never going to be a Better Steal for the Elite Spec. What Thieves didn’t have was a way to play effectively that doesn’t require constantly resetting fights with Stealth. DD is all about giving us that, and I think it’s been quite successful.

compare +1 dodge to DH’s virtue upgrades :^)

tobascodagama.2961:

Realistically, given all the ways Thieves can buff Steal, there was never going to be a Better Steal for the Elite Spec. What Thieves didn’t have was a way to play effectively that doesn’t require constantly resetting fights with Stealth. DD is all about giving us that, and I think it’s been quite successful.

They could have gone in so many other more interesting directions, though. Compare the new mechanics behind the reaper to the Daredevil and it’s quite obvious that the reaper is better-designed by a huge margin.

To me, the Daredevil is the result of ANet either not having any ideas on what to do or simply not having put forth the time to make it well-designed.

I only started using DD recently, general PvE outside raids, due to the recent VS nerfs as the SA spec is now junk outside PvP/WvW and mainly DPS stealth spike builds or cheese perma-stealth condi. Like many I won’t use a whole spec just to access venom recharge. Up till that my favorite build in the game for the vast majority of PvE including HoT was a vanilla D/D VS/condi build largely unchanged since the game released although it’s worth mentioning I play either with a small group of friends or solo.

My other release day main is a Guardian and he’s still vanilla as well, if I wanted to pew pew and lay traps I’d roll Ranger but that’s a tangent. On both accounts I really felt underwhelmed with the elite specs and the novelty wore off pretty quickly after a few weeks trying them out.

Not saying DD is garbage at all, just not my flavor and I enjoy the other vanilla play styles and my original build more which is totally subjective.

Point being I get what your saying OP, especially all this time later.

While staff is pretty awesome and DD overall has some great merits I went back to my vanilla build after the novelty wore off, mainly because personally I found it more fun, effective, and I’m also big on character theme. Not hardcore RP but my thief is D/D condi in general PvE. Always has been, always will be. That’s been his buzz since the servers went live, more so with his gearing and the time it took me to farm his gear.

Now I kind of have to play DD though as my original build is nerfed and to play it’s now nerfed variation is really choosing to kitten myself and my party. Next best spec is DD.

Just another hit to a PvE casual like me and my friends I guess, mainly so PvP can have free Basi share and boon steal. I noticed skill recharge is split on several skills now so I’m hopeful maybe a PvP/PvE balance split might happen at some stage as I think everything being balanced around PvP is the true catalyst of why many find DD pretty average to disappointing. In saying it’s a selling point for HoT….so…..yeah.

emkelly.2371:

Anet must have forgotten that we bought three expansions for GW1, not because they made the core game nonviable anymore, but because we wanted the new content. you delivered new content without destroying the old. and you expect any sane human being not to notice that you just threw together some ideas, specifically designed to force players to pay money. Anet, we’d have bought the content anyway, seriously, we would have payed $50 for less content, if it had been well implemented.

Okay that’s enough ranting for me.

And players forget that Anet had at one time planned on continuing in that vein with GW1 until the chapters got so bloated with new skills and classes that the business model became untenable. GW2, right or wrong now, represents a concrete and visible effort to fix what was wrong with GW1 from a game development perspective.

ErebusVindictus.6514:

Before anyone explodes, I’m not saying the 3 dodges are bad, but I feel Anet could’ve made something more unique than just adding a dodge. For example, look at the other classes, Warrior, Ranger, and Necro got new states, Rev got a new legend, Mesmer got a new shatter, etc. While I don’t know what Anet could’ve done,but, like I stated earlier, they could’ve given us something newer and more unique.

I also know this is really late, but I started after HoT was released and have been giving it a lot more thought lately with all the DHs running around.

Please, if you leave a suggestion or response, try to keep it constructive, because the purpose of this thread isn’t to hate on what we have, but rather wonder what we could’ve had.

Happy Thieving!

Thief getting another dodge is great, allows for a bit more survivability

And makes it more faceroll, you can just Bound or Condi dodge all day

Oh and tons of other classes got evades / blocks / passives on their classes with HoT (Druid staff 3, rev sword 3, Chrono shield, Engi hammer block (and evade!!!), guard got an F3 buff)

So basically the third dodge lowered the skill floor for thief, and everyone else got an invuln + a new class mechanic. WTB function gyros for thief since scrapper got an evade / block haha