Guild Wars 2

I want to make a level 80 of every character and gear it out to current meta builds, currently I have herald reaper tempest zerker chrono, working on druid scrapper DH and… now daredevil/thief.

Which sounds like a very fun class to be honest but I did a little homework and omg the salt… apparently the thief is bad in every game mode, not viable in high lvl fractals, no1 wants them in raids, and on and on and on… I’m not even sure what I just got myself into.

Is this class really just that bad? Or its just lazy people griping about a hard to play class that can be very good if played properly like engineer but requires effort?

Also in terms of end game, is it better to go for condi or power build for thief/dd? I don’t PvP and exclusively do PvE (WvW I go for some xp boost but nothing more)

If you’re just starting out with the Thief, you’re a long way away from having to worry about raids or high level fractals. Beyond that, as an MMORPG, balance is constantly in flux. A year ago at this time, it was Ranger and Necromancer that everyone was complaining about as being subpar and undesired. A year from now, who’s to say what it will be?

If you’re doing exclusively PvE, you should focus on power rather than conditions. Get to know your different weapons and what they bring to the table, because without cooldowns on weapon skills Thief plays quite differently than most other classes. You can learn how stealth and your stealth attacks work on your way to 80, and then forget all about that once you get Daredevil and the staff and suddenly don’t have stealth options on your weapon anymore, but extra dodges and better healing to make up for it.

Condi cleanse can be a rough spot for the class. Our best old cleanse from Shadow Arts was nerfed to only apply to damaging conditions. Daredevil added a “cleanse a condi on successful evasion” trait, which is tremendous, but starting out it’ll take you a while to get to that. So be careful!

Well I am a thief noob this is true but I have gear and gold from my 5 other lvl 80s, I actually do have some ascended armor (zerker) already from fractal drops (I keep getting friggin wrist and head drops so I ended up getting it for multiple armor classes). This is to say, once I get to lvl 80 I’m pretty sure I can get to end game gear within another 2 weeks ish. I was just curious what people use for end game thieves, I have seen a few in lvl 50+ fractals but few and far in between, and NOBODY runs a staff which makes me a sad panda… I kind of wanna play a martial artist with the bo staf =(

I would argue SE got buffed in terms of cleansing power. Nothing was worse than cleansing a stack of vuln and a 4s blind over 19 stacks of bleeding or a ton of confusion and torment.

The thief class is definitely suffering relative to other professions. Is it totally bad? No. There certainly is a lot of overreaction and some of the proposed buffs and changes people make would drive the class into just being wildly overpowered.

You’ll never find yourself in demand playing a thief. If you’re not playing with a group of people you know, you’re not getting priority in any setting over another player at anything. All I can suggest is to practice and see if you like it.

Staff is an amazing PvE weapon. It has huge burst damage and cleave on vault with lots of evasion. D/D is still a better boss killer set, but only barely.

Tiggers.3890:

I was just curious what people use for end game thieves, I have seen a few in lvl 50+ fractals but few and far in between, and NOBODY runs a staff which makes me a sad panda… I kind of wanna play a martial artist with the bo staf =(

Hi,
well endgame for thieves. Mostly is personaly, I say many our “new” guild thieves play what you want in fractals/dungs. But when you want rly jump into serious business you end in mostly common used weapon set combo D/D + Shorbow and S/P for fast clearing. Staff dont have so much DPS and you end up in low DPS spikes, you need constatly holding your maxed dps, whle with staff you never gain. Staff have slow 1 skill and slow animations.
Traits are mostly used this way
Deadly arts – Mug – Revealed Training – Executioner
Critical strikes – Side Strike/Signets of Power – Practiced Tolerance – No Quarter
Daredevil – Havoc Mastery – Escapist’s Absolution – Bounding Dodger

and armor + jewels + weapons – Zerker .. In soon I wanna try Viper stats… but dont have so much time now ^^

Tiggers.3890:

like engineer but requires effort?

Hooo hoo hoo hoo

Oh man

Yes, the class is in a bad spot, but you are still viable against unaware people or new players.

Everyone else outsustains you for the most part, except other thieves.

that being said, you can go either condi or power. the moment your damage output becomes reasonable you are vulnerable to melt, so play careful.

Tiggers.3890:

Well I am a thief noob this is true but I have gear and gold from my 5 other lvl 80s, I actually do have some ascended armor (zerker) already from fractal drops (I keep getting friggin wrist and head drops so I ended up getting it for multiple armor classes). This is to say, once I get to lvl 80 I’m pretty sure I can get to end game gear within another 2 weeks ish. I was just curious what people use for end game thieves, I have seen a few in lvl 50+ fractals but few and far in between, and NOBODY runs a staff which makes me a sad panda… I kind of wanna play a martial artist with the bo staf =(

For high level fractals, damage is not everything, you need survivability outside of boss fights. Hence an offhand Pistol will be optimal for skill 5, black powder. Black Powder mitigates almost all damage from trash mobs, which makes it invaluable for the whole party.
However, if you are confident in your ability as a thief, and you are confident that your party can survive without relying on your black powder, feel free to use staff. The AOE damage on staff clears mobs very efficiently.
For boss fights though, staff is a very solid option, as it is the highest DPS weapon set we have. Although if you need condi-cleanse, D/D is a better choice.

DeceiverX.8361:

Staff is an amazing PvE weapon. It has huge burst damage and cleave on vault with lots of evasion. D/D is still a better boss killer set, but only barely.

Not really. You have to worry about positioning to get the most damage out of backstab, which means if ever you do a face-stab, your dps is suffering, and in some situations, you really can’t tell if you are backstabbing or not (when stacking, for example).
Not to mention Cloak and Dagger got a damage nerf a few months back.
x3 Weakening charge deals as much damage as a>25% heartseeker, and Staff auto-attack has more dps then Mainhand Dagger auto-attack.
The only advantage D/D has over Staff is condi cleanse and steath (de-aggro), if you run SE in the SA line. D/D with SE pretty much lets you solo Mai Trin, as 90% of her damage comes from bleeds. D/D is also pretty good against the Fire Elemental in the Volcanic Fractal for clearing burns.

Theandil.6045:

Hi,
well endgame for thieves. Mostly is personaly, I say many our “new” guild thieves play what you want in fractals/dungs. But when you want rly jump into serious business you end in mostly common used weapon set combo D/D + Shorbow and S/P for fast clearing. Staff dont have so much DPS and you end up in low DPS spikes, you need constatly holding your maxed dps, whle with staff you never gain. Staff have slow 1 skill and slow animations.

Unfortunately, I’d have to correct you on that. Staff is currently the highest DPS weapon for thief.
The loss of Dagger training’s +5% damage on dagger skills, (compared to Staff Master’s +10% damage),
Higher Auto-attack damage on staff compared to Dagger (sword has the highest AA DPS btw). Slow animation =/= less damage.
Weakening Charge dealing as much damage as <25% heart seeker,
with Staff skills giving back more endurance then Dagger Auto-attack, which means more Bound dodges = more DPS, +10% dps buff)
Cloak and Dagger damage nerf, loss of Infusion of Shadows and Hidden Assassin (gain 2 initiative when entering stealth).
Not to mention Staff does not rely of positioning to deal full DPS (backstab)
So yeah, D/D USED to be the highest DPS weapon set, but now it’s slightly behind staff in terms of DPS.

Theandil.6045:

Traits are mostly used this way
Deadly arts – Mug – Revealed Training – Executioner
Critical strikes – Side Strike/Signets of Power – Practiced Tolerance – No Quarter
Daredevil – Havoc Mastery – Escapist’s Absolution – Bounding Dodger

and armor + jewels + weapons – Zerker .. In soon I wanna try Viper stats… but dont have so much time now ^^

I’d say for Critical Strikes, take Flawless strikes for your Adept trait for max DPS. If you are using Scholar runes, you’ll need to maintain +90% hp anyways.

And as for Viper stats, it’s not really worth it on thief. =(
Sure i can hit pretty hard with Vipers, but it’s ultimately a condition build, and our condi damage is, while decent, not comparable to other classes. Plus our Condi Damage skills do not benefit from Power damage, unlike engineers whose skills deal a lot of power and Condi Damage at the same time.

I ended up moving all my viper gear to my Engie.