Guild Wars 2

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/PU-Shatter-anyone-Mass-Invis-10s/first#post5150372

this thread talks about how stealth has been buffed for mesmers.

what are the thieves’ thoughts?

will thieves fall behind in terms of stealth?

or will mesmers finally stand on equal footing as thieves?

I will just copy my post on the other tread! Here you go:

According to the wiki (https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stealth)
Mesmers only have 4 skills with Stealth:
- The Prestige – 30CD, 6 seconds stealth if traited.
- Decoy – 40CD, 6 seconds stealth if traited.
- Veil – 90CD, 4 seconds stealth if traited.
- Mass Invisibility – 90CD, 10 seconds stealth if traited.
All with pretty massive cooldowns. A D/P thief leaping 3 times through blinding powder can already get 9 seconds of stealth almost outplaying Mass Invisilibilty.

Next to that thieves have:

- Cloak and Dagger = 4 seconds when traited on no cooldown
- Shadow Refuge = around 12~16 seconds if I am not wrong? 60 seconds cooldown
- Dagger/Pistol Combo = 9 seconds of stealth
- Blinding powder – 4seconds when traited + 3 if used in Smoke field – 40 seconds cooldown
And lot’s more

I think since we can use initiative for stealth and gain longer durations mesmer will not outplay us when it comes to stealth. Expecially when you compare the cooldowns, thief has much more access to stealth. At least that’s what I think:P

Eremite, are you the forum’s gossip maker 2015?

Jayden Ennok.3687:

Eremite, are you the forum’s gossip maker 2015?

I think you may be on to something. Every time I log in and even just browse the forums Eremite has a new post somewhere calling something OP, or something else weak, or just stirring up some opinionated arguments somewhere. If he spent the time he spends on this forum on actually playing the game he may have learned how to fight thieves a bit better and not complain about them so much.

And yes, I realize he recently apologized for thief hating, but some of his more recent posts than that one are starting to drift into “whining about thief” territory again. I think it’s fun to read those types of posts though, so I’m all for them lol.

godz raiden.2631:

Jayden Ennok.3687:

Eremite, are you the forum’s gossip maker 2015?

I think you may be on to something. Every time I log in and even just browse the forums Eremite has a new post somewhere calling something OP, or something else weak, or just stirring up some opinionated arguments somewhere. If he spent the time he spends on this forum on actually playing the game he may have learned how to fight thieves a bit better and not complain about them so much.

And yes, I realize he recently apologized for thief hating, but some of his more recent posts than that one are starting to drift into “whining about thief” territory again. I think it’s fun to read those types of posts though, so I’m all for them lol.

I also think its fun. matching one class against another, probing for more critical thinking and discussion.

Don’t you guys find the forums totally boring without such posts?

EremiteAngel.9765:

godz raiden.2631:

Jayden Ennok.3687:

Eremite, are you the forum’s gossip maker 2015?

I think you may be on to something. Every time I log in and even just browse the forums Eremite has a new post somewhere calling something OP, or something else weak, or just stirring up some opinionated arguments somewhere. If he spent the time he spends on this forum on actually playing the game he may have learned how to fight thieves a bit better and not complain about them so much.

And yes, I realize he recently apologized for thief hating, but some of his more recent posts than that one are starting to drift into “whining about thief” territory again. I think it’s fun to read those types of posts though, so I’m all for them lol.

I also think its fun. matching one class against another, probing for more critical thinking and discussion.

Don’t you guys find the forums totally boring without such posts?

i dont get the complains of you guys, this was nothing near claiming thief (or anything) to be op, just some question

so imo while it can be strong, its in a defensive trait line from mesmers which they will (i think at least) rarely use
and no, i also dont think mesmers will stand equal to thieves – we can port after them without great problems, /D builds can still stealth on their clones and the stolen skill is still strong

Strategist.6132:

Mesmers only have 4 skills with Stealth:
- The Prestige – 30CD, 6 seconds stealth if traited.
- Decoy – 40CD, 6 seconds stealth if traited.
- Veil – 90CD, 4 seconds stealth if traited.
- Mass Invisibility – 90CD, 10 seconds stealth if traited.

thats 12s self stealth +14s self and 9 allies
with Mimic: Updated functionality of this skill. This skill now causes the next utility slot skill you use within 10 seconds to recharge in 1 second. Increased recharge to 90 seconds.
it can be even more (6/10s depends on that if elite also counts as “utility” >.< )

Strategist.6132:

Next to that thieves have:

- Cloak and Dagger = 4 seconds when traited on no cooldown
- Shadow Refuge = around 12~16 seconds if I am not wrong? 60 seconds cooldown
- Dagger/Pistol Combo = 9 seconds of stealth
- Blinding powder – 4seconds when traited + 3 if used in Smoke field – 40 seconds cooldown

At first i want to say: i count only passive ini regen.

looks you forgot about that initiative regen is not 1kk per sec, but 1 per 1.6s so CnD cost 6×1.6=9,6s “cd” 4s traited. blind/block/dodge means thief lose 6 ini and get nothing

d/p combo: 6 +3 for ea hs. 14,4s “cd” if 1 hs, 24s “cd” if 3 hs. Can be easily countered by running/porting to thief’s smoke field.

SR… good knockback/fear means no stealth and 60s cd and there will be a lot of skills in HoT that counter SR

BP 3/4s stealth on demand

as you can see thief have only 1 stealth that can’t be countered, mes have 3 (Decoy, the pristige. Both with no cast and Veil with 1/4s cast.. its more luck than skill to cc when mes is casting). Easy to counter MI (almost 2s cast and its telegraphed animation) after changes can be a “gimme revealed and 90s cd plsss” or a skill much stronger than SR(long stealth [almost same as SR] that doesnt require to stay for 4s in small circle). depends on enemy.

I still think we outplay mesmer when it comes to stealthXD But let the release show for itself:P

Seeing as stealth kinda screws up a vast majority of mesmers attacks(since most are targeted), it would make sense for them to get ways to deal with stealth more effectively. That being said, mesmer’s weakest matchup is arguably thief so I’m glad mesmers can do a bit more than just blow all their evades/blocks the moment they lose sight of a thief now.

yeah in 1v1 I think thieves need to be more concerned about this:

Blinding Dissipation: Whenever you use a shatter skill you blind foes around you for 3 seconds.

I think this is going to give shatter mes a chance with thieves.

nightblood.7910:

yeah in 1v1 I think thieves need to be more concerned about this:

Blinding Dissipation: Whenever you use a shatter skill you blind foes around you for 3 seconds.

I think this is going to give shatter mes a chance with thieves.

It’ll be annoying for sure, but unless they add some sort of drawback to a blinded/blocked backstab, it’ll just mean wasting a shatter skill to delay a backstab by 1 second.

Necrotize.2974:

nightblood.7910:

yeah in 1v1 I think thieves need to be more concerned about this:

Blinding Dissipation: Whenever you use a shatter skill you blind foes around you for 3 seconds.

I think this is going to give shatter mes a chance with thieves.

It’ll be annoying for sure, but unless they add some sort of drawback to a blinded/blocked backstab, it’ll just mean wasting a shatter skill to delay a backstab by 1 second.

even though they’ll see the “missed” sign and will know that thats the time o dodge/stealth/blurred frenzy

but yeah i still think thieves will have an advantage against mesmers – even though who gets the first burst off atm is really important

PU gives memser an option to disengage when needed, especially after thief shadow refuge.

Tarkan.5609:

Necrotize.2974:

nightblood.7910:

yeah in 1v1 I think thieves need to be more concerned about this:

Blinding Dissipation: Whenever you use a shatter skill you blind foes around you for 3 seconds.

I think this is going to give shatter mes a chance with thieves.

It’ll be annoying for sure, but unless they add some sort of drawback to a blinded/blocked backstab, it’ll just mean wasting a shatter skill to delay a backstab by 1 second.

even though they’ll see the “missed” sign and will know that thats the time o dodge/stealth/blurred frenzy

but yeah i still think thieves will have an advantage against mesmers – even though who gets the first burst off atm is really important

I suppose, but they’d need to be really on top of things since Backstab has that .25 second cast time. If you use a shatter to blind the thief and you see that missed sign, you have less than a quarter of a second to do something about it.

Now at least they’ll be some way for a mesmer to recover from a burst that doesn’t outright kill the thief.

Outside conquest/+1 ing fights, thieves are not such a hard counter to mesmers.

Well timed blinds are a lot worse for me than fighting an opponent with long stealth so I don’t think the longer stealth durations will change much for mesmers. Outplaying thief is not about outstealthing him, mesmer needs to deny stealth by using cc/shattering, d/d and d/p thieves are predictable enough to do this.

steal backstab is my combo