Guild Wars 2

Build Link: http://tinyurl.com/cgfcjne

So I watched his video and I really liked the play style but I was discouraged by the crappy backstabs. I copied the build almost exactly and changed a few things I thought would help better and I’ll explain why.

First, the build is awesome as is from his video. It’s as close to a bunker thief as you will get while keeping your ability to put pressure on people and thief mobility. Defense highlights of the build include blind field, stealth regen, stealth condi removal, stealth, feline grace. Offense is simply built around fury and mobility skills and backstabs.

First, I changed falling damage+blind powder to fleet shadow. I feel like with a stealth build like this the 50% movement speed is going to help you land back stabs way easier or get you out of trouble way quicker. The 50% falling damage is too situational for me to carry around all the time and a good player will avoid getting trolled and you won’t get points. The stealth speed gives you insane abiltiy to position correctly after bp+hs.

Second, to compliment the increased stealth speed I dropped signet of shadows. I use it sometimes in wvw for simply running across the map but it is actually faster to dodge roll, spam HS while swiftness is up and dodge roll again. Swiftness makes heartseeker move further. I only use SoS to be lazy. I kept shadowstep/inf signet for having 2 stun breaks. I rarely have to use both, but sometimes it does save my life. The reason I rarely use inf signet is because I have shadow shot. I only use the inf signet if everything else is down and I need to break a stun or teleport somewhere with low init.

Shadow shot, while not used very well in Yishis video, is probably the best new ability I have found. It works while in stealth as a free teleport+back stab. It does not break stealth on the blind shot and it lands backstab right after as long as you are spamming the #1 key. You can apply pressure to anyone, even d/d ele’s with this. No one will ever escape you if you know what you are doing.

The last thing, which I think is the thing that makes this build so effective, is the runes. I changed to rage runes for additional time with fury. As Yishis pointed out when he has fury up he was hitting backstabs with crit way more often and auto-attacks do much better damage. So with the fury duration+fury on hit for 30s you are able to pump out some great dps. Your sustainable DPS increases significantly with rune which compliments the superior defenses the build has.

Lastly, this build is not for noobs. You have to be able to play it well and it will take pratice to learn the synergy of your skill rotation and when to use shadow shot, etc.

swinsk.6410:

First, I changed falling damage+blind powder to fleet shadow. I feel like with a stealth build like this the 50% movement speed is going to help you land back stabs way easier or get you out of trouble way quicker. The 50% falling damage is too situational for me to carry around all the time and a good player will avoid getting trolled and you won’t get points. The stealth speed gives you insane abiltiy to position correctly after bp+hs.

You only want to use falling damage+blind powder if you are initiating an ambush from above since it allows you to fall from an undetectable height and grants a free stealth when you hit the ground.

Second, to compliment the increased stealth speed I dropped signet of shadows. I use it sometimes in wvw for simply running across the map but it is actually faster to dodge roll, spam HS while swiftness is up and dodge roll again. Swiftness makes heartseeker move further. I only use SoS to be lazy. I kept shadowstep/inf signet for having 2 stun breaks. I rarely have to use both, but sometimes it does save my life. The reason I rarely use inf signet is because I have shadow shot. I only use the inf signet if everything else is down and I need to break a stun or teleport somewhere with low init.

In WvW, it is foolish to waste endurance and initiative for a minor movement boosts.

The last thing, which I think is the thing that makes this build so effective, is the runes. I changed to rage runes for additional time with fury. As Yishis pointed out when he has fury up he was hitting backstabs with crit way more often and auto-attacks do much better damage. So with the fury duration+fury on hit for 30s you are able to pump out some great dps. Your sustainable DPS increases significantly with rune which compliments the superior defenses the build has.

If your DPS stretches for 30s, you’d already be dead. The window in most cases is 4s since you cannot stealth for that amount of time after hitting a back-stab, so you should be doing as much damage as possible before going to stealth again.

But I agree that I wouldn’t take Sigil of Rage either, since after the quickness nerf, 3s of quickness is just one more auto-attack.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

You only want to use falling damage+blind powder if you are initiating an ambush from above since it allows you to fall from an undetectable height and grants a free stealth when you hit the ground.

I know. Yishis likes the falling damage+blind, not me.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

In WvW, it is foolish to waste endurance and initiative for a minor movement boosts.

The only viable choices for this trait is stealth speed, might on dodge, falling damage, vigor on heal. I feel that feline grace+black powder give me enough defenses. I don’t have a moment where I wish had I more endurance with this build due to skill rotation. Might on dodge is great but this is not a burst build and I get plenty of extra dps from bloodlust stacks and might from stealthing.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If your DPS stretches for 30s, you’d already be dead. The window in most cases is 4s since you cannot stealth for that amount of time after hitting a back-stab, so you should be doing as much damage as possible before going to stealth again.

Completely untrue. If there is a zerg, sure I die in 2s. In spvp I can fight 2-3v1 and down/stomp people if they are bad. If they are good usually stalemate. The point of this build is not to be the guy who just instantly downs people in seconds. The point is to maximize survivability while keeping as much DPS as possible. You hit back stab and then depending on the reaction you either continue to do more dps with auto-attack or you drop a black powder to blind them and set your stealth up.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

But I agree that I wouldn’t take Sigil of Rage either, since after the quickness nerf, 3s of quickness is just one more auto-attack.

You misunderstood. I don’t use Sigil of Rage and never have. I use Superior Runes of Rage. These give you 30s of fury on hit. 60s CD. 20% increased fury duration. 10% crit damage and 5% damage when fury is active. These runes are what give you some more DPS with this build.

Like I said this is a highly mobile/defensive build and requires some skill to play effectively.

swinsk.6410:

~snip~
The only viable choices for this trait is stealth speed, might on dodge, falling damage, vigor on heal. I feel that feline grace+black powder give me enough defenses. I don’t have a moment where I wish had I more endurance with this build due to skill rotation. Might on dodge is great but this is not a burst build and I get plenty of extra dps from bloodlust stacks and might from stealthing.

Fair enough

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If your DPS stretches for 30s, you’d already be dead. The window in most cases is 4s since you cannot stealth for that amount of time after hitting a back-stab, so you should be doing as much damage as possible before going to stealth again.

Completely untrue. If there is a zerg, sure I die in 2s. In spvp I can fight 2-3v1 and down/stomp people if they are bad. If they are good usually stalemate. The point of this build is not to be the guy who just instantly downs people in seconds. The point is to maximize survivability while keeping as much DPS as possible. You hit back stab and then depending on the reaction you either continue to do more dps with auto-attack or you drop a black powder to blind them and set your stealth up.

I guess it’s because I don’t play like a warrior that when I see that my first 4s attacks did not affect my target that I simply disengage rather than stay trying to survive the whole time when my damage is simply negligible.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

But I agree that I wouldn’t take Sigil of Rage either, since after the quickness nerf, 3s of quickness is just one more auto-attack.

You misunderstood. I don’t use Sigil of Rage and never have. I use Superior Runes of Rage. These give you 30s of fury on hit. 60s CD. 20% increased fury duration. 10% crit damage and 5% damage when fury is active. These runes are what give you some more DPS with this build.

Like I said this is a highly mobile/defensive build and requires some skill to play effectively.

You’re right, I completely miread that.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Fair enough

I guess it’s because I don’t play like a warrior that when I see that my first 4s attacks did not affect my target that I simply disengage rather than stay trying to survive the whole time when my damage is simply negligible.

You’re right, I completely miread that.

Warriors with this build are actually going to be one of your easier fights. I don’t think I have lost to a warrior in 1v1 yet. The reason being is because you can negate a lot of their damage with the blind field and blind shot if they try to run. It doesn’t really matter if you do 10% damage or 50% in the first 4 hits with this build because you will always be at high health and almost immune to melee damage.

You can also be very “cheesy” with this build as well. Remember how people would chain CnD to stay stealthed and kill people?

Well this build, you can chain bp+hs, wait 4s, do it again. Black powder shoots for about 700-1k damage, heart seeker can hit pretty hard depending on their health/crit.

You can actually whittle people down while regen and removing conditions. This can really mess with your opponent.

The point is to stay alive no matter what the odds while dishing out the best dps possible with a full defensive build.

These runes allow you to do that. I have 64% crit chance with fury up in spvp. 71% crit chance from side or behind.

That’s where the dps comes from, consistently attacking and critting.

EDIT: Wanted to add that during those 4s of revealed you are usually surrounded by a blind field. Once you get really good at D/P timing, you can hit heart seeker right before revealed wears off. When the HS animation finishes you will stealth. Allowing you to act more like a tank with a blind field as defense. Ranged can still hit you tho.

swinsk.6410:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Fair enough

I guess it’s because I don’t play like a warrior that when I see that my first 4s attacks did not affect my target that I simply disengage rather than stay trying to survive the whole time when my damage is simply negligible.

You’re right, I completely miread that.

Warriors with this build are actually going to be one of your easier fights. I don’t think I have lost to a warrior in 1v1 yet. The reason being is because you can negate a lot of their damage with the blind field and blind shot if they try to run. It doesn’t really matter if you do 10% damage or 50% in the first 4 hits with this build because you will always be at high health and almost immune to melee damage.

Then you have not fought an S/S warior. GS warrior build is easy mode for them because of 100blades and typically easy to take down also. But S/S warrior and M/Shield warriors are PITA.

You can also be very “cheesy” with this build as well. Remember how people would chain CnD to stay stealthed and kill people?

Well this build, you can chain bp+hs, wait 4s, do it again. Black powder shoots for about 700-1k damage, heart seeker can hit pretty hard depending on their health/crit.

You can actually whittle people down while regen and removing conditions. This can really mess with your opponent.

I already know all these and the scenario you’re trying to paint is somewhat superficial.

The point is to stay alive no matter what the odds while dishing out the best dps possible with a full defensive build.

These runes allow you to do that. I have 64% crit chance with fury up in spvp. 71% crit chance from side or behind.

That’s where the dps comes from, consistently attacking and critting.

I have to disagree because the bulk of your damage comes from backstab. You can easily gauge the turnout of a fight with that first backstab. If your backstab didn’t faze your target, no point in staying since you’re already at a disadvantage.

I agree with Sir Vincent, if you land a heavy BS at the start of a fight and it barely does jack kitten, disengaging may be a viable effort. Not that I’m saying I always do, but if I need to be somewhere and your def is holding me up then more time for you. For both of us.

I wish I could stream. My computer can’t handle it and my internet connection isn’t as good as it used to be.

Even if your backstab doesn’t do great damage you can out last your opponent with skilled played and mobility and down/stomp them by constantly being able to keep in their dpsing them and stealthing for regen/condi removal.

Guardians were honestly a huge problem for me no matter what build I was because if I didn’t instantly kill them I they would invuln/knockback/heal to full and I wasn’t going to dps them down for another 45s.

With this build I can beat them but it requires playing well and is usually a longer fight than shorter. No other build I have found kills guardians 1v1 outside of condi builds because they just negate your burst with 1 button and are able to outlast your dps with no problem.

This build is not about burst. It’s about being in combat constantly and never having to pull out unless you are stun breaking/getting better positioning in a team battle.

1v1 you can stand toe to toe with any class without having to reset or feel like “one trick pony” relying only on backstab.

EDIT: Sword/shield warriors are different than GS? I run S/S + GS on my warrior, most GS run S/S for the adrenaline root. Blind field usually stops this attack and even if they land it you just have to hit bp and hs when you can so you stealth. Condi removal will remove the root+bleeds and you can move. Blind field will negate most of the attacks as well. Even if he uses shield bash on you it’s not going to land if you are standing on a blind field.

swinsk.6410:

I wish I could stream. My computer can’t handle it and my internet connection isn’t as good as it used to be.

Even if your backstab doesn’t do great damage you can out last your opponent with skilled played and mobility and down/stomp them by constantly being able to keep in their dpsing them and stealthing for regen/condi removal.

Keep in mind that there are many other professions that does this way way better than a Thief.

If your most damage weapon skill did didly squat to your target, every other inferior damaging skill you have will not work.

You’re just wasting your time and his, but if that’s the idea, to waste time, then you’re doing a good job.

Guardians were honestly a huge problem for me no matter what build I was because if I didn’t instantly kill them I they would invuln/knockback/heal to full and I wasn’t going to dps them down for another 45s.

S/S warriors will bleed you to death every time you pop out of stealth. M/Sh warrior will chain stun/daze you every time you pop out of stealth.

See if you can last against those builds.

With this build I can beat them but it requires playing well and is usually a longer fight than shorter. No other build I have found kills guardians 1v1 outside of condi builds because they just negate your burst with 1 button and are able to outlast your dps with no problem.

This is why you need to choose your battles. The longer you stay, the less likely you are to come out on top.

When stealth was 3s, sure I will dance with any professions because I can backstab faster than they can heal off my damage.

This build is not about burst. It’s about being in combat constantly and never having to pull out unless you are stun breaking/getting better positioning in a team battle.

1v1 you can stand toe to toe with any class without having to reset or feel like “one trick pony” relying only on backstab.

That’s fine, if that’s your goal, but don’t say that you will outlast your target because that’s simply far-fetched.

And backstab is not a “one trick pony”, it’s a staple for any D/x build because that’s where the bulk of the damage is going to come from.

EDIT: Sword/shield warriors are different than GS? I run S/S + GS on my warrior, most GS run S/S for the adrenaline root. Blind field usually stops this attack and even if they land it you just have to hit bp and hs when you can so you stealth. Condi removal will remove the root+bleeds and you can move. Blind field will negate most of the attacks as well. Even if he uses shield bash on you it’s not going to land if you are standing on a blind field.

S/S is Sword/Sword, not Sword/SHield.

I thought that was apparent since I spelled out shield for clarification.

“even if they land it you just have to hit bp and hs when you can so you stealth”

Not if you’re Revealed you can’t. That S/S warrior have you on the chopping block for 4s.

Have you been in the receiving end of Flurry (sword F1) -> 100blades (GS) combo while crippled and bleeding the whole time?

How about a high level skill combo of Pummel Bash (mace) -> 100blades -> Bull Charge -> Shield Bash -> Crushing Blow(mace) -> Skull Crack (mace F1) -> 100 blades?

You think you can stay and fight and out last those warrior builds?

All that time, you are an easy target due to revealed debuff. Even if you use BP, you think the warrior will just keep attacking you? They’ll wait because it buys them time to get their skills off CD.

You see, the scenario you are painting is not realistic.

I thought Superior Rune of Rage was bugged, not giving the +5% crit damage while Fury is up. Is that not true or are you just not bothered?

I don’t know about the runes. I just assume things work like runes at this point in the game. I’ll test it at some point but I really got it for the duration bonus to fury and fury on hit which actually do work.