Guild Wars 2

This is the WvW build I run for my thief for roaming. It is a condition build, pretty over powered and does not use the elite spec. (For those of you who scream that not having HOT makes you useless.)

http://asphyxia.tv/wvw-roaming-thief-condition-build/

Man, I used to run this pre-HoT. The “hacking” salty PMs are gold. Does the “heal+stow” trick still work?

borgs.6103:

Man, I used to run this pre-HoT. The “hacking” salty PMs are gold. Does the “heal+stow” trick still work?

Not sure, I don’t really play thief that much because it got boring lol. But yeah any time you play this build, you get those kind of PMs if people ever get a chance to see you outside of stealth lol.

One day my 3 man group got into it with 2 thieves running this build and we eventually just had to run away because we couldn’t ever see them outside of stealth lol.

I never understood why condi theif, especially that trapper build and being pm flamed isnt fun. Even going full ascended as well lol.

Seen a few of them around and luckerly they have no stun break if they revealed them self (shadow step onto their bp) they normally die fast.

The glaring hole with this build does seems to be stun or immobilize but I suspect the player picks their spots and avoids players running heavy AoE CC.

Straegen.2938:

The glaring hole with this build does seems to be stun or immobilize but I suspect the player picks their spots and avoids players running heavy AoE CC.

Not sure I understand what you’re saying. Needle trap immobilizes, tripwire knocks down.

If you mean stun breaks – you’re right, it doesn’t have anything good to deal with that. But if you’re careful, you won’t need it because you can keep up your stealth shortbow 5 away if you need. Shortbow 5 is the easy way to get away from the immobilizes, but lacks stun breaks. Luckily being full dire, it has plenty of toughness and HP to survive being stunned for a few seconds then just shortbow5 away.

Josh XT.6053:

Not sure I understand what you’re saying. Needle trap immobilizes, tripwire knocks down.

I was referencing defensively. One knockdown trap by another thief and this build will end up eating any number of big shots with no way to defend. I routinely catch similar builds by switching a utility to Trip Wire then DPSing the area it was popped. Basically any build that drops crazy CC can blow this build up.

That said, I am sure once a player learns the build they know what to avoid and to be careful around CC builds. Course Trip Wire is a particularly nasty problem for builds that lack a stun break.

Straegen.2938:

Josh XT.6053:

Not sure I understand what you’re saying. Needle trap immobilizes, tripwire knocks down.

I was referencing defensively. One knockdown trap by another thief and this build will end up eating any number of big shots with no way to defend. I routinely catch similar builds by switching a utility to Trip Wire then DPSing the area it was popped. Basically any build that drops crazy CC can blow this build up.

That said, I am sure once a player learns the build they know what to avoid and to be careful around CC builds. Course Trip Wire is a particularly nasty problem for builds that lack a stun break.

Nothing is perfect, but I’ve had pretty good success in winning 3v1s with this build even lol. Can’t say they were “good players” but it is not hard to win those kind of fights on it.

So you keep 100% stealth uptime with d/p heartseeker combo, right? So nobody sees you coming and you start casting tripwire, steal in right before it finishes casting, and then you place needle trap and caltrops?

And they just melt?

Sidizen.9048:

So you keep 100% stealth uptime with d/p heartseeker combo, right? So nobody sees you coming and you start casting tripwire, steal in right before it finishes casting, and then you place needle trap and caltrops?

And they just melt?

Bad players melt. Also with any bit of lag its very easy to miss the precast tripwire on someone, so sometimes its better just to steal in and predict where they might be moving before you cast it.

I think the build is overrated because of how easy its to counter, but one thing its good and fun at is fighting bad players outnumbered.

Sidizen.9048:

So you keep 100% stealth uptime with d/p heartseeker combo, right? So nobody sees you coming and you start casting tripwire, steal in right before it finishes casting, and then you place needle trap and caltrops?

And they just melt?

It is a gimmick that relies on players willing to engage. Basically this thing can irritate the hell out of most players that locks horns with it.

On the rare occasion I run across the trapper spam from stealth build, I leave. If I am really bored I will drop a stealth trap over a knockdown trap but most of the time it is not worth it.

Sidizen.9048:

So you keep 100% stealth uptime with d/p heartseeker combo, right? So nobody sees you coming and you start casting tripwire, steal in right before it finishes casting, and then you place needle trap and caltrops?

And they just melt?

Pretty much lol. You steal in to the person, drop your traps and caltrops then also dodge roll to drop the caltrops from the traits. Then you just go back to stealthing with your d/p and go back in for the burst when cooldowns are up.

Straegen.2938:

It is a gimmick that relies on players willing to engage. Basically this thing can irritate the hell out of most players that locks horns with it.

^ This lol. It is funny to do with anyone who thinks they can engage without some kind of reveal ability or stealth trap. Even if they do drop a stealth trap, just switch to shortbow and hit 5 to get away lol. The build is pretty tank being full dire so its not super easy to kill even if you do get caught for a second, it isn’t like a zerker thief that just instantly blows up if you throw a rock at it.

troll build

u will never kill decent player with this crap. Maybe u can kitten them off but thats about it.

So… Does this build actually kill someone?
I mean, how do you actually get people to fight you? kitten easy to just walk away from your trapped area and force you to go out of stealth (after which a quick turn with a Basi venom up for a stun will completely destroy you…), or give up the chase.

Suppose you could kill some baddies with it, sure… Aside of that, this build doesn’t really do kitten.

Most kittened up build. For trolls only who dont know how to use their class properly. Just go condi trapper perma stealth then. 50% of WvW roamers play this crap.

Like someone else said above, if you get someone to commit to trying to fight you – you’ll generally end up killing them because they won’t know what to do about it. If they decide to run from you, you’re not going to do anything to them.

That build is not even optimized.

Lower Steal CD (Sleight of Hand) is better than applying Confusion since Poison on Steal (DA: Serpent’s Touch) deals more damage thus picking Bewildering Ambush is a bad choice.

Pressure Striking is unnecessary, instead take Bountiful to deny them of any boon.

Using trapper rune makes Hidden Thief unnecessary. You’re better off using Leeching Venom and Venomous Aura and swap Tripwire with Spider Venom for more poison stacks.

Drop D/P for P/P since the stealth from D/P is not necessary when running with Trapper Rune.

Bodyshot can add another 5% Condition damage.

P/P Unload can stack might really fast that makes those Poison ticks hurt. Only use Unload to stack might — don’t spam it since it’s useless due to low Power.

Only drop the trap for stealth when necessary or to keep distance.

If you play it right, you can actually kill someone instead of just being an annoying troll.

Fixed Build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAqaVlsMhmnYbTwoJQ/EHyEFPH6hdQvnTRA43ixINA-TlyBABNqE0ONEYcIAA4EAIq6Plv/ABHJglfAAdp8jQ9BBAQASml5MDM0hO0hO0h2Mn5QH6MnZpAWUsF-w

Sir Vincent III.1286:

That build is not even optimized.

Lower Steal CD (Sleight of Hand) is better than applying Confusion since Poison on Steal (DA: Serpent’s Touch) deals more damage thus picking Bewildering Ambush is a bad choice.

Pressure Striking is unnecessary, instead take Bountiful to deny them of any boon.

Using trapper rune makes Hidden Thief unnecessary. You’re better off using Leeching Venom and Venomous Aura and swap Tripwire with Spider Venom for more poison stacks.

Drop D/P for P/P since the stealth from D/P is not necessary when running with Trapper Rune.

Bodyshot can add another 5% Condition damage.

P/P Unload can stack might really fast that makes those Poison ticks hurt. Only use Unload to stack might — don’t spam it since it’s useless due to low Power.

Only drop the trap for stealth when necessary or to keep distance.

If you play it right, you can actually kill someone instead of just being an annoying troll.

Fixed Build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAqaVlsMhmnYbTwoJQ/EHyEFPH6hdQvnTRA43ixINA-TlyBABNqE0ONEYcIAA4EAIq6Plv/ABHJglfAAdp8jQ9BBAQASml5MDM0hO0hO0h2Mn5QH6MnZpAWUsF-w

Would the life steal causing actual damage instead of condition damage reveal you? I haven’t tried but that looks pretty solid aside from that.

And are trapper runes really worth while if you’re only running 1 trap?

Josh XT.6053:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

That build is not even optimized.

Lower Steal CD (Sleight of Hand) is better than applying Confusion since Poison on Steal (DA: Serpent’s Touch) deals more damage thus picking Bewildering Ambush is a bad choice.

Pressure Striking is unnecessary, instead take Bountiful to deny them of any boon.

Using trapper rune makes Hidden Thief unnecessary. You’re better off using Leeching Venom and Venomous Aura and swap Tripwire with Spider Venom for more poison stacks.

Drop D/P for P/P since the stealth from D/P is not necessary when running with Trapper Rune.

Bodyshot can add another 5% Condition damage.

P/P Unload can stack might really fast that makes those Poison ticks hurt. Only use Unload to stack might — don’t spam it since it’s useless due to low Power.

Only drop the trap for stealth when necessary or to keep distance.

If you play it right, you can actually kill someone instead of just being an annoying troll.

Fixed Build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAqaVlsMhmnYbTwoJQ/EHyEFPH6hdQvnTRA43ixINA-TlyBABNqE0ONEYcIAA4EAIq6Plv/ABHJglfAAdp8jQ9BBAQASml5MDM0hO0hO0h2Mn5QH6MnZpAWUsF-w

Would the life steal causing actual damage instead of condition damage reveal you? I haven’t tried but that looks pretty solid aside from that.

No. It behave like Caltrops. scatch that. The venom only triggers on hit and you should only use it with Unload.

And are trapper runes really worth while if you’re only running 1 trap?

For a P/P build — yes because nobody expected a P/P to go in stealth.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

For a P/P build — yes because nobody expected a P/P to go in stealth.

Yeah but the point of the build is to be in permanent stealth while just dropping conditions on people while in stealth. To never be seen, so pistol main hand is really pointless since I wouldn’t be seen out of stealth anyway.

Josh XT.6053:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

For a P/P build — yes because nobody expected a P/P to go in stealth.

Yeah but the point of the build is to be in permanent stealth while just dropping conditions on people while in stealth. To never be seen, so pistol main hand is really pointless since I wouldn’t be seen out of stealth anyway.

You can achieve “to never be seen” and dropping conditions on people tossing dead cows from a trebuchet too.

I am confused by the P/P variant as its stealth capability is severely limited.

• D/P offers more stealth. Players also lose Shadow Shot which is great for staying on fleeing enemies. With D/P they do lose the AA that bleeds and the immobilize which can be powerful in this build but I think this build is meant to be high stealth.
• I don’t think traps proc venoms besides that is a lot of traits and utility for one venom that applies poison which this build already applies heavily
• Removing Pressure Striking eliminates Torment from the build which makes condi-cleanse easier by removing another condition type. It also synergizes well with head shot.
• Geomancy is a pretty powerful sigil on this build
• Hidden Thief while not a must have is definitely a great escape mechanism and the mobility is excellent for a near perma stealth build
• Cloaked in Shadow is a suprising effective trait on a stealth build. It allows players to more easily drop traps on top of attacking opponents. Going stealth from terrain is also surprisingly easy.
• Bewildering Ambush is 5 stacks on Confusion. On this build that is some serious damage.
• Signet of Agility can be a solid option over Caltrops. The extra dodge applies a lighter Caltrops but you pick up a condi clear and more defense. Shadow Step is what I would put here mainly for the extra condi-removal, escape and closing capability. The build already has plenty of condi applicaiton.
• While the cooldown sucks, Mistfire Wolf is actually a pretty decent option for this build. The pet applies chill and burning on foes in an AoE. The pet also doesn’t proc a reveal and uses the players condi stats. If Dagger Storm hit like it used to, it would be an obvious pick but these days it just makes the thief an easy target.

Something like this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQNAoaVnsMBlOhtNBmNBEIiDZiyvFH6Hq3zpIA45QL8CA-TlyCABHfCA8U9nJeAAJqEEQ9Bhv/AFHSgsU+BwRC4FNEBAQAmZZWmzMwQH6QH6QHazcmDdozcmlCYRpRA-w

Straegen.2938:

I am confused by the P/P variant as its stealth capability is severely limited.

It’s not a variant, rather an alternative condi build using Trapper Runes. The OP emphasizes on perma-stealth yet have chosen to take Dagger Storm so I made the suggestion assuming that perma-stealth was not the main focus.

• D/P offers more stealth. Players also lose Shadow Shot which is great for staying on fleeing enemies. With D/P they do lose the AA that bleeds and the immobilize which can be powerful in this build but I think this build is meant to be high stealth.

Yeah, no argument there. Like I said, looking at the build’s Elite skill choice, I assume that perma-stealth was not the focus.

• I don’t think traps proc venoms besides that is a lot of traits and utility for one venom that applies poison which this build already applies heavily

You can’t go wrong with applying more poison since it is the highest condition damage that Thief can easily apply. The Venom is to be used in conjunction with Unload — applying poison at the same time stacking might.

• Removing Pressure Striking eliminates Torment from the build which makes condi-cleanse easier by removing another condition type. It also synergizes well with head shot.

Adding torment doesn’t make condi-cleanse easier since the build already applies bleed, poison, weakness, vuln, immob, cripple, and blind — that’s a lot of conditions to remove already. However, the choice here is between applying Torment or denying buff and the choice is clear.

EDIT: Besides, how are you going to apply Torment if the goal is to remain in stealth?

• Geomancy is a pretty powerful sigil on this build

I guess, but I rather boost all condition damage with Busting.

• Hidden Thief while not a must have is definitely a great escape mechanism and the mobility is excellent for a near perma stealth build

Yes for a perma-stealth.

• Cloaked in Shadow is a suprising effective trait on a stealth build. It allows players to more easily drop traps on top of attacking opponents. Going stealth from terrain is also surprisingly easy.

Yes, but it’s redundant since the build already has Black Powder. The only time this trait is useful is when using Steal with Hidden Thief. VA grants the build more access to conditions by lowering the CD of Venom.

• Signet of Agility can be a solid option over Caltrops. The extra dodge applies a lighter Caltrops but you pick up a condi clear and more defense. Shadow Step is what I would put here mainly for the extra condi-removal, escape and closing capability. The build already has plenty of condi applicaiton.

Caltrops is a good skill to force your target to waste dodges or teleports. You can’t get that kind of advantage using Signet of Agility. Besides, if the OP’s build is to remain in stealth, he should not have to worry about cleansing conditions — Shadow’s Embrace will take care of that.

• While the cooldown sucks, Mistfire Wolf is actually a pretty decent option for this build. The pet applies chill and burning on foes in an AoE. The pet also doesn’t proc a reveal and uses the players condi stats. If Dagger Storm hit like it used to, it would be an obvious pick but these days it just makes the thief an easy target.

Mistfire is an expensive Elite skill, expensive meaning, you need to buy it with real money if you want it and if you don’t have the upgraded version of the game.

If it was based on my elite skill choice – just make a suggestion on an alternative for the elite. I don’t think the venoms work on traps or caltrops since they don’t technically do any raw damage (I could be wrong?) I mostly just took dagger storm to help me out a little bit if I do get caught by a stealth trap or something like that.

Josh XT.6053:

If it was based on my elite skill choice – just make a suggestion on an alternative for the elite. I don’t think the venoms work on traps or caltrops since they don’t technically do any raw damage (I could be wrong?) I mostly just took dagger storm to help me out a little bit if I do get caught by a stealth trap or something like that.

The thing is, it’s not just the Elite skill. I’m simply showing a better use of Trapper where you can actually kill someone instead of just being a troll. Another thing I failed to change was that, in my P/P build, I should have used Viper/Dire instead of full Dire. Just a different approach using the same Rune and more effective than perma-stealth. Popping in and out of stealth is just as annoying.

I’ve killed plenty on this build – but they have to get confident and try to fight me for it to happen lol. If they even attempt to fight me, they lose and I get an easy bag.

The whole point of it is to be a permanent stealth troll condi build. If someone runs from me, sure – might not be able to take them down, but if they don’t – easy bag lol.

If they see someone using D/P, it’s an automatic waste of time and only new players will even attempt to duel a D/P. However, when they see a P/P, they automatically get overconfident and would commit faster than they would have seeing a D/P. Just my WvW experience.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

It’s not a variant, rather an alternative condi build using Trapper Runes. The OP emphasizes on perma-stealth yet have chosen to take Dagger Storm so I made the suggestion assuming that perma-stealth was not the main focus.

After the nerf to the trapper runes unless running multiple traps the runes are going to seriously under perform compared to other condi runes.

Adding torment doesn’t make condi-cleanse easier since the build already applies bleed, poison, weakness, vuln, immob, cripple, and blind — that’s a lot of conditions to remove already. However, the choice here is between applying Torment or denying buff and the choice is clear.

Every condi type is a big deal when dealing with bunkers. If I could get burning in there I would cram that as well. The first d/w ele or chronomancer running condi removal will necessitate a variety of condi to get anything to stick. I actually find variety more important than duration in most fights since most condi removal is by stack.

EDIT: Besides, how are you going to apply Torment if the goal is to remain in stealth?

As for proc’ing torment. The knockdown trap can do that and firing Headshot during a player trying to heal is worth dropping out of stealth. Headshot can also be a strong applicator when a player is trying to run.

I guess, but I rather boost all condition damage with Busting.

Bursting and Geo is a strong combo on this build as Geo doesn’t proc Reveal.

Yes, but it’s redundant since the build already has Black Powder. The only time this trait is useful is when using Steal with Hidden Thief. VA grants the build more access to conditions by lowering the CD of Venom.

Black Powder is expensive. I believe the trait also procs even when using a stealth skill while already stealthed. It is also a surprisingly effect escape tool allowing a thief to barrel off a long drop.

Caltrops is a good skill to force your target to waste dodges or teleports. You can’t get that kind of advantage using Signet of Agility. Besides, if the OP’s build is to remain in stealth, he should not have to worry about cleansing conditions — Shadow’s Embrace will take care of that.

SoA gives one more dodge which in turn procs the Caltrops trait. The dodge Caltrop is not as good as the Caltrops utility but SoA also comes with the condi removal. As for Embrace, it cannot clear condi fast enough from a spike applicator like a ChronoCondi build that Shatters right on top of a thief especially if the thief is already in stealth.

Mistfire is an expensive Elite skill, expensive meaning, you need to buy it with real money if you want it and if you don’t have the upgraded version of the game.

True but if a player has access to the skill it is a better choice. These days almost any elite on the thief is better than Dagger Storm which has been completely neutered. Some of the racial elites would even be potential options such as Sylvan Hound, Snow Leopard, Wolf, Reaper, Balthazar. BV is a better choice as well but requires a reveal to apply.

Trapper runes do not impact your apply to apply conditions in a negative fashion. You only really need to trait one trap though you will very often take two as the trap laid from your heal will also stealth you. (trappers respite)

In other words you can trait withdraw to open a gap, cleanse those 4 conditions plus one for SE, heal you, stealth you and drop a trap all of this uninterruptable and at 0 cast time. Those extra sneak attacks out of stealth add significantly to the number of bleed stacks you can apply that are free of INI usage which in turn allows more usage of shadowstrike as you not spending ini with a CnD. The 10 percent added condition duration is also very nice.

This in turn gives more flexibilty on the Utility bar wherein Blinding powder becomes more usable or where you can sub in another skill.

There another way you can apply conditions while remaining in stealth that I have been toying with and that the skill pain inverter. It an AOE condition app of three stacks of confusion and it does not reveal. It appears to have no upper limit on targets and a decent range.

Trait BA, steal to target and use pain inverter and you have 8 instant confusion stacks.

babazhook.6805:

Trapper runes do not impact your apply to apply conditions in a negative fashion. You only really need to trait one trap though you will very often take two as the trap laid from your heal will also stealth you. (trappers respite)

Trapper runes compared to say Krait does indeed reduce the total condi DPS. Krait can apply some solid condi every 30s and make bleeds last a VERY long time. If a player did go P/P with a trap I would suggest BV with Krait over Trapper.

Straegen.2938:

If a player did go P/P with a trap I would suggest BV with Krait over Trapper.

Been there, done that, it doesn’t work since the Trapper gives P/P access to stealth while Krait doesn’t. The bleed from stealth attack is way better condi application than what Krait can provide.

babazhook.6805:

… the skill pain inverter. It an AOE condition app of three stacks of confusion and it does not reveal. It appears to have no upper limit on targets and a decent range.

Trait BA, steal to target and use pain inverter and you have 8 instant confusion stacks.

Ohh, nice one. Too bad I have no Asura Thief :/ I should really roll one.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

babazhook.6805:

… the skill pain inverter. It an AOE condition app of three stacks of confusion and it does not reveal. It appears to have no upper limit on targets and a decent range.

Trait BA, steal to target and use pain inverter and you have 8 instant confusion stacks.

Ohh, nice one. Too bad I have no Asura Thief :/ I should really roll one.

Radiation field is also of interest again an Asura racial. I have not yet tried and the cooldown quite long but it a full 15 second posion field. You can get a lot of poison off that with whirls or projectiles.

babazhook.6805:

There another way you can apply conditions while remaining in stealth that I have been toying with and that the skill pain inverter. It an AOE condition app of three stacks of confusion and it does not reveal. It appears to have no upper limit on targets and a decent range.

Trait BA, steal to target and use pain inverter and you have 8 instant confusion stacks.

Good call on the pain inverter, my thief is asura so I might have to try that out.