Guild Wars 2

Hey everyone I’m actually learning the thief class and I’m playing this build

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoaVlsMp0pVOx7J8PNxOBtdtDwE4+EXoEdtDA-TVCBABCu/wKaBg4RAcmSQsU+BwJAIFdNMckA0R9HSBExYA-w

So my problem is that in WvW I never hit for more than 4k with my backstab, I wouldn’t mind if that was the average backstab dmg but I keep seeing 6k to 9k backstab from other thief.

I’m talking about post patch, on videos I often see 6k+ and when I play my mesmer I also often get hit for 6K+

So is there something I’m missing on the build/gear ? or maybe something I do wrong that could improve my backstab damage ?

Thanks

Are you hitting your targets in the back?

This is my opinion:
I wouldn’t use travelers runes anymore, because they got nerfed. Get used to use Signet of Shadows, and switch it out before combat.

The might-stacking build with valk-armor actually works great for me, see the “balanced d/d build” in the thief forums.

As you might know, critical damage-focused builds got nerfed, so we have to find the damage somewhere else. So far might-stacking with strength runes is per now a good replacement.

mompen has a valid yet scary and downright nauseating point, I’m sorry to say but the Traveler Runes won’t cut it anymore for the D/D build, they didn’t get nerfed it’s just that they don’t offer the needed bonuses anymore to make up for damage loss (their stats didn;t get changed but they are now inadequate). I personally recommend salvaging your current gear that has the runes and selling the runes for money toward new valk armor and another rune set, as for strength runes, they cost about as much if not more than Traveler Runes so the money from them will not pay for strength runes.

4-6k with that setup is honestly about what I would expect to see. With 25 stacks of bloodlust, your backstab is rated at 2200 damage. IIRC, those damage ratings are based off 2600 armor. So if you were to hit a glass cloth wearer without protection (say 1800 armor), you can expect a base damage of about 3k. With your ferocity, that would be multiplied by 2.26, giving you a final hit of abouy 6,750. This is against pure glass with no protection though, with any medium armored build, you should expect to hit around an average of 5k, and against bunkers with protection I have hit for as little as 2-3k with similar builds.

If you want to see bigger numbers, you really need to stack multipliers. Since you’re using D/P, you’re probably not even getting the 10% from first strikes.

Consider this change (I left all your gear the same but changed your traits and signet)(http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoaVlsMp0pNOx7J8PNRLBtd07wL87M6+gAA-TVCBABCu/wKaBg4RAcmSQsU+BwJAIFdNMckA0R9HSBExYA-w).

The base damage for backstab is now 2687, and you will be benefiting from 4 multipliers which are multiplicative, not additive so you end up with a final multiplier of 3.01. If we adjust that base damage to a glass cloth wearer again, you end up with a base of 3,880 ish making the final crit somewhere around 11,680. This could have been about 20% higher before the ferocity change meaning a hit of around 14k.

One of the biggest mistakes non-thieves make when talking about thieves and backstab damage is that backstab is not an innately high hit, but rather all the damage comes from traits and multipliers.

Hey thanks for all answers, sounds like changing my weapon set from D/P to D/D would be a good first step to benefit the 10% from first strikes.

The runes and mightstacking sounds like a good step too to raise my BS dmg too , I’ll farm some gold to try that setup.

@Maugetarr, thanks that build seems to reach some high number but is it really possible to roam without shadow arts ? Asking that because I’m still unfamiliar with the class but I feel like those traits saved my life more than once and dropping those traits is like being a free kill for most of the tanky/semi-tanky people I’ll face

Mydnyght.5026:

Hey thanks for all answers, sounds like changing my weapon set from D/P to D/D would be a good first step to benefit the 10% from first strikes.

The runes and mightstacking sounds like a good step too to raise my BS dmg too , I’ll farm some gold to try that setup.

@Maugetarr, thanks that build seems to reach some high number but is it really possible to roam without shadow arts ? Asking that because I’m still unfamiliar with the class but I feel like those traits saved my life more than once and dropping those traits is like being a free kill for most of the tanky/semi-tanky people I’ll face

Not gonna lie, you’d probably die a lot. That was the classic glass cannon (for the most part) which is where everyone’s assumption that all thieves have insane damage comes from. I’d stick with a more balanced build, especially while still learning the class. Just don’t expect huge hits without taking all those modifiers.

It’s possible to roam without shadow arts, but you’ve got to know when to hold ‘em and when to fold ’em. Right now, I haven’t been doing a lot of solo roaming, but when I’ve been in small groups (2-3), I’m run with the 2/6/0/0/6 PvP build making for pretty short and intense fights. You can get condi clears from Lyssa runes (still a decent 5 condi clear + boon on heal), shadowstep/return, and Signet of Agility (in a pinch). As long as you don’t try to heal while you’re poisoned and your opponent doesn’t have a huge variety of conditions, you can treat it as relatively normal damage if you have some vitality for breathing room. High risk/high reward is pretty fun/addicting though and armor repair is free now.

Haven’t seen Yski lurking in the forums lately, but check out some of his videos if you’re interested in looking into those types of hits. He’ll be the first to tell you that it’s pretty much one and done though. If you miss, you’re dead.

This is a pretty decent build as others have mentioned and it builds momentum nicely.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/balanaced-d-d-build/first

Maugetarr.6823:

4-6k with that setup is honestly about what I would expect to see. With 25 stacks of bloodlust, your backstab is rated at 2200 damage. IIRC, those damage ratings are based off 2600 armor. So if you were to hit a glass cloth wearer without protection (say 1800 armor), you can expect a base damage of about 3k. With your ferocity, that would be multiplied by 2.26, giving you a final hit of abouy 6,750. This is against pure glass with no protection though, with any medium armored build, you should expect to hit around an average of 5k, and against bunkers with protection I have hit for as little as 2-3k with similar builds.

If you want to see bigger numbers, you really need to stack multipliers. Since you’re using D/P, you’re probably not even getting the 10% from first strikes.

Consider this change (I left all your gear the same but changed your traits and signet)(http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoaVlsMp0pNOx7J8PNRLBtd07wL87M6+gAA-TVCBABCu/wKaBg4RAcmSQsU+BwJAIFdNMckA0R9HSBExYA-w).

The base damage for backstab is now 2687, and you will be benefiting from 4 multipliers which are multiplicative, not additive so you end up with a final multiplier of 3.01. If we adjust that base damage to a glass cloth wearer again, you end up with a base of 3,880 ish making the final crit somewhere around 11,680. This could have been about 20% higher before the ferocity change meaning a hit of around 14k.

One of the biggest mistakes non-thieves make when talking about thieves and backstab damage is that backstab is not an innately high hit, but rather all the damage comes from traits and multipliers.

If youre gonna go that glassy you might as well just go full glass.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoYVlsMp0pNOxyJ8PNRLRtd0NCvgXxh2PQAEiA-TFSBABP8IAoU9HzUCe1+jyPU01gnWgFOSAAcCAIDg+YA-w

12k backstabs, 7k CnD, 1.5k mug. If all of that still fails to kill them you can use a heart seeker or 2 or if their buddies come and try to help you can shadow step away and heal up

Carpboy.7145:

Maugetarr.6823:

4-6k with that setup is honestly about what I would expect to see. With 25 stacks of bloodlust, your backstab is rated at 2200 damage. IIRC, those damage ratings are based off 2600 armor. So if you were to hit a glass cloth wearer without protection (say 1800 armor), you can expect a base damage of about 3k. With your ferocity, that would be multiplied by 2.26, giving you a final hit of abouy 6,750. This is against pure glass with no protection though, with any medium armored build, you should expect to hit around an average of 5k, and against bunkers with protection I have hit for as little as 2-3k with similar builds.

If you want to see bigger numbers, you really need to stack multipliers. Since you’re using D/P, you’re probably not even getting the 10% from first strikes.

Consider this change (I left all your gear the same but changed your traits and signet)(http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoaVlsMp0pNOx7J8PNRLBtd07wL87M6+gAA-TVCBABCu/wKaBg4RAcmSQsU+BwJAIFdNMckA0R9HSBExYA-w).

The base damage for backstab is now 2687, and you will be benefiting from 4 multipliers which are multiplicative, not additive so you end up with a final multiplier of 3.01. If we adjust that base damage to a glass cloth wearer again, you end up with a base of 3,880 ish making the final crit somewhere around 11,680. This could have been about 20% higher before the ferocity change meaning a hit of around 14k.

One of the biggest mistakes non-thieves make when talking about thieves and backstab damage is that backstab is not an innately high hit, but rather all the damage comes from traits and multipliers.

If youre gonna go that glassy you might as well just go full glass.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoYVlsMp0pNOxyJ8PNRLRtd0NCvgXxh2PQAEiA-TFSBABP8IAoU9HzUCe1+jyPU01gnWgFOSAAcCAIDg+YA-w

12k backstabs, 7k CnD, 1.5k mug. If all of that still fails to kill them you can use a heart seeker or 2 or if their buddies come and try to help you can shadow step away and heal up

As I said, I wouldn’t recommend going that glassy, especially for someone new to the class, but I didn’t change everything because I wanted to show where the damage was coming from with those hihgh backstabs. You’re right though, no point in taking half measures at that point.