Guild Wars 2

I have been hopping all over the forums for lately. I saw a lot of so and so is OP, nerf this, nerf that, QQ threads under almost every class forum except for Necro’s. There are other classes come to our forums calling for nerf, and those people are on other classes’ forum calling for thief nerf, and there are “thieves” among us calling for self nerf. In addition, every other class is doing the same thing to each other and themselves. This is not Guild Wars 2, this is Nerf Wars 2.

From my observation, many of these people/QQer made their statement and accusation based on single or few events they have encountered, and possibly an overly exaggerated story they made up based on one player. I certainly dismiss them as facts without any credibility whatsoever. Yes, some of them attaches a picture of two of combat log or link some else’s video of OPness, but pictures can be easily edited and that video is NOT yours. For all we know, the person in those videos can be an extremely good player with more than 1 class. Therefore, none of those things would server as a convincing evidence of OP or not in my book.

So I would like to bring an idea forth as a proposal. It is Do It Yourself Post Thief Stress Disorder. (DIY-PTSD). The thief can be substituted for any other class. From now on, every QQ or complain about a specific class, build, ability is required to have a video evidence to back up your claim. This video has to be YOUR video. No images, no crappy combat logs, no other pro’s noob pawning video, but YOUR video. And YOU, have to play the class that YOU want to nerf. Show us how you can use simple buttons smashing to bring down a group. Let us see your OPness with a newly made class. There are two options to demonstrate the OPness that you want to nerf.

Option 1. Level yourself a class from 1 to 80, gear up, go into WvW and roam. Show us your gear and stats in the video.

Option 2. Too lazy to level? Wonderful, there is this magnificent thing called sPvP on your top left menu where all the icons hang out. See that cross sword one? Click that and you will be able to do just as the same except with no food buffs and lower stats than WvW. And all this comes at Lv 1 and free!

Option 3. Too lazy to video cap and do either of those? Well then, you are either a forum troll or you just do not believe necessary nerf hard enough to actually put a little effort into making it happy. Either way, your post will be disregarded and put into the same trash can as North Korea’s empty threat along with Fatty Kim III QQ face image. So pick one.

And the outcome is simple as most of people who actually played the class can see what you and your opponents are doing.

Outcome 1. Your opponent is good, but you suck. You are not dodging at the right moment, you are not healing at the right moment, you are doing simple button smashing, you are not positioning yourself right. You are consistently making mistake while you are playing the class, and guess what? You killed your opponent and won! Now it shows us that the class is a low skill cap, noob friendly, OP, thus nerf is needed. Your statement and complain is valid. We will not take your words seriously unlike North Korea. And if he/she happened to win, then it is a player skill issue, not a class issue.

Outcome 2. You are descent at the class, but your opponent sucks. He/she is consistently making mistakes while you put up a good fight. And he/she kicked your kitten Well, good effort, but it looks like your claim does not match the OPness you described. And if you win the fight? We will see your moves, we will see your skills. We will see how you master the craft of the class, while your enemy does not have a clue how to fight you. OP? No. Skilled play? Yes.

Outcome 3. Both of you and your opponent are on par in terms of skill, but you are consistently beating the crap out of your opponent or vice versa. Then, we now have a case of possible OPness or Class V Class counter. Your statement may now be taken seriously, other wise, please unplug your keyboard and mouse.

Want to complain about a class? Go play that class first and show us YOUR evidence in a video how you can make the make the class so OP it absolutely needs a nerf. Other wise, Alt+F4 or just Deal with it. Oh and do not try to ask a friend to fake a video, players are not stupid, we can see the different performance.

+1
Well done OP, Well done.

But QQ is not about proving a point or to present supporting evidence.

If such action has to be taken, it’s no longer a QQ but a valid argument.

OP completely missed the point.

The point is not to define or redefine what QQ is, the point is to set up a definite line to separate those who just whine and QQ and those who honestly believe certain class needs a nerf.

I believe that the Culling issue certainly contributed to Nerfing thief as we intentionally or unintentionally exploited this mechanic. However, after so many nerf patches, people are still crying nerf with their pitchforks. One post I saw today was a person saying something along the line:

“I have never played (insert class) or played against (insert class), but since I am a noob and all the pros are saying that (class) is OP, so I just joined them calling for nerfs. They should know what they are talking about.”

There is absolutely no way of stopping people from QQing or being so ignorant, but there is a way to dismiss their entire argument and trolling. And that is by giving them the burden of proof. As so you say (X) is more OP than (Y), you want to (X) nerfed? Then why don’t you show us how you can use (X) to roflstomp (A)(B)© ~ (Z), otherwise just shut up and no one cares.

Of course, the easy way just is for anyone not caring at all what these QQer are crying about, but then I felt the need to say something in defending my main class and those people who truly are skilled and not relying on OP or exploit in what they play. That is my point.

You do know that, unfortunately, you’re in the wrong place, right? Nobody in the internet would even try to convince or persuade another person. If you do know that, then it only leads to two purposes: letting off some steam, or trying to look good.

If no one on the internet would even try to convince others something, then how did Thieves end up at where we are today? Because somebody is convinced by the amount of QQ and rage after the release that thief is broken, thief is OP, thief needed a nerf. And someone is convinced enough to actually do soemthing about it. And now, someone is also convinced the 4s reveal is a bad idea after culling fix, going back to 3s for PvE/WvW.

Oh no, I am not trying to covince anyone here, I want them come to convince me. If they are not going to try to do that, then I can just dismiss their stupid comment easily by saying go make a (class) and show me how OP you are. They might not be trying to convince others, but they sure are doing it unintentionally.

Azura.4172:

If no one on the internet would even try to convince others something, then how did Thieves end up at where we are today? Because somebody is convinced by the amount of QQ and rage after the release that thief is broken, thief is OP, thief needed a nerf. And someone is convinced enough to actually do soemthing about it. And now, someone is also convinced the 4s reveal is a bad idea after culling fix, going back to 3s for PvE/WvW.

That’s hearsay — you have no proof nor any substancial evidence to support that it was the “amount of QQ” was the main reason that convinced Anet to nerf the thief.

The burden of proof is in your court.

How about it?

Oh no, I am not trying to covince anyone here, I want them come to convince me. If they are not going to try to do that, then I can just dismiss their stupid comment easily by saying go make a (class) and show me how OP you are.

Well, you’re not doing a good job trying to convince us to present a convincing argument so that we can convince you.

They might not be trying to convince others, but they sure are doing it unintentionally.

Then let us all “unintentionally” convince others. If you believe that is the reason, then it might be a very effective method on convincing others.

Your way, by the way, already failed. Just so you know.

And here you are tear my post apart for what purpose? Are you trying to prove that I am wrong, I fail, I should apologize? Because You are a Lv80 Forum Warrior? That you need your daily Forum battle XP?

I don’t expect people to support this idea, but I also don’t expect people to argue about something irrelevant like you. But, you know, people do whatever they want when they are bored. So go ahead, farm away your Forum XP in this thread. Get your grumpiness out of the day so you can sleep at night.

I proposed an method of IDEA for those who complain about OP or not OP for all classes, and you are here to argue with me in terms of facts and internet argument? You are right Sir Forum Warrior the 3rd Lv80.5. I don’t have proof on how or why Anet nerfed Thief this badly from the start, but I do have proof that I am willing to defend for the class that I love.

While you are here spending you lovely time to level up your Forum Warrior XP with me, I am going to stand by my idea, and I will tell every single “QQ omg OP” person that comes to me in game or out to not kitten off, but go try out the class, and show me how OP it is. And when I am convinced, I will gladly join the Nerf camp to call for self nerf for any class that I play.

Good day, and keyboard away your pain.

Azura.4172:

And here you are tear my post apart for what purpose? Are you trying to prove that I am wrong, I fail, I should apologize? Because You are a Lv80 Forum Warrior? That you need your daily Forum battle XP?

I don’t expect people to support this idea, but I also don’t expect people to argue about something irrelevant like you. But, you know, people do whatever they want when they are bored. So go ahead, farm away your Forum XP in this thread. Get your grumpiness out of the day so you can sleep at night.

I proposed an method of IDEA for those who complain about OP or not OP for all classes, and you are here to argue with me in terms of facts and internet argument? You are right Sir Forum Warrior the 3rd Lv80.5. I don’t have proof on how or why Anet nerfed Thief this badly from the start, but I do have proof that I am willing to defend for the class that I love.

While you are here spending you lovely time to level up your Forum Warrior XP with me, I am going to stand by my idea, and I will tell every single “QQ omg OP” person that comes to me in game or out to not kitten off, but go try out the class, and show me how OP it is. And when I am convinced, I will gladly join the Nerf camp to call for self nerf for any class that I play.

Good day, and keyboard away your pain.

You see, you have just illustrated that there is no way to convince anyone to support your idea — neither will the QQs will ever manage to convince you.

If you don’t see what I’m trying to tell you, then good luck in your endeavor.

FYI, I am also defending the profession I love from people like you who gives us a bad name by behaving the way you are behaving now.

You demand proof yet you have nothing to show for it. Isn’t that a double standard?

Well, seeing the sig, he’s apparently feeding off that said ‘QQ’, it seems more like a troll post.

/sticky request.
Just sayin’.

Azura.4172:

The point is not to define or redefine what QQ is, the point is to set up a definite line to separate those who just whine and QQ and those who honestly believe certain class needs a nerf.

I believe that the Culling issue certainly contributed to Nerfing thief as we intentionally or unintentionally exploited this mechanic. However, after so many nerf patches, people are still crying nerf with their pitchforks. […]

Oh yeah, They nerfed LBD, pistol auto, sword auto, pistol whip’s base speed, Tactical Strike’s daze duration, and quickness speed boost all because of Culling? A-net was nerfing thief prior to the culling because as soon a player developed a mediocre amount of timing and skill, the thief could weave in and out of battles similar to dnd’s rogue.

Every non-cheese thief build got smacked by the nerf-bat until it’s head leaked meat, and the build later awoke as an illiterate due to said beating. If you paid attention you could even notice smaller “tweaks” and adjustments where damage was down-scaled so that tool-tip damage fluctuated despite no change in character level or build or a notice put out to player base. I’m not referring to level scaling between zones either.

One of the reasons why I loved the original thief (before nerf craze) was because of how the class did not need to rely on stealth to be viable, even in spite of half the builds and utilities being broken. This is because every other mmo and now most rpg’s (not GW2) give thief/scout/rogue/scoundrel true no holds barred perma-stealth. It gets boring. Also makes me wonder how people mistake this “cloaking” for true perma-stealth, excluding exploits.

Now stealth is thief’s last “strong” build. So I have a “great” idea, let’s smack guardians with a 50% nerf too, since they can do practically everything and possess a class perk too(cough virtues cough). Warrior 100b should do as much damage as their auto-attack and eviscerate should hit for about 11k in pve with fury, food, and 25 stacks of might and vulnerability not 16k plus. Perma-fury is too strong, lets give it a max stacked duration of 30 sec. Necromancers should have a take reduced damage in Death Shroud and not have a second health bar.

“But those are all class mechanics!”, you cry? Exactly. Stealth is a thief class mechanic.

Reason why 90% of thieves roll stealth is not because stealth is op; it’s because the rest of the class mechanics have either very niche uses or are clearly inferior. (Tautological, I know.) Ability to clear a dungeon does not mean a build is pve viable if it significantly slows the progress of a group.