Guild Wars 2

Its super easy to play D/P and its also super annoying to play against it. I could always beat them even with my D/D power build, but shadow shot + Shadow Step+Evade Spam makes them a pain in the kitten to lock down.

What will happen is I will get them down low and they will run away for a while. Seems like Shadow Step is a get out of jail free card. Pretty hard to time a steal after shadow step but before they dodge again or black powder.

So it results in a lot of stale mates but I suppose i win in a matter of speaking for area denial.

An aggressive thieve who is kitteny is almost a guaranteed win for me unless he gets scared. I understand that thief’s role is largely dipping in and out of combat and I know Thief is the king of stalemates (if you consider it a stalemate by not dyeing) but the dipping role has gone overboard with the d/p set.

I think this is the set most other classes complain about as well. (generally speaking over the years.)

I really don’t think thief needs buffs like many think. I do believe that some other classes are hard counters and that no matter how much james bond epic ninja tactics you use on some classes, their healing rotations are far too great. Ive solo Dh but were they as good as player as I am? Probably not. They were probably pretty bad.

But if clases like Dh etc were made more killable and HoT over sustain was brought in line for more balance guess what set would get complained about? Thats right D/P and also the crazy evade spam.

Wait, you are complaining about this being annoying and think it does not need a buff?

Well, take it away thief community.

it is d/p not p/d…

Fat Disgrace.4275:

it is d/p not p/d…

Ha yeah, the first one I typed wrong. I know d/p is one of the few viable options for many, but if HoT builds in general get toned down, as they should, d/p will be the first to get complained about since its the easier set to play and easiest to reengage the fight.

its not just that its the easiest to play. the weapon set it self is has everything to a point of being ‘perfect’ which no other set can do and things like Impacting Disruption and bounding dodge just puts more icing on the cake.

All those d/d bs:

- d/p is utility weapon set, you pick d/d which is pure dmg – ofc you will find d/p annoying, what did you expect? If i pick GS on war vs LB war, i would find LB annoying.

- d/p is barely keeping thief viable in pvp – lets QQ about it so thief is completely unplayable. You want to nerf spec because in some alternative universe, where HoT specs are not OP and DrD is, dp would be OP? What a moronic argument. And yes, if HoT specs were nerfed i am pretty sure DrD would be first one to get nerfed across the board – let’s not forget how MUCH devs LOVE to nerf thieves.

- wanna complain about d/p? Go try to play it w/o HoT spec and see how “broken” it is. Jokes are – you will uninstall the game

- also “easiest to play” – ahahahahahahahahaha, this is rich comming from D/D players HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Shall i remind you, your whole gameplay evolves around 51111511111111511112222222222222222. Or even better – equip condi amy -> SPAM 3 TO VICTORY = this is definition of “easiest to play”

- also s/p offers just about as much as d/p, the only thing that is holding it in pvp is rooting on pw but the set is awesome in pve, especially fractals

- also, most thieves run dash in pvp. But nooo d/p is OP because WvW issues – who cares that pvp exists.

Cynz.9437:

All those d/d bs:

- d/p is utility weapon set, you pick d/d which is pure dmg – ofc you will find d/p annoying, what did you expect? If i pick GS on war vs LB war, i would find LB annoying.

- d/p is barely keeping thief viable in pvp – lets QQ about it so thief is completely unplayable. You want to nerf spec because in some alternative universe, where HoT specs are not OP and DrD is, dp would be OP? What a moronic argument. And yes, if HoT specs were nerfed i am pretty sure DrD would be first one to get nerfed across the board – let’s not forget how MUCH devs LOVE to nerf thieves.

- wanna complain about d/p? Go try to play it w/o HoT spec and see how “broken” it is. Jokes are – you will uninstall the game

- also “easiest to play” – ahahahahahahahahaha, this is rich comming from D/D players HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Shall i remind you, your whole gameplay evolves around 51111511111111511112222222222222222. Or even better – equip condi amy -> SPAM 3 TO VICTORY = this is definition of “easiest to play”

- also s/p offers just about as much as d/p, the only thing that is holding it in pvp is rooting on pw but the set is awesome in pve, especially fractals

- also, most thieves run dash in pvp. But nooo d/p is OP because WvW issues – who cares that pvp exists.

OP speaks from power D/D. Everyone knows condi D/D is the easiest thief build to play and imho the easiest build in the entire game to play.

The fact D/P has superior engage, CC, and staying power to D/D and almost no loss in damage (in many cases especially now it has net gains in practice) is what the OP is saying: it makes no sense for D/D to be as bad as it is and D/P to go around playing with no sacrifices on pretty-much-optimal performance. On the subject of power builds, though, you’re so clueless it’s almost sad. Pretending D/P isn’t the easiest power thief set to play and pretending D/D is in good shape or even remotely on the same tier of effort in : performance out in sPvP is more laughable than basing the claims in WvW – since it’s more viable in WvW than in sPvP and always has been. Actually, a number of players (myself included) have had tremendous success in the past on D/D pretty much solely because it only works in WvW.

Clearly, you’ve never played D/D much aside from PvE or clinching bad players via 5->1 -> Shadowstep -> 5 -> 1. And if that’s the skill level you’re claiming to be playing on, please, the door to the thread is in the top corner of your browser. I’d argue CnD is weaker than Dancing Dagger, and HS is never worth using.

I think I’m beginning to understand why HoT’s powercreep happened. People are so crazed against making sacrifices to see their overall class improve and more diversity get introduced into the game that they’d rather see themselves being out-performed by another class with the ability to call OP rather than looking at the design-level problems of their own and presenting alternatives to fix the core problems, even if it “nerfs” some design aspects of the dominant builds.

An overwhelming majority of thief players I’ve conversed with in-game, including D/P and staff players agree D/P needs toning down in order to bring the thief up to snuff across the board and fix problematic design.

Whatever, though. The thief population can keep shrinking and get increasingly more spammy and skill-less as a profession, and the developers can continue to never improve the profession or buff it.

DeceiverX.8361:

OP speaks from power D/D. Everyone knows condi D/D is the easiest thief build to play and imho the easiest build in the entire game to play.

The fact D/P has superior engage, CC, and staying power to D/D and almost no loss in damage (in many cases especially now it has net gains in practice) is what the OP is saying: it makes no sense for D/D to be as bad as it is and D/P to go around playing with no sacrifices on pretty-much-optimal performance. On the subject of power builds, though, you’re so clueless it’s almost sad. Pretending D/P isn’t the easiest power thief set to play and pretending D/D is in good shape or even remotely on the same tier of effort in : performance out in sPvP is more laughable than basing the claims in WvW – since it’s more viable in WvW than in sPvP and always has been. Actually, a number of players (myself included) have had tremendous success in the past on D/D pretty much solely because it only works in WvW.

Clearly, you’ve never played D/D much aside from PvE or clinching bad players via 5->1 -> Shadowstep -> 5 -> 1. And if that’s the skill level you’re claiming to be playing on, please, the door to the thread is in the top corner of your browser.

I think I’m beginning to understand why HoT’s powercreep happened. People are so crazed over making sacrifices to see their overall class improve and more diversity get introduced into the game that they’d rather see themselves being out-performed by another class with the ability to call OP rather than looking at the design-level problems of their own and presenting alternatives to fix the core problems, even if it “nerfs” some design aspects of the dominant builds.

An overwhelming majority of thief players I’ve conversed with in-game, including D/P and staff players agree D/P needs toning down in order to bring the thief up to snuff across the board and fix problematic design.

Whatever, though. The thief population can keep shrinking and get increasingly more spammy and skill-less as a profession, and the developers can continue to never improve the profession or buff it.

I agree HoT specs are brainless. I don’t agree that d/p is broken. Yes, power d/d needs help but then again balance shouldn’t be based on whether or not d/d can fight d/p but whether thief generally can actually do ok in pvp and pve (sry, but wvw was never meant to be balanced around). You, just like Jaina, want actually not broken set to be nerfed and ruin experience for every thief in pvp for the sake of your hipster wvw d/d builds.

I don’t understand why do you have an illusion that Anet would ever buff d/d if d/p gets nerfed to the ground. 4 years of their balancing should have actually taught you something about them.

D/P has its own sacrifices. Just like any weapon set. Simply due to ini costs alone.
I actually did play power d/d in the past, frankly i found it very one dimensional, boring and just not useful enough for teams in pvp due to lack of utility. It is pretty much GS equivalent of warriors. I can see how it can be fun for some people but it is very very very selfish set and is basically middle finger for your team in pvp.

I am playing d/p right now w/o HoT in pvp and that is everything but “easy”, go try it out before screaming OMG dp OP and calling other clueless. I play in legend, do some research before you talk crap to other people. The fact that you have to resort to personal attacks just shows how much weight your opinion and arguments have.

Also, i would loveeeeee to see all those players that supposedly said d/p and staff are broken, or all those best players that left game because d/p > s/d and what not. I always see those arguments but never get the names.

Cynz.9437:

I am playing d/p right now w/o HoT in pvp and that is everything but “easy”, go try it out before screaming OMG dp OP and calling other clueless. I play in legend, do some research before you talk crap to other people. The fact that you have to resort to personal attacks just shows how much weight your opinion and arguments have.

I wouldn’t say d/p is easy, most of thief isn’t really that forgiving. Aside from thief v thief match ups d/p is all around the most viable set because it has better utility and the most reliable damage. As such d/p is one the few sets you can do a lot without understanding much about the set. Thus it is one of our lowest skill floor sets(next to p/p and condi d/d), and you can do a lot with it playing at a low skill level, but it also does have a very high skill cap. Which can allow for all kinds of picks and plays.

I am not trying to attack you personally, but I don’t think you realize how unrewarding or how harsh the rest of thief is in a pvp/wvw context outside of d/p is, and how lacking all the other weapon sets are: in damage, consistency and utility compared to d/p. Thief outside of power d/p is limited to gimmick spam and even when played well it often falls short.

A lot of people see thief as a class has some major issues, that will never get fixed because people go “theif is fine, I used d/p and got to legend”, yes that’s nice, d/p is fine, the rest of thief is pretty lacking. There is a lot of people that share the view that until d/p get’s nerfed, the rest of thief will remain near useless.

Eval.2371:

Cynz.9437:

I am playing d/p right now w/o HoT in pvp and that is everything but “easy”, go try it out before screaming OMG dp OP and calling other clueless. I play in legend, do some research before you talk crap to other people. The fact that you have to resort to personal attacks just shows how much weight your opinion and arguments have.

I wouldn’t say d/p is easy, most of thief isn’t really that forgiving. Aside from thief v thief match ups d/p is all around the most viable set because it has better utility and the most reliable damage. As such d/p is one the few sets you can do a lot without understanding much about the set. Thus it is one of our lowest skill floor sets(next to p/p and condi d/d), and you can do a lot with it playing at a low skill level, but it also does have a very high skill cap. Which can allow for all kinds of picks and plays.

I am not trying to attack you personally, but I don’t think you realize how unrewarding or how harsh the rest of thief is in a pvp/wvw context outside of d/p is, and how lacking all the other weapon sets are: in damage, consistency and utility compared to d/p. Thief outside of power d/p is limited to gimmick spam and even when played well it often falls short.

A lot of people see thief as a class has some major issues, that will never get fixed because people go “theif is fine, I used d/p and got to legend”, yes that’s nice, d/p is fine, the rest of thief is pretty lacking. There is a lot of people that share the view that until d/p get’s nerfed, the rest of thief will remain near useless.

I disagree that the solution to nerf. If the other sets all lacking then no amount of nerf on d/p will fix them.

When nerfing a weapon set the only valid question IMHO is it OP as compared to other professions. If no then you should not ask for a nerf just because other weapon sets in that profession not up to snuff.

The only way I could see a nerf to d/p as happening is if a whole pile of other specs and traits are nerfed across all professions. If that does not happen then a nerf to d/p short sighted and accomplishes nothing.

if d/p barely competitive now and it made less competitve and you bring all other sets up to the new D/P level than every set is not competitive.

^this is very accurate.

people fail to understand that wvw and pvp are totaly different, everyweapon set is easier in wvw because there is nothing to slow them down as in point capture, rotations and it is all open meaning they have all of the space then can ever want, and more too. d/p is not easy when you are fighting a competent person, if you are not 3 steps ahead of them its pretty hard to deal any real pressure and you become pressured. i mean yeah you could run off but what will that accomplish? In pvp where everything is toned down the dmg from thief is nothing compared to that in wvw wich makes it a lot harder to pull it off, i but i do stand by what i said that Impacting Disruption and bounding dodge make this set so much easier to play.

anet has to be very careful with nerfing/buffing they have already made s/d a lot better then it was before (not before june23) but then they also nerfed, or fixed IS

babazhook.6805:

I disagree that the solution to nerf. If the other sets all lacking then no amount of nerf on d/p will fix them.

When nerfing a weapon set the only valid question IMHO is it OP as compared to other professions. If no then you should not ask for a nerf just because other weapon sets in that profession not up to snuff.

The only way I could see a nerf to d/p as happening is if a whole pile of other specs and traits are nerfed across all professions. If that does not happen then a nerf to d/p short sighted and accomplishes nothing.

if d/p barely competitive now and it made less competitve and you bring all other sets up to the new D/P level than every set is not competitive.

Normally, and logically I would agree with you 1000%. However, anets balance pattern has rarely ever been sensible. If I learned anything from my days of playing ranger prior to thief; that you have to be basically gutted before anet even starts throwing your class a bone (unless your guardian, but that’s an exception)…

Hopefully, (and I’m not holding my breath) the balance changes oct 4th prove me wrong. As I remember somewhere in the ama for this patch that the changes are supposed to be wvw centralized. So they might stray from their usual pattern.

Eval.2371:

babazhook.6805:

I disagree that the solution to nerf. If the other sets all lacking then no amount of nerf on d/p will fix them.

When nerfing a weapon set the only valid question IMHO is it OP as compared to other professions. If no then you should not ask for a nerf just because other weapon sets in that profession not up to snuff.

The only way I could see a nerf to d/p as happening is if a whole pile of other specs and traits are nerfed across all professions. If that does not happen then a nerf to d/p short sighted and accomplishes nothing.

if d/p barely competitive now and it made less competitve and you bring all other sets up to the new D/P level than every set is not competitive.

Normally, and logically I would agree with you 1000%. However, anets balance pattern has rarely ever been sensible. If I learned anything from my days of playing ranger prior to thief; that you have to be basically gutted before anet even starts throwing your class a bone (unless your guardian, but that’s an exception)…

Hopefully, (and I’m not holding my breath) the balance changes oct 4th prove me wrong. As I remember somewhere in the ama for this patch that the changes are supposed to be wvw centralized. So they might stray from their usual pattern.

Except it never works for thief. Balancing team is literary using this class as scapegoat and nerfs it to please wvw masses for next month or so. This class never did and never will see love from dev team. 4 years were proof enough. S1 was all time low for thief class (i was literary getting reported for playing the class in matches on daily basis) and only conclusion dev team drew from it is to nerf the class even further – so no, being garbage doesn’t really help.
The very few buffs that ever happened to this class were either absolutely pointless, absolutely disconnected from the community or had only use in killing other thieves faster but not helping us vs other classes.