Guild Wars 2

Sup, folks. I haven’t really posted here much, but when I do visit, I always see lots of topics from newer players asking about the viability of P/P builds. Usually those are accompanied by plenty of responses suggesting to steer clear of that weapon-set completely. While it’s certainly not optimal due to its identity crisis between trying to be both a power set AND a condition set at the same time, it’s still plenty capable of holding its own if you work at it and understand your weaknesses. Plus, it’s way more fun to play as a gunslinger than as an assassin. :P

So, now that I’ve got a computer I can run editing software on again, I plan on occasionally posting up some videos of my P/P thief in action. I spend most of my time in WvW, usually in a small group or out roaming, so I’ve built for extreme mobility and a “twitch” style of gameplay (just for kicks, I also avoid using stealth unless I happen to steal it off of an enemy thief).

Here’s the first one: http://youtu.be/2Ag3VwuWPS4
If you dig it, the build is linked in the video description.

Anybody else out there having a blast playing P/P? Please post your videos here. WvW, PvP, PvE, whatever. Let’s give people interested in playing dual pistols something other than the usual “pick a different weapon-set” advice.

That last execute gets bonus points for style, i’m interested in seeing some more p/p action as well.

Ever try 0/30/0/25/15 for lulz?

Novem Reyn.5816:

Ever try 0/30/0/25/15 for lulz?

Yeah, but that’s waaaaay more initiative than needed, even for Unload. I tried out a Ricochet build right after the patch that was something like 0/20/0/20/30 (keeping Quick Recovery and adding Hastened Replenishment) just to see how much I could spam. It was downright silly.

Another fight clip from last night. Me + support engi vs 4.
http://youtu.be/yyMpX-OUZnM

Cool videos
I think Ricochet might be more useful, at least in PVE.

Will this stupid build have nigh-unlimited initiative? :P

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-c;4Zw-1-J5N-Vd0;9;5J-JT;147;218-59A;9;5FgFAf

What build are you using or gear I should say. Saw the link in tiny although also saw you were gaining stacks and did not notice the weapons having that. Just wondering if something may have changed from when the build was made and vid was made.

Regardless, thank you! and great vid’s was fun to watch.

@flyingfox: That’s exactly what I tried for the ricochet build. It’s pretty ridiculous, but a bit overkill since you’re trading in survivability options for tons of initiative you don’t really need. Really fun with a fire sigil if you’re shooting at a zerg, though.

@Bailey: Bloodlust stacks. I have a spare pistol that I use for building stacks, then swap out to the fire sigil pistol when I’m full.

Would you say then, maybe take out Quick Recovery or Hastened Replenishment for Executioner instead so you get extra dmg and not overkill initiative? Mmmm I think I’m going to level up my thief just to try this build with fire sigil bwahahaha.

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

@flyingfox: That’s exactly what I tried for the ricochet build. It’s pretty ridiculous, but a bit overkill since you’re trading in survivability options for tons of initiative you don’t really need. Really fun with a fire sigil if you’re shooting at a zerg, though.

@Bailey: Bloodlust stacks. I have a spare pistol that I use for building stacks, then swap out to the fire sigil pistol when I’m full.

Thank you,
I appreciate you taking the time to answer my question and for posting the build and vid!

I’ve played around with P/P and I’ve had some fun with it. I’ve run it mostly in a zerg, so my build has had more survivability and aoe damage (making ricochet useful in this context).

No P/P build is very elegant, of course, as you pointed out: you are spending useless points in condition damage. Anet could certainly improve upon these options.

Apart from that, however, I think the biggest thing they could do to make this build viable is give us armor piercing as a trait, similar to what a Ranger has. After all, it makes sense that if a Thief can steal his way in close to a knight in armor, he should be able to place an aimed shot at the armor’s weakest point, or bypass it entirely, as in a shot through the visor. Give us that, and P/P might be viable, in spite of it’s condition/direct damage awkwardness. As it is, it does way too little damage to, say, guardians, warriors, and tank-build engineers.

Two things I’d love to change if I could:

Turn Pistol #2 into a 600 range arc-based aoe attack so that if you lost your target, you’d still have another option besides swapping weapons or waiting until your target re-appeared. (see http://youtu.be/4weEXyoXZKs?t=1m58s for what I imagine would be cool). I know that’s more of a dual-pistol kind of move, but something along that idea.

Give Unload an incremental damage boost for each successive hit in its chain. Basically, treat it like Hundred Blades for thieves. If you can manage to lock down a target and make them eat the whole combo, it should hurt like hell.

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

Two things I’d love to change if I could:

Turn Pistol #2 into a 600 range arc-based aoe attack so that if you lost your target, you’d still have another option besides swapping weapons or waiting until your target re-appeared. (see http://youtu.be/4weEXyoXZKs?t=1m58s for what I imagine would be cool). I know that’s more of a dual-pistol kind of move, but something along that idea.

Give Unload an incremental damage boost for each successive hit in its chain. Basically, treat it like Hundred Blades for thieves. If you can manage to lock down a target and make them eat the whole combo, it should hurt like hell.

Yeah, some non-targeted AOE might help a little, since a P/P Thief will get totally pwned by any stealth-build thief.

But since Unload is ranged, I don’t see it getting an incremental boost. It’s not that hard to keep a target in range (unlike for hundred-blades).

Wastrelz.8235:

Yeah, some non-targeted AOE might help a little, since a P/P Thief will get totally pwned by any stealth-build thief.

What? No!
Just use 5 and stand in the circle, and then shoot at where he might be~
Really those are not the Problem if you play p/p.

Unload is not the issue…or is it? The problem is the rest of the skills are so kittenty it makes P/P thief so boring to play (and level). Let us have some kind of rotation! >:(

flyingfox.6150:

Unload is not the issue…or is it? The problem is the rest of the skills are so kittenty it makes P/P thief so boring to play (and level). Let us have some kind of rotation! >:(

Since we don’t have weapon skill cooldowns and thus no need for a traditional rotation, our skills seem to be a bit more situationally focused than other classes. Unload is your primary damage source, Headshot is your heal/rez/stomp interrupter, Black Powder is your blind field… even Body Shot, as awful as it is compared to the other skills, can still be used against PvE bosses and keep lords.

I actually kinda like Body Shot at times when I’m running in WvW with the guild because dropping a quick 20 stacks of vulnerability on a beefy target your team is focusing can be pretty effective. Still wouldn’t mind seeing it replaced with a more useful skill, but as with everything else about the P/P weapon set, you’ve got to find creative ways to make it work.

I read somewhere that thief pistol shots pierce by default is this true? Didnt seem like it from my tests last night..

I think pistol should have a ‘from passive’ attack like an old west quick draw. And they should add an awesome cowboy outfit. I’d totally rock a p/p set then.

i think pp is pretty cool atm.. it just needs some mobility and a buff to unload..

im going to try and make it work.

iNaddict.8021:

i think pp is pretty cool atm.. it just needs some mobility and a buff to unload..

im going to try and make it work.

Uh oh. If people start liking it, next comes the qq, and the nerfs which follow in their wake!

Yet I hope it does get a little help. It’s one of the few potentially viable non-stealth builds a thief can use. But on the other hand, if they help it the way they “helped” sword skills not long ago, I’d rather they just leave it alone. I turned in my sword the day after they came out with that. Maybe it was just me….

Cyhann.2609:

What? No!
Just use 5 and stand in the circle, and then shoot at where he might be~
Really those are not the Problem if you play p/p.

I guess that makes sense. Come to think of it, the only time pesky stealth thieves have bothered me on ANY class is when I’ve been in the process of just learning to play that class, or anyway a particular build for that class, which is where I am now with P/P Thief.

Wastrelz.8235:

Cyhann.2609:

What? No!
Just use 5 and stand in the circle, and then shoot at where he might be~
Really those are not the Problem if you play p/p.

I guess that makes sense. Come to think of it, the only time pesky stealth thieves have bothered me on ANY class is when I’ve been in the process of just learning to play that class, or anyway a particular build for that class, which is where I am now with P/P Thief.

Funny that..

that is exactly where i am at at the moment..

I still have issues when melee pressured and focused.. i keep forgetting to switch to my D/P offset and stealth out of there.

my build is 0/30/0/20/20 opting for ricochet as opposed to mug..

though i am missing the extra mug heal…

iNaddict.8021:

i think pp is pretty cool atm.. it just needs some mobility and a buff to unload..

im going to try and make it work.

You gotta be joking! I swapped to P/P running OP’s build. In sPvP I can honestly say I can move over halfway across maps in the blink of an eye.

Shadowstep, Withdraw, quadruple evade (signet that refills endurance) and you literally should be untouchable. I also run shortbow as my swap so I can shortbow #5 away after Shadowstepping. Its a little unfair tbh.

Bootzilla.4280:

iNaddict.8021:

i think pp is pretty cool atm.. it just needs some mobility and a buff to unload..

im going to try and make it work.

You gotta be joking! I swapped to P/P running OP’s build. In sPvP I can honestly say I can move over halfway across maps in the blink of an eye.

Shadowstep, Withdraw, quadruple evade (signet that refills endurance) and you literally should be untouchable. I also run shortbow as my swap so I can shortbow #5 away after Shadowstepping. Its a little unfair tbh.

Not kidding.. and I mean mobility with the weapon skills.. all those you described are available to all weps.. name a wep set in thiefs repertoire that doesnt have a gap closer or mobility skill?? PP

iNaddict.8021:

Not kidding.. and I mean mobility with the weapon skills.. all those you described are available to all weps.. name a wep set in thiefs repertoire that doesnt have a gap closer or mobility skill?? PP

It IS lacking, and it bothered me at first. But I think it can be compensated for without much difficulty. I now save Steal primarily for that purpose. Switching weapons is always an option; shadow step, whatever. Also I take Ankle Shots out of Critical Strikes to effectively apply a 3-second cripple every 10 seconds, which is significant. And after all, your real gap closer is that it’s a ranged weapon.

Wastrelz.8235:

iNaddict.8021:

Not kidding.. and I mean mobility with the weapon skills.. all those you described are available to all weps.. name a wep set in thiefs repertoire that doesnt have a gap closer or mobility skill?? PP

It IS lacking, and it bothered me at first. But I think it can be compensated for without much difficulty. I now save Steal primarily for that purpose. Switching weapons is always an option; shadow step, whatever. Also I take Ankle Shots out of Critical Strikes to effectively apply a 3-second cripple every 10 seconds, which is significant. And after all, your real gap closer is that it’s a ranged weapon.

Yeah, I ditched the stealth stuff to make room for all teleport/evasion-based utils and haven’t looked back. Gap closing is incredible… the Shadowstep, Infiltrator’s Signet, Steal combo gives you ridiculous range at the blink of an eye. Sure, those can all be used with any weaponset, but with P/P you can do all that while channeling Unload. That’s a huge deal, in my opinion. Just hit Unload, pop your gap closer(s), and watch that guy who was previously at ballista range away from you eat some major damage before he even has time to react. With Ankle Shots, it’s even better because it forces them to stick around and fight you wounded.

New video up. Didn’t really record much this week because I’ve been leveling up my necro, but there’s a couple of good clips in there.

Enjoy!

http://youtu.be/mAyBti7Rc3A

And another one from yesterday where I crash a camp fight between our two rival servers for the week. It’s a good example of how thieves can control a fight no matter what weaponset you’re using or whether or not you choose to use stealth. Terrain and mobility are your best friends in 1vX situations.

http://youtu.be/Byk31cMwwco

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

And another one from yesterday where I crash a camp fight between our two rival servers for the week. It’s a good example of how thieves can control a fight no matter what weaponset you’re using or whether or not you choose to use stealth. Terrain and mobility are your best friends in 1vX situations.

http://youtu.be/Byk31cMwwco

Amazing! What traits are you using, if you don’t mind me asking?

PwnsFroggles.7561:

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

And another one from yesterday where I crash a camp fight between our two rival servers for the week. It’s a good example of how thieves can control a fight no matter what weaponset you’re using or whether or not you choose to use stealth. Terrain and mobility are your best friends in 1vX situations.

http://youtu.be/Byk31cMwwco

Amazing! What traits are you using, if you don’t mind me asking?

Sure, no problem.
Here’s the link to the full build I’m running, including food buffs.

Cyhann.2609:

Wastrelz.8235:

Yeah, some non-targeted AOE might help a little, since a P/P Thief will get totally pwned by any stealth-build thief.

What? No!
Just use 5 and stand in the circle, and then shoot at where he might be~
Really those are not the Problem if you play p/p.

You can still reach the thief if he’s standing in the middle of his blind field with a backstab. Done it several times, so you gotta move forward in the blind field and try to keep your back out of range ^^ On the other hand, you probably have way more evades than the backstab thief

To OP: I tried a similar build but with S/P as the second weapon set. So funny to interrupt a thief about to do his backstab and the slashing him with the sword. The minute he pops out of stealth he gets an unload

The minute he pops out of stealth he gets an unload

that just sounds really dirty.

Thanks for sharing your build and videos, TeamBattleAxe! I have an 80 thief whom I have been tentative to use in WvW, for I really enjoy dual pistol but I couldn’t seem to decide on a build. I might give your build a whirl and see how it goes! If anything, it helps since you gave a nice mold and ideas for using P/P! I look forward to more P/P videos!

I also look forward to more P/P videos!

Seriously, with all the cool stuff in this game, nothing is more thrilling to me than running into another P/P thief out in the wild. Same goes with the other fellow no-stealth thieves and anyone else out there playing wacky builds simply because it’s fun for them. Those are my favorite type of players to fight and my favorite kind of gw2 videos to watch. Hopefully, there will eventually be other videos in this thread besides mine, and I’m really looking forward to what sort of crazy ideas you folks come up with.

I agree ^^

I used to run s/p with p/p off hand, had alot of fun with it too but don’t play alot of thief nowadays.

enjoy watching people play it though. nice videos man really fun to watch.

Cyhann.2609:

Wastrelz.8235:

Yeah, some non-targeted AOE might help a little, since a P/P Thief will get totally pwned by any stealth-build thief.

What? No!
Just use 5 and stand in the circle, and then shoot at where he might be~
Really those are not the Problem if you play p/p.

Do that and I’ll stand outside of the ring and auto-attack you down. The field isn’t large enough to stop people from meleeing you from outside of it or it’d be OP, so it’s horrible for countering any melee player who knows about it.

Incurafy.6329:

Cyhann.2609:

Wastrelz.8235:

Yeah, some non-targeted AOE might help a little, since a P/P Thief will get totally pwned by any stealth-build thief.

What? No!
Just use 5 and stand in the circle, and then shoot at where he might be~
Really those are not the Problem if you play p/p.

Do that and I’ll stand outside of the ring and auto-attack you down. The field isn’t large enough to stop people from meleeing you from outside of it or it’d be OP, so it’s horrible for countering any melee player who knows about it.

Yeah if he uses a sword, but not with a dagger, and even if it works with dagger,
even if he knows nobody can react to everything, also you can always stand on
the other edge of the field, use finishers to spread the blind, dodge, attack…..
So no it’s not horrible, it’s highly efficient against meele users, no matter the
pvp format …. at least it was for me, and I used it for 7 months or something,
and the only meele attacks that actually hit me were those who are faster than
the blind ticks.