Guild Wars 2

Finally I found a thief PvE that fits my play style, and I know there are similar builds like this out there but I don’t know the specifics. It goes something like this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYEQNAoYVlcmKP3eS6E+5ECniiyC9e8VoFZ1p4q0KA

Here are my questions, it relates mostly to optimization:
Since this is a condition build I maxed out the trickery trait line, the thing is, outside of uncatchable I’m not really in love with any of the other major traits. I guess since I use caltrops so much trick recharge is helpful even though its the only trick skill I use. Should I leave that alone or maybe there are better major traits that helps optimize this build? The only other thing that makes sense is steal buffs but meh…

Also I have no clue about the gear I need for this build in the end game, I’m assuming a whole bunch of carrion sigils is about as far as I got, and that I should have condition damage as well as power (which bolsters condition damage). Should I focus on Condition/power/vitality in terms of end gear? Maybe condition/power/toughness?

Let me describe my play style and state what I want to do with this build, what’s working for me, and then what my problem in terms of optimization is and some gear advice:

Main idea of this build, or at least the way I play it, is to either steal into a mob or just run into them, Death Blossom once, and if I hit most of the mob I drop caltrops here, then DB 2x more, dodge out of there to drop some more caltrops from uncatchable trait. Pop shadow refuge if needed (usually only in emergencies) and generally just wait for initiative and caltrops to recharge, jump back into the foray and DB/caltrops some more.

So far this is really fun, signet of malice helps my health stay more or less topped off (and I try to save caltrops until my health drops below 50%, because if it is a large mob and i drop caltrops my signet of malice almost immediately tops me off again). Shadow step is a pretty sweet condition removal skill so it’s more or less a necessity. I’m currently level 60 so I haven’t fully unlocked all the traits or dagger storm yet but so far so good.

Let me know if you guys think I’m totally doing this wrong or if there are some things that will further help optimize this build. Also, let me know what dungeons or temples or whatever can help give me gear to optimize this build.

Thanks!

I love the condition build for my thief (which is my main). I am level 80 and I focus on PVE. Basically I am running a very similar build but I put points into Deadly arts instead of acrobatics because Serpents Touch and Mug are a huge factor in party settings as you should really be using steal on cool down. I have all exotic carrion gear which gives me alot of condition and vitality. Power wont help you much with this build as your main damage is going to come from the bleeds and poisons. For runes I use Necromancer for the condition and vitality (only need 5 though because the fear bonus is no good for us). I then fill the rest with Runes of the Undead, again for the condition and for some extra toughness.

With this build I am able to solo several champions and open world pve is super fast paced. Signet of Malice is a must when solo but you want Hide in Shadows for group stuff to drop agro. Shadow refuge is good and I agree with the shadow step we simply have to have it unfortunately ( i mean cures condition and breaks stun). Honestly if you get good with your uncatchable ( i use them all of the time) they apply cripple and bleed so you really don’t need caltrops and can go for Blinding powder or even roll for initiative (another stun break).

I like to open like this:
run in LDB x3
steal
LDB
(if they all hit good if not roll to drop caltrops)
then you can alternate between C&D for a backstab between keeping you bleeds stacked and heart seeker based on the targets health. Keeping the bleed up with a LDB here and a caltrop there is pretty easy especially if the mob is mobile. Keeping up 15 stacks of bleed is easy with this build especially since you get an extra 20% to duration (if you put 20 into deadly arts (which also gets you dagger training).

Best thing is if you need to back off either short bow with number 5 skill or P/P with the number 1 skill will keep your bleeds up as well.

Hope this helps.

In terms of fun, if you use thieves guild, you should be able to kill veterans solo, which means it is viable. However I am very skeptical of the performance of DB, (admitting I do not have a full condition damage set), however with +1300cd, DB will do in the level of 3000 bleeding damage over 10 seconds. Using an evasive mostly tank build (gear is half soldiers, half berserkers), my backstab crits for 5000, with 100% crit chance.

Assassin’s reward is trash, it heals for about 70 per point (no healing power), so if you have 1initive every 2 seconds it gives you 35/s hp regen or a massive burst heal of 700 (you have 14khp at level 80, with HiS healing for 6k).

Main idea of this build, or at least the way I play it, is to either steal into a mob or just run into them, Death Blossom once, and if I hit most of the mob I drop caltrops here, then DB 2x more, dodge out of there to drop some more caltrops from uncatchable trait. Pop shadow refuge if needed (usually only in emergencies) and generally just wait for initiative and caltrops to recharge, jump back into the foray and DB/caltrops some more.

Is this a normal mob? using CnD, BS, HS, HS, you should be able to kill any white level 80 mob (in about 3s, sub 80 mobs will go down in the BS). For multiple mobs you would want to use shortbow and aoe.

If you want to run a DB spam try something like this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYEQNAoYVlUmaO3eS6E95Eh/hvq9gmt8l9MuqVB
It is important to get deadly arts because condition duration increases your bleeding damage by more than anything else. I would also recommend stacking those listed bonuses just to make the DB damage as high as possible. Also taking the extra initiative will allow a bit more spammage. Caltrops isn’t that important because the damage is pretty low (it is mainly used for the slow), If you keep shadow step, you don’t need shadow refuge as you should be able to escape fine (remember to dodge to gain swiftness if you don’t get signet of shadows). The other utilities are open for argument as are most trait choices. I recommend Thieves Guild so you can take any 1-2 vet mobs.

I just double checked the condition damage trait Fourb:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition_Damage

The reason why I’m thinking of investing in gear that ups power is because of power also upping condition damage, as does might.

Thanks for the gear selection suggestions Fourb, I honestly didn’t even know where to start! I’ll do some research and see how I can get the things you mentioned!

jROON I used this website to calculate my bleed damage, I don’t know how accurate it is I’ll try to look for another site calculator to double check.:
http://gw2.hazno.net/

However, according to this, at level 60 where I do 495 condition damage currently, my condition damage per tick is 57. This seems accurate, as I just double checked with some mobs, I do anywhere from 55 to 58 bleed damage per tick depending on how many stacks of might I have up. This means:

1. With my +3 initiative from the trickery trait line I can easily stack 9 bleeds from 3 DBs. That actually results in 513 damage per second = 5130 damages per 10 seconds. Assuming I’m using the right sources, this is already more damage than what your crit backstab would do, and it applies to an AoE of mobs that got hit by DB.
2. Not accounting for gear with better condition damage, just filling out the trickery trait line will up my condition damage by another 100 pts, so at level 80 according to the website I’d be doing 72 damage per tick, 9 stacks is 648 damage per sec, 6480 damage per 10 secs.
3. Realistically from caltrops, uncatchable and DB its more common for me to stack 15 bleeds rather than just 9, so damage overall is even greater than that.

I do like what you point out regarding the deadly arts resulting in condition duration, I did consider it. But, im not in level 80 areas yet, I heard that mobs will later have the ability to remove conditions so I was a little apprehensive about investing into that.

I also did not know that about assassin’s reward, if that is the case ur completely right I’m better off getting quick recovery instead.

I’ll try out what you said, but the two issues I have with CnD BS HS, the way I am built if I employ that strategy I’ll be more of a burst/condition hybrid, neither optimizing one or the other. Secondly I can burst down an enemy really quickly as you say, but how would that perform in mobs? What I love about the DB + Caltrops combo is the AoE, I don’t have to switch to SB necessarily unless I need range.

Anyway thanks for the suggestion guys, I’ll mull this build over some more.

Also I forgot to mention that the reason I picked shadow arts instead of deadly arts is the signet of malice heal as well as the increase in toughness. My build heavily relies on healing from SoM against large mobs from the hits of DB and caltrops, and increased vitality doesn’t really mean much if you still take massive damage per hit if you don’t have toughness.

This is my rationale anyway, call me jaded but after dying 3820310201 times with the thief I think I’ve become conditioned (pun intended) to be a little more tanky. Actually that’s why this build appeals to me so much, the ability to do some decent damage while being quite survivable and resilient.

Silver.4798:

I just double checked the condition damage trait Fourb:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition_Damage

The reason why I’m thinking of investing in gear that ups power is because of power also upping condition damage, as does might.

Not sure about that, I was also fooled by first but after reading it 2-3 times it came up like this.

The boon Might increases condition damage along with power.

So it’s about the boon wich increases condition damage with power. If You read about power on Wiki:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Power

The boon Might increases power along with Condition Damage. So it’s the boon specificly not the stat.

Ur right Quam! Ugh what a mishap… well hmm, thank God I didn’t actually get any gear yet, I’m so glad I made this thread lol! Thanks for the save dude!

“The boon Might increases condition damage along with power.”

It seems this is an easily misinterpreted sentence. What it means is that Might increases condition damage AND power at the same time. 1 stack of might will give you about 35 power and condition dmg at lvl80. But power and cond. dmg are separated. Some even ignore power and go for crit/thoughness/conditiondmg gear (called Rabid) instead, and put some “proc on crit” sigils into the weapons. However, if you go for Carrion gear, you’ll get power along with vit and cond.dmg anyway.

Thanks Strayhand, so my option is either power vit condition or crit tough condition for my end gear… why couldn’t they make a condition vitality toughness set? I don’t think I have any use for power if it doesnt buff condition damage (now that this is cleared up) and since im condition damages dont benefit from crit either… kitten !!

Does anyone have any creative use for either the power or the crit afforded by these gears that a condition thief can use?

i’m using a full condition armor kit and food/buff, each bleed do 140 damage and more ,

Power Vitality and Condition damage on all my pieces,

2000 CD and more to come with ascended