Guild Wars 2

I used to play a Witch Elf in WAR and, of course, I played a Rogue in WoW.

Naturally, I wanted to main a Thief in GW2 – the Rogue archetype has always been my favorite kind of character to play.

Thinking about all the problems I encountered with Rogues and Witch Elves, and now Thieves, I realize it’s always the same, no matter what game it is:

This class is not meant to fight in the front lines.

The Rogue/Thief/Assassin/Witch Elf is a SOLO class. Everything about the class is meant to be solo (or at best, with a small group, as in dungeon play).

You skulk in the shadows. You try to take your opponent down in a flurry from which they cannot recover, then retreat until you can reposition yourself for the next kill.

You don’t work in a sustained fight, if you could, you would be a Warrior or a Guardian.

Anet has two choices: leave the Thief forever broken, and unusable in PvP, or modify them until they are more like another class that is actually good at fighting on the front lines: the Warrior.

IN which case, you might as well play a Warrior.

Everything about the playstyle of a Thief screams solo, but PvP is NOT solo – it’s a group fight, a grand melee. The Thief simply doesn’t belong there.

I suppose Anet could redesign the PvP environment itself, adding elements that are exclusively meant for the Thief (example: there used to be talk about rappelling for Thieves – what happened?) but this introduces problems of it’s own – either you have to wait for a Thief to get there, or you don’t really need that particular thing done anyway, in which case it’s trivial.

Let’s face it – the Thief is kinda fun for PvE, but in the end, it will never be a PvP class because PvP is inherently group oriented, and the Thief – in our very nature, the core of our being – are a SOLO class.

It’s fine in pvp and in wvw. Just need to spec correctly.

ipan.4356:

I used to play a Witch Elf in WAR and, of course, I played a Rogue in WoW.

Naturally, I wanted to main a Thief in GW2 – the Rogue archetype has always been my favorite kind of character to play.

Thinking about all the problems I encountered with Rogues and Witch Elves, and now Thieves, I realize it’s always the same, no matter what game it is:

This class is not meant to fight in the front lines.

The Rogue/Thief/Assassin/Witch Elf is a SOLO class. Everything about the class is meant to be solo (or at best, with a small group, as in dungeon play).

You skulk in the shadows. You try to take your opponent down in a flurry from which they cannot recover, then retreat until you can reposition yourself for the next kill.

You don’t work in a sustained fight, if you could, you would be a Warrior or a Guardian.

Anet has two choices: leave the Thief forever broken, and unusable in PvP, or modify them until they are more like another class that is actually good at fighting on the front lines: the Warrior.

IN which case, you might as well play a Warrior.

Everything about the playstyle of a Thief screams solo, but PvP is NOT solo – it’s a group fight, a grand melee. The Thief simply doesn’t belong there.

I suppose Anet could redesign the PvP environment itself, adding elements that are exclusively meant for the Thief (example: there used to be talk about rappelling for Thieves – what happened?) but this introduces problems of it’s own – either you have to wait for a Thief to get there, or you don’t really need that particular thing done anyway, in which case it’s trivial.

Let’s face it – the Thief is kinda fun for PvE, but in the end, it will never be a PvP class because PvP is inherently group oriented, and the Thief – in our very nature, the core of our being – are a SOLO class.

So roam www, kill upleveled squishies and run away screaming “Thats what you get for being such a kittening zergling!” while they type one more topic about how op thieves are. Thats how i play my thief. Thats your role in gw2.

Watch a nature documentary about wolves. Then you will understand how Thieves function best in team-oriented PvP.

My WvW team has recently requested my change from a Mesmer to a Thief. While the support of the Mesmer is still needed, our team lacked severely in damage (most of us were either support or bunker built).

My guild leader plays a Hammer Warrior. He and the other Warriors and Guardians play the frontline. While he and the rest of the guild pushes through an enemy group, I skirt around the side and pick off the stragglers, whittling down the enemy numbers quickly. When I finally rejoin my guild, I’ll look for any players my guild leader has knocked down and finish them off. He now jokes that his tooltip should read:

“Backbreaker: Knock down your foe. Summon [a thief] to finish off your target.”

Thieves are not well suited for frontline offense or defense, they’re skirmishers. While that often implies “solo class,” they play a necessary role in “herding” enemy forces and picking off the weakest of the pack – like wolves do.

@deepwinter: you’ve just earned my respect with your post.
Would love to meet u in-game to learn more about the thief class. Are you on EU or NA server?

Most people that play a thief share a very similar mindset which is to see a lot of crits and big numbers. There is a side to the class that most people don’t want to play because it doesn’t make much sense to them.

I’m the guildleader of probably one of the most disliked small skirmish guilds in tier 1. In my group, I’m the point man and I play the role that is normally played by a guardian or a warrior. I get people to focus on me while the rest of my team gets free play.

Some of the stuff I don’t see a lot of thieves do but which I consider extremely important.

• I try to get as much attention on me as possible.
• I peel for the guys that are in trouble.
• I can always get my team members up when they go down, a guarantee rez.
• I chain immobilize targets.
• I can cover a lot of distance in order to put my targets back in combat.
• I use daggerstorm not for the damage but to keep my targets in combat while also making them scatter.
• I help my group get away when we’re getting stuck in bad situations or when the fight goes down hill.
• I chain daze players that I consider a threat.
• I play a can-opener for my guildies by stripping boons off of my targets.
• I stomp about 80% of the targets that get killed by my team because it’s a guarantee stomp.

To sum it up, you can be a real team player if you want to be but most thieves struggle with that mindset. Feel free to check out to see what I’m talking about: http://www.youtube.com/user/oppveretta

I want to play a match where stealth stomps is guaranteed

deepwinter.9015:

Watch a nature documentary about wolves. Then you will understand how Thieves function best in team-oriented PvP.

My WvW team has recently requested my change from a Mesmer to a Thief. While the support of the Mesmer is still needed, our team lacked severely in damage (most of us were either support or bunker built).

My guild leader plays a Hammer Warrior. He and the other Warriors and Guardians play the frontline. While he and the rest of the guild pushes through an enemy group, I skirt around the side and pick off the stragglers, whittling down the enemy numbers quickly. When I finally rejoin my guild, I’ll look for any players my guild leader has knocked down and finish them off. He now jokes that his tooltip should read:

“Backbreaker: Knock down your foe. Summon [a thief] to finish off your target.”

Thieves are not well suited for frontline offense or defense, they’re skirmishers. While that often implies “solo class,” they play a necessary role in “herding” enemy forces and picking off the weakest of the pack – like wolves do.

Hexiactlay!

Thief is good for roaming but also for zerg and better for small fight. Thief need to do damage and while other class engage enemy thief must kill and finish the fallen.

Image a fight where warriors/guardians in front line engage and take the enemies attention. Support class give backup while thieves, hidden, fight against the enemies around the fight, the medium and light armor.

Yesterday i joined in a fight 1 vs 5. They were all concentrated to the guardian, he did his work very well. 2/3 shoot with my sb and 3 falled down. A disorganized group, the other 2 players fought against guardian while i finished the downed and, in 2, killed the last 2.

Thief, as gully said, it’s a wonderfull support class for a lot of situation.

It’s not that you can’t be on the frontlines. It’s more like you can’t take hits, period. Well, a few, but if you actually get pinned down, you can get downed fast.

Supporty hammers with thieves and other dps builds in a roaming squad are devastating to run in to.

Also, dual thieves are a nice roaming combo.

I find zergs incredibly boring. They are just masses of PVT that require no less than 5 to kill 1 of anything.

I think the OP has picked up some issues but not identified all the causes. Thief defenses like blind do not scale up with the number of enemies. As more attacks come in it becomes harder to dodge and evade everything. Heavy armor class defenses (such as a big health pool, boons, invulnerability, and armor) are still be effective against any number of enemies. I don’t think sustainability is an issue since thief defenses can be very sustainable and highly effective provided they are appropriate in the first place.