Guild Wars 2

Previously, you could down somebody, start finishing them, shadow step away and then back toward the end to finish them safely.
now if you take damage after the shadow step your finish is cancelled (although the animation still plays) which makes finishing really unreliable. Shadowstep stomping was a great counter to many classes that felt fluent and rewarding to use as a nimble assassination class, please revert this seemingly un-intentional nerf.

“We gotta nerf Thief. Somehow.”
“Well we tried steal, but the outcry was potent. How about a utility?”
“Brilliant, ah here is one. Shadowstep. How about-”

Welcome to 2k15.

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Well…if you’re arguing against safe-stomps in general, then that’s fine, but if you’re targeting specifically Shadowstep, then I can’t say I agree.

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

blarghhrrkblah.3412:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Well…if you’re arguing against safe-stomps in general, then that’s fine, but if you’re targeting specifically Shadowstep, then I can’t say I agree.

I got nothing against shadowstep.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

to be fair, I always assumed the shadowstep-stomping to be unintentional anyway. if it nerfs our utility to a point where the devs have to notice our current state, then great. if not, then it’s not exactly a new trend, is it?

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

Thief has many issues that are 3yrs old and I doubt that is their intention.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

Thief has many issues that are 3yrs old and I doubt that is their intention.

I thought when they were asked about Sword #2 stomping and shadowstep stomping they made a clear delineation between the the two which basically boiled down to CD time. Sword#2 + infiltrator signet had an effective 21-24 second CD (and you could alternate between them) while shadowstep stomping is once every 40 seconds when traited (maybe less via rng).

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

Thief has many issues that are 3yrs old and I doubt that is their intention.

List of Three Year old Thief problems:
Scorpion Wire still does not work properly.
No reason to pick Skelk Venom or Signet of Malice. Ever. Not unless for gimmick builds.
Dodging after firing Shortbow 5, but before it lands results in losing dodge distance.
Valid Pathing is allowed/disallowed at a millimeter.
Shortbow 5 eats all your initiative on a failed teleport.
Most Signet active effects are undesirable.
Thief Guild still needs its cooldown reduced or its effectiveness improved (rampage, lich, plague, etc).

Wait, I should stop right? I mean I can go for days…

Has anyone else tried / confirmed this?
I tried with practice npcs in heart of the mist but I was still able to complete the shadow step stomp.

Maugetarr.6823:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

Thief has many issues that are 3yrs old and I doubt that is their intention.

I thought when they were asked about Sword #2 stomping and shadowstep stomping they made a clear delineation between the the two which basically boiled down to CD time. Sword#2 + infiltrator signet had an effective 21-24 second CD (and you could alternate between them) while shadowstep stomping is once every 40 seconds when traited (maybe less via rng).

An excellent point. If it was unintended, it really should have been addressed around that time. Also, it still isn’t a safe stomp vs elementalists, thieves, and mesmers. It’s not really thematically weird (and if that’s the argument *cough*steal with no target*cough*), and Vincent, you said the only safe stomp should be baiting downed skills by faking a stomp. If that’s the criteria, none of the things I listed should be ok (distortion, stealth etc.), yet you say they are.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

Thief has many issues that are 3yrs old and I doubt that is their intention.

As long as Portal stomp exists, you are insane to question the intentions of Shadowstep stomp lol.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

So, they should also nerf stomping in:
elementalist mist forms.
engineer elixir forms.
Any block/aegis should cancel stomping.
And any other option(s) that I surely missed.

If they take away all those because they also interfere with the normal stomping rules, then yes, then and only then I could agree with you.

What kind of mentality is this? Distortion ok but ahadow step not? Are you insane? If we got an option like mist form, why would we burn our only condi cleanse for a bloody stomp?

I’d like to hear a few more people say it’s actually broken before letting lose the full on freak out.

Serious Thought.5394:

Dodging after firing Shortbow 5, but before it lands results in losing dodge distance.

Sadly this isn’t 3 years old, but somewhat younger. There WAS a time when we could dodge out of shadowstepping with #5… sigh.

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

Thief has many issues that are 3yrs old and I doubt that is their intention.

As long as Portal stomp exists, you are insane to question the intentions of Shadowstep stomp lol.

What makes you think I agree with that. That should go too.

IMO, and you’re free to disagree, any stomper needs to be in melee range the whole duration of the casting time. And changes in range should interrupt the stomp. It doesn’t really matter if you use blind, stab, evade, etc. as long as you’re in melee range the whole time, then that method should be fine.

Cooldowns or what other “balance” there is should not allow an out of range stompping.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

Thief has many issues that are 3yrs old and I doubt that is their intention.

As long as Portal stomp exists, you are insane to question the intentions of Shadowstep stomp lol.

What makes you think I agree with that. That should go too.

IMO, and you’re free to disagree, any stomper needs to be in melee range the whole duration of the casting time. And changes in range should interrupt the stomp. It doesn’t really matter if you use blind, stab, evade, etc. as long as you’re in melee range the whole time, then that method should be fine.

Cooldowns or what other “balance” there is should not allow an out of range stompping.

Sounds pretty stupid to me. Your idea whole take on “stomping”.

We can talk about it but you will lose the discussion. For example, based on what you said so far, you think mist stomp is ok but SS stomp isn’t? yet they have similar CD? One is invul and the other isnt. Whatever. So stupid. GTFO of this forum.

Some proffessions have real safestomps…and that is okay? While thief has only ss stomp/stealth and blind. All not real safestomps as you or your team can counter the thief while stomping.
I think anet should give us back sword ss stomps. I know they said thief should need offhand pistol to secure a stomp , but they nerfed that too and they really shouldnt force us even More into d\p.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

Thief has many issues that are 3yrs old and I doubt that is their intention.

As long as Portal stomp exists, you are insane to question the intentions of Shadowstep stomp lol.

What makes you think I agree with that. That should go too.

IMO, and you’re free to disagree, any stomper needs to be in melee range the whole duration of the casting time. And changes in range should interrupt the stomp. It doesn’t really matter if you use blind, stab, evade, etc. as long as you’re in melee range the whole time, then that method should be fine.

Cooldowns or what other “balance” there is should not allow an out of range stompping.

I understand what you’re saying, but it’s just an arbitrary opinion about how it “should” behave. Teleporting away and back while still performing the whole animation makes much more sense than a ball of mist stomping someone. Or a tornado. Or a flying gyro.

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

Thief has many issues that are 3yrs old and I doubt that is their intention.

As long as Portal stomp exists, you are insane to question the intentions of Shadowstep stomp lol.

What makes you think I agree with that. That should go too.

IMO, and you’re free to disagree, any stomper needs to be in melee range the whole duration of the casting time. And changes in range should interrupt the stomp. It doesn’t really matter if you use blind, stab, evade, etc. as long as you’re in melee range the whole time, then that method should be fine.

Cooldowns or what other “balance” there is should not allow an out of range stompping.

I understand what you’re saying, but it’s just an arbitrary opinion about how it “should” behave. Teleporting away and back while still performing the whole animation makes much more sense than a ball of mist stomping someone. Or a tornado. Or a flying gyro.

They gyro…don’t get me started on that. But hey, to Mr. Sir here, it is fine b/c it is in melee range.

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

Better get rid of stab, blind, distortion, stealth, invuln, and impact strike then.

That won’t make sense nor reasonable because they are working as intended.

Shadowstep stompping is obviously not their intention, which they have expressed in the past when they nerfed Sword #2.

I think 3 years is a nice period to classify something as ‘working as intended.’

Thief has many issues that are 3yrs old and I doubt that is their intention.

As long as Portal stomp exists, you are insane to question the intentions of Shadowstep stomp lol.

What makes you think I agree with that. That should go too.

IMO, and you’re free to disagree, any stomper needs to be in melee range the whole duration of the casting time. And changes in range should interrupt the stomp. It doesn’t really matter if you use blind, stab, evade, etc. as long as you’re in melee range the whole time, then that method should be fine.

Cooldowns or what other “balance” there is should not allow an out of range stompping.

I understand what you’re saying, but it’s just an arbitrary opinion about how it “should” behave. Teleporting away and back while still performing the whole animation makes much more sense than a ball of mist stomping someone. Or a tornado. Or a flying gyro.

The point I’m making is how changing the range never interrupt the stomp, which, IMO, it should.

The form change is no different than applying a stability buff, which is completely different than changing the range.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

The point I’m making is how changing the range never interrupt the stomp, which, IMO, it should.

The form change is no different than applying a stability buff, which is completely different than changing the range.

Right, and I’m saying you’re picking on range changes for no reason other than you decided you didn’t like it. Give me an actual reason why you should have to stay in melee range, other than personal opinion. I’d say it would be a silly precendent to set.

The part of a stomp that kills a downed played is when you land at the end and “stomp” them, the rest is a “prep” animation (winding up for the stomp).

The part of Cloak and Dagger that deals damage and stealths you is the dagger strike at the end. There is also a wind up here.

Saying you need to be right next to someone as you wind up before the stomp is the same as saying you need to be right next to your target to use CnD. They should both allow you to be anywhere you like until the part that actually hits the target, at which point you need to be in range.

It’s kind of sad that no one realized he was slowed by a down-state Revenant and that nothing’s changed.

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

The point I’m making is how changing the range never interrupt the stomp, which, IMO, it should.

The form change is no different than applying a stability buff, which is completely different than changing the range.

Right, and I’m saying you’re picking on range changes for no reason other than you decided you didn’t like it. Give me an actual reason why you should have to stay in melee range, other than personal opinion. I’d say it would be a silly precendent to set.

This is quite obvious. If you look at all the downed skills, they are meant to counter a stomp to buy them time for a rez or a rally.

If there would be skills that will undermine these downed skills, then they might as well remove the downed state because it became silly to have them from this point on.

The part of a stomp that kills a downed played is when you land at the end and “stomp” them, the rest is a “prep” animation (winding up for the stomp).

And it’s also a window of opportunity to prevent a stomp, thus all of downed skills are designed to do just that.

The part of Cloak and Dagger that deals damage and stealths you is the dagger strike at the end. There is also a wind up here.

In general, casting time is designed to allow counterplay. SS Stomp simply bypass that and if that is acceptable, then might as well make stompping instant or remove downed state because honestly, what’s the point?

Saying you need to be right next to someone as you wind up before the stomp is the same as saying you need to be right next to your target to use CnD. They should both allow you to be anywhere you like until the part that actually hits the target, at which point you need to be in range.

Not the same at all. Stompping is different because the downed state skills are designed specifically to counter it.

Not allowing to counter because the stomper is out of range should be the same to the stomper not allowing to stomp because they are out range.

If you blind me before a stomp or you applied stability, I can still attempt to counter. Even if it does nothing, I’m not denied on an attempt. Unlike SS Stomping, there is no trying or an attempt to counter — I’m completely denied, instead just lay there waiting for the stomp.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

The point I’m making is how changing the range never interrupt the stomp, which, IMO, it should.

The form change is no different than applying a stability buff, which is completely different than changing the range.

Right, and I’m saying you’re picking on range changes for no reason other than you decided you didn’t like it. Give me an actual reason why you should have to stay in melee range, other than personal opinion. I’d say it would be a silly precendent to set.

This is quite obvious. If you look at all the downed skills, they are meant to counter a stomp to buy them time for a rez or a rally.

If there would be skills that will undermine these downed skills, then they might as well remove the downed state because it became silly to have them from this point on.

The part of a stomp that kills a downed played is when you land at the end and “stomp” them, the rest is a “prep” animation (winding up for the stomp).

And it’s also a window of opportunity to prevent a stomp, thus all of downed skills are designed to do just that.

The part of Cloak and Dagger that deals damage and stealths you is the dagger strike at the end. There is also a wind up here.

In general, casting time is designed to allow counterplay. SS Stomp simply bypass that and if that is acceptable, then might as well make stompping instant or remove downed state because honestly, what’s the point?

Saying you need to be right next to someone as you wind up before the stomp is the same as saying you need to be right next to your target to use CnD. They should both allow you to be anywhere you like until the part that actually hits the target, at which point you need to be in range.

Not the same at all. Stompping is different because the downed state skills are designed specifically to counter it.

Not allowing to counter because the stomper is out of range should be the same to the stomper not allowing to stomp because they are out range.

If you blind me before a stomp or you applied stability, I can still attempt to counter. Even if it does nothing, I’m not denied on an attempt. Unlike SS Stomping, there is no trying or an attempt to counter — I’m completely denied, instead just lay there waiting for the stomp.

Dude, what the kitten do you want really? You said anything is fair game in melee range then go on to talk about counterplay. SS stomp isn’t 100% safe but Ele mist form, mesmer dist, engi exli S are all melee range yet it is 100% safe. You basically contradict yourself. Like I mention earlier, GTFO of this thread.

Maybe you dont get it so I’ll try to spell it out for you the counter to SS stomp.

Guardian – Pushback right before the thief port back or as soon as.
Necro – Time fear to hit right before port back
Ele – Vapor form before port back
Engi – Pull right before port back
Warrior – Knockdown right before port back
Thief – Port before port back
etc

What is the counter to Mist form, stab, elixir s, etc stomp? Almost none.

Puz.8529:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

If they finally nerfed shadowstep stomping then good. I support it 100%. Keep it that way.

Why? Makes no sense. It is a 50 sec CD and one of our only safe stomps. Even if you decide to use the SB 5 trick, it still requires at least a 20 sec CD (steal) to work. Balanced the way it was IMO.

What makes no sense is that something like this undermines the downed state, makes the whole downed skills useless, and takes away the risk of trying to stomp someone due to a long casting time.

All theses are in place to counter or delay a stomp, yet it’s being bypassed by shadowstep stompping.

The only acceptable “safe” stomp is faking it to bait the counter before actually stompping.

So, they should also nerf stomping in:
elementalist mist forms.
engineer elixir forms.
Any block/aegis should cancel stomping.
And any other option(s) that I surely missed.

If they take away all those because they also interfere with the normal stomping rules, then yes, then and only then I could agree with you.

If it undermines the downed skills, sure why not. Another thing they can do is improve the downed skills so they are actually useful. Or they can just remove the whole downed state since everyone tries to undermine it anyway.

Everything you said about why SS stomp isn’t ok applies to every other safe stomp in the game, but you say only SS is a problem. Yes downed skills are designed to delay a stomp, but distortion, stab, invuln etc. completely negate most downed skills. In fact SS allows more counterplay than other safe stomps since you can still be stunned, knocked back and so on, you just changed position.

Edit: Also blowing a cd to get a safe stomp is healthy counterplay. Just like stab can counter stun which can counter an important skill, counterplay for counterplay is not a bad thing.

Zodryn.4216:

Everything you said about why SS stomp isn’t ok applies to every other safe stomp in the game, but you say only SS is a problem.

The SS is not the problem; the fact that a stomp isn’t interrupted when you SS is.

Yes downed skills are design to delay a stomp, but distortion, stab, invuln etc. completely negate most downed skills.

Something that negates the whole reason why there is a downed state in the first place shouldn’t be acceptable.

In fact SS allows more counterplay than other safe stomps since you can still be stunned, knocked back and so on, you just changed position.

You can’t knockback someone who is out of range, which is my whole point.

If you move while channeling, it interrupts the stomp. This should also apply when using SS while channeling a stomp.

Edit: Also blowing a cd to get a safe stomp is healthy counterplay. Just like stab can counter stun which can counter an important skill, counterplay for counterplay is not a bad thing.

If you are downed, SS Stomp denies you of any counterplay — that is the whole goal of this combo.

First, as already stated, there is counterplay. You can still knock back, fear etc. if you time it right when they port back. Thief, Mes, and Ele can all move or stealth in downed state, which hard counters the SS stomp.

Also, you save a couple of seconds getting the safe stomp, but you just wasted two stun breaks and a condi cleanse. Even if there was no counterplay, that is a big trade off.

Finally, if SS interrupts stomping, stability, distortion, mist form etc should all be removed when you start a stomp and disabled for the duration, and impact strike should be deleted. That’s never going to happen. If they did do that though, stomping would become very predictable and uninteresting. Stomp, get delayed two seconds, stomp again. Every time. No risk/reward or other options.

Zodryn.4216:

First, as already stated, there is counterplay. You can still knock back, fear etc. if you time it right when they port back. Thief, Mes, and Ele can all move or stealth in downed state, which hard counters the SS stomp.

It counters stomp in general which is what it’s designed to do.

Also, you save a couple of seconds getting the safe stomp, but you just wasted two stun breaks and a condi cleanse. Even if there was no counterplay, that is a big trade off.

Thus it shows the value of the SS Stomp. If you are willing to trade those utilities, then there is something wrong with the whole thing.

If SS Stomp is susceptible to counterplay as you said, nobody in their right mind will trade two stun breaks for it.

Rather the reason why it is being traded is because it is 100% guarantee that it will complete a stomp.

Finally, if SS interrupts stomping, stability, distortion, mist form etc should all be removed when you start a stomp and disabled for the duration,

Not really because stab, evade, mist, etc. doesn’t displace the stomper when they are active, while SS does.

…and impact strike should be deleted.

Why?

Impact Strike follows the same rule of stompping and downed skills can be used to counter it.

That’s never going to happen. If they did do that though, stomping would become very predictable and uninteresting.

I agree because those are working as designed. The stomp is still interrupted in those if the stomper moves.

Stomp, get delayed two seconds, stomp again. Every time.

That’s how it is designed and I agree that it is uninteresting.

No risk/reward or other options.

Stompping is the risk and the stomp/finish is the reward, SS Stomp removes that risk, so I’m not sure what you mean here.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

First, as already stated, there is counterplay. You can still knock back, fear etc. if you time it right when they port back. Thief, Mes, and Ele can all move or stealth in downed state, which hard counters the SS stomp.

It counters stomp in general which is what it’s designed to do.

Also, you save a couple of seconds getting the safe stomp, but you just wasted two stun breaks and a condi cleanse. Even if there was no counterplay, that is a big trade off.

Thus it shows the value of the SS Stomp. If you are willing to trade those utilities, then there is something wrong with the whole thing.

If SS Stomp is susceptible to counterplay as you said, nobody in their right mind will trade two stun breaks for it.

Rather the reason why it is being traded is because it is 100% guarantee that it will complete a stomp.

Finally, if SS interrupts stomping, stability, distortion, mist form etc should all be removed when you start a stomp and disabled for the duration,

Not really because stab, evade, mist, etc. doesn’t displace the stomper when they are active, while SS does.

…and impact strike should be deleted.

Why?

Impact Strike follows the same rule of stompping and downed skills can be used to counter it.

That’s never going to happen. If they did do that though, stomping would become very predictable and uninteresting.

I agree because those are working as designed. The stomp is still interrupted in those if the stomper moves.

Stomp, get delayed two seconds, stomp again. Every time.

That’s how it is designed and I agree that it is uninteresting.

No risk/reward or other options.

Stompping is the risk and the stomp/finish is the reward, SS Stomp removes that risk, so I’m not sure what you mean here.

Since when is SS stomp at 100% stomp? You are no longer qualify to discuss this topic as you proven you are a noob.

Narcarsis.5739:

It’s kind of sad that no one realized he was slowed by a down-state Revenant and that nothing’s changed.

Right?

Knee-jerk reactions.

@Vincent
Impact strike can completely bypass the downed state. As for distortion etc., good grief make up your mind! Are you against safe stomps or just SS?They guarantee a stomp just like SS, only they have less counterplay than SS.

Zodryn.4216:

@Vincent
Impact strike can completely bypass the downed state.

True. If the whole point with other skills is to bypass downed state anyway, might as well remove this state since it is pointless.

As for distortion etc., good grief make up your mind! Are you against safe stomps or just SS?They guarantee a stomp just like SS, only they have less counterplay than SS.

Here, let me make it simpler;
1) Does the stomper in melee range for the duration of the activation?
2) Does the stomp gets interrupted when the stomper moves out of melee range?
3) Does the downed players has the opportunity to counter?

If all the answer to these questions is “yes”, then I have nothing against it.

What I’m responding to is, if you — your opinion — think that stab, evade, etc. should also be nerfed or whatever, then you have to make that argument yourself. I’ve already stated the difference between stab, etc and SS Stomp.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

@Vincent
Impact strike can completely bypass the downed state.

True. If the whole point with other skills is to bypass downed state anyway, might as well remove this state since it is pointless.

As for distortion etc., good grief make up your mind! Are you against safe stomps or just SS?They guarantee a stomp just like SS, only they have less counterplay than SS.

Here, let me make it simpler;
1) Does the stomper in melee range for the duration of the activation?
2) Does the stomp gets interrupted when the stomper moves out of melee range?
3) Does the downed players has the opportunity to counter?

If all the answer to these questions is “yes”, then I have nothing against it.

What I’m responding to is, if you — your opinion — think that stab, evade, etc. should also be nerfed or whatever, then you have to make that argument yourself. I’ve already stated the difference between stab, etc and SS Stomp.

Based on that criteria, you aren’t ok with things like stab because they can’t be countered. You also are against SS (and function gyro) even if it can be countered since you can go out of melee range. I’m saying it’s fine since it can be countered and the melee range thing is just a thematic complaint. You’re entitled to dislike it thematically, but you at least have to recognize that it is no stronger than any other safe stomp. If they aren’t going to remove those safe stomps, why should they nerf thieves options?

DeceiverX.8361:

Narcarsis.5739:

It’s kind of sad that no one realized he was slowed by a down-state Revenant and that nothing’s changed.

Right?

Knee-jerk reactions.

I was also going to add this, thank you Caed

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

@Vincent
Impact strike can completely bypass the downed state.

True. If the whole point with other skills is to bypass downed state anyway, might as well remove this state since it is pointless.

As for distortion etc., good grief make up your mind! Are you against safe stomps or just SS?They guarantee a stomp just like SS, only they have less counterplay than SS.

Here, let me make it simpler;
1) Does the stomper in melee range for the duration of the activation?
2) Does the stomp gets interrupted when the stomper moves out of melee range?
3) Does the downed players has the opportunity to counter?

If all the answer to these questions is “yes”, then I have nothing against it.

What I’m responding to is, if you — your opinion — think that stab, evade, etc. should also be nerfed or whatever, then you have to make that argument yourself. I’ve already stated the difference between stab, etc and SS Stomp.

Based on that criteria, you aren’t ok with things like stab because they can’t be countered. You also are against SS (and function gyro) even if it can be countered since you can go out of melee range. I’m saying it’s fine since it can be countered and the melee range thing is just a thematic complaint. You’re entitled to dislike it thematically, but you at least have to recognize that it is no stronger than any other safe stomp. If they aren’t going to remove those safe stomps, why should they nerf thieves options?

Two things. Stealth and blind.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

@Vincent
Impact strike can completely bypass the downed state.

True. If the whole point with other skills is to bypass downed state anyway, might as well remove this state since it is pointless.

As for distortion etc., good grief make up your mind! Are you against safe stomps or just SS?They guarantee a stomp just like SS, only they have less counterplay than SS.

Here, let me make it simpler;
1) Does the stomper in melee range for the duration of the activation?
2) Does the stomp gets interrupted when the stomper moves out of melee range?
3) Does the downed players has the opportunity to counter?

If all the answer to these questions is “yes”, then I have nothing against it.

What I’m responding to is, if you — your opinion — think that stab, evade, etc. should also be nerfed or whatever, then you have to make that argument yourself. I’ve already stated the difference between stab, etc and SS Stomp.

Based on that criteria, you aren’t ok with things like stab because they can’t be countered. You also are against SS (and function gyro) even if it can be countered since you can go out of melee range. I’m saying it’s fine since it can be countered and the melee range thing is just a thematic complaint. You’re entitled to dislike it thematically, but you at least have to recognize that it is no stronger than any other safe stomp. If they aren’t going to remove those safe stomps, why should they nerf thieves options?

Two things. Stealth and blind.

Lol using either of those to stomp will get you 100-0’d by cleave before you’re even halfway through the animation.

Still works for me…
Maybe you got slowed or something?

Gabriell.4856:

Since when is SS stomp at 100% stomp? You are no longer qualify to discuss this topic as you proven you are a noob.

He is ignoring you because, you are right with all the arguments you brought up in your different posts on that topic. Sir Ignorance though ignores you.. Just don’t bother anymore. The rest should’ve noticed it by now too.

Is this for real? nerf invuln or block-stomping too then… -.-

Serious Thought.5394:

No reason to pick Skelk Venom or Signet of Malice. Ever. Not unless for gimmick builds.

Signet of Malice is really good in PvE – I would like to keep it like it is.

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zodryn.4216:

@Vincent
Impact strike can completely bypass the downed state.

True. If the whole point with other skills is to bypass downed state anyway, might as well remove this state since it is pointless.

As for distortion etc., good grief make up your mind! Are you against safe stomps or just SS?They guarantee a stomp just like SS, only they have less counterplay than SS.

Here, let me make it simpler;
1) Does the stomper in melee range for the duration of the activation?
2) Does the stomp gets interrupted when the stomper moves out of melee range?
3) Does the downed players has the opportunity to counter?

If all the answer to these questions is “yes”, then I have nothing against it.

What I’m responding to is, if you — your opinion — think that stab, evade, etc. should also be nerfed or whatever, then you have to make that argument yourself. I’ve already stated the difference between stab, etc and SS Stomp.

Based on that criteria, you aren’t ok with things like stab because they can’t be countered. You also are against SS (and function gyro) even if it can be countered since you can go out of melee range. I’m saying it’s fine since it can be countered and the melee range thing is just a thematic complaint. You’re entitled to dislike it thematically, but you at least have to recognize that it is no stronger than any other safe stomp. If they aren’t going to remove those safe stomps, why should they nerf thieves options?

Two things. Stealth and blind.

Lol using either of those to stomp will get you 100-0’d by cleave before you’re even halfway through the animation.

Like it should, thus the long casting time. Nothing’s wrong with that.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

snip

If it undermines the downed skills, sure why not. Another thing they can do is improve the downed skills so they are actually useful. Or they can just remove the whole downed state since everyone tries to undermine it anyway.

Sadly that means this topic can be closed. You are saying that you find downed state is being ignored by a certain type of skill and it should not be.

Whether we agree or not doesn’t matter, since the design team working on this game just implemented exactly that as their new thing → Function Gyro.