Its time this got what it deserves. No atk skill that has evade should be this spamable. It costs 4 init dodges and cripples. It is stupid how spamable.
No i did not lose to it. Its just a stupid thing to have. Every thief that fails hard with his/her back stab whips this out and goes 3333333. Its dumb and can be easily spammed. If you spec for a high init build this thing is stupid.
Remove the dodge and just leave it for the cripple.
Its time this got what it deserves. No atk skill that has evade should be this spamable. It costs 4 init dodges and cripples. It is stupid how spamable.
Only if immob stacking gets removed, then I’m okay with an increased aftercast time. It’s amazing when people complain about shortbow 3, but don’t complain about people using 3 second duration (about 2 disabling shots for a teef = 8 initiative) blocks to prevent spikes while immobed.
Its time this got what it deserves. No atk skill that has evade should be this spamable. It costs 4 init dodges and cripples. It is stupid how spamable.
Only if immob stacking gets removed, then I’m okay with an increased aftercast time. It’s amazing when people complain about shortbow 3, but don’t complain about people using 3 second duration (about 2 disabling shots for a teef = 8 initiative) blocks to prevent spikes while immobed.
Immob didnt need to stack any how idk which person thought immob needed a buff. Who the hell is doing these balance patches.
Really?… First SB evade sucks if spammed, the initiative cost is too high to spam. It does crap damage and if used more than once it’s a waste. I’ve always used infiltrator’s arrow to choose which direction to escape.
Second, everyone thinks that thief’s niche is stealth. Well that’s wrong. Their niche is the ability to use a weapon skill twice (sometimes more) in a row due to having no cool down. Thief is the only class that can “spam” weapon abilities and this is due to having initiative rather than weapon skill cool down timers. Although if a skill is spammed they run out of initiative rather quickly and then have a cool down time waiting for more initiative. This is why it is ineffective to use an ability more than twice in a row depending on the initiative cost. i.e. HS spam
yu know what? i was in SPvP yesterday and missed all my venom shots on a thief doing this to me XD i laughed! At first i was like “kitten kitten kitten kitten”, but then i was like, "hey it’s as if i had wasted my venom on a warrior blocking. accept when a warrior is done blocking he still has 4 more skills available… that thief had no more initiative… where is the OP?
yu know what? i was in SPvP yesterday and missed all my venom shots on a thief doing this to me XD i laughed! At first i was like “kitten kitten kitten kitten”, but then i was like, "hey it’s as if i had wasted my venom on a warrior blocking. accept when a warrior is done blocking he still has 4 more skills available… that thief had no more initiative… where is the OP?
Where is the OP?
It was a thief duh… so it’s OP… mainly because we have stealth…
People won’t be happy until the thieves only weaponskill is “Auto-Stomp”, where they stomp themselves from full health to give the opposing team 5 points.
Seriously, after every nerf patch players magically discover the next thief ability that has been game-breakingly OP since launch that needs to be addressed in the next nerf patch.
Something is not OP if it is frustrating to fight against.
Something is not OP if you personally have a hard time countering it.
Something is not OP if it works well against your specific spec.
If you’re a thief and haven’t
pre-ordered HOT at this point,
save yourself the money and don’t bother.
Its time this got what it deserves. No atk skill that has evade should be this spamable. It costs 4 init dodges and cripples. It is stupid how spamable.
No i did not lose to it. Its just a stupid thing to have. Every thief that fails hard with his/her back stab whips this out and goes 3333333. Its dumb and can be easily spammed. If you spec for a high init build this thing is stupid.
Remove the dodge and just leave it for the cripple.
hey =)
it’s really amazing. the second topic complaining about SB#3 during one day.
it’s really annoying to repeat myself to an issue that is .....simply .....not understandable.
its not hard to regen init if you spec for it. These days you can spec for init gain like nothing. Its a piece of cake to keep chaining evade on sb. Idk what thieves you guys are playing but a evade skill on a thiefs weapon slot is op.
its not hard to regen init if you spec for it. These days you can spec for init gain like nothing. Its a piece of cake to keep chaining evade on sb. Idk what thieves you guys are playing but a evade skill on a thiefs weapon slot is op.
It seems as if you know what you are talking about. Can you please explain how a thief kills people by spamming short bow evade?
Watch out, next body shot is going to be nerfed because it has too many effects. After that backstab is going to turn into heal stab and you heal the enemy for striking their back. Maybe we should just get a pointy stick and stay in SoAB because people can’t seem to live with thief anymore unless it turns into easy mode for a 3yr old.
“I’m waiting for the staff to get off their lunch
break. I feel like they should be back by now..”
Watch out, next body shot is going to be nerfed because it has too many effects. After that backstab is going to turn into heal stab and you heal the enemy for striking their back. Maybe we should just get a pointy stick and stay in SoAB because people can’t seem to live with thief anymore unless it turns into easy mode for a 3yr old.
isnt it already easy mode for a 3 year old. I havent played my thief in months and was easily killing people with an outdated build. It dosent take much to kill as a thief just 5 and 1 and here and there a heal and a basilisk venom.
Its time this got what it deserves. No atk skill that has evade should be this spamable. It costs 4 init dodges and cripples. It is stupid how spamable.
No i did not lose to it. Its just a stupid thing to have. Every thief that fails hard with his/her back stab whips this out and goes 3333333. Its dumb and can be easily spammed. If you spec for a high init build this thing is stupid.
Remove the dodge and just leave it for the cripple.
This would be a dead skill if it only cripples. I mean, it’s not exactly a highly used skill as it is, but I can’t think of a single reason to spend the initiative if all it did was cripple.
i gotta say. bow does many things bot nothign really well.
900 range. pffft
cluster bomb. decent dmg …. but SLOOOOOOW
poison gass 4s of poison…. eh nice and usefull but nothing wow
trick shot. slow cast slow aftercast. slow flight. not heat seeking. low dmg/no effects
Infil arrow- used only as a get away ….even tho HS is much better.
disabling shot- cripple for a few secs + evade. the one shining thing about this weapon.
disabling shot is what really makes the short bow work. u will never see a thief use shortbow to kill somebody. it just doesnt happen. its usually brought out bc we are weak against bosses and zergs so we spread poison and bleeds.
doesnt deserve a nerf bc we can evade 4x in a row.
warriors get invuln , blocks and feel no pain etc….. i dont see the difference when we have to spam all our initiative for the same effect.
to keep you guys in check. imagine if warrior had to use 6 weapon attacks like 2 3 4 5 on weapon set 1 and skill 2 on weaponset 2 all for 3.5 seconds of evade/invuln.
would that be OP? no of course not. but people dont think like that. oh well. simple simple simple.
Criticizing a weapon skill as ‘spammable’ simply describes how the class mechanics are designed. Thieves are limited by initative, not cooldowns. Four initiative is not trivial.
If a thief does blow all his initiative by ‘spamming’ SB3 three or four times, he now has no initiative, and therefore has access to no weapon skills other than auto-attack. Initiative does not regenerate as quickly in the game as it does in your imagination. Also note that every thief initiative regen trait was nerfed on 12/10.
Snit Dirtnap (Thief)
Ratbag Dogsticker (Guardian)
…Yak’s Bend
Criticizing a weapon skill as ‘spammable’ simply describes how the class mechanics are designed. Thieves are limited by initative, not cooldowns. Four initiative is not trivial.
If a thief does blow all his initiative by ‘spamming’ SB3 three or four times, he now has no initiative, and therefore has access to no weapon skills other than auto-attack. Initiative does not regenerate as quickly in the game as it does in your imagination. Also note that every thief initiative regen trait was nerfed on 12/10.
i gotta say. bow does many things bot nothign really well.
900 range. pffft
cluster bomb. decent dmg …. but SLOOOOOOW
poison gass 4s of poison…. eh nice and usefull but nothing wow
trick shot. slow cast slow aftercast. slow flight. not heat seeking. low dmg/no effects
Infil arrow- used only as a get away ….even tho HS is much better.
disabling shot- cripple for a few secs + evade. the one shining thing about this weapon.
disabling shot is what really makes the short bow work. u will never see a thief use shortbow to kill somebody. it just doesnt happen. its usually brought out bc we are weak against bosses and zergs so we spread poison and bleeds.
doesnt deserve a nerf bc we can evade 4x in a row.
warriors get invuln , blocks and feel no pain etc….. i dont see the difference when we have to spam all our initiative for the same effect.
to keep you guys in check. imagine if warrior had to use 6 weapon attacks like 2 3 4 5 on weapon set 1 and skill 2 on weaponset 2 all for 3.5 seconds of evade/invuln.
would that be OP? no of course not. but people dont think like that. oh well. simple simple simple.
You can perma evade if you spec for it just like you can outheal and out live on warrior IF YOU SPEC FOR IT. A zerker war or a hybird wont live long even if they do pop endure pain and stuff. Where as a thief can blind on stealth by simply putting 10 points into shadowarts and still do massive back stabs AND be able to chain evade with SB/dodges.
Everytime something sensible on the forums is posted its shot down by forum warriors. Do you people even play the game? When cry babies make post after post on one thing and it gets nerfed and no one says anything to them. Well i guess there is no point in using the game forums as they dont seem to be working as intended.
Watch out, next body shot is going to be nerfed because it has too many effects. .
I made a build that just “spammed” body shot (occasional the switch to auto with devourer’s venom or other skills for surviving while regenerating init). It sucked big time in duels, but god the laughs I had for immobilizing someone while my
team butchered him I think that if the current meta would shift to P/D and P/P, that skill will actually get nerfed while the rest of the weapon setup is still useless.
i gotta say. bow does many things bot nothign really well.
900 range. pffft
cluster bomb. decent dmg …. but SLOOOOOOW
poison gass 4s of poison…. eh nice and usefull but nothing wow
trick shot. slow cast slow aftercast. slow flight. not heat seeking. low dmg/no effects
Infil arrow- used only as a get away ….even tho HS is much better.
disabling shot- cripple for a few secs + evade. the one shining thing about this weapon.
disabling shot is what really makes the short bow work. u will never see a thief use shortbow to kill somebody. it just doesnt happen. its usually brought out bc we are weak against bosses and zergs so we spread poison and bleeds.
doesnt deserve a nerf bc we can evade 4x in a row.
warriors get invuln , blocks and feel no pain etc….. i dont see the difference when we have to spam all our initiative for the same effect.
to keep you guys in check. imagine if warrior had to use 6 weapon attacks like 2 3 4 5 on weapon set 1 and skill 2 on weaponset 2 all for 3.5 seconds of evade/invuln.
would that be OP? no of course not. but people dont think like that. oh well. simple simple simple.
You can perma evade if you spec for it just like you can outheal and out live on warrior IF YOU SPEC FOR IT.
…
Ladies and gentlemen, there we have it, the perma evade spec!
k… gonna lay out some ground rules here guys…
If you have a SB and:
Evade once, you’re fine, you’re just using SB…
Evade twice, people will start to be suspicious of you…
God forbid you evade three times, you’re perma evading….
Anything more then three times you’re surely using the perma evade spec…
i gotta say. bow does many things bot nothign really well.
900 range. pffft
cluster bomb. decent dmg …. but SLOOOOOOW
poison gass 4s of poison…. eh nice and usefull but nothing wow
trick shot. slow cast slow aftercast. slow flight. not heat seeking. low dmg/no effects
Infil arrow- used only as a get away ….even tho HS is much better.
disabling shot- cripple for a few secs + evade. the one shining thing about this weapon.
disabling shot is what really makes the short bow work. u will never see a thief use shortbow to kill somebody. it just doesnt happen. its usually brought out bc we are weak against bosses and zergs so we spread poison and bleeds.
doesnt deserve a nerf bc we can evade 4x in a row.
warriors get invuln , blocks and feel no pain etc….. i dont see the difference when we have to spam all our initiative for the same effect.
to keep you guys in check. imagine if warrior had to use 6 weapon attacks like 2 3 4 5 on weapon set 1 and skill 2 on weaponset 2 all for 3.5 seconds of evade/invuln.
would that be OP? no of course not. but people dont think like that. oh well. simple simple simple.
You can perma evade if you spec for it just like you can outheal and out live on warrior IF YOU SPEC FOR IT. A zerker war or a hybird wont live long even if they do pop endure pain and stuff. Where as a thief can blind on stealth by simply putting 10 points into shadowarts and still do massive back stabs AND be able to chain evade with SB/dodges.
Everytime something sensible on the forums is posted its shot down by forum warriors. Do you people even play the game? When cry babies make post after post on one thing and it gets nerfed and no one says anything to them. Well i guess there is no point in using the game forums as they dont seem to be working as intended.
im not a warrior. im a thief. i hate warrior. not bc of whatthey do. just because its not my style.
my point is valid. until you said another class giving up 5 attack skills to be put on coolodown to evade for 3.5 secs is OVERPOWERED. let me know ill have the conversation then.
k… gonna lay out some ground rules here guys…
If you have a SB and:
Evade once, you’re fine, you’re just using SB…
Evade twice, people will start to be suspicious of you…
God forbid you evade three times, you’re perma evading….
Anything more then three times you’re surely using the perma evade spec…
u guys also forget (the guys against 3 3 3 ) that thieves cant go in aoe. they are insta dead reagardless of build. using disablign shot 2x is just barely enough to get out of aoe. 3 times to create space. 3 -4 times and ur out of init for sure. then ur a sitting duck. its not like the skill does dmg thats so noticeable. the skill should and will stay as is. if u dont understand why then u dont understand thief or the game.
k… gonna lay out some ground rules here guys…
If you have a SB and:
Evade once, you’re fine, you’re just using SB…
Evade twice, people will start to be suspicious of you…
God forbid you evade three times, you’re perma evading….
Anything more then three times you’re surely using the perma evade spec…
this is obviously sarcasmright?
Yes… yes it is…
sad part is though… i have a feeling that that’s how it’s actually going to be…
k… gonna lay out some ground rules here guys…
If you have a SB and:
Evade once, you’re fine, you’re just using SB…
Evade twice, people will start to be suspicious of you…
God forbid you evade three times, you’re perma evading….
Anything more then three times you’re surely using the perma evade spec…
this is obviously sarcasmright?
Yes… yes it is…
sad part is though… i have a feeling that that’s how it’s actually going to be…
dun worry, shortbow is next on the chopping block.
Of all the things would could try and make an argument against, you picked this?!? Seriously, I wonder if people will stop their QQ’ing if we are just left with “auto attack” ability…
k… gonna lay out some ground rules here guys…
If you have a SB and:
Evade once, you’re fine, you’re just using SB…
Evade twice, people will start to be suspicious of you…
God forbid you evade three times, you’re perma evading….
Anything more then three times you’re surely using the perma evade spec…
this is obviously sarcasmright?
Yes… yes it is…
sad part is though… i have a feeling that that’s how it’s actually going to be…
puts “sarcasm” at end. seroiusly i had a hard tie telling. anet will think ur serious.
for the rest of you guys. dont use sarcasm in here. unless its so apparent…well just dont use it lol. anet wont get it and think people actually want more nerfs.
not much dif than death blossom but moves u back . but death blossom can at least do damage
death blossom needs atleast 1/2 s evade.
death blossom is about 1.25 seconds from time you click to the time you can do another. and it only evades for .25 seconds. so as far as an evade…its prolly the worst thief has. i NEVER usethis as an evade. i actually pretend its not there. it cant be used strategically as an evade. its more like a bonus that u might sjust miss an incoming attack by pure chance.
k… gonna lay out some ground rules here guys…
If you have a SB and:
Evade once, you’re fine, you’re just using SB…
Evade twice, people will start to be suspicious of you…
God forbid you evade three times, you’re perma evading….
Anything more then three times you’re surely using the perma evade spec…
this is obviously sarcasmright?
Yes… yes it is…
sad part is though… i have a feeling that that’s how it’s actually going to be…
puts “sarcasm” at end. seroiusly i had a hard tie telling. anet will think ur serious.
for the rest of you guys. dont use sarcasm in here. unless its so apparent…well just dont use it lol. anet wont get it and think people actually want more nerfs.
See… that’s the problem. As opposed to them sitting down and thinking “Is anything broken”, “Is anything out of balance”, “If we listen to the community and nerf X how will that effect the class overall?”, “If we nerf X how will that effect the class with respect to other classes” and so on…
It shouldn’t start with… “Look there are threads about class X needing a nerf on skill Y, clearly we have to do it, let’s come up with something”.
It’s ok for engi to run at max speed in circle spamming AoE and dodge because it can cap a node. It needs to stay in the area.
It’s ok for mesmer to evade spam and stealth because its phantasms continue doing damaging while it evades/hides.
It’s ok for warrior to spam evade because they still deal good damage while dodging, crit for 2-3k per dodge. Maybe another completely justified buff to 5k next patch?
It’s ok for elementalist and guard to keep perm vigor through crits because they need to offset their 2sec knock backs, stuns and invulnerability abilities.
It’s ok for elementalist to gain 100% energy regeneration through channeled skills because they don’t have hard to catch.
Thief can’t cap node, no need to evade spam.
Thief can’t attack while in stealth. No need to evade spam.
Thief can’t damage on dodge. Thief master trait caltrops on dodge doesn’t compare to minor 3k on dodge.Thief mug also master trait 20-30s cd and can’t crit. Evade spam with this is not fair.
Thief doesn’t have weaponised knock backs or invulnerability, so it shouldn’t have evade spam. Perm vigor for thief class was unbalanced and rightfully nerfed. Only non-thief should have perm vigor. But now they deliberately avoid your damage with SB instead? Trying to survive with no invuln or vigor and not using their stealth? They just asking to be nerfed. (If it stealthed, that should be nerfed instead, obviously)
Thief has hard to catch. It is the best trait in the game. Since this got moved down a tier, everything thief-related should be nerfed to compensate.
Seriously though… I literally “lol” every time someone posts threads like these because people get this impression that these skills or “techniques” are so godlike when really if you play thief, or play your own class well, you realize that your perception is severely off.
SB 3 doesn’t even help you get out of range of someone chasing you. If you spam it 3+ times you will still be EASILY catchable, and also have 0 initiative to do much else other than autoattack.
If you’re so sad about people getting away from you and not letting you get a bag… let me just get on my warrior and RUSH + BULLS RUSH + WHIRL + SAVAGE LEAP + WARHORN [REPEAT] while I wave at you and yell “trolololololo” because I can and because I can cover FAR more distance doing that than I ever could hope to by “spamming” SB 3.
Instead of blowing your cooldowns on someone spamming 3, how bout you just wait till they use it 3 or 4 times and are out of initiative?
“To grenth with thieves, them and their evasion techniques make me leap off cliffs all the time. I wish they couldn’t do damage while evading, then I would be totally fine. "
(person walks into room and whispers into 3yr olds ear)
“Wait they die in seconds when locked down?! Wish I knew that earlier”
(Davy jones walks into room)
“NOW ye got 2 wishes left!”
(scene)
“I’m waiting for the staff to get off their lunch
break. I feel like they should be back by now..”
Its time this got what it deserves. No atk skill that has evade should be this spamable. It costs 4 init dodges and cripples. It is stupid how spamable.
No i did not lose to it. Its just a stupid thing to have. Every thief that fails hard with his/her back stab whips this out and goes 3333333. Its dumb and can be easily spammed. If you spec for a high init build this thing is stupid.
Remove the dodge and just leave it for the cripple.
hey =)
it’s really amazing. the second topic complaining about SB#3 during one day.
it’s really annoying to repeat myself to an issue that is …..simply …..not understandable.
Prob same guy who created the other nerf sb thread now he on his alt accoutnt.
nope he is not me
And I still stand by revamping the skill to something like move back way faster, short daze and steal a boon on interrupt. maybe gain swiftness.
The evade is just silly and no fun.
Its time this got what it deserves. No atk skill that has evade should be this spamable. It costs 4 init dodges and cripples. It is stupid how spamable.
No i did not lose to it. Its just a stupid thing to have. Every thief that fails hard with his/her back stab whips this out and goes 3333333. Its dumb and can be easily spammed. If you spec for a high init build this thing is stupid.
Remove the dodge and just leave it for the cripple.
hey =)
it’s really amazing. the second topic complaining about SB#3 during one day.
it’s really annoying to repeat myself to an issue that is …..simply …..not understandable.
Prob same guy who created the other nerf sb thread now he on his alt accoutnt.
nope he is not me
And I still stand by revamping the skill to something like move back way faster, short daze and steal a boon on interrupt. maybe gain swiftness.
The evade is just silly and no fun.
PVE players will despise you. same with PVE. that AOE is killer. we have almost 0 chance to survive serious AOE. its our 1 trump card.
how do other classes survive aoe?
high regen
high HP
high toughness
high armor
blocks
invul
aegis
protection
whirl/leaps
HP life force(necro) and other class specific skills from others.
does thief have any of these to get out of large AOE? no. without Disabling shot how can a thief get out? Shadow step. shadow step is the answer for many questions… yet it can be the answer for only 1 question bci t has a min cooldown. disabling shot is our chance to survive. low dmg. low effect on it. fair init. fair cost.
Watch out, next body shot is going to be nerfed because it has too many effects. After that backstab is going to turn into heal stab and you heal the enemy for striking their back. Maybe we should just get a pointy stick and stay in SoAB because people can’t seem to live with thief anymore unless it turns into easy mode for a 3yr old.
isnt it already easy mode for a 3 year old. I havent played my thief in months and was easily killing people with an outdated build. It dosent take much to kill as a thief just 5 and 1 and here and there a heal and a basilisk venom.
Truly thou hath mastered the way of the Shadow, teach us your ways O Grandmaster so that we too may striketh fear unto the heart of thy foe!
Watch out, next body shot is going to be nerfed because it has too many effects. After that backstab is going to turn into heal stab and you heal the enemy for striking their back. Maybe we should just get a pointy stick and stay in SoAB because people can’t seem to live with thief anymore unless it turns into easy mode for a 3yr old.
isnt it already easy mode for a 3 year old. I havent played my thief in months and was easily killing people with an outdated build. It dosent take much to kill as a thief just 5 and 1 and here and there a heal and a basilisk venom.
Truly thou hath mastered the way of the Shadow, teach us your ways O Grandmaster so that we too may striketh fear unto the heart of thy foe!
I feel like he’s referring to those “outnumbered” videos where a thief 1vX and wins.
If he is, you should know that the people he fought were complete bafoons and had no idea what they were doing. It was like watching a predator stalk a newborn prey. Not to mention the occasional uplevel or even the kind that sat dead still and waited for him to reappear….
“I’m waiting for the staff to get off their lunch
break. I feel like they should be back by now..”
Do you people even play the game? When cry babies make post after post on one thing and it gets nerfed
You’re talking about yourself, right? Clearly, you have no idea about the game, and even less about playing a Thief.
And no, I don’t main Thief. And yes, I’ve got my kitten handed to me by Thieves before. I also manage to kill them from time to time. And believe me when I say that I’ve never seen one using Shortbow 3. That skill is mainly useful to kite NPC’s which you don’t want to melee. No sane person would use it in a 1vs1 or 1vsX; especially not multiple times in a row.
k… gonna lay out some ground rules here guys…
If you have a SB and:
Evade once, you’re fine, you’re just using SB…
Evade twice, people will start to be suspicious of you…
God forbid you evade three times, you’re perma evading….
Anything more then three times you’re surely using the perma evade spec…
not much dif than death blossom but moves u back . but death blossom can at least do damage
death blossom needs atleast 1/2 s evade.
death blossom is about 1.25 seconds from time you click to the time you can do another. and it only evades for .25 seconds. so as far as an evade…its prolly the worst thief has. i NEVER usethis as an evade. i actually pretend its not there. it cant be used strategically as an evade. its more like a bonus that u might sjust miss an incoming attack by pure chance.
Do you people even play the game? When cry babies make post after post on one thing and it gets nerfed
You’re talking about yourself, right? Clearly, you have no idea about the game, and even less about playing a Thief.
And no, I don’t main Thief. And yes, I’ve got my kitten handed to me by Thieves before. I also manage to kill them from time to time. And believe me when I say that I’ve never seen one using Shortbow 3. That skill is mainly useful to kite NPC’s which you don’t want to melee. No sane person would use it in a 1vs1 or 1vsX; especially not multiple times in a row.
k… gonna lay out some ground rules here guys…
If you have a SB and:
Evade once, you’re fine, you’re just using SB…
Evade twice, people will start to be suspicious of you…
God forbid you evade three times, you’re perma evading….
Anything more then three times you’re surely using the perma evade spec…
Lmao xD.
im not saying thieves are hard to kill or anything. But when all else fails they start the evade spam.
And no im not talking about me. I probably have less forum time since release then you do in a week. I actuly like to play the game instead of coming on forums and reading this stuff. I only post when abusive cheese is being run and no one speaks a word of it.
I think that if the current meta would shift to P/D and P/P, that skill will actually get nerfed while the rest of the weapon setup is still useless.