Guild Wars 2

I couldn’t find any exact topic for this, so I just created one here…

ANet keep nerfing thieves, patch after patch. We thieves have adopted to these new nerfs, patch after patch. They some times tell us about something great that is going to happen (mobility, team support, to say a few), but somehow they always let us down.

What’s up with this?! You’re changing the very foundation of the thief class because of forum feedback? Well guess what most people say in the thief forum about nerfing us, it all boils down to the same thing: The Thief can be invisible, HE IS OP!! @ RageFlippingkitten…

People are intimidated by the very nature of this class – they can’t see us 50% of the match. But guess what, we are squishy as hell and we’re a melee class! This means that we have to stay in a warriors face the entire fight to deal any damage – and guess what? He can damage us too. We’re still there, you just can’t see us, and therefore we are over powered.

Every single time a new patch arrives we’re getting hit hard one way or another, but this is by far the worst. You have destroyed the very foundation you built the class on – Stealth. Almost every single build rely on stealth to shine, wether it’ll be backstabbing, dazing, stacking bleeds or stunning you, and now many of these builds rotations are broken. We have to re-learn the entire class and find new rotations. Nothing is logical any more. Most of our #1 skill chains take exactly 3 seconds to do, which fitted perfectly with the stealth de-buff, but now? Broken.

Please remember what you said in the SotG interview; (not exact words, but this is what it was like) you feel like the elementalist have more mobility than the thief and that it’s a more slippery profession, and you want to push that more on to the thief, since thats what they’re suppose to be doing. You said that we are supposed to be the most sneaky and slippery class with our STEALTH and utilities. Why the hell did you completely destroy our stealth then?! You even said that you wanted all the weapon sets to be more mobile so that we wouldn’t need the short bow to be mobile any longer. You also said that you want to give the thief more team support abilities. But hey! We hate thieves, the forum hate thieves, so let us just kitten this and destroy them even more.

I’ve been used to adapt to new changes (nerfs), but not this. This is not adapting. This is changing the entire build, because many thieves have now gotten their builds broken. And as if it wasn’t enough to nerf our stealth, you had to nerf our only under-water elite skill. You “fixed” a steal ability? Seriously? We have so many other things that needs polishing, and you “fix” our most useless abilities and traits…

Please fix this. I’d rather have the de-buff after leaving stealth without attacking than actually have to re-work my entire build. I know I’m not alone in this, because a quick peek in this forum will tell you that what I’m saying is true. Most of us feel let down. We trusted you to actually fix something, but yet again we got a kick right in the nuts.

tl:dr We were sick of adapting to new changes. And now you completely destroy the very foundation of this profession: stealth. So now we need to change our builds and make drastic changes to get viable builds. It’s not adapting any more – it’s learning the profession all over again.

Lol. Bro. Take a deep breath. Yes, like that. Now breathe out. Very good.

Let’s look at the update:

Thief
Corrosive Traps trait:
Applies the correct vulnerability duration with Shadow Trap.
Now applies vulnerability with Ambush Trap.
Healing Seed skill:
Increased radius slightly.
Now displays the combo field ring.
Caltrops:
Reduced duration from 15 seconds to 10 seconds.
Now indicates its radius.
Steal skill: No longer initiates autoattacks.
Uncatchable trait:
Now displays an active combat area to both allies and enemies.
Increased effective radius by 50%.
Basilisk Venom skill: No longer immobilizes targets in addition to stunning them.
Haste skill: Increased duration from 4 seconds to 5 seconds.

Stealth: The duration of Revealed has been increased to 4 seconds when coming out of stealth via an attack.

You’re throwing a fit over nothing. Unless you’re a 12K DPS 0/30/30/X Berker GC Backstab Thief, but that was pretty OP, and that’s coming from another thief.

Outside of that, the changes to us were almost nonexistent. The Haste change, for example- everybody gets the debuffed Quickness now. It’s not like we’re alone. And Caltrops: for a utility that applies insane amounts of bleed and cripple, and has an insanely low CD, it is still fantastic. And the radius- given that it was virtually impossible to see cals before, and all traps have a displayed radius, this change was totally justified.

Also; if you’re sick of adapting, you shouldn’t have chosen a thief. Every build that I have ever created has had to be extremely flexible, able to adapt to as many situations as possible. For example, here was a build that, for a long time, was a favorite of mine:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYAQNAsaVlUmaOHfS4E9JFymiKUo4UUUGl/hvq/wVB

The thinking behind the original version of this build (0/30/20/0/20) was to have a very flexible build that could use signets, deception, and trickery utilities. It was fairly logical, actually; before every battle, you would select the exact utilities that you would need for the upcoming battle. The eventual fallback would be that, due to a lack of consistency with the build, you would suffer from a lot of problems, including lack of good damage output and survivability. That’s why I built the 0/20/20/15/15 version. I don’t use either of these any more, but the principle still stands.

You’re the class with some of the best (but most specialized) utilities, and have no cool downs on weapon skills. So, my point?

Seriously, if you can’t be flexible- if you can’t adapt- then thief was absolutely the wrong profession for you. Reroll.

I’m used to adapt. I too usually swap traits, skills and stuff in between instances, fights or dungeons, and that wasn’t even the point here. I’ve adapted to tons of changes and nerfs that they’ve hit us with and just thought “we just have to adapt to these changes and everything will work out just fine”. But this stealth nerf is the worst so far imo. They could first have tried to see if anything would change after fixing the culling, not making builds completely broken…

My build is still shining as I don’t use stealth that much, but for the P/D thieves this was a hard hit. Caltrops and traps was justified yes, but not the stealth stuff.

They just changed one of the basics that the entire profession was built upon. Totally uncalled for and nothing anyone have asked for.

Geiir.7603:

I’m used to adapt. I too usually swap traits, skills and stuff in between instances, fights or dungeons, and that wasn’t even the point here. I’ve adapted to tons of changes and nerfs that they’ve hit us with and just thought “we just have to adapt to these changes and everything will work out just fine”. But this stealth nerf is the worst so far imo. They could first have tried to see if anything would change after fixing the culling, not making builds completely broken…

My build is still shining as I don’t use stealth that much, but for the P/D thieves this was a hard hit. Caltrops and traps was justified yes, but not the stealth stuff.

They just changed one of the basics that the entire profession was built upon. Totally uncalled for and nothing anyone have asked for.

The only complaint you seem to have is about the Revealed debuff.

Which is now one second longer than before.

And still only applies after you’ve attacked from stealth.

… I’m not sure what your complaint is. I’m guessing it’s that you can’t use Sneak Attack so often any more. Well, looks like you can’t apply 5 stacks of bleeding quite so fast any more. It’s not that big a deal.

I tested the P/D build for a few hours now in sPvP, and the damage nerf is pretty big. It’s hard to be called a viable build any more really..

Arganthium.5638:

Geiir.7603:

I’m used to adapt. I too usually swap traits, skills and stuff in between instances, fights or dungeons, and that wasn’t even the point here. I’ve adapted to tons of changes and nerfs that they’ve hit us with and just thought “we just have to adapt to these changes and everything will work out just fine”. But this stealth nerf is the worst so far imo. They could first have tried to see if anything would change after fixing the culling, not making builds completely broken…

My build is still shining as I don’t use stealth that much, but for the P/D thieves this was a hard hit. Caltrops and traps was justified yes, but not the stealth stuff.

They just changed one of the basics that the entire profession was built upon. Totally uncalled for and nothing anyone have asked for.

The only complaint you seem to have is about the Revealed debuff.

Which is now one second longer than before.

And still only applies after you’ve attacked from stealth.

… I’m not sure what your complaint is. I’m guessing it’s that you can’t use Sneak Attack so often any more. Well, looks like you can’t apply 5 stacks of bleeding quite so fast any more. It’s not that big a deal.

D/D condition thieves are way more viable now than the P/D condition thief because of this stealth. P/D is not my main (I run a build quite similar to yours actually).

The debuff is what really struck me. I would much more have wanted the de-buff after stealth even if I didn’t attack than getting 4 seconds of if instead…

Geiir.7603:

I tested the P/D build for a few hours now in sPvP, and the damage nerf is pretty big. It’s hard to be called a viable build any more really..

I dont see the big damage nerf here … Instead of 3 vital shots, now you have to shoot 4 between CnD. With 100% bleed time it keeps your bleeds stacked up. P/D got affected the least from stealth builds. D/D basilisk mug cnd bs hshshs didnt got affected at all…

“You’re throwing a fit over nothing. Unless you’re a 12K DPS 0/30/30/X Berker GC Backstab Thief, but that was pretty OP, and that’s coming from another thief.”

We’ve got two melee off handers for the thief and one of them has taken a proper downgrade here. Whether you are using stealth for triggering heals, blinds, might, condition cures, applying dazes, safe maneuvering, or just getting damage then this is bad. It delays a lot of utility that is needed for an offhand dagger build. Almost everything a thief does is set backwards for a shadow arts build and if you can’t see that then you’re not understanding that trait line. I ran Arah 4 with it today and it is still playable but it is strictly worse now in every sense.

Stooperdale.3560:

“You’re throwing a fit over nothing. Unless you’re a 12K DPS 0/30/30/X Berker GC Backstab Thief, but that was pretty OP, and that’s coming from another thief.”

We’ve got two melee off handers for the thief and one of them has taken a proper downgrade here. Whether you are using stealth for triggering heals, blinds, might, condition cures, applying dazes, safe maneuvering, or just getting damage then this is bad. It delays a lot of utility that is needed for an offhand dagger build. Almost everything a thief does is set backwards for a shadow arts build and if you can’t see that then you’re not understanding that trait line. I ran Arah 4 with it today and it is still playable but it is strictly worse now in every sense.

A step back for an overpowered mechanic is a step in the right direction. CnD/Backstab was overpowered and the developers balanced it. Balance happens, you guys really need to get over it.

I’m in PvE using CnD and utility. It wasn’t overpowered ….

darkace.8925:

A step back for an overpowered mechanic is a step in the right direction. CnD/Backstab was overpowered and the developers balanced it. Balance happens, you guys really need to get over it.

What about all the other stuff that got nerfed along with CnD/Backstab? The stuff that wasn’t “overpowered”

Yeah balance happens, but this isn’t balance, this is just blanket nerfing and hoping for the best.

I learned to play my thief without relying on stealth. the only stealth ability i use is refuge and its only for emergencies.

People cried about thieves being able to chain stealth to heal up to full hp again. That is still(!!) possible to do, and instead they just broke the very mechanic our profession is built upon. Destroying builds that relied on stealth to have some survivability. Now the entire shadow arts tree is a laugh. I’ve scrapped it completely going for a more burst build…

Try adding +25% cooldown on 100blades and attunement switching and see how well those classes would react. Or lower the limit of clones a mesmer can spam. Try telling them that it’s needed.

They just nerf us, never a single fix is given (except useless ones like Healing Seed). They nerfed pistol whip because of haste making it OP. Now they nerfed haste without giving us the pw damage back.

Thief just went from being a sneaky kitten to become a warrior with half the hp, toughness and damage. w2g anet.