Guild Wars 2

QQ train. I am an engi with full exotic (3 ascended) knights gear (all pieces are knights only weapon is zerker). Was standing on the point in WvW capping flag. And then something happened. Fast. I stared at the monitor (???), then checked combat log.

Steal (2500) -> C&D (6000) -> Backstab (14000) -> C&D (3000)

Dear thieves. I really really really dont want to hate you. Please show me how. Explain me the math behind this. I am sad

Steal can no longer crit, previously that mug would have been 6-7k not 2.5 thats a pretty big nerf. Cnd was nerfed by 33%. so that would have been larger as well. So yes that combo has taken a massive nerf. as far as a 14k backstab on a full knights character that doesnt quite smell right. Neither does your list of attacks, the thief would be revealed for 3 seconds after backstab, so there had to be a 3 second gap between bs and the second cnd, why didnt you heal if he did nothing between them

I was crit for 34000 by a thief and I am in double Knight’s gear and have 3 weapons which are all P/V/T. Please explain this.

Dear my Engi friend,

If you’re asking about the mechanics of how this was possible, what he did, most likely, given the massive damage output you are talking about, was activate assasin’s signet first (next 5 attacks do 15% more damage) cast CnD and while the animation was happening he used steal with the mug trait equipped, ergo the 2500 damage followed almost instantly by the CnD the 6k damage (although that is pretty high all things considered… even with assasin’s signet)

He may or may not have had basilik venom activate before he cast CnD (that depends on if were able to move or not). Then he probably took one step to your side and backstabbed you, (never in my life have I backstabbed for 14k, 10k and change was my max) and finished you off with another CnD (which doesn’t make sense because his stealth is on cool down, and CnD is expensive, generally you would heart seeker at this pt).

If you’re asking about how this is fair and where is the nerf hammer, understand that this guy blew his entire wad in that one sequence. As for the nerf hammer, back in the day mug could crit, would hit for around 5k alone, there wouldn’t be much need for him to activate assasin’s signet in that case =D

Its hard to believe you are using knight gear. 14k bses are only possible on light armored glass cannons. Or that thief had like 20 stacks of might.

Nilgoow.1037:

I was crit for 34000 by a thief and I am in double Knight’s gear and have 3 weapons which are all P/V/T. Please explain this.

2nd lvl players shouldn’t enter www.

On a related note Mr. Engi care to share your build with me and explain how you are all decked out in knight’s gear yet your health pool must be 25,500 if you add the 2500 mug the 6K CnD the 14k BS and the 3k CnD? Last I checked Knight’s gave you power/prec/tough, even if you maxed out alchemy, 25,500 health for an engineer without any gear that gives vitality seems… odd…

This is why:

1. You are underleveled.
2. Your equipment is bad (green/blue/etc.)
3. He maxed just about every skill and sacrificed all utility to get uberdamage.

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fYAQNAoYVlUmKOHdy9E/5Ex2jd6Ti6fAs6MoZLB-jUyAYLBRCCERAkKAk+KiGbxtIas6aMlLRUt9eR1SBExYA-w
I theorycrafted this build in 5 mins. Factor in might stacks(at least 5), bloodlust stacks and additional 15% more dmg for the next 5 attacks and you have a recipe for disaster to someone that didn’t see the thief coming. Great build… if your goal is to kill 1 unaware/slow to react enemy every 40s.

Awe.1096:

Dear thieves. I really really really dont want to hate you. Please show me how. Explain me the math behind this. I am sad

Well that’s my speciality.

I’ll need your stats first though.

Awe.1096:

QQ train. I am an engi with full exotic (3 ascended) knights gear (all pieces are knights only weapon is zerker). Was standing on the point in WvW capping flag. And then something happened. Fast. I stared at the monitor (???), then checked combat log.

Steal (2500) -> C&D (6000) -> Backstab (14000) -> C&D (3000)

Dear thieves. I really really really dont want to hate you. Please show me how. Explain me the math behind this. I am sad

engineer can do dmg pretty close to th is too…with 25 might 25 bloodlust full zerk food and 10% sigils. yeah. no big deal really…ive done 23k backstabs on fully armored players. perfect conditions of course but still.

Awe.1096:

QQ train. I am an engi with full exotic (3 ascended) knights gear (all pieces are knights only weapon is zerker). Was standing on the point in WvW capping flag. And then something happened. Fast. I stared at the monitor (???), then checked combat log.

Steal (2500) -> C&D (6000) -> Backstab (14000) -> C&D (3000)

Dear thieves. I really really really dont want to hate you. Please show me how. Explain me the math behind this. I am sad

Alright first off i don’t run a backstab build never have never want to. But OP you are really setting yourself up for some tough hits here, a lack of screenshots with some fictional numbers means this can be extremely mis construde… For instance.

I was fighting a warrior in WvW and he suddenly smacked me for 20,000, 50,000 and then 1.8mill. Fictional numbers are easy to make up to prove a point. Now i’m not trying to trash you OP just saying, to avoid incoming flak use SS’s next time.

Nilgoow.1037:

I was crit for 34000 by a thief and I am in double Knight’s gear and have 3 weapons which are all P/V/T. Please explain this.

i was crit for 37000 by a warrior and I am in double KnightMs gear and have 3 weapons which are all P/V/T. Please explain this.

See, without screenshot to prove this, you can write anything. Just another one for fun!

i was crit for 28000 by a ranger and i am in full bunker with toughness/vit and have 3 weapons that are P/V/T. Please explain this.

darkchicken.8692:

Nilgoow.1037:

I was crit for 34000 by a thief and I am in double Knight’s gear and have 3 weapons which are all P/V/T. Please explain this.

i was crit for 37000 by a warrior and I am in double KnightMs gear and have 3 weapons which are all P/V/T. Please explain this.

See, without screenshot to prove this, you can write anything. Just another one for fun!

i was crit for 28000 by a ranger and i am in full bunker with toughness/vit and have 3 weapons that are P/V/T. Please explain this.

Sorry m8 for you and the rest of the thiefs fanboys but I got a screenshot of it.

http://i.imgur.com/4UHRuUr.png

Nilgoow.1037:

darkchicken.8692:

Nilgoow.1037:

I was crit for 34000 by a thief and I am in double Knight’s gear and have 3 weapons which are all P/V/T. Please explain this.

i was crit for 37000 by a warrior and I am in double KnightMs gear and have 3 weapons which are all P/V/T. Please explain this.

See, without screenshot to prove this, you can write anything. Just another one for fun!

i was crit for 28000 by a ranger and i am in full bunker with toughness/vit and have 3 weapons that are P/V/T. Please explain this.

Sorry m8 for you and the rest of the thiefs fanboys but I got a screenshot of it.

http://i.imgur.com/4UHRuUr.png

you really need a new computer, dem graphics be horrible.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fYAQJAoYlcmSOXcS4E/5Ex2je6Ti6fAs6MoZLB-jEyAYrASQApCAJvioxWcLiGruGT5SEVbvLiWtUARMGA-w

Since you were wearing nearly full knight you should have about 2600 armor.
25 bloodlust, blow all signets for 20 might. This might do close to the numbers you received.

What is a build like this good for in pvp?
- 1v1-damage on afk players… the end

It takes just a small thing as dodging CnD and steal and this build is countered and
the thief gets kitten on.

Did the thief pop any signets before hitting you? How many might stacks did he have?

Take a look at this build.

Add in 25 stacks of Might and Bloodlust it will look like this:

• 3963 Power
• 100% Critical chance from stealth
• 118% Critical Damage
• 65% extra damage

The extra damage are from the following sources:

• Superior Sigil of Impact / Night
• Superior Rune of the Scholar
• Assassin’s Signet
• Exposed Weakness (trait)
• Dagger Training (trait)
• First Strikes (trait)
• Flanking Strikes (trait)

With this build you’ll leave yourself vulnerable to all other engagements that those where you get the opening strike. No thief will ever use this build for any other reason than trolling, because it’s completely useless and you can’t do anything in group fights.

If the OP would give us his numbers of toughness and vitality, then I could calculate from this build how much damage those attacks would hit him for.

I was crit for 48k by a Quaggan, please explain this.

Awe.1096:

QQ train.

yes, welcome to the QQ train. enjoy the ride it’s awsome

Sounds like a 3 signet instagib build: put all your traits into increasing damage and run 3 signets that each give 5 might on use and you have a pretty decent burst.

Of course, you’re now running practically naked with no stun breakers or any other defense for that matter, but it’s fun so who cares? :P

Shameless plug: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onzIWX-AQV8

EDIT: Looking at the builds posted before, I’ve never thought of running signet of malice as well. That would boost the spike even further, though I’m not a fan of losing the only non-C&D stealth

Still, you could do a 4 signet spike instead of 3 signet one

yski.7642:

Sounds like a 3 signet instagib build: put all your traits into increasing damage and run 3 signets that each give 5 might on use and you have a pretty decent burst.

Of course, you’re now running practically naked with no stun breakers or any other defense for that matter, but it’s fun so who cares? :P

Shameless plug: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onzIWX-AQV8

EDIT: Looking at the builds posted before, I’ve never thought of running signet of malice as well. That would boost the spike even further, though I’m not a fan of losing the only non-C&D stealth

Still, you could do a 4 signet spike instead of 3 signet one

I see that 90% of the time you’re chasing people and doing the entire combo. What you could do is swap sigil of agility with shadow trap. This way you can get fury, swiftness, stealth and 10 stacks of might for 5 seconds if they trigger the trap. It will remove some of the burst from steal and CnD, but this way you can get 25 stacks of might on top of fury and swiftness

The thing is, the build is all about maximizing that burst. It’s not much good for a fair fight, and to use shadow trap for a burst means you must open with back stab. While it does make your back stab stronger, it’s not enough to compensate for the loss of mug+CnD, so we end up with a smaller burst.

If the boons were longer than the stealth it would be amazing, but since they aren’t I wouldn’t use it for this particular build.

yski.7642:

The thing is, the build is all about maximizing that burst. It’s not much good for a fair fight, and to use shadow trap for a burst means you must open with back stab. While it does make your back stab stronger, it’s not enough to compensate for the loss of mug+CnD, so we end up with a smaller burst.

If the boons were longer than the stealth it would be amazing, but since they aren’t I wouldn’t use it for this particular build.

Yeah, if you go with shadow trap then you’ll lose a good portion of the burst.

A few more ideas:

• Have an extra dagger in your inventory with sigil of bloodlust. Have it on when you enter WvW and kill a few mobs until you have 25 stacks, then you can change it for a dagger with another sigil. You still keep those stacks of bloodlust, which in turn gives more damage!
• Instead of Ruby orb on dagger I think you’ll get more damage from superior sigil of force. Not sure if superior sigil of impact works on targets that is under the effect of basilisk venom. If so, then that might be a good choice.
• In the nights you could run a dagger with sigil of night instead of ruby orb or sigil of force. Put it on an Ghastly dagger (AC tokens) so you can see when it’s night.

Just a few ideas that I would have used ^^

thief burst is dead. thief combos are still few around

Travlane.5948:

thief burst is dead. thief combos are still few around

It’s way weaker than it was at launch, but I wouldn’t say it’s gone. 20k + in two seconds is more than most other professions are capable of doing.

Travlane.5948:

thief burst is dead. thief combos are still few around

Look at the video I linked a couple of posts ago and say that again.

It may not be viable for high end tournaments, but it works just fine in WvW and a more sensible build (swap out some of the signets for some defensive utilities) should still be doable for casual tPvP as well. The damage isn’t too much lower in sPvP environment.

Burst isn’t dead, it just isn’t the optimal way to do things anymore.

Geiir.7603:

A few more ideas:
-snip-

All true, I’m just too lazy to stack blood lust 1 kill at the time (I LOVE the sPvP blood lust) and I cheaped out a little bit there as well – ruby orb is ~20s while sigil of force is ~2g and buying extra weapons is even more expensive. I’m somewhat of an altaholic so I’m constantly struggling to fund all my fancy build ideas anyway.

For instance, I’m just dying to try something similar to what I did here with a kill shot warrior (currently lvl 2, I’m drooling over those hits in sPvP) and I also have a few necromancer WvW builds I’d love to try, and when I last checked I had some 15g total for all that, and being mostly a PvPer (worse, a buildcrafter) my daily income isn’t exactly huge, even when I’m not wasting all my time on the forums lol

I hate getting ganked by overpowered thieves when I’m half watching tv and in WvW too. But don’t worry help is on the way. Next patch, thieves will not be able to damage targets that aren’t moving. Can’t wait.

Could be sigil of blood lust, 25 stacks of might and some food.

WWW is very poorly balanced, the refinement is more in sPvP. As a result there are a lot of cheesed out builds out there, that would never be allowed in sPvP.

Bloodlust for example can net you about 250 extra power by killing random animals in the area. Then another 600 some from stacking might. You can use bloodlust in sPvP, but it’s risky, because you have to face a human opponent instead of a bunny NPC. If you lose and chances are high, that’s a whole stack gone.

Then there’s food…

Bud.5617:

Could be sigil of blood lust, 25 stacks of might and some food.

WWW is very poorly balanced, the refinement is more in sPvP. As a result there are a lot of cheesed out builds out there, that would never be allowed in sPvP.

Bloodlust for example can net you about 250 extra power by killing random animals in the area. Then another 600 some from stacking might. You can use bloodlust in sPvP, but it’s risky, because you have to face a human opponent instead of a bunny NPC. If you lose and chances are high, that’s a whole stack gone.

Then there’s food…

Funny that, I find bloodlust easier to stack in PvP. I’m too lazy to go hunting some silly animals, and asking for 25 player skills for max stats is pushing it, even with my amazing skills :P

yski.7642:

Sounds like a 3 signet instagib build: put all your traits into increasing damage and run 3 signets that each give 5 might on use and you have a pretty decent burst.

Of course, you’re now running practically naked with no stun breakers or any other defense for that matter, but it’s fun so who cares? :P

Shameless plug: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onzIWX-AQV8

EDIT: Looking at the builds posted before, I’ve never thought of running signet of malice as well. That would boost the spike even further, though I’m not a fan of losing the only non-C&D stealth

Still, you could do a 4 signet spike instead of 3 signet one

Super editing skills! Loved the 5 and 1 in time to the music.

Azraelle.1683:

Its hard to believe you are using knight gear. 14k bses are only possible on light armored glass cannons. Or that thief had like 20 stacks of might.

Shadow Refuge alone gives close to that with a SA build.

when are people going to stop whining about getting instagibbed in wvw? the game mode just isn’t balanced