Guild Wars 2

After looking at the Chronomancer, Dragonhunter, and Reaper, it’s clear that the new F1 abilities are meant to be useful with current f1 traits. So we would want an ability that works with mug, slight of, hand bountiful thief, etc etc.

I began to wonder what type of ability would work well with these. What I came up with is.. “Swap.”

Swap would work something like this:

“Swap locations with the targeted foe.”

I think that this ability would work great with current traits as well as provide some interesting utility.

Ranger sniping your team from a ledge? Swap!
Want to pull an enemy to your team? Swap!

Swap would follow shadowstep rules, so there would need to be a valid path etc.
There would also be risk to using this, such as accidently plopping yourself into the enemy teams area.

I’ll probably add more ideas to this when I’m not at work, but I wanted to post this to see what others think.

No.
It’s not that is a bad idea. It isn’t. But our “get over here” skill is scorpion wire and they refuse to fix it. I don’t want a downgraded version (scorpion wire can’t send you in the middle of their team) get passed as a “new elite” thing.
Give us real new tricks. And fix the kitten ed wire.

Ignarel.7916:

No.
It’s not that is a bad idea. It isn’t. But our “get over here” skill is scorpion wire and they refuse to fix it. I don’t want a downgraded version (scorpion wire can’t send you in the middle of their team) get passed as a “new elite” thing.
Give us real new tricks. And fix the kitten ed wire.

You bring up some good points. What abilities do you think would work with our steal trait?

Honestly, a different set of items to steal would be enough. Something less random?

On the very slim chance that thief goes more magical, (dark, shadowy arts, obviously), you could get items that let you mess with that particular target again. Maybe steal “mementos” to serve as magical foci. Take a lock of hair, a coin from their pocket, or such. Gain an advantage against that foe while you have their memento in hand. Then use it later to steal their health, speed, recharge etc.

[F2]: Take cover

-Used in conjunction with Rifle or Pistols.
-Activating it hides you behind nearest tree, chest-high rock, or wall corner, etc…
-Protects from everything not in LOS of you.
-Activates first person shooter mode, with 500% damage from headshots.
-Summon’s Nathan Drake, the master thief, if you are taking cover for more than 30 seconds.

Maybe you can go all Shang Tsung on people and turn into your opponent for like 10 seconds or something… like a “disguise” skill.

If we are to get rifles and possibly be a sniper then I could see the our F1 steal being turned into a Mark Target skill, once a target it marked it can still be seen even while stealthed, target also receives 10 stacks of vunerability. Something like that.

Vavume.8065:

If we are to get rifles and possibly be a sniper then I could see the our F1 steal being turned into a Mark Target skill, once a target it marked it can still be seen even while stealthed, target also receives 10 stacks of vunerability. Something like that.

Yeah! And our Skills would be:
-Aimed Shot
-Serpent Sting
-Concussive Shot
-Arcane Shot
-I can’t think of a 5th one its been so long.

Turk.5460:

Vavume.8065:

If we are to get rifles and possibly be a sniper then I could see the our F1 steal being turned into a Mark Target skill, once a target it marked it can still be seen even while stealthed, target also receives 10 stacks of vunerability. Something like that.

Yeah! And our Skills would be:
-Aimed Shot
-Serpent Sting
-Concussive Shot
-Arcane Shot
-I can’t think of a 5th one its been so long.

lol I was thinking I had seen the Mark Target idea in ESO but yeah it was in WoW right? I cant remember either its ben so long :P but still I want it and 2000m range

I am expecting sniper profession I really don’t know what else thief could become since thief the top close ranger profession it would make sense it could become long range expert as well.

I would like the F1 swap to tracker device . shadow steps to the target and puts a tracker device on them this would put 10 seconds of reveal on them and a increase the precision of you by 25%.

I would like initiative to be scrapped but I cant see it happening as all thiefs weapon skills would need changing I liked the way caithes thiefs skills where in the story I like the cooldown system. if thief’s got cool down system but all really short CD’s max 10 secs but small damage and traits that refresh CD’s for doing stuff and reducing weapon swaps would be better.

anyway just my thoughts with marks as the utility as well aoe buffing and debuffing when targets standing in them not condition Appling more like stat % reduction and increasing.

Drennon.7190:

Ignarel.7916:

No.
It’s not that is a bad idea. It isn’t. But our “get over here” skill is scorpion wire and they refuse to fix it. I don’t want a downgraded version (scorpion wire can’t send you in the middle of their team) get passed as a “new elite” thing.
Give us real new tricks. And fix the kitten ed wire.

You bring up some good points. What abilities do you think would work with our steal trait?

I have no idea about what the new mechanic could be. What we know is that, similarly to necro or guardian, we can expect it to take advantage of current traits that affect steal. So let’s take a look:

- Serpent’s Touch, Mug, Sleight of Hand and Bewildering Ambush → Apply poison, damage&healing, daze and confusion respectively when using Steal. This means the skill must be a ground targeted, targeted or close area skill, since a self buff or similar wouldn’t have a chance to apply these effects. Close area would end up similar to the reaper’s new shouts, so I would mark that one as unlikely.

- Hidden Thief → Stealing grants you stealth. This means the new mechanic probably won’t be a source of blocks, invulnerability or evades since it would be redundant. Also can’t give stealth untraited if this is going to remain.

- Kleptomaniac, Thrill of the Crime and Bountiful Theft → Stealing gives you initiative, fury, might, swiftness, vigor and you rip 2 boons from our target and share them with nearby allies. That last one is the kicker. If we rip 2 boons from each target, our probabilities of getting a skill that can affect more than one target go down significantly. We can probably say we won’t get a ground targeted or close area skill. Also these traits offer a significant amount of self-buffs, so adding more is also unlikely.

- Long reach → Increases the range on stealing. So, it must be a ranged skill for this to make any sense, don’t you think?

When we put it all together we get a ranged targeted skill that won’t give us boons or stealth us or affect more than one target.

What could that be? If I had to say something, I’d bet on a skill that let us unload our conditions on a single foe, but that may prove op (the necromancers can already do that, but we are thieves, Anet likes to nerf us).

Just saying unless traits work differently in the specialization than they do currently, a ground targeted, close area or self-buff seems unlikely. I hope to be proven wrong and get a new and exciting new option.

If the new weapon really is rifle, I could almost see the F1 calling up a “shadow thief” to steal from the target, instead of you doing it directly. This would give a brief close-range distraction to the enemy while you stay at range.

Its behavior would have to be different from necro or mesmer summons. So maybe it could poof in and steal, staying on the target only until a few seconds pass or you hit F1 again. Then the shadow thief tries to run toward you and give you the item (plus some buffs) before disappearing.

Traits that trigger on stealing would proc when the shadow thief appears on the target. New traits could give you boons if the shadow thief successfully returns to you, increase its speed, and make it inflict conditions when running through enemies on its voyage home.

(One thing to be careful about: using this in stealth would let enemies follow the shadow thief to your location.)

The shadow thief idea is interesting, but unlikely. We already have a few summons in the form of a trap and an elite which summon thieves to attack.

I will admit the idea has me thinking of a different utility thieves could get in a spec : clones. Though they we be better paired if we felt the thief was getting a scepter, staff, or even torch.

In terms of the profession mechanic something like a placed trap may work and match the theme of a sniper as a means up setting up defense if someone approaches. The base skill would probably apply some sort of snare with traits adding upon the functionality.

-Serpent’s Touch, Mug, Sleight of Hand and Bewildering Ambush – Trap now applies poison, heals when placed, deals damage, dazes and applies confusion.

- Hidden Thief – grants stealth when placed, or when triggered.

- Kleptomaniac, Thrill of the Crime and Bountiful Theft – grants initiative/ boons when placed, strips boons when triggered.

- Long reach – trap can now be ground targeted and ‘thrown’ up to 600 range.

Granted most of these are a stretch, and would not fit if they wanted it to match the new utilities received which thieves already have traps, and guardians already got through their spec.

If we went for the whole Rifle/Gadgets type of deal, I can imagine Steal becoming like a Sabotage of sorts. You shadowstep to the enemy, plant something on them whether it’s a timed bomb or a unique debuff or whatever, and then you get a Shadow Return instead of a stolen skill.

As I said in another thread, clones are a mesmer mechanic. You can argue that they can get them through utilities, but we can also get initiative through ours and that doesn’t change that it is our class mechanic.

Clones, the same as initiative or life force, are part of a class mechanic and I can’t see them being spread around.

Ignarel.7916:

As I said in another thread, clones are a mesmer mechanic. You can argue that they can get them through utilities, but we can also get initiative through ours and that doesn’t change that it is our class mechanic.

Clones, the same as initiative or life force, are part of a class mechanic and I can’t see them being spread around.

I think you’re right.
If we were to get some mesmer mechanics I would think manipulations would be the prime candidate. I mean you have stuff like arcane thievery, blink, and mimic under it which all easily fit under thief style gameplay. If we were to pick up some of their skills, i would think more debuffs(hexes) under the name “manipulation.”

Clones being a mesmer mechanic are why I suggested the shadow thief as a very temporary unit with a unique purpose. It only briefly attacks the enemy to get its attention, then runs off toward their master with the goods they just stole. Their primary function would be to deliver the stolen item, with affecting units they pass through as secondary, and attacking as a distant tertiary.

It shouldn’t step on the toes of illusions or Thieve’s Guild if done right. The idea is that enemies know it’s delivering something valuable to you and try to stop it; this not only takes some heat of you for a few seconds, but it also encourages enemies to follow it, helping to pull them into a line for piercing rifle attacks.

Yeah, as long as the thief has a different name and apearance, I could see the shadow thief thing happening.

I sincerely hope it doesn’t, though. Mesmer and ranger already have enough problems having to deal with the AI, watching a summon trying to get to a higly movile thief would be painful. Also, if you make it stronger because the thief can be killed then using it in melee will probably be op. We must remember that the new weapon will be an option, not mandatory, and the new mechanic and trait line must work with the weapons we already have.

Agreed, this also would mean initiative will still be in place so other base weapons can be used.

We don’t know just what our Spec will be, so speculating about it is meaningless for now.

I think if rifle comes , melee thief isn’t over.Because rifle should be 2nd weapon , what you can do when your enemies near you ? or what abaout who want play melee thief ? So f1 should be like stealing’s mechanic.Also I think we will use axe

Ehh, I kinda forgot about the other weapons. (Oops.) Shadow thief would not do much of anything interesting when you’re in melee range. Not at all. Bugger.

Building in a Shadow Return option after stealing might be enough, although a change to the stolen items table could be more interesting in the long run.

If it is a rifle I think skills/traits should focus on some sort of sniper theme. Steal would be changed to some sort of mark target ability granting either increased damage/range for a set period of time. Or it could garantee the next hit regardless of protection or perhaps even dodging. All negative skill effects attached to steal would be applied to the target on the hit after using the skill.

The specialization would favor a more stationary playstyle, rewarding sacrificing the defense of movement, but on the flip side making it very difficult to maintain an offense under pressure. Rifle skills with decent damage would take a while to use and lock the user down. Traits would have at least one restoring initiative at a faster rate while stationary. I’d actually like to see something close to mantras for the new skill type. The idea would be a skill based on concentrating and possibly shoring up some weaknesses of long skills with a few emergency instant casts. A skill/trait to remain stealthed while not moving would be interesting to. If a trait, it would kick in once a stealth skill ends if you aren’t moving. Chaining stealth on top of it to continue moving would not be possible and moving would cause a reveal debuff. If a trait, being directly damaged should probably end the effect. It would be mostly tactical and not worth anything in spvp for capturing points, though it could make a pretty good guard if that ever became a thing. Possibly add some sort of wall trap as well, not activated til an enemy tries to cross.

I’d really like to see a sniper type class, though I know the challenges to it. It would have to be rewarding enough to have the feel of sniping while making sure the risks balance out the reward to avoid something unfairly OP. At the same time, ANet has a thing about wanting to avoid overly simplistic classes. Perhaps that could be overcome in a need to move after successful kills. Maybe have certain high damage skills punish the sniper with vulnerability. If GW2 were to get such a class, this would be one of the best opportunities do to the similar nature but completely different playstyles of a GW2 thief and a sniper type class.

I could see a sort of “stationary combat” style of thief gameplay emerge. They’d be anti-roamers for the most part – assuming the sniper rifle is lockdown and power based, it wouldn’t be difficult to stay in a single spot (assuming you have traits meant for standing still and/or your skills require it) and layeth the smack down on any jabronis what come within thine sight.

The trick, of course, would be setting up ambush points. In sPvP, this is fairly easy, as you can basically guarantee where enemy players are going to go. Maybe you wouldn’t capture while stealthed, obviously, but you’d be able to maintain a position and unload if someone got too close, and there’s tons of choke points you can do this with in all of the pvp maps except for maybe the courtyard. In WvW, it’d also be able to sit and wait for other roamers to show up and then wreck their day, or wait on well-traveled roads to play yakslapper.

Here’s an idea for a replacement for Steal though – Shadowstep to a location and gain camouflage (those who don’t know what that is, it’s stealth that’s broken when you move). When you make an attack out of camouflage, you gain steal effects (Thrill of the Crime, Mug, that sort of thing) on the target hit by your attack. Maybe a grandmaster trait to make camouflage indefinite, as long as you’re out of combat while using it.

I would be happy with steal turning into what shadowstep is now. :/ Useful in no matter what spec you choose as a thief.

Thief is this games only assasin class , why u want turn to sniper ? we have engineer for rifles …

You guys are going to get Long bow, the specialization will be called Link and your f1 will turn into a boomerang that can steal at range. GL. Spoiler alert.

Crimson, Engineer has a tricked out shotgun. Warrior has an assault rifle. It stands to reason a long-range, single-shot setup is missing from the roster.

Additionally, “assassin class” means a hell of a lot of things to a lot of different people, so you may want to clarify. What you mean here is the stabby glass cannon, right? A sniper wouldn’t be breaking the theme of the thief, much to some people’s consternation. At that point it’s an ambusher setting up so that when prey comes close, it can shoot and kill as easily as possible. Thieves are not, and never have been, just stabby fighters.

@Harnel: I somewhat like your idea much more than any of the possibilities I suggested for a sniper based F1. It can greatly change the playstyle of thief without taking away from the old. It’s also not completely OP powerwise.

I see only two problems.
1.) Sort of makes thieve’s stealth on steal redundant. Not that big a problem because the trait provides something a bit different, letting you move.

2.)Most broken escape skill ever.

I agree Kury. It’d need to be balanced, and there’d have to be some kind of timer in effect if you used it in combat, to prevent you from just vanishing into thin air in the middle of a fight, but should you manage that you’re golden.

Keep the name, but change the mechanic of it. Instead of swapping places with your foe, swap items with them!

How it works is when we trait into the elite specialization the thief’s f1 skill is changes to: whenever you steal something you leave your enemy a little surprise. ;D

Of course, some of the stolen skills would have to change to better acclimate to our f1 change.

For example, when you steal from an engineer, instead of getting gunk you get an elixir while the engineer gets a bomb that harms him! Or when you steal from a ranger you get a buff( could not think of one atm), but leave a piece of meat on the ranger that makes his pet attack him for a few seconds.

Traits could also synergize with this, such as when whenever you steal you also transfer X amount of conditions to your foe.