Guild Wars 2

This is a sub topic for the state of the thief. you can get to the main overview by clicking one of the links below.
This Topic is used to discuss about a specific skill or trait and to make suggestions on how to improve it.

• General
• Traits – weak
• Traits – strong
• Skills – weak
• Skills – strong
• Wild Ideas

———————————————
Shadowstep:
———————————————
Utility Skill: Deception
Shadowstep to target area. Becomes Shadow Return, which returns you to your starting area and cures three conditions. (50s cooldown)

Stun Breaker

———————————————
Ideas :
———————————————

crouze.3078:

Shadowstep to target area. Becomes Shadow Return, which returns you to your starting area and cures three two conditions. (50s 30s cooldown)

Stun Breaker

Increase the duration for Shadow Return from 10s to 20s.
(The Stun Breaker on Shadow Return will stay)

My idea:

Shadowstep to target area. Becomes Shadow Return, which returns you to your starting area and cures three two conditions. (50s 30s cooldown)

Stun Breaker

Increase the duration for Shadow Return from 10s to 20s.
(The Stun Breaker on Shadow Return will stay)

Disagree completely. Thief needs MORE condition cleanse options that don’t depend on stealth, not less… especially with the current meta’s incredible emphasis on condi-spam builds.

There’s nothing wrong with Shadow step at the moment.

We should be focusing on bringing sub-par skills up to par with the rest of our options – once we have a rich pool of functioning, useful skills to judge it against, we can talk about whether or not Shadow step needs to be changed.

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

Disagree completely. Thief needs MORE condition cleanse options that don’t depend on stealth, not less… especially with the current meta’s incredible emphasis on condi-spam builds.

is removing 2 conditions in 30 seconds worse then 3 conditions in 50 seconds?

^I personally would like his option more. Except for the loss on stunbreak on use. It’s a great skill for escaping when you get surprised. This kind of forces us to take another stunbreaker just to compensate (for example if a basilisk BS thief attacks you). In my current build this would I have to run with 3 stunbreakers (since two of them will only work after placing them, with one having a potentive use of 20 seconds)

So in regard of the stunbreaking part, i’d prefer having 3condi clear on 50 sec then 2 condi clear on 30 sec

Gwalchgwn.1659:

^I personally would like his option more. Except for the loss on stunbreak on use. It’s a great skill for escaping when you get surprised. This kind of forces us to take another stunbreaker just to compensate (for example if a basilisk BS thief attacks you). In my current build this would I have to run with 3 stunbreakers (since two of them will only work after placing them, with one having a potentive use of 20 seconds)

So in regard of the stunbreaking part, i’d prefer having 3condi clear on 50 sec then 2 condi clear on 30 sec

The point of my idea is to use it to engange into a fight and use the shadow return to disengage. Removing the stun break on the first shadowstep prevents you from using it when getting caught off guard.

In return for the remove of stun breaker you can use it more often and have more mobility.

I didn’t see you were proposing a shorter cooldown.
Yeah, I like that idea.

crouze.3078:

Gwalchgwn.1659:

^I personally would like his option more. Except for the loss on stunbreak on use. It’s a great skill for escaping when you get surprised. This kind of forces us to take another stunbreaker just to compensate (for example if a basilisk BS thief attacks you). In my current build this would I have to run with 3 stunbreakers (since two of them will only work after placing them, with one having a potentive use of 20 seconds)

So in regard of the stunbreaking part, i’d prefer having 3condi clear on 50 sec then 2 condi clear on 30 sec

The point of my idea is to use it to engange into a fight and use the shadow return to disengage. Removing the stun break on the first shadowstep prevents you from using it when getting caught off guard.

In return for the remove of stun breaker you can use it more often and have more mobility.

You’ve removed what is hands down Thief’s most functional, versatile stunbreaker.

Haste is a poor choice for hopefully obvious reasons.

Inf Sig isn’t a bad skill, but teleporting to your target to break a stun can have negative consequences.

RFI would be fine if it worked. All too often, you’ll hit it 10 times in the span of 2 seconds before it goes off (eating damage you should have been evading while you wait), and among those times it DOES go off, it’s random whether or not you’ll actually evade away, or do an evade roll in place for 80% of the animation.

Shadow step is far more reliable, and can break 2 stuns if they happen within 12 seconds of each other ( a reality in team fights and against the current meta stunlock warriors).

Even though I don’t think we should bother dissecting our functioning skills at all until we bring under-performing skills to the same level, you would need to propose another stun breaker to replace shadowstep before you could seriously consider any changes to it that remove stunbreaker.

Source: I run RFI, Inf Sig and Shadow Step, and have for a while now – I’m very aware of their strengths and limitations.

If you engange the fight with shadowstep, you will still have a stunbreaker for the next 20 seconds with shadow return.

crouze.3078:

If you engange the fight with shadowstep, you will still have a stunbreaker for the next 20 seconds with shadow return.

Why would I bother? I’ve got inf strike, shadow shot, and sometimes HS to engage with, and the currently superior form of Shadow step that breaks stuns to disengage with if need be.

It just forces you to prepare your stun breaker = more skillful play
while gaining more mobility because of the shorter cooldown.

crouze.3078:

It just forces you to prepare your stun breaker = more skillful play
while gaining more mobility because of the shorter cooldown.

You seem to think limiting the functionality of a skill = Better play.

There’s nothing wrong with shadow step as it stands. Turning shadow step into an opener isn’t necessary, because thief already has access to strong opening skills.

As a class in the lowest HP pool, with no prot/stability/aegis, no immune skills and no blocks, having to prepare my stunbreaker in advance is an unnecessary hurdle, especially when there’s absolutely nothing wrong with shadowstep as it is.

Edit: You are trying to solve a problem that doesn’t exist. Thief already has plenty of gap closing openers, and shadowstep isn’t such a strong/brainless stunbreaker as to necessitate a nerf.

I only would like to see the 20s time before shadow return ends.

crouze.3078:

Gwalchgwn.1659:

^I personally would like his option more. Except for the loss on stunbreak on use. It’s a great skill for escaping when you get surprised. This kind of forces us to take another stunbreaker just to compensate (for example if a basilisk BS thief attacks you). In my current build this would I have to run with 3 stunbreakers (since two of them will only work after placing them, with one having a potentive use of 20 seconds)

So in regard of the stunbreaking part, i’d prefer having 3condi clear on 50 sec then 2 condi clear on 30 sec

The point of my idea is to use it to engange into a fight and use the shadow return to disengage. Removing the stun break on the first shadowstep prevents you from using it when getting caught off guard.

In return for the remove of stun breaker you can use it more often and have more mobility.

And my opinion is that the benefit doesn’t outweight the risk in this particular example. I prefer having an escape skill when caught off guard then a better mobility. Again, this is just my opinion. If the skill would ever be changed like this I’d probably just adapt but since we’re just theory crafting right now I’m in my right to disagree.
(PS: I like some of the other topic ideas, so nothing personal )

evilapprentice.6379:

You are trying to solve a problem that doesn’t exist. Thief already has plenty of gap closing openers, and shadowstep isn’t such a strong/brainless stunbreaker as to necessitate a nerf.

I agree. Why exactly would I use this new Shadowstep to engage? It not being a stunbreak any more doesn’t make it good for engaging. The idea of having to prepare your stunbreak in advance sounds interesting in theory, but it sort of contradicts the purpose of a stunbreak: to save you from a vulnerable position. Also I sincerely doubt anyone would use it that way in practice. You’d just use it as a ghetto stunbreak the first time you get CC’d, since it’ll still be able to move you far enough away to avoid most follow up.

You should really explain in these threads why you believe these particular things need to be changed at all. Shadowstep isn’t particularly OP in my opinion, and this forum isn’t overflowing with complaints about it. “It should be used to engage” is a pretty flimsy reason, and is just an opinion that you don’t justify.

actually it should be nice like this:
CD 40 or 45 sec:
1.shadowstep breaks stun and cleanse 1 condition
2.shadowreturn breaks stun and cleanse 1 condition (12 sec duration)