Guild Wars 2

I think this trait would be worth looking at if it had no internal cd thoughts?.

Have you tried it? Maybe it is that cooldown but I can not garner much in the way of benefits off it. It needs to do more in the way of other benefits or be able to lower the steal time more than what I can see getting. (it hards to track but I think the most I got was 3 secs)

Well it come down being able to recharge steal faster allow you mug gaining hp + cc allowing you fight longer having more reward from your eva.

just make thief stronger in odd way

Yeah my own opinion there just not enough there to warrant giving up hard to catch. Maybe if the cooldown 1 second lower or as I auggested one also gained 5 end everytime an attack evaded.

With no icd on Swindler’s Equilibrium, it would be possible for steal to recharge within a few seconds in certain situations, which would be too strong.

With the current 1 second cool down, it should be possible to reduce steal’s recharge by 50% in perfect circumstances. However, this would require a thief to perfectly dodge once per second indefinitely, which isn’t nearly possible. Swindler’s Equilibrium could be changed to reduce steal’s recharge by 3 seconds per successful dodge with a 5 second icd. Even though it might look like a nerf on paper, this would allow for better results more realistically.

Raiden.1375:

With no icd on Swindler’s Equilibrium, it would be possible for steal to recharge within a few seconds in certain situations, which would be too strong.

With the current 1 second cool down, it should be possible to reduce steal’s recharge by 50% in perfect circumstances. However, this would require a thief to perfectly dodge once per second indefinitely, which isn’t nearly possible. Swindler’s Equilibrium could be changed to reduce steal’s recharge by 3 seconds per successful dodge with a 5 second icd. Even though it might look like a nerf on paper, this would allow for better results more realistically.

Do the math and the amount of dodges a thief has now vs before the trait isn’t better than H2C.

You get rid of the ICD it still requires you to successfully dodge an attack, and with the awesomeness that is feline grace + nerfed vigor how many evades you think a thief has now?

Not that many

p.s. If you are talking about when they dodge more than 1 enemy attacking at once being OP…..well compared to all the kitten mesmers, eles, etc got its not.

T raw.4658:

Do the math and the amount of dodges a thief has now vs before the trait isn’t better than H2C.

You get rid of the ICD it still requires you to successfully dodge an attack, and with the awesomeness that is feline grace + nerfed vigor how many evades you think a thief has now?

Not that many

p.s. If you are talking about when they dodge more than 1 enemy attacking at once being OP…..well compared to all the kitten mesmers, eles, etc got its not.

Yeah, thief has less dodges now which doesn’t help with Swindler’s Equilibrium having a 1 second icd. This change would only help with that.

Also, I agree that with no icd it wouldn’t be so op that a thief could 1v5 or anything, but it would still be too strong. For example, if you are just being focused temporarily by multiple enemies in a team fight, or if you dodge fast attacks from a single enemy like a rapid fire or someone with quickness, it would result in multiple evades from 1 dodge by itself.

Raiden.1375:

T raw.4658:

Do the math and the amount of dodges a thief has now vs before the trait isn’t better than H2C.

You get rid of the ICD it still requires you to successfully dodge an attack, and with the awesomeness that is feline grace + nerfed vigor how many evades you think a thief has now?

Not that many

p.s. If you are talking about when they dodge more than 1 enemy attacking at once being OP…..well compared to all the kitten mesmers, eles, etc got its not.

Yeah, thief has less dodges now which doesn’t help with Swindler’s Equilibrium having a 1 second icd. This change would only help with that.

Also, I agree that with no icd it wouldn’t be so op that a thief could 1v5 or anything, but it would still be too strong. For example, if you are just being focused temporarily by multiple enemies in a team fight, or if you dodge fast attacks from a single enemy like a rapid fire or someone with quickness, it would result in multiple evades from 1 dodge by itself.

So the enemy players are punished for bad use of skills vs thief……I fail to see the problem

T raw.4658:

Raiden.1375:

With no icd on Swindler’s Equilibrium, it would be possible for steal to recharge within a few seconds in certain situations, which would be too strong.

With the current 1 second cool down, it should be possible to reduce steal’s recharge by 50% in perfect circumstances. However, this would require a thief to perfectly dodge once per second indefinitely, which isn’t nearly possible. Swindler’s Equilibrium could be changed to reduce steal’s recharge by 3 seconds per successful dodge with a 5 second icd. Even though it might look like a nerf on paper, this would allow for better results more realistically.

Do the math and the amount of dodges a thief has now vs before the trait isn’t better than H2C.

You get rid of the ICD it still requires you to successfully dodge an attack, and with the awesomeness that is feline grace + nerfed vigor how many evades you think a thief has now?

Not that many

p.s. If you are talking about when they dodge more than 1 enemy attacking at once being OP…..well compared to all the kitten mesmers, eles, etc got its not.

Well to be fair the trait kicks in on a successful evade and not just a dodge. In other words PW and Flanking strikes would shave time off.

babazhook.6805:

Well to be fair the trait kicks in on a successful evade and not just a dodge. In other words PW and Flanking strikes would shave time off.

I’ve been working in a sort of sequence for everything that gives an evade but Flanking Strikes seems to have the hardest time to activate when I tell it to. I also seem to get more reliable evades with Flanking Strikes when I use it un-targeted to sweep more of the action. I’m not sure if it’s because it covers more of the area the enemy effects are using or if it’s syncing the timing of Flanking Strikes animation better against the enemy effect.

Evades in general feel like they have to be used more deliberately to squeeze in just the tiniest hesitation to connect for the effect better because evading on instinct seems to be too fast and I overshoot. This is all anecdotal of course and it might be I’m fooling myself a bit because I’m confusing prediction for instinct. I also feel like adding a small lighted ping to the Steal skill whenever Swindlers trait activates would help average players like me understand it’s whole dynamic more in the way a better player already understands it.

kash.9213:

babazhook.6805:

Well to be fair the trait kicks in on a successful evade and not just a dodge. In other words PW and Flanking strikes would shave time off.

I’ve been working in a sort of sequence for everything that gives an evade but Flanking Strikes seems to have the hardest time to activate when I tell it to. I also seem to get more reliable evades with Flanking Strikes when I use it un-targeted to sweep more of the action. I’m not sure if it’s because it covers more of the area the enemy effects are using or if it’s syncing the timing of Flanking Strikes animation better against the enemy effect.

Evades in general feel like they have to be used more deliberately to squeeze in just the tiniest hesitation to connect for the effect better because evading on instinct seems to be too fast and I overshoot. This is all anecdotal of course and it might be I’m fooling myself a bit because I’m confusing prediction for instinct. I also feel like adding a small lighted ping to the Steal skill whenever Swindlers trait activates would help average players like me understand it’s whole dynamic more in the way a better player already understands it.

Agreed. I would like some sort of tell so I can get feedback as to how well I am doing trying to get that lower steal time. Without one I feel I am accomplishing little no matter how well timed the evades are.

T raw.4658:

So the enemy players are punished for bad use of skills vs thief……I fail to see the problem

No icd on Swindler’s Equilibrium would allow for exceptional results in a few niche situations, but in those situations the thief will likely die anyway so they won’t even get to use the extra steals much. In small scale fights, no icd on SE will perform very similarly to a 1 second icd because thieves still have a limited amount of dodges. Including weapon skill evades and permanent vigor, a thief can realistically dodge at best once every 3 or 4 seconds on average over time. This doesn’t allow them to ever make the best use out of such a short icd. Swindler’s Equilibrium reducing steal’s recharge by 3 seconds per successful evade with a 5 second icd would allow a thief to at least achieve the maximum results if they play well enough, and it would probably still perform better than no icd in small scale fights due to limited dodges. This would also prevent the few situations where SE would be arguably too strong with no icd.

kash.9213:

I also feel like adding a small lighted ping to the Steal skill whenever Swindlers trait activates would help average players like me understand it’s whole dynamic more in the way a better player already understands it.

I agree, a better indication to know when it activates would be nice.

babazhook.6805:

T raw.4658:

Raiden.1375:

With no icd on Swindler’s Equilibrium, it would be possible for steal to recharge within a few seconds in certain situations, which would be too strong.

With the current 1 second cool down, it should be possible to reduce steal’s recharge by 50% in perfect circumstances. However, this would require a thief to perfectly dodge once per second indefinitely, which isn’t nearly possible. Swindler’s Equilibrium could be changed to reduce steal’s recharge by 3 seconds per successful dodge with a 5 second icd. Even though it might look like a nerf on paper, this would allow for better results more realistically.

Do the math and the amount of dodges a thief has now vs before the trait isn’t better than H2C.

You get rid of the ICD it still requires you to successfully dodge an attack, and with the awesomeness that is feline grace + nerfed vigor how many evades you think a thief has now?

Not that many

p.s. If you are talking about when they dodge more than 1 enemy attacking at once being OP…..well compared to all the kitten mesmers, eles, etc got its not.

Well to be fair the trait kicks in on a successful evade and not just a dodge. In other words PW and Flanking strikes would shave time off.

Yes I know and even then the amount of evades is inconsequential

So from reading what you guys have been saying. What if we change it to 1 eva = 1 steal cd gone but gave thief a buff of x charge allowing him on next one to be 2 eva = 2 steal cd have it cap out at 10.

So it be Gain buff on Eva Duration lasting 10 seconds (each charge refreshes buff time)
Well under the effect of “Swinder Equilibrium” allowing Steal to recharge faster up to 10 stacks. Each stack allowing you recharge Steal faster.

Thoughts on how that mite improve the trait or break it more.