Guild Wars 2

I used to run a high HP build with D/D but as the game as grown the build is no longer that great. I have been working on a build that gives you solid HP, armor, and crt. I would like some feedback on it and see what others think. This is for PvP in case anyone was wondering.

Cheers!

Edit: opps forgot the link http://www.gw2db.com/skills/calc/thief#2|3|2642|3990|4001|134|11435|25|1137|1143|0|30|1190|1723|1728|0|0|0|0|15|1698|0|0|0|0|0|0|10|3|5|28043|28033|49965|49965|49965|49965|49965|21031|48792|0|0|0|0|

Is this for PvP or PvE?

PvP I will change that my fault

I would take Mug over both traits you took in deadly arts. Traps really aren’t that great in PvP and Sundering Strikes is hands down a PvE trait. Most fights are over in seconds, you’ll never get a valued return on Sundering in PvP. That’s a sustained DPS trait. I’d sooner take venomous strength.

Traps really suck in PvP. PvE they’re awesome. Sword and Dagger is bar none the lamest weapon combo we got. I’m all for accepting a challenge and trying to make odd combinations work but S/D is hopeless in PvP atm. I eat S/D’ers alive.

rickshaw.5279:

I would take Mug over both traits you took in deadly arts. Traps really aren’t that great in PvP and Sundering Strikes is hands down a PvE trait. Most fights are over in seconds, you’ll never get a valued return on Sundering in PvP. That’s a sustained DPS trait. I’d sooner take venomous strength.

Traps really suck in PvP. PvE they’re awesome. Sword and Dagger is bar none the lamest weapon combo we got. I’m all for accepting a challenge and trying to make odd combinations work but S/D is hopeless in PvP atm. I eat S/D’ers alive.

Only because most people have absolutely no clue about how to build and play an S/D build.

I play S/D and eat alive all classes. All builds. As long as i play better than them , since S/D is the only set really able to deal with all classes, turning it all about player skill.

And i’m eagerly waiting for FS to become something useful, since when it will happne, i’ll eat alive other classes even more.

Hyperbole is fun.

Mrb can you PM and give me some tips. That would be really helpful!

http://www.gw2db.com/skills/calc/thief#2|3|2642|8743|2631|134|4485|10|1738|0|0|30|1190|1731|1728|30|2198|2199|751|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|0|10|3|5|28043|28033|53491|53491|53491|53491|53491|25790|48788|0|0|0|0|

This is the build i’m playing. The tooltip is wrong , in game i have 51 % crit and 15.855 HP but whatever.

It requires skill to be used.

6x Mesmer runes for +33% daze duration ( making tactical strike daze lasting 2.6 secs, an eternity).

Stealth will give you 330 healt per sec + remove a condition WHEN you enter stealth and one every 3 secs ( C&D alone removes 2 conditions and heal for 1.3 k health, as long as you don’t attack).

You need great awareness of your position, inf strike is extremely important, since you need to juke and disorient your enemies a lot.

Scorpionwire is your on demand interrupt, and you need to time it well, especially against bunker guardians ( you absolutely need to interrupt their heal, or the fight will simply never end, as long a you’re good enough to dance around him in stealth).

your damage is good, your burst is reliant on mug, make sure to use it when your foes is below 50 % health ( according to the fight, of course). You’re not as bursty as other builds, but your sustained is a lot higher, and moreover you have tons of escaping tools+ tactical strike stunlock ( the daze will ALWAYS expire after the revelead debuff, so you can totally dazelock your opponent if you’re smart enough).

Leave DB , HS and PW spam to noobs, and learn to play a real build. the thief will seem much more interesting as soon as you start playing with other builds, and maybe thief “noob” aura will slowly fade away.

I would also suggest a P/D condition damage variant, also realying on heavy stealthing.

I think one problem here is that you’re regarding armor as an important aspect up there with HP, and Crit.
There’s no straight-up tanking in Guild Wars 2, a lot of survivability depends purely on dodging, interrupts, condition-removers, and positioning.
So, assuming you got dodging mastered, you’re either playing to kill things, CC enemies, or heal/boost allies.

You need to decide on a role. DPS, Control, or Support.

Obviously, you’re not going support. (Who would go support-thief as a preference?! lol)

That leaves DPS and Control.
Once you figure out which side you prefer, your build will shape up better.

(The main difference here is that Control-Thieves are basically a sustained-damage dealer, so you’re more likely to make use of traits like Sundering Strikes)

I have been testing the sword/dagger and I have had some good games with this build, Yet I am finding it lacks something. What could I be missing?

http://www.gw2db.com/skills/calc/thief#2|3|2642|6677|2631|2786|11435|20|1738|1714|0|30|1190|1193|1728|0|0|0|0|20|1165|1700|0|0|0|0|0|19|0|5|28033|61745|49965|49965|49965|49965|49965|21031|48789|0|0|0|0|

Bazeleel.8219:

I have been testing the sword/dagger and I have had some good games with this build, Yet I am finding it lacks something. What could I be missing?

http://www.gw2db.com/skills/calc/thief#2|3|2642|6677|2631|2786|11435|20|1738|1714|0|30|1190|1193|1728|0|0|0|0|20|1165|1700|0|0|0|0|0|19|0|5|28033|61745|49965|49965|49965|49965|49965|21031|48789|0|0|0|0|

Look my above post.

Your build is simply not effective, there’s no real S/D build without going heavy with shadow arts.

Ill give the shadow arts traits a go. Keep in mind though there is no right way to build something, I know there are a lot more build for S/D then just yours

Op has the right idea Nd MrB build is OK although I WvW a lot so prefer reduced falling damage over mug. The only thing JD change from mrb build besides that are sigil of choice and rune sets.
I would go with rune set of divinity for more balanced stats and 15% stun duration on main hand with sigil of air, accuracy, fire, or rage on offhand. Utilities bigz use is alright for spvp but in wvw I have a big success with blinding powder, roll for init, and 25% MS Skgnet.
I too am nigh undefeatable most of the time even when outnumbered. Though I have a bit more balanced stats and get just as many kills.

you can build an S/D differently of course, but shadow arts is a must. Otherwise there’s simply no reason to have an off hand dagger without heavy stealth components over a off hand pistol.

you can make it a venom share build based on survivability and evasion ( with trickery and deadly arts), but if your goal is to bring down people 1vsX ( and be also viable in tournaments), there’s no better S/D build than the one i posted (currently).

Sadly the thief can’t be built as a bunker effectively, due to stealth not being recognized while contesting ( aka: if you’re stealthed, your opponents will cap the point even if you’re there), that’s why the only use for an S/D build is for 1vs1 while roaming or solo defending, or for support, with venom share.

>“you can build an S/D differently of course, but shadow arts is a must. Otherwise there’s simply no reason to have an off hand dagger without heavy stealth components over a off hand pistol.”

Not so at all. I run S/D without shadow arts at all. Dancing Dagger alone is a good reason to use /D instead of /P, and C&D can still be effective without Shadow Arts, you just can’t base your entire setup around it. S/* favors a target rich environment, and S/D caters to that far moreso than S/P.

I dont like replying on my stealth. Because its not perma stealth you cant count on it. I would rather use the doging as much as I can while just making my target annoyed as crap.

Tulisin.6945:

>“you can build an S/D differently of course, but shadow arts is a must. Otherwise there’s simply no reason to have an off hand dagger without heavy stealth components over a off hand pistol.”

Not so at all. I run S/D without shadow arts at all. Dancing Dagger alone is a good reason to use /D instead of /P, and C&D can still be effective without Shadow Arts, you just can’t base your entire setup around it. S/* favors a target rich environment, and S/D caters to that far moreso than S/P.

so you’re preferring dancing dagger over an on demand interrupt, an AoE pulsing blind and a great burst attack ? even more knowing that FS is currently useless ?

Great choice.

@kitono

Sigil of paralyzation doesn’t work on dazes, only stuns. With S/D, mesmer runes are basically a must.

“so you’re preferring dancing dagger over an on demand interrupt, an AoE pulsing blind and a great burst attack ? even more knowing that FS is currently useless ?”

Much of the thief community hasn’t grown to appreciate how useful dancing dagger is. DD’s utility matches Black Powder’s depending on the situation. FS is no more useless than a PW sans setup (and is our only spammable boon removal), and C&D->sword can still act as an interrupt in a pinch although nothing in the game comes close to offhand thief pistol for interrupt spamability.

They’re different playstyles, surely, but then again I’ve never tried a Lyssa’s Basilisk build but I can appreciate how effective it can be even though that isn’t my playstyle.

This is not about playstyle, this is about optimization.

FS is slow and unreliable, ANY player with half a brain would NEVER allow you to land the second, most damging, hit without preparation ( root, stun and similar) and your best damaging skill is C&D ( unless against more opponents, in that case DD becomes better), that is ALWAYS followed by a 2secs daze.

S/D is a set where you’re supposed to be in stealth a lot, even more knowing that inf strike allows C&D to land 100% of the time.

There’s no reason to not enhance your abilities while stealthed via shadow arts as long as you play with S/D, at least if you want to do high damage and be a roamer.

If you don’t like stealth, there’s no real reason to pick S/D and not a different weapon set : S/D is optimal only when stealth is enhanced at its best.

Mrbig you’re wrong about the sigil unless they just tested it. I ran tests on the sigil a couple weeks ago.

Kitono.9152:

Mrbig you’re wrong about the sigil unless they just tested it. I ran tests on the sigil a couple weeks ago.

tested it right now in the mists.

100% sure sigil of paralyzation doesn’t affect daze duration.

MrBig. You’re wrong. I just tested in in Mists and my tests that I did before are still in effect. I even frapsed it, parsed it, stretched it out in slow motion. The size of my clips are conclusive.
There is a “Hard Cap” on the duration of the daze. Both the 33% increased daze duration and the 15% increased stun duration increase the duration of this daze attack to the maximum duration of the cooldown timer of stealth.
Essentially, that 18% more from rune of the mesmer is waisted.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aik9kHFybM&feature=youtube_gdata

this is actualy a good news. I’m not sure if this is working as intended ( it’s strange for that “hard cap” to exist, knowing there are longer dazes than our 2 secs) but as long as it’s like this, it’s even better.

Those extra stats with runes of divinity will really benefit my play.

Thanks

So flanking strike is not useful at all, I really hate to use pistol whip and want to learn how to correctly use FS. I am not a fan of the no HP thief that just bursts down targets.

Flanking Strike is great, and will be better once it has it little quirks sorted out. The trick is it’s not something you use all the time, like DB or PW can be. It’s an Evade and rips a boon off. I’ve also had some impressive crits on that second strike.

The key is to learn to balance it with your Dodges and Energy, and pop it when you want a boon gone – even when it hiccups, the first strike always hits and is the boon ripper.

I think the best way to learn FS is to fight the NPCs in the Mists. Go up against the Warrior and Guardian and play around with it.

I actually agree with both Mr Big and Tulisin. Sword Dagger is fun for it’s Dazelock (even in dungeons), and Dancing Dagger is an amazing tool. Once I had Rare and Exotic weaponry, I loved when I’d get jumped in Orr, and in WvW and sPvP I welcome a chance to throw Dancing Dagger in a crowd – as long as you have at least two targets, three is better, and a Ranger is just a free kill, it’s some nice burst.

It’s value compared to Black Powder is debatable – I don’t find too many people who are willing to stand in the pulse; I always find people standing too close together. Then again, I try not to 1v1, even as a roamer. Get in, flip a fight, and continue on.

And Headshot is nice, but if you slot an interrupt like Wire instead of taking it, that’s just a risk you take. It’s called flexibility.

I’m tempted to try S/D but the ease of stomps with black powder is just so hard to give up. P/D is probably better for this type of play.

Bazel you will have a good time with sword dagger if you have skill. Its got mobility, condition removal, dazes, stun breakers, and cone aoe damage at the cost of the difference in back stab damage. That is why sword main is better than dagger main. Because it allows for better reacting to and controlling your opponent.
I laugh at p/p and D/d thieves and generally find p/d skilled thieves to be my only comparable competition.

Also nothing is easier than using cloak and dagger on your downed opponent and then stomping him. Not even blinding powder. I’ve got videos kitten d killing and stomping people in the middle of groups of 30+ in wvw. Got video of soloing 5v1. Even have video of ruining the day of some EB jumping puzzle campers after the dark room. I doubt you will find a thief more enthusiastic about the profession. Lol. I will be eventually be practicing other weapon sets so as to maintain flexibility but nothing makes me happier than S/D atm.

Kitono.9152:

Bazel you will have a good time with sword dagger if you have skill. Its got mobility, condition removal, dazes, stun breakers, and cone aoe damage at the cost of the difference in back stab damage. That is why sword main is better than dagger main. Because it allows for better reacting to and controlling your opponent.
I laugh at p/p and D/d thieves and generally find p/d skilled thieves to be my only comparable competition.

What are some good utility skills that go well with the S/D build? I am currently using Shadow Ref, S wire, and ShadowStep. With my elite skill as the venom.

Dagger storm for big zerg PvP. Thieves guild for small PvP. Blinding powder is a good emergency stealth and initiative on regen signet is also a personal favorite. Just make sure you get that movement speed signet for wvw. Honestly defensive utilities are way more important.