Guild Wars 2

Hello everyone! I have been playing GW2 for a month now and I loved thief. It is the class I will be sticking with, my main and only as I dont like making alts.

After playing with the standard power “meta” build up until now, after hearing over and over that condition builds aren’t viable, I am trying to come up with a working venom build since the last update.

The general idea is: while in a group, boost the overall party’s DPS via conditions (which normally people won’t bring since it doesn’t fit the current “meta”) and mighty stacks, survivability via leeching venoms, support via steal and overall awesomeness via venom aura.

I am nowhere near a “pro” or experienced on build design, but overall I think this build I came up with is good overall:

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fZMQNAoYVnMJSTTW0EeOB7TmwmQ4+UtZe2drmDCA-TByCABAcIAwR9HFeCApoPIRlgBt/QWK/m+EAQIgFzBA-e

I chose the speed runes for open world and wvw mobility, plus the added vitality is nice. I also mixed in Dire with Rabid for that same purpose.

Do any of you guys have any advice/suggestions/comments regarding this? I will not ever go for a power build again, I like condition build gameplay (especially with D/D) and I like being needed and making a difference in a group, be it wvw or dungeons.

Thanks in advance!
IGN Fierce Knuckledust

Useful in www zerg. Meh in roaming, not that bad in spvp yoloq, awful in dungeons.
D/D isn’t really a great condi set, and the heal venom is underwhelming in anything but www zergs. For pve, if you want to make the difference and be needed, it’ll be with a power build. For the build itself, bountiful thief is really powerful but you loose residual venoms, and it could be a nice boost.

on a group VS group scenario, i’d replace the torment venom for the immobilize venom, thieves’ guild for basilisk venom, and maybe skelk venom for hide in shadows (more reliable, stronger heal). i’d also get a stunbreaker there instead of signet of shadows.

as for the weapon set, D/D condi isn’t exactly good. i’d say P/D with ricochet would be a better bet (especially with cloaked in shadow), but ricochet isn’t particularly strong, it might help tagging more enemies though. and rabid gear is a bit of a waste of damage because it won’t up your precision high enough to have reliable crits, and with no power, you won’t crit for much.

oxtred.7658:

For the build itself, bountiful thief is really powerful but you loose residual venoms, and it could be a nice boost.

residual venom doesn’t add enough charges to warrant another 2 points.

The build is fine but condition thief does not really benefit from precision so you can switch your armor/weapons to all dire or even throw in some healing power combinations shamans/settlers

The thing with venom share in WvW is that you are reliant on teammates. You have no mobility/stun breaks/stealth utilities. So in small havoc groups 5+ this build is very effective and can see great results.

Here is where the problems start – In WvW you simply will not be able to solo roam with that kind of build – does not matter if that is not your goal. In large zerg fights conditions are rendered ineffective due to massive cleansing from Guardians/War Horn Warriors. Dungeons you will see the condition cap of 25 render a lot of your damage ineffective.

Bottom Line – It is a “niche” build; Only effective in certain situations – small scale pvp
Even in those situations a power build will be more effective. Dungeons/PvE is all about high power damage this build has no real place there. BUT.. having said all that if you like the playstyle continue to use it at least Anet is acknowledging it needs buffs.

I get the build isn’t as optimal as a full power one would be, but doesn’t it compensate the lack of raw DPS for more survivability and support? Also I dont like being a copycat of others standard builds.. its just boring

Narkodx.1472:

The build is fine but condition thief does not really benefit from precision so you can switch your armor/weapons to all dire or even throw in some healing power combinations shamans/settlers

I went for some precision due to geomancers sigils so I can apply bleed more reliably since I am not using a pistol

From a pve point of view you have far less support with this build. For www, your lack of personal defense and burst damage ( because no one will die from a thief spamming death blossom, let’s be honest) greatly reduce your efficiency in roaming. It’s just a good zergly build, though. But as Narkodx said, play what you want, just keep in mind it’s far from ideal and you have to be a great player to not be a dead weight in your team. And even then, having a better build would help them even more.

Belisario.3410:

I get the build isn’t as optimal as a full power one would be, but doesn’t it compensate the lack of raw DPS for more survivability and support? Also I dont like being a copycat of others standard builds.. its just boring

Of course you have more support/survivability – Venomous Aura is about as supportive as it gets for a thief. Condition builds obviously have more survivability than full power glass cannon builds.

People are not trying to dissuade you from running the build. In fact, most veteran thieves at one point in time ran this build. I ran it for a long time with my MM Necro buddy and it was hilarious to say the least. It simply has too many limitations which as you play more you will become aware of. Goodluck Have fun!

EDIT – Precision will benefit you to have EARTH sigils not Geomancer sigils – Geo procs on weapon swap earth procs on criticals. Either way Rabid is not the best option for a Thief because earth does not add that much more damage and having some vitality/healing power will greatly enhances your survivability as opposed to a minor increase in damage from precision

Thank all you guys for the advice! I reeally understand its far from “ideal”, but “ideal” is just boring for me.

How you guys would improve this even further? I also like using D/D instead of P/D

Rabid isn’t really worth it on a venom build and weapon set like that, exchange it for either a Carrion or Dire set. Carrion will give you power to where D/D can be more useful than if you were just using Deathblossom, while Dire will just give you toughness and vitality to help you survive more.

If you’re playing this build you shouldn’t seek optimisation. But yeah, swap to dire, change your heal, and join groups that don’t mind your build. What about using D/D and P/D? That way you keep the theme of your build, and you have a more powerful weapon switch.

Im not seeking optimisation at all, just advice on how to improve a venom aura condition damage D/D build

oxtred.7658:

If you’re playing this build you shouldn’t seek optimisation. But yeah, swap to dire, change your heal, and join groups that don’t mind your build. What about using D/D and P/D? That way you keep the theme of your build, and you have a more powerful weapon switch.

The heal is fine for healing the group with the aura. Just don’t expect to be able to heal yourself up in a pinch is all. That’s the problem with Skelk Venom, it absolutely sucks when you’re by yourself, but with a group in a Venom Share build, it’s absolutely amazing support healing for the party.

venoms aren’t really used for condi damage. poison doesn’t tick hard enough (and only stacks duration), leaving torment as the only condi sigil.

i’d recommend trying out carrion instead of dire. as a power/condi hybrid, you’ll be more effective on D/D, and the 300 toughness + all the vitality from carrion will ensure you’re still very survivable.

i’d also replace that adept major trait. your build won’t be using stealth, so slowed pulse might be a better trait (even if it’s a worse trait than cloaked in shadow, at least it’ll be used).

so here we go with my suggestions:

• replace signet of shadows for a stunbreaker
• replace thieves’ guild for basilisk venom
• consider replacing one of the venoms for the immobilize venom
• change cloaked in shadow (SA adept) for slowed pulse
• go for carrion gear. it keeps you tanky while adding a bit more oomph to your offense when death blossom inevitably runs out.
• don’t use on-crit sigils, thief is not one of those professions that can do a good condition/precision build. you could pick geomancy and agony, to increase the length of your death blossom bleeds by two seconds and have bleeding on swap.
• since venom share is by definition a small group build, you can rely on other people for swiftness (on top of having heartseeker and infiltrator arrow, which more often than not makes swiftness completely redundant), don’t bother with traveler runes. i personally enjoy krait runes, which give AoE condis on nearby enemies and synergizes well with basilisk venom. i think mad king runes could work well too, but i never used them, so don’t quote me on it.

i think that covers it, trying to keep the playstyle similar to what you envisioned.

BrunoBRS.5178:

i think that covers it, trying to keep the playstyle similar to what you envisioned.

A mix of power and condition damage seems good to play alongside venoms, thank you for the input BrunoBRS.

Mad King runes seems great for the kind of hybrid build, does anyone else agree?

RyuDragnier.9476:

Rabid isn’t really worth it on a venom build and weapon set like that, exchange it for either a Carrion or Dire set. Carrion will give you power to where D/D can be more useful than if you were just using Deathblossom, while Dire will just give you toughness and vitality to help you survive more.

best choice is actually celestial.
Torment spam is weak and cost too much, the venoms you want is devourer and basilisk. no they are not worth residual venom. Yes bountiful theft >>>> 2 extra points in deadly arts any day.

For group play – find trap ranger and shatter mesmer to team up with. Devourer/basilisk will lock the enemy inside their bombs, causing enemies to take massive damage in a tiny tiny timeframe.

Keep the skale venom because it is ridicolously op in a small group. If your team is good enough to focus a target with that vuln on the enemy would be down in less than 2secs.

go full dire p/d and d,d second set
go full venoms share build and stay at back.
take swap sigil like geo and hydro as both good in aoe dmg
you dont need speedbuff in group play as guardian ele will take care of it
share you venom at the right time and look for the necro/mesmer/ele and burst on them and all over again .
dont stay in melee range or you’ll be dead

in 1vx take out 1 venom for breakstun skill and change heal skill