Guild Wars 2

Thief is by far the class that needs the least amount of skill to achieve any kind of decency with the profession. Being able to stealth every 4 seconds is stupid (to put it nicely). You don’t’ have to use any kind of “skilled play” to just spam stealth. All you Thiefs’ know it is true and just use it to get cheap kills.

Either 1 of 4 things need to happen.

1) Rework the trait that gives the condition removal on stealth. It is ridiculously that they can remove a condition every time they go in stealth and another one while they are in stealth for 3 seconds (which every stupid stealth in this game for them is at least 3 seconds). This makes it only possible for a Necromancer or Engineer with conditions to actually kill them with conditions. Even then they will just use their cheesy stealth to run away.

2) Increase the reveled de-buff to at least 8 to 10 seconds. Make them actually fight and think about what they are going to do instead of allowing them to just stealth backstab, teleport around while evading back into stealth just to have all of their conditions removed and fill their initiative to full. To all of you who will whine that this will ruin the class… you still have the most evades on any weapon set. You have them for a reason. You have another skills beside 2 and 1. Learn to use them.

3) Remove the unbalanced pure stealth from the game and make it a silhouette stealth. This way skilled players can actually do something about stealth; instead of letting bad players completely benefit from having a advantage the entire fight.

The fight is always in the Thiefs hands no matter who they face. They choose who they fight and don’t. No class should be able to do this with such ease as they do. No class should be able to get away when they have been beaten by a more skillful player just by using stealth. Stealth allows this class to just poke and prod the opponent with no draw backs. Since all of their skills rely on the very cheap initiative system, they rarely have to think about what to do since it will all be restored in a short order of time (much shorter than all the other classes good skills with 20+ second cooldowns).

4) If you get hit in stealth you are removed from stealth. This one is harsh but the best for the current system since you can just spam stealth anyway. You only have to be visible for 4 seconds so if someone is skilled enough to follow you and hit you, he deserves to be rewarded.

None of these suggestions would make Thief horrible and useless like all of you will claim. You fear actually having to use slight skill and thought before you engage someone. In the current situation of the game you have 0 risk involved in engaging anyone.

Edit: There is no argument against stealth being a cheap class ability. You have no defense and you know it is true. This is why the majority of the first comments are mere mocking comments more than discussion about the ability.

TL;DR – I don’t know how to fight thieves and they always kill me. Instead of learning how to fight them I think they should be nerfed!

By all means, go ahead and rant. I find it amusing.
No one (other than Cruuk) uses Shadow Arts. It’s a pretty sub-par traitline lol.

So why don’t you duel me in-game with a thief, and then we can see how little skill they require?

No Walking.6349:

TL;DR – I don’t know how to fight thieves and they always kill me. Instead of learning how to fight them I think they should be nerfed!

Nope, you are wrong. You are a common thief who only plays this class to take advantage of the stealth because you fear using skill to win instead of cheap class abilities.

I know how to fight them and I can kill them in certain situations but that doesn’t justify stealth. Stealth is a cheap non-skill ability. It takes 0 skill to play a thief and stealth around.

Arganthium.5638:

So why don’t you duel me in-game with a thief, and then we can see how little skill they require?

I have no need too. Stealth is cheap and I will either win easily or just be able to stealth away. Which is the point of this thread. Stealth is cheap to the point in this game that even if you lose horribly bad, you can always stealth and walk away with ease.

Vanthian.9267:

No Walking.6349:

TL;DR – I don’t know how to fight thieves and they always kill me. Instead of learning how to fight them I think they should be nerfed!

Nope, you are wrong. You are a common thief who only plays this class to take advantage of the stealth because you fear using skill to win instead of cheap class abilities.

I know how to fight them and I can kill them in certain situations but that doesn’t justify stealth. Stealth is a cheap non-skill ability. It takes 0 skill to play a thief and stealth around.

Nope, I play a ranger. And you obviously don’t know how to kill thieves otherwise you wouldn’t be here QQing about it. Also, you do know that other MMOs have it to where they can stealth all the time right…. You just need to get better.

Actually, there is plenty of play/counter play to entering stealth.
There is Dagger offhand (rarely used) Cloak and Dagger which is a huge tell and dodge/interruptible with a HUGE initiative cost.
There is Thief stolen ability and Hide in Shadows(heal) which both have obvious animations and easily interruptable.
There’s the D/P Black Powder Heartseeker which is again, interruptible and extremely easy to read.
And there’s the most easy of all to counter, Shadow refuge, aka. knock him out of the circle or just kill him.

The only “uncounterable” stealth a thief has is Blinding Powder, a 40sec cd utility noone uses.

No Walking.6349:

So? You get the thief to leave, you get the cap. I see no problem here unless you’re a point farmer.

If you don’t see the point, then I feel sorry for you. The point is, no class should be able to permanently evade death just because they have one cheap class skill. If you have beaten a Thief to the point he is forced to run (which always happens), then he should die. You should not get a “get out of jail” free card just because you are a thief. I am fine with mobility as long as you don’t couple it with stealth.

I would also be fine with this broken stealth as long as you don’t couple it with massive mobility.

Arganthium.5638:

So why don’t you duel me in-game with a thief, and then we can see how little skill they require?

I’ll also be willing to accept this challenge. Any thief vs my guardian.

Never really lost a 1v1 against one, and I 1v1 alot.

Jumper.9482:

Actually, there is plenty of play/counter play to entering stealth.
There is Dagger offhand (rarely used) Cloak and Dagger which is a huge tell and dodge/interruptible with a HUGE initiative cost.
There is Thief stolen ability and Hide in Shadows(heal) which both have obvious animations and easily interruptable.
There’s the D/P Black Powder Heartseeker which is again, interruptible and extremely easy to read.
And there’s the most easy of all to counter, Shadow refuge, aka. knock him out of the circle or just kill him.

The only “uncounterable” stealth a thief has is Blinding Powder, a 40sec cd utility noone uses.

There is no counter to stealth. Once they are stealth, that is it. They will only be reveled once they hit something (choose to come out) or the stealth runs out (3 seconds/4 seconds (most thievies)/ or the annoying 16 seconds). None of these things are negative and prove there is 0 skilled play that can counter someone in stealth. The best you can do is guess which way he went and swing in the air.

Doomdesire.9365:

Arganthium.5638:

So why don’t you duel me in-game with a thief, and then we can see how little skill they require?

I’ll also be willing to accept this challenge. Any thief vs my guardian.

Never really lost a 1v1 against one, and I 1v1 alot.

Again, you fail to realize the point of the thread. Even if we did duel, I could easily stealth away and deprive you of the kill very easily or if you are not as good as you claim I would kill you.

Well, if you want to live in your own ignorant little world, that’s fine.
I’m just trying to help you l2p.
To think I was even nice enough to reply to a post QQing about how OP Stealth/Shadow Arts is…

Vanthian.9267:

Jumper.9482:

Actually, there is plenty of play/counter play to entering stealth.
There is Dagger offhand (rarely used) Cloak and Dagger which is a huge tell and dodge/interruptible with a HUGE initiative cost.
There is Thief stolen ability and Hide in Shadows(heal) which both have obvious animations and easily interruptable.
There’s the D/P Black Powder Heartseeker which is again, interruptible and extremely easy to read.
And there’s the most easy of all to counter, Shadow refuge, aka. knock him out of the circle or just kill him.

The only “uncounterable” stealth a thief has is Blinding Powder, a 40sec cd utility noone uses.

There is no counter to stealth. Once they are stealth, that is it. They will only be reveled once they hit something (choose to come out) or the stealth runs out (3 seconds/4 seconds (most thievies)/ or the annoying 16 seconds). None of these things are negative and prove there is 0 skilled play that can counter someone in stealth. The best you can do is guess which way he went and swing in the air.

Then you prevent that by dodging the CnD. It’s extremely noticeable. Also, all melee thieves are going for one target when they stealth – your back. Knowing this you can predict where the thief will attempt to move in order to land the backstab. If you are an AoE heavy class, AoEs are your feet work well. If you are a melee, your auto attack rotation is an indicator of wether you hit them or not. Guardians and Warriors also have blocks. If there is a wall you can use, place your back against the wall.

No Walking.6349:

Nope, I play a ranger. And you obviously don’t know how to kill thieves otherwise you wouldn’t be here QQing about it. Also, you do know that other MMOs have it to where they can stealth all the time right…. You just need to get better.

“Nope, I currently play the most OP dueling class in this game and have no problem killing most other professions.”

Well good for you skippy. Only, I highly doubt your claim because as a Thief you can easily run from a Ranger. I out run Rangers on my Warrior/Thief/Elementalist/Guardian(sometimes)/Mesmer (due to stealth).

You need to play another class and see if it is your skill carrying or the class (<— way more likely).

Vanthian.9267:

Doomdesire.9365:

Arganthium.5638:

So why don’t you duel me in-game with a thief, and then we can see how little skill they require?

I’ll also be willing to accept this challenge. Any thief vs my guardian.

Never really lost a 1v1 against one, and I 1v1 alot.

Again, you fail to realize the point of the thread. Even if we did duel, I could easily stealth away and deprive you of the kill very easily or if you are not as good as you claim I would kill you.

A) You would not kill me

B) If you run away I still win

Winning isn’t making someone get repair bills. It’s knowing you outplayed them.

Jumper.9482:

Well, if you want to live in your own ignorant little world, that’s fine.
I’m just trying to help you l2p.
To think I was even nice enough to reply to a post complaining about how OP Stealth/Shadow Arts is…

Not ignorant, and it is obvious that it is unbalanced. No one wants to admit it because they don’t’ want to see it go. I didn’t say it was OP, maybe if you actually read and understand what the thread you wouldn’t feel this way. Best of luck.

Doomdesire.9365:

A) You would not kill me

B) If you run away I still win

Winning isn’t making someone get repair bills. It’s knowing you outplayed them.

A) You assume a lot, over confidence does not equate skill.

B) False, it is a tie if you run. If no one dies, no one wins.

Vanthian.9267:

Doomdesire.9365:

A) You would not kill me

B) If you run away I still win

Winning isn’t making someone get repair bills. It’s knowing you outplayed them.

A) You assume a lot, over confidence does not equate skill.

B) False, it is a tie if you run. If no one dies, no one wins.

A) Then 1v1 and we will find out

B) Seems we have a different definition of winning then. You also don’t seem the get the design of ‘thief’. Now say it again out loud ‘thief’. What does a thief do? Attack, steal, then get away

Doomdesire.9365:

Then you prevent that by dodging the CnD. It’s extremely noticeable. Also, all melee thieves are going for one target when they stealth – your back. Knowing this you can predict where the thief will attempt to move in order to land the backstab. If you are an AoE heavy class, AoEs are your feet work well. If you are a melee, your auto attack rotation is an indicator of wether you hit them or not. Guardians and Warriors also have blocks. If there is a wall you can use, place your back against the wall.

Again, I am not complaining about losing. The skill is cheap and they dont’ have to be on you to stealth. Thieves have multiple avenues of stealth (why do I need to explain this to thieves?).

Thieves also have quite a few unblock able attacks. Your newly buffed 3 on sword is a great example.

There is not always a wall and I shouldn’t be forced into a certain fighting style to face one profession. That shows bad balanced and design. I should be able to use my skills wisely to counter as the fight goes on not rely on terrain to win. Is it nice to be able to use the terrain? Yes, but I should not be forced into using it to win.

Doomdesire.9365:

A) Then 1v1 and we will find out

B) Seems we have a different definition of winning then. You also don’t seem the get the design of ‘thief’. Now say it again out loud ‘thief’. What does a thief do? Attack, steal, then get away

It seems you are fine having a poorly designed class in the game. Stealth is a fail mechanic in most games. The main type of people who play these classes do it because they know they are easier to play due to stealth.

Edit: Oh, to the dodging the CnD (if you ever run into those Thieves any more)… even if you dodge it, they still have plenty of other options to stealth. This will not magically make them vulnerable by dodging one attack.

Vanthian.9267:

No Walking.6349:

Nope, I play a ranger. And you obviously don’t know how to kill thieves otherwise you wouldn’t be here QQing about it. Also, you do know that other MMOs have it to where they can stealth all the time right…. You just need to get better.

“Nope, I currently play the most OP dueling class in this game and have no problem killing most other professions.”

Well good for you skippy. Only, I highly doubt your claim because as a Thief you can easily run from a Ranger. I out run Rangers on my Warrior/Thief/Elementalist/Guardian(sometimes)/Mesmer (due to stealth).

You need to play another class and see if it is your skill carrying or the class (<— way more likely).

Ranger is an OP class? Thieves are impossible to kill? My god man you really need to learn how to play this game.

Vanthian.9267:

Doomdesire.9365:

Then you prevent that by dodging the CnD. It’s extremely noticeable. Also, all melee thieves are going for one target when they stealth – your back. Knowing this you can predict where the thief will attempt to move in order to land the backstab. If you are an AoE heavy class, AoEs are your feet work well. If you are a melee, your auto attack rotation is an indicator of wether you hit them or not. Guardians and Warriors also have blocks. If there is a wall you can use, place your back against the wall.

Again, I am not complaining about losing. The skill is cheap and they dont’ have to be on you to stealth. Thieves have multiple avenues of stealth (why do I need to explain this to thieves?).

Thieves also have quite a few unblock able attacks. Your newly buffed 3 on sword is a great example.

There is not always a wall and I shouldn’t be forced into a certain fighting style to face one profession. That shows bad balanced and design. I should be able to use my skills wisely to counter as the fight goes on not rely on terrain to win. Is it nice to be able to use the terrain? Yes, but I should not be forced into using it to win.

By multiple avenues of stealth outside dodgeable CnD you mean

Hide in shadows – A thief who wastes his hide in shadows without needing to heal is setting himself up for disaster
Blinding Powder – 3s stealth on a 40s cooldown
Shadow Refuge – Generally the thief’s escape tool, shadow refuge is often used when you need to GTFO out of there.

Realistically speaking, blinding powder is the only reliable stealth outside of CnD on an offhand dagger thief that reliable as “other avenues of stealth” when we’re talking about offensively landing a backstab.

No Walking.6349:

Ranger is an OP class? Thieves are impossible to kill? My god man you really need to learn how to play this game.

You are either blind or illiterate. Rangers are currently the best duelist class in game. Not many people will argue against this fact.

Yes Thieves choose to fight or run with ease. Does this make them great? No, it makes them cheap. The point of this thread is to highlight this fact, which it does well considering no one has actually offered a decent counter argument.

Vanthian.9267:

No Walking.6349:

Ranger is an OP class? Thieves are impossible to kill? My god man you really need to learn how to play this game.

You are either blind or illiterate. Rangers are currently the best duelist class in game. Not many people will argue against this fact.

Yes Thieves choose to fight or run with ease. Does this make them great? No, it makes them cheap. The point of this thread is to highlight this fact, which it does well considering no one has actually offered a decent counter argument.

I’m guessing you play a warrior eh? Can’t think of any other reason someone would claim to be unable to beat rangers and thieves lol.

Vanthian.9267:

No Walking.6349:

Ranger is an OP class? Thieves are impossible to kill? My god man you really need to learn how to play this game.

You are either blind or illiterate. Rangers are currently the best duelist class in game. Not many people will argue against this fact.

Yes Thieves choose to fight or run with ease. Does this make them great? No, it makes them cheap. The point of this thread is to highlight this fact, which it does well considering no one has actually offered a decent counter argument.

People have, you just brush it off and ignore any evidence by insulting the people who provide some.

Doomdesire.9365:

By multiple avenues of stealth outside dodgeable CnD you mean

Hide in shadows – A thief who wastes his hide in shadows without needing to heal is setting himself up for disaster
Blinding Powder – 3s stealth on a 40s cooldown
Shadow Refuge – Generally the thief’s escape tool, shadow refuge is often used when you need to GTFO out of there.

Realistically speaking, blinding powder is the only reliable stealth outside of CnD on an offhand dagger thief that reliable as “other avenues of stealth” when we’re talking about offensively landing a backstab.

Again, you are wrong. There are more stealth than what you listed and trying to sway a argument with false claims is bad practice.

Just to name a few more:
Blackpowder+Heartseeker
Smokescreen+Cluster Bomb
Steal (when traited)
Many traits…..

As stated… They have multiple avenues.

Please learn the class.

Vanthian.9267:

Please learn the class.

You learn the class….you’re the only one qqing about them lol. All of us here are fine at killing thieves. Maybe you should go roll one

Doomdesire.9365:

People have, you just brush it off and ignore any evidence by insulting the people who provide some.

The only thing close to trying to discuss the opposite is the comment where they said “Put your back against the wall”. Even then, that is a 0.000001 millimeter thick argument.

If anything this helps prove the fact further that stealth is a cheap ability if you are forced to fight near towers/keeps/hills just in to combat it. Also, in reality this will do nothing to hamper the Thieves ability to stealth or do damage (it is bad advice in general).

Assuming this thread is for trolling and fun, 5/10. You ranted on too long and probably should have went to general forum so more people would have seen this.

If you are 100% serious and believe in your “balance” changes then I have 2 things to say and that will sum up just how uh… smart and well thought out… your answers are.

1. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OX5Fcd8syp8

2. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTufHU5eQQE

cheapest thread
play thief please or just leave this place

No Walking.6349:

Vanthian.9267:

Please learn the class.

You learn the class….you’re the only one qqing about them lol. All of us here are fine at killing thieves. Maybe you should go roll one

I have one (rarely play it because it is a cheap class), and I doubt the majority of people who have commented can kill a decent Thief 1v1. Anyone can boast big on forums while the point of forums is to discuss the class itself.

The point of this discuss (again) is that stealth is a bad class ability that requires 0 skill to use effectively with its affect always being the same on the battle no matter who it is used by. All other professions are at least player centric and not solely relying on the profession itself.

Vanthian.9267:

Doomdesire.9365:

By multiple avenues of stealth outside dodgeable CnD you mean

Hide in shadows – A thief who wastes his hide in shadows without needing to heal is setting himself up for disaster
Blinding Powder – 3s stealth on a 40s cooldown
Shadow Refuge – Generally the thief’s escape tool, shadow refuge is often used when you need to GTFO out of there.

Realistically speaking, blinding powder is the only reliable stealth outside of CnD on an offhand dagger thief that reliable as “other avenues of stealth” when we’re talking about offensively landing a backstab.

Again, you are wrong. There are more stealth than what you listed and trying to sway a argument with false claims is bad practice.

Just to name a few more:
Blackpowder+Heartseeker
Smokescreen+Cluster Bomb
Steal (when traited)
Many traits…..

As stated… They have multiple avenues.

Please learn the class.

Which of these besides BP+HS(Too powerful, I agree on that) is of any real use?

Smokescreen + clusterbomb, you mean the auto reveal if your target is anywhere close to the smokescreen with half a brain?

Steal on stealth, you mean the broken trait that even without autoattack has a 50/50 chance of auto revealing you?

I have >1300 hours in WvW. Out of all those hours, I’ve seen maybe two thieves use SS +CB combo, and maybe 5 who have used the stealth granting steal trait. They aren’t reliable. Not nearly as much as the stealth you can gain from BP/SR even shadow trap

Yeah, you should go practice against some thieves bud, you’re way too angry at them. They’re a very balanced class.

Wow. Haven’t seen a rant post of this caliber in a while. And completely entrenched in his perception, unwilling to explore different perspectives to boot.
I’m just gonna say you’re wrong. You don’t see thieves dominating anything but solo roaming in WvW, and even then, there’s plenty of players that can handle them, especially with survivability becoming the Meta of WvW. Thieves are considered on the low end in PvE, Dungeons, Sieges and TPvP.

Reduktion.5791:

cheapest thread
play thief please or just leave this place

You have the fear of stealth nerf. I have a thief and it doesn’t change the fact stealth is cheap.

Vanthian.9267:

Doomdesire.9365:

People have, you just brush it off and ignore any evidence by insulting the people who provide some.

The only thing close to trying to discuss the opposite is the comment where they said “Put your back against the wall”. Even then, that is a 0.000001 millimeter thick argument.

If anything this helps prove the fact further that stealth is a cheap ability if you are forced to fight near towers/keeps/hills just in to combat it. Also, in reality this will do nothing to hamper the Thieves ability to stealth or do damage (it is bad advice in general).

So basically it’s an argument if you say it’s an argument? I guess you have no clue as to what an argument is.

I not agree and disagree with you, so here’s my two cents.

• Do not increase the revealed debuff, but make it so it appears every time I’m leaving stealth – even if the thief isn’t attacking.
• Make any physical attack remove stealth. (Not AoE) if this is going to happen, then they must let stealth break channeled skills.
• Make it so stealth doesn’t stack. This will fix the D/P bandwagon and make it much more challenging to play.
• Set a cool down on Shadows Embrace (10 seconds). I agree that being able to remove two conditions (if 15 deep in Shadow Arts) every 3 seconds is too strong. But any more than 10 seconds to cleanse one condition upon entering stealth is better. We are, after all, suppose to be weak against conditions, but as it is now we are not…

One more thing: We are the weakest class if jumped, therefore we have the ability to take out our enemy fast with a high burst. We’re suppose to be the sneakiest, most slippery and deceptive class. We got blinds, evades, shadow step and stealth to survive. We are suppose to chose when to enter combat. Any good thief will analyze the enemy before attacking, finding the weakest link and eliminate it

Dual.8953:

Wow. Haven’t seen a rant post of this caliber in a while. And completely entrenched in his perception, unwilling to explore different perspectives to boot.
I’m just gonna say you’re wrong. You don’t see thieves dominating anything but solo roaming in WvW, and even then, there’s plenty of players that can handle them, especially with survivability becoming the Meta of WvW. Thieves are considered on the low end in PvE, Dungeons, Sieges and TPvP.

That is true, they are low scale professions because they can bring little to a group other than massive stealth (and some sub par venoms’).

The point of the post is not calling the profession “OP” or amazing in anyway. I am clearly calling out the developers choice on adding a very bad stealth design to the class. It does nothing but lower the profession to a level of unskilled play that revolves around abusing this ability (which has no true counter in this game from another profession).

Geiir.7603:

I not agree and disagree with you, so here’s my two cents.

• Do not increase the revealed debuff, but make it so it appears every time I’m leaving stealth – even if the thief isn’t attacking.
• Make any physical attack remove stealth. (Not AoE) if this is going to happen, then they must let stealth break channeled skills.
• Make it so stealth doesn’t stack. This will fix the D/P bandwagon and make it much more challenging to play.
• Set a cool down on Shadows Embrace (10 seconds). I agree that being able to remove two conditions (if 15 deep in Shadow Arts) every 3 seconds is too strong. But any more than 10 seconds to cleanse one condition upon entering stealth is better. We are, after all, suppose to be weak against conditions, but as it is now we are not…

One more thing: We are the weakest class if jumped, therefore we have the ability to take out our enemy fast with a high burst. We’re suppose to be the sneakiest, most slippery and deceptive class. We got blinds, evades, shadow step and stealth to survive. We are suppose to chose when to enter combat. Any good thief will analyze the enemy before attacking, finding the weakest link and eliminate it

I would take these changes as they would at least add some level of depth to the play. But I still disagree with the design behind stealth. If they truly want to keep it in this game they need to make it so other professions can have the tools to revel stealth-ed opponents at least once every 5 minutes.

I guess I’ll go make a post on the mesmer forums then…
MOA FORM IS OP!
It’s uncounterable once I let it hit me the mesmer just kills me!
(Just ignore the fact that I let it hit me in the first place)

Doomdesire.9365:

So basically it’s an argument if you say it’s an argument? I guess you have no clue as to what an argument is.

No, I understand what the thread is about, while you have been swinging around at a “stealth” thread.

(that is a pun encase you missed it).

If these changes went through every single thief would go s/d evasion build and stealth builds would be dead.

LOL @ noobs who QQ!

Jumper.9482:

I guess I’ll go make a post on the mesmer forums then…
MOA FORM IS OP!
It’s uncounterable once I let it hit me the mesmer just kills me!
(Just ignore the fact that I let it hit me in the first place)

Moa form is also a very cheap skill but not what this forum is about. Also, if you looked up on the game updates and SOTG they mentioned changes to Moa Form due to the cheapness of it.

Thieves also have quite a few unblock able attacks. Your newly buffed 3 on sword is a great example.
There is not always a wall and I shouldn’t be forced into a certain fighting style to face one profession. That shows bad balanced and design. I should be able to use my skills wisely to counter as the fight goes on not rely on terrain to win. Is it nice to be able to use the terrain? Yes, but I should not be forced into using it to win.

This is filled with so much fail I am having a hard time deciding where to start…

Sword/dagger 3 is unblockable on the 2nd strike but doesn’t give stealth… you know, the thing you’re complaining about. If they use this skill from stealth, they aren’t using their stealth attacks and are either out of initiative or are out a utility skill. Being out that utility skill really helps to make sure a thief won’t be able to run away nearly as easily and have probably just lost their “oh shi” button. And if you are blocking, that thief won’t be able to land their stealth strike anyways.

You’re seriously coming onto the thief forum to complain about how op thieves are then a few posts down you blatantly say you don’t want to do counter-play against a thief. And you wonder why people say L2P and laugh off your post.
Geese I sure hope they remove block and confusion because they are sooo op. I don’t want to stop attacking or not blow all my skills when the other guy is blocking/I’m filled with confusion. It’s especially bs when they use skills like chaos storm or symbols.

I shouldn’t be forced into a certain fighting style to face one profession. That shows bad balanced and design. I should be able to use my skills wisely to counter as the fight goes on not rely on terrain to win. Is it nice to be able to use the terrain? Yes, but I should not be forced into using it to win.

It’s so nice when you can directly quote half of someone’s post to let them know just how terrible their logic sounds.

Vanthian.9267:

Doomdesire.9365:

So basically it’s an argument if you say it’s an argument? I guess you have no clue as to what an argument is.

No, I understand what the thread is about, while you have been swinging around at a “stealth” thread.

(that is a pun encase you missed it).

So this is not a thread about the “cheapness” of stealth? Are you sure about that? Because it sure seems like one to me

Also

Definition of argument = “An exchange of diverging or opposite views”

Learn what an argument is before you comment about it.

randomfightfan.4091:

This is filled with so much fail I am having a hard time deciding where to start…

Sword/dagger 3 is unblockable on the 2nd strike but doesn’t give stealth… you know, the thing you’re complaining about. If they use this skill from stealth, they aren’t using their stealth attacks and are either out of initiative or are out a utility skill. Being out that utility skill really helps to make sure a thief won’t be able to run away nearly as easily and have probably just lost their “oh shi” button. And if you are blocking, that thief won’t be able to land their stealth strike anyways.

You’re seriously coming onto the thief forum to complain about how op thieves are then a few posts down you blatantly say you don’t want to do counter-play against a thief. And you wonder why people say L2P and laugh off your post.
Geese I sure hope they remove block and confusion because they are sooo op. I don’t want to stop attacking or not blow all my skills when the other guy is blocking/I’m filled with confusion. It’s especially bs when they use skills like chaos storm or symbols.

I shouldn’t be forced into a certain fighting style to face one profession. That shows bad balanced and design. I should be able to use my skills wisely to counter as the fight goes on not rely on terrain to win. Is it nice to be able to use the terrain? Yes, but I should not be forced into using it to win.

It’s so nice when you can directly quote half of someone’s post to let them know just how terrible their logic sounds.

You also failed to read the post. I have neither said Thieves are “OP” nor that they are to strong and need to be nerfed. I also never said their sword 3 stealth them, in fact in the quote you linked it clearly states it is just a unblock able attack ( I failed to mention it also steals boons).

Also, most of you mock because you are completely missing the point. I do nothing but write you off when you try to “troll” (as you put it) with fluff of “L2P”. The issues is not a L2P issue. The issue is the decision to add stealth to the most mobile and evasion class in the game. Stealth is cheap on its own, but adding the later two in with it takes it to a new level. This is why I said, “Thieves can choose who they fight and when they fight. They can also easily run from any fight.” (not word for word, but very similar).

Edit: Just notice to later of your post….

If by logic you are talking about what you are using, then I believe we have a problem. To use logic you actually have to read and understand what the post is about before commenting, which you obviously have not done. Secondly, the point I made stands. A class should not be forced into use terrain advantages to stand a chance to win, instead a thing called “player skill” (I know this is a foreign concept to you) should determine the match.

Jumper.9482:

By all means, go ahead and rant. I find it amusing.
No one (other than Cruuk) uses Shadow Arts. It’s a pretty sub-par traitline lol.

That’s really wrong. In sPvP the SA trait line is pretty useless if you intend to cap anything. But in the current meta of WvW it’s the strongest trait line for the thief.

Doomdesire.9365:

So this is not a thread about the “cheapness” of stealth? Are you sure about that? Because it sure seems like one to me

Also

Definition of argument = “An exchange of diverging or opposite views”

Learn what an argument is before you comment about it.

I am glad you can use google. Now if you could fine the opposite view that actually stands a counter point then I would be happy to converse.

Vanthian.9267:

Jumper.9482:

Actually, there is plenty of play/counter play to entering stealth.
There is Dagger offhand (rarely used) Cloak and Dagger which is a huge tell and dodge/interruptible with a HUGE initiative cost.
There is Thief stolen ability and Hide in Shadows(heal) which both have obvious animations and easily interruptable.
There’s the D/P Black Powder Heartseeker which is again, interruptible and extremely easy to read.
And there’s the most easy of all to counter, Shadow refuge, aka. knock him out of the circle or just kill him.

The only “uncounterable” stealth a thief has is Blinding Powder, a 40sec cd utility noone uses.

There is no counter to stealth. Once they are stealth, that is it. They will only be reveled once they hit something (choose to come out) or the stealth runs out (3 seconds/4 seconds (most thievies)/ or the annoying 16 seconds). None of these things are negative and prove there is 0 skilled play that can counter someone in stealth. The best you can do is guess which way he went and swing in the air.

He just explained to you…that, and how? I don’t understand, its right there in front of you. Seriously, I think this ONE guys takes up about 70% of the ignorance on the internet.