Guild Wars 2

someone said damage is equal on both. is that really true?

it feels like staff does more damage to me.

here’s some input from MasterBlaster.6827
I found this after I opened topic

So, D/D compared to staff:

D/D: (Dodge), CnD, BS, 1 autochain
t: 3,97s
coefficient: 6,16

Staff: (Dodge), WCx2, 1 autochain
t: 3,94s
coefficient: 6,72

Both rotations take the same time, but they are not completely sustainable (running out of initiative).

Since we have two different weapons and different traits we have to correct these coefficients now:

D/D: Revealed training: approx 6% modifier
Staff: Staff Master 10%; Staff weapon dmg/Dagger weapon dmg = 1,1

corrected coefficient:
D/D: 6,44
Staff: 8,62
—> Staff approx. 26% more dmg, meaning you only need to hit more than 1,8/3 WC to have more dmg than D/D.

Slower rotations slightly favor D/D, but still lead to a difference of about 22%.

This where just some fast estimations, there might be some errors in it, if you find them pls tell me

Nike explains when which is better. I think his conclusion is the D/D will be better in most scenarios since the DPS of staff hinges on landing all 3 hits of WC.

Neither are completely sustainable, however if we move away from the numbers and think about what happens in practise, you’re not going to be able to just execute that rotation over and over without doing SOMETHING else, whether it’s moving out of an AoE/avoiding an attack or helping the team with a raid mechanic etc. Even moving away for a couple of seconds will almost put you back to the beginning with your initiative and endurance can easily be sustained with Endurance Thief + Channeled Vigor if Staff Master doesn’t give you enough even in long rotation phases.

It’s not difficult at all to land all 3 hits of WC. If you can’t be bothered to learn positioning, then go for D/D because it will be better for you.

Also bear in mind that Revealed Training will only affect the autoattacks as CnD + Backstab cannot be used while Revealed. Staff Master will affect all attacks during its rotation.

I have compared the DPS somehow (miserably though). Nike took 30 secs for 2 golem kills.

Staff (only WC with steal and vault when available)

Without fist flurry: 25-25.5 seconds
With fist flurry: 23.5 seconds ~

D/D (nike rotation)

With Fist flurry: 27 seconds
Without Fist flurry: 29.5 seconds

Note: i’m not really familiar with D/D, so my rotation is a bit flawed, also staff adds 8-12 stacks vuln

Why doesn’t Nike use fist flurry? It has additional stun, DPS and vuln.

any comment? so far I think my bias, that DnT are a bunch of people who actually have no idea what they’re talking about, was rtight

assassin.7895:

any comment? so far I think my bias, that DnT are a bunch of people who actually have no idea what they’re talking about, was rtight

You’re not far off, nor the only one who feels that way tbh.

I’ve never liked them displaying themselves as all knowing, and setting the ‘meta’ as they see fit (because sheeple love following their guides due to lazyness), because all I’ve seen that do is create a very poor dungeon/fractal community.

They’ve been wrong about a lot of things, not just this recent D/D vs Staff DPS discussion. However, because of the sheeple effect, majority of the community takes their words as gospel and all that results in is negativity when someone is not playing what was suggested by them.

I would personally like them to keep their ‘meta’ guides to themselves. I’ve said this numerous times before, but I think it’s best for the community’s health.

Having said that, I agree that staff is better at DPS than D/D, however, that gap get closer once a target is below 25% HP…but, that also means with Staff you get to that 25% faster than with D/D. So, optimal usage would be Staff and then D/D on swap if you really want that. However, none of this takes into account that Staff is actually very lackluster with skill 3, and especially skill 4. ANet needs to seriously address those 2 skills, especially 4.

Ya I posted my thoughts on Nike’s vid concerning Staff DD here

Personally I think it’s very short sighted. I agree skills 3 & 4 could use some attention, but not more so than core thief… and the record repeats.