Guild Wars 2

I have about 19.8k hp and 1.5k thoughness:

http://img6.imagebanana.com/img/xaumkvpz/thiefgw2.png

My only words:
http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/10130415.jpg

Turn around. Backstab just did half its normal damage. You’re welcome.

And 1.5k toughness isn’t really massive amounts… I have almost that much without stacking for it at all.

How should i turn around? He spawns instant behind me in the middle of nowhere and after 0.5s im dead.
hoho

1.5k toughness? My hamster has more than that.

Though you and my hamster share the inability to dodge, clearly. How you don’t see someone coming in such a confined area is beyond me.

I see, im in the wrong forum. Shouldnt have post it in the thief forum…

If what you’re looking for is blind bandwagon support from other people who don’t understand the thief class, then yes, you posted in the wrong forum.

No, it’s right to complain about such burst damage. Those posters above clearly don’t know about the CnD + Steal combo which instantly shadowsteps you to the target and cloaks you. There’s no avoiding that burst damage, especially not when combined with Basilisk Venom and the + damage Singet.

I can’t justify such damage. All I can say is that there seems to be a clear discrepancy between the power of offensive stats vs. the power of defensive ones.

Ergo, Toughness especially doesn’t seem to do enough to mitigate the insane damage boosts provided by the other stats.

1.5k toughness is nothing. Steal has a range of 900, which means you should easily be able to see the thief coming and then dodge out of the way before you get combo’d to death. I’ve yet to die to a backstab thief and it’s not because they haven’t tried.

And some classes have extra ways to avoid damage taken, such as shield warrior. Either way if you somehow manage to get stabbed IN THE BACK you deserve taking double damage.

Edit not working, woo.

One more thing, Axe/Shield warriors can hit a 1.5k toughnes target for 8-9k and it hardly involves setting anything up. They have less mobility, but more survivability and it’s harder to anticipate. And even then, greatsword+axe/shield is like… lol.

Sure u can justify it’s ok if u deal that much damage cause the other op burst class do nearly same, nice try.

I don’t consider warriors OP, no. Haste/quickness is a broken mechanic which makes everything OP (Pistol whip, heartseeker, 100 blades) but overall the class is fine. It’s just that necro’s/elementalists/engineers are sort of weak, everything else is okay when it comes to balance. And when I say okay I mean it’s not perfect, but it works.

Lorithias.2873:

Sure u can justify it’s ok if u deal that much damage cause the other op burst class do nearly same, nice try.

I swear, every rogue/assassin/thief class featured in any MMO has a wonderful following of tear stained cheeks relentlessly QQing in our wake.

We’re thieves, borderline ninjas, murderous assassins, etc etc. Everyone wants to cry and moan about how OP we are because we can “assassinate” other players. Tell me what exactly would the thief bring to the table without damage? We don’t have a whole lot of support abilities, especially if we’re not traited properly. If you take a look at our weapon skills, utility skills, and traits, you’ll notice as a thief our entire existence revolves around chewing on faces.

Instead of whining about how OP thieves are and how life is so hard and unfair, maybe it’d help to try and step up your game. I could go on and on about how ridiculously “OP” I think mesmers are, which I don’t anyway, but instead I acknowledge a difficult match up and try to devise tactics to overcome the challenge.

Humorless.1573:

Either way if you somehow manage to get stabbed IN THE BACK you deserve taking double damage.

^ A thousand times this. If I can get within 30 feet of you without you noticing me and shove a dagger into your spine, that’s your own fault.

^Issue with that is you know when they go stealth, you not just going to turn around and “HA” Cause then all they would just have to do is wait for you to turn around. There is zero counter to it. If I’m hitting you, (Like most MMOS) Usually they shouldn’t be able to return to stealth.

Well, all of that didnt happen at once because steal is on a 45 second cooldown… the theif stole from a warrior right which is his highest dps spin, hes specced glass cannon and hes probably used up assassins signet too.

This means he can do this once every 45 seconds. There are numerous counters to backstab, these include blind and aegis…

How is there zero counter options? Dodge out of the way. Use swiftness and run. They’re in stealth and they’re going to walk to your backside, you know -exactly- where they are and you can get away from it easily.

lets not talk about mesmers.. im a P/D speced for stealth and sneak attack with venom life steal… my whole spec is around stealthing and unloading with sneak attack… and a mesmer can stealth more than i can… not to mention blinking around making them hard to catch… not to mention their illusions dealing tons of damage, and stupid confusion…

so yeah when a class can out stealth, out blink a thief.. deal with our back-stab damage, but really… it not hard to not die to a back-stab thief, dodge the steal and make them waste quickness and then proceed to destroy them as all they can do is auto-attack you, they cant even dodge…

on a side note.. 1.5k toughness is really low, i have 1800 and all i have is undead runes and speced into shadow arts.. just because you spec into your toughness tree dosn’t give you mass toughness

oh and i agree, quickness is the problem.. not the thief class itself

Deathpope.6253:

lets not talk about mesmers.. im a P/D speced for stealth and sneak attack with venom life steal… my whole spec is around stealthing and unloading with sneak attack… and a mesmer can stealth more than i can… not to mention blinking around making them hard to catch… not to mention their illusions dealing tons of damage, and stupid confusion…

so yeah when a class can out stealth, out blink a thief.. deal with our back-stab damage, but really… it not hard to not die to a back-stab thief, dodge the steal and make them waste quickness and then proceed to destroy them as all they can do is auto-attack you, they cant even dodge…

on a side note.. 1.5k toughness is really low, i have 1800 and all i have is undead runes and speced into shadow arts.. just because you spec into your toughness tree dosn’t give you mass toughness

oh and i agree, quickness is the problem.. not the thief class itself

why is a backstab build using quickness…..

for the heart-seeker spam that comes after the backstab…..

Shomaruki.7395:

^Issue with that is you know when they go stealth, you not just going to turn around and “HA” Cause then all they would just have to do is wait for you to turn around. There is zero counter to it. If I’m hitting you, (Like most MMOS) Usually they shouldn’t be able to return to stealth.

Okay, here’s some tips from an 80 thief, about thieves, to you regarding stealth:

*All stealth lasts for 2-3 seconds by default and 3-4 seconds if traited into, not including Shadow Refuge.
*A thief cannot return to stealth for roughly 2-3 seconds immediately upon exiting stealth, this is the thief’s stealth cooldown.
*A thief can chain stealth, this means he can activate another stealth ability before his initial stealth wears off to refresh his current stealth duration. This doesn’t mean he can stack stealth durations, it essentially means the thief can re-stealth without triggering his stealth cooldown.
*Shadow Refuge is the only thief ability that allows a thief to be stealthed for longer than 3-4 seconds with a single ability. To do this, the thief must stand in the Shadow Refuge for it’s duration. If the thief leaves the Shadow Refuge before it’s duration is complete, he is immediately revealed, unless he chain stealths out of it.
*Stealing will only confer 2-3 seconds of stealth if traited into, otherwise no stealth is conferred to the thief.
*Generally, if a thief is approaching you and vanishes from sight, odds are he is maneuvering to backstab you or just used Steal and is already behind you. A good idea, for either likelihood, is to dodge and keep distance between yourself and where you presume the thief to be.
*If you activate a channeled ability, ranger Rapid Fire for example, and a thief goes into stealth during the ability, he’s still being targeted and hit by your ability if he’s within range. I personally find this ridiculous and gawd awful annoying, but that’s how it works currently.

There you have it, now there’s no excuse.

Knyx.5926:

why is a backstab build using quickness…..

Deathpope.6253:

for the heart-seeker spam that comes after the backstab…..

Quickness is good for any build IMO, being able to significantly boost your dps is rarely a bad thing. Also, unless you’re under 50% health, you have nothing to fear from Heartseeker spam anymore. Of course, if you just got backstabbed by a one trick pony… well yeah, sucks to be you. xD

^ this post all the way… also cc breaks are really useful against bas venom

Cyric.7485:

Knyx.5926:

why is a backstab build using quickness…..

Deathpope.6253:

for the heart-seeker spam that comes after the backstab…..

Quickness is good for any build IMO, being able to significantly boost your dps is rarely a bad thing. Also, unless you’re under 50% health, you have nothing to fear from Heartseeker spam anymore. Of course, if you just got backstabbed by a one trick pony… well yeah, sucks to be you. xD

Im gonna have to disagree. The 60 sec cooldown for 4 seconds of quickness is not worth it on a backstab build. A stealth utility or a shadowstep utility is 10x more useful in its spot for a backstab build. Heck id take caltrops in a backstab build over haste

Knyx.5926:

Im gonna have to disagree. The 60 sec cooldown for 4 seconds of quickness is not worth it on a backstab build. A stealth utility or a shadowstep utility is 10x more useful in its spot for a backstab build. Heck id take caltrops in a backstab build over haste

For a backstab build, I agree it’s not the most optimal choice since backstab is your main source of damage. All I’m saying is it isn’t the worst choice of skills for that particular type of build. Before I put together my stealth build, I was running a straight up eat your face and fashion your teeth into a necklace build focusing on power and critical strikes… I’ve ended many fights (100% health to 0% health) before that 4 seconds of quickness has expired, don’t underestimate the power of quickness on any thief.

so you do insane damage every 45 secs with signet/backstab… then what spam HS .. and get destroyed because you have no toughness and they can dodge all your HS.. the reason for quickness is to destroy a target before they even know your there, without quickness they can easily dodge HS, and your screwed if your backstab dosn’t 1 shot them

all in all.. backstab builds are pretty much useless in WvW.. as any level 80 player has enough health and toughness to survive the burst. I’ve been killed by a backstab thief once.. and i had no cool-downs or heal to counter the burst, ive been killed by alot more Quickness / HS thiefs as that damage is hard to get away from.

Deathpope.6253:

so you do insane damage every 45 secs with signet/backstab… then what spam HS .. and get destroyed because you have no toughness and they can dodge all your HS.. the reason for quickness is to destroy a target before they even know your there, without quickness they can easily dodge HS, and your screwed if your backstab dosn’t 1 shot them

This is probably why even my Backstab/stealth build isn’t so heavily reliant on Backstabs success If you think like a 1 trick pony, your playstyle will be 1 trick pony

not sure what the point of this post is.

are you asking for advice on how to fight against Backstab Thieves?

what do you want us to say exactly? yes, Thief does have effective single target burst damage. Sometimes you will die to it without knowing what hit you. Thats the point. Its not like we can do it back-to-back or against more than one target. Its a team game after all. Try relying on your teammates.

Knyx.5926:

Deathpope.6253:

so you do insane damage every 45 secs with signet/backstab… then what spam HS .. and get destroyed because you have no toughness and they can dodge all your HS.. the reason for quickness is to destroy a target before they even know your there, without quickness they can easily dodge HS, and your screwed if your backstab dosn’t 1 shot them

This is probably why even my Backstab/stealth build isn’t so heavily reliant on Backstabs success If you think like a 1 trick pony, your playstyle will be 1 trick pony

the name of the build is backstab.. its your main source of damage, you have no condition damage or toughness, your only option is to kill the target before he and his team kills you.. which is done by backstab and HS spam into stealth.. no way your playing any different than this

I will say again If you think like a 1 trick pony, your playstyle will be 1 trick pony.
So the answer to your question is: actually I am playing different then that

I will say again If you think like a 1 trick pony, your playstyle will be 1 trick pony.
So the answer to your question is: actually I am playing different then that

please enlighten us on how different your play-style is then

Its is simple.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/en/?fYAQNAoaVlUmKOHfy0E95Ex2DfKUiypIpIVTBNbJA;ToAg0U1YqRUjtGXNyaWgMsYOB

I also take 10 out of deadly arts and put it into trickery for Instinctual response based on if I am doing w3 as well as switch out skale venom for signet of shadows.

It all depends if you are in a position where you need to use steal to get to the target and stealth or not (but on a crit build with mug and sigil of Air/Fire you can get upwards of 5k on that alone). So since it based on situation I will make it general: Stealth+Assassin signet+Backstab, Then skale venom and heartseeker.

(If skale venom is down use 3 #1 attacks and then hit Black powder. Heartseeker to the target and backstab again. I usually use this on the the second target, if there is one, after the first is dead)

This actually has quite a bit of viability because you have blinding powder/black powder/SB and HiS all for getting away. You either have the target blinded or with weakness.

Sometimes if there are multiple targets after the initial backstab, I will immediately switch to shortbow freezing nearby targets then using disabling shot to back off and popping a cluster bomb if I am in a position to finish them off or choking gas if I want to weaken the group first.

Link doesnt work, FYI.

Thats because its too long for the forums just copy and paste it

Cyric.7485:

Lorithias.2873:

Sure u can justify it’s ok if u deal that much damage cause the other op burst class do nearly same, nice try.

I swear, every rogue/assassin/thief class featured in any MMO has a wonderful following of tear stained cheeks relentlessly QQing in our wake.

We’re thieves, borderline ninjas, murderous assassins, etc etc. Everyone wants to cry and moan about how OP we are because we can “assassinate” other players. Tell me what exactly would the thief bring to the table without damage? We don’t have a whole lot of support abilities, especially if we’re not traited properly. If you take a look at our weapon skills, utility skills, and traits, you’ll notice as a thief our entire existence revolves around chewing on faces.

We have plenty of support. But it, just like our damage, is designed to prey on players who are weakened or not paying attention. That’s our niche, and we do it well. If you’re at full strength and are paying attention to your surroundings, you’ll be able to either kill the thief or make him retreat.

@bwillb
I agree wholeheartedly, our purpose is to snuff out life. We’re the predators on the battlefield, if you’re not an ally, then you’re prey.