Guild Wars 2

Noss.4105:

I got hit by an unusually painful heartseeker today. As I’ve been on a break from GW for couple months, I thought something was changed about thieves. I however took a screenie of the combat log, as it was pretty hilarious how fast I dropped.

Note that the first C&D hit me for 6.2k, which still kept my 17,6k healthpool above 50%. 7,5k HS seems pretty high to 50%+ hp target.

Oh, I think I got around 2,6-2,7k armor.

That’s extraordinarily insane damage from a C&D. Even if you’re absolute glass, you shouldn’t be taking that much.

Noss.4105:

Geiir.7603:

Noss.4105:

I got hit by an unusually painful heartseeker today. As I’ve been on a break from GW for couple months, I thought something was changed about thieves. I however took a screenie of the combat log, as it was pretty hilarious how fast I dropped.

Note that the first C&D hit me for 6.2k, which still kept my 17,6k healthpool above 50%. 7,5k HS seems pretty high to 50%+ hp target.

Oh, I think I got around 2,6-2,7k armor.

You had 3 stacks of weakness from Cloak and Dagger, and burning from judges intervention. Both are conditions which means that he could deal 10% more damage from one trait. He also had over 6 initiative which gives him more damage.

If you had been below 25% hp he would have hit for far more than 7,5k. Creds to you for dodging his backstab, because that would probably have been devastating for you

You act like that’s normal. Before my small break I would’ve never been hit for that much with heartseeker, so something must be off. 7k+ for minimum damage on HS is too high, way too high.

I tried to explain how it can happen. But from my calculations you should have been below 50% hp for that damage to happen. Any other explanation can be that you had max stack of vulnerability, but I don’t think that’s the case. Are you sure you were above 50%?

Geiir.7603:

Noss.4105:

I got hit by an unusually painful heartseeker today. As I’ve been on a break from GW for couple months, I thought something was changed about thieves. I however took a screenie of the combat log, as it was pretty hilarious how fast I dropped.

Note that the first C&D hit me for 6.2k, which still kept my 17,6k healthpool above 50%. 7,5k HS seems pretty high to 50%+ hp target.

Oh, I think I got around 2,6-2,7k armor.

You had 3 stacks of weakness from Cloak and Dagger, and burning from judges intervention. Both are conditions which means that he could deal 10% more damage from one trait. He also had over 6 initiative which gives him more damage.

If you had been below 25% hp he would have hit for far more than 7,5k. Creds to you for dodging his backstab, because that would probably have been devastating for you

Also it was at night so he may have had 10% extra damage from sigil of night and another 5% damage from sigil of force

I don’t see what the problem is. He’s only asking if it’s a bug, not complaining or asking for nerfs or anything. Then again, this is typical of the thief community. Thief players have no interest in balance. In fact they wont be happy until they can do everything better than everyone. For the record, I main a thief. I think thieves have kittened amounts of stealth, and pathetically easy access to it. At the moment, thief is 90% cheese, 10% skill. I personally run a stealthless build (mostly stealthless. CnD). It requires actual skill instead of mindlessly spamming stealth for easy kills.

OP, do yourself a favor and avoid the thief forums. You wont find any form of intelligent life here.

Geiir.7603:

Any other explanation can be that you had max stack of vulnerability, but I don’t think that’s the case. Are you sure you were above 50%?

I started the “fight” at 100%, and that one C&D won’t bring me under 50% health. What you see in the combat log is the start of the fight.

Dunno if it’s a bug or some other weird stuff, but in any situation over 7k heartseekers are way too high. Gap closer, easy to land and leap finisher for mere 3 init. But that’s just my humble opinion.

Rome.3192:

Noss.4105:

I got hit by an unusually painful heartseeker today. As I’ve been on a break from GW for couple months, I thought something was changed about thieves. I however took a screenie of the combat log, as it was pretty hilarious how fast I dropped.

Note that the first C&D hit me for 6.2k, which still kept my 17,6k healthpool above 50%. 7,5k HS seems pretty high to 50%+ hp target.

Oh, I think I got around 2,6-2,7k armor.

That’s extraordinarily insane damage from a C&D. Even if you’re absolute glass, you shouldn’t be taking that much.

Nah, it’s typical damage against a light armor target that isn’t a bunker and doesn’t have protection.

OP, You’re looking at this the wrong way, I’ll try and explain why. Sorry this may end up long.

This game’s combat system is designed to promote active damage avoidance, not damage mitigation. This is why every character has the ability to dodge. Every character also has the ability to build for high burst damage.

Heartseeker, cloak and dagger, and backstab are all skills with a high base damage value. They are designed to be burst damage attacks. They will scale very high with other damage boosting traits, stats and boons. Regardless of your stats, they will hit hard. As burst skills, they are supposed to be avoided, not absorbed.

This isn’t the kind of game where you can turn yourself into a tank. You showed a video of you standing in one place, doing no dodges, attacks, or damage mitigation skills, taking damage from 4 attackers at once for about 20 seconds, without even any use of protection boon. This is impressive by itself, and yet you’re complaining about taking too much damage.

The protection boon on a character with base level of toughness, i.e. no added toughness stats, would provide as much, if not more damage reduction than your 3500+ toughness stats.

The toughness stat provides diminishing returns on how much damage mitigation it provides the higher you stack it. I had a quick look for a thread that goes into detail on it and found this from October 2012.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/warrior/Toughness-Power-theory-numbers

Going on to the heartseeker skill, and why it’s damage should not be nerfed.

When a thief puts all of their initiative into using multiple heartseeker’s, they are locking themselves into a 1 second obvious animation that gives them no evasion frames, and if queued up (by pressing 2 multiple times), the chain will continue, locking the thief into the multiple heartseeker animations until the thief runs out of initiative, regardless of if they try to dodge roll or use another weapon skill midway through. Basically, spamming heartseeker makes a thief vulnerable.

Here are some ways that your warrior can avoid a heartseeker spamming thief and leave them with no initiative (which means no access to weapon skills besides auto attack):

Dodge roll, dodge roll again, use whirlwind attack away from the thief, then use rush, again away from the direction of the thief.

Use shield block, then if necessary use endure pain. Watch repeated 0’s pop up.

Use throw bolas skill. Watch thief stand in one place, stuck in the heartseeker animation. If necessary, follow up with pin down if you have a longbow.

Chain stun/daze/knockdown attacks, or if you want to troll them, wait until they have just started the animation or heartseeker and interrupt it with a stun attack. The thief will still have spent initiative.

Use cripple skills, such as blade trail on GS, or throw axe on axe mainhand, and proceed to kite.

Hope this helps in some way.

Jakare.6807:

OP, You’re looking at this the wrong way, I’ll try and explain why. Sorry this may end up long.
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This isn’t the kind of game where you can turn yourself into a tank. You showed a video of you standing in one place, doing no dodges, attacks, or damage mitigation skills, taking damage from 4 attackers at once for about 20 seconds, without even any use of protection boon. This is impressive by itself, and yet you’re complaining about taking too much damage.
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No, what is impressible is that toughness seems broken; the build that I had was purely a tank. If I have a tank build that is receiving incredible hits then I might think there is some kind of bug with the toughness code.

Toughness baby build warrior comes to cry about heart seeker on thief forums because he cant into the active mitigation meta.

Absolutely beautiful!

Maybe you should go put on some zerker gear and learn how to actually play the game OP.

Hitman.5829:

Jakare.6807:

OP, You’re looking at this the wrong way, I’ll try and explain why. Sorry this may end up long.
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This isn’t the kind of game where you can turn yourself into a tank. You showed a video of you standing in one place, doing no dodges, attacks, or damage mitigation skills, taking damage from 4 attackers at once for about 20 seconds, without even any use of protection boon. This is impressive by itself, and yet you’re complaining about taking too much damage.
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No, what is impressible is that toughness seems broken; the build that I had was purely a tank. If I have a tank build that is receiving incredible hits then I might think there is some kind of bug with the toughness code.

Way to just completely ignore his thorough and accurate explanation and say, “Oh, you’re wrong, I made my Warrior a tank so that means this game does have tanks because I said so, and Toughness really is supposed to mitigate a lot more damage than it does, because I said so and I made a tank and that’s that!”

Go read his reply again and soak it in. Toughness isn’t bugged. It is working as intended. It is not supposed to mitigate extreme amounts of damage. The combat system in GW2 shares heavy similarities to an Action RPG; active defence is the only true defence. There is no such thing as pure passive mitigation.

Daggers ignore toughness. It’s not supposed too, but it does. Daggers are simply bugged, but trying to get someone from this company fix something in the game . . . . you’re better off trying to shake hands with a cat.

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you do realize hs does more damage the lower health you get right….

If I have initiative to hs spam you at low health…. you did something wrong. Really wrong…

And your a warrior why are you letting a thief hs you anways. Earthshaker = thief worst nightmare.

edit: you really need to play the class….. only advice thief can give. L2p the class, you’ll never lose to a thief again if you know how to play one. Or that thief is kitten good.

There are two ways to play a thief..

The first play style is vs someone who doesn’t know how a thief works… instant win. Eat while playing in stealth. MMM free bag and a meal irl.

The second playstyle is someone who knows how to fight a thief…. I’ll be lucky if I can get away with resetting the fight. Depending on the class. Play a thief and see how people react to you in pvp etc. You’ll see… it’s no bug. It’s called crit damage foods and might.

Oh forgot to mention VULNERABILITY! Thiefs do that you know.