Guild Wars 2

Some of them are seriously terrible and useless, I wish Anet would change those. Especially PvP wise.

Right now I am thinking about:

1. Ice Shard Stab stolen from the Elementalist.

I would rather have a lightning attack that could maybe stun or daze at the very least. Chilling is kind of useless for a thief.

2. Throw Gunk, stolen from the Engineer,

Even Panick strike won’t put them in place long enough to have an effect. A part from the Chaos Armor I would get from leaping into it, It’s not worth it. Could they replace Throw Gunk with : a. Rusty Scrap Strike, cause bleed,poison and weaken or b. Shoot Rifle, launching both of you backwards in the opposite direction, but leaving your target vulnerable.

Opinions?

Agree – ice shard in theory is good as chilling eles screws their rotations, but in reality they have so much cleanse and your condi output is otherwise low so it has little effect. throw gunk is complete garbage

Agree, the icicle should hit more and have a shorter chill. Or some different sort of revamp. Eles atm cleanse it by accident before realising they got chilled :/

The gunk you steal from engis is honestly the worst of all by far. Hurts you more than it helps. Really slow flying skill with a cast so its really hard to get someone caught up in it. By the time u throw ot on a downed body and then start to cleave immediately 1 person resses him up easily because it has so little damage. So it has no use since u r better off autoattacking. The only meaningful thing it accomplishes is that it reveals you if you try to go into stealth. IMO if its dmg was boosted greatly it would still be the worst stolen but at least it would have some use against downeds.

And the skull you steal from necros has the same cast time as the fear. I wouldnt have reduced the fear in the first place but now that they did they should reduce the cast time too.

Throw Gunk is quite nice if one plays p/d or p/p to get some confusion stacks on the enemy.

Throw Gunk is only useful in PvP to put pressure on the people staying on point when you range dps them with Shortbow. Just throw it on the point, along with Sb #4, and have fun.

Ice Stab used to be really good against Eles before patch, but now their condi cleanses are insane and can easily cleanse it. Still, it’s a good skill overall. But against Eles you probably need Improvisation to use it twice so that when they cleanse it the first time, you can reapply it soon enough. Landing that skill is the only thing that can make a Thief beat a DD Ele as of now…

I think it’s nice also, but I think they should add an immobilize effect on it, because the max you’ll get is 2 stacks, other than that it’s pretty useless.

It shouldn’t take long to find a stolen item to replace Throw Gunk.That’s how bad it is imo.

@hihey you made a good point talking about Landing that Ice stab.

Throw Gunk is maybe best stolen skill. l2u.

Throw Gunk is hardly useless. With up to 2 stolen one can load significant confusion stacks on using whirl. . If I whirl over using d/d db i load bleeds confusion poison all at once. Using Daggerstorm you can load on bleeds cripples confusion. I would extend duration of the field by one second as this would allow a bit more time to take advantage of it and or make the field a bit larger.

I also use it to load area chaos armor on teammates using a blast finisher. It can be hard to pull off because duration low.

I also use chill a lot and see no issues with it. Again the double use is what counts and added to that it not required you use it against that Elementalist. It too would favor a condition build over power simply because in a condition build one is looking to apply as many total conditions as possible so as to make them burn those cleanses. As well when an enemy DOES take an extra cleanse or trait just to deal with potential chill (such as stop drop and roll) it another trait they might want that they can not take.

babazhook.6805:

Throw Gunk is hardly useless. With up to 2 stolen one can load significant confusion stacks on using whirl. . If I whirl over using d/d db i load bleeds confusion poison all at once. Using Daggerstorm you can load on bleeds cripples confusion. I would extend duration of the field by one second as this would allow a bit more time to take advantage of it and or make the field a bit larger.

I also use it to load area chaos armor on teammates using a blast finisher. It can be hard to pull off because duration low.

I also use chill a lot and see no issues with it. Again the double use is what counts and added to that it not required you use it against that Elementalist. It too would favor a condition build over power simply because in a condition build one is looking to apply as many total conditions as possible so as to make them burn those cleanses. As well when an enemy DOES take an extra cleanse or trait just to deal with potential chill (such as stop drop and roll) it another trait they might want that they can not take.

I would like every thief stolen skill to be used in a general sense. You mentioned that using Ice Stab ON THE CONDITION that the thief has improv. Obviously not every thief is using that trait, so your argument is too conditional and too specific to actually be of any use.

Chill WILL get cleansed in a matter of seconds.

Look:
-You steal from a Thief? that’s an extra 4 seconds – and possibly 8 seconds- of invisibility.
That is crucial in any thief vs thief fight. 4 seconds is enough to get you killed and anything could happen.

-You steal from a warrior? that warrior better ready to avoid a HUGE amount of damage.
- You steal from Guardian, those stuns could easily lead to his death.
- You Steal from a Necro, those seconds of fears could interrupt so much of his rotations.

I don’t see those dangerous implications I mentioned above with Throw Gunk & Ice Shard Stab.

I hope you reconsider.

Not to mention that throw gunk reveals you if someone walks in it. The only thing that makes this more tolerable is that you don’t have to throw it in order to steal again (finally).

I agree Ice Shard Stab needs a different item, better than what is currently stolen. Perhaps a frost aura for 3-4 seconds. In line with what they can actually do, without being BETTER than the skills they can do.

Unlike, things like AoE Fear from Necro. That fear is longer duration than what they can produce, and hits much wider area.

The axes stolen from Warrior is better than their own offhand axe ability. Reflects projectiles and does more damage.

Consume Ectoplasm from Mesmers, is literally better than all of their buffing abilities combined. Funny how they can’t use their own ectoplasm to produce that same effect.

Ranger Healing Spring item is balanced, nice duration waterfield. Spam dat Shortbow 2.

Engineer stolen gunk is… interesting, I have a love/hate relationship with it.

Guardian mace isn’t poorly balanced. Useful.

The engi stolen item should be that overcharged shot that you get from some PvE mobs. I’d really like to give their CC back to them.

Ice shard at least has its uses if timed for after water.

just pointing out how strong gunk can be

https://youtu.be/BeTmSGt3pFU

Taobella.6597:

just pointing out how strong gunk can be

https://youtu.be/BeTmSGt3pFU

That’s my point exactly. When your target is gonna stand there and take all those stacks with a smile on his face, let me know.

Chill when they used their cleanse..
that’s a dodge and water 5..
unless they use utility.. then they use big cooldown…chill again..

ice shard is not useless, it’s just ele is too stronk with too much burning.

and yes, gunk is stronk…specially against engi, after you proc panic strike and throw gunk..or just stealth then auto with shortbow after they used their healing turret…if you want to beat an engi, l2use gunk..that’s the thing that kills engi..

Kocoff.7582:

Taobella.6597:

just pointing out how strong gunk can be

https://youtu.be/BeTmSGt3pFU

That’s my point exactly. When your target is gonna stand there and take all those stacks with a smile on his face, let me know.

When I am using whirling axe who is just going to stand there as I whirle away? When I use Caltrops who is going to stand in the field? When you have some immobile for whatver reason throw gunk works great. You can get 10 seconds of chaos armor with this Everytime struck in combat you get one of protection regen or swiftness while inflicting confusion blind or cripple. This can be done without a target standing in the field.

The field needs to be slightly larger and this a great stolen item. People do not like it because they just do not want to bother with Combo fields. By the way the target does not have to stand on the field to be affected if one relies on confusion with a whirl. Confounding bolt range is 900 units

As to ice stab all that needed is a tweak up to the damage down on a strike so it akin to a lightning strike of a sigil. Even at that 20 seconds of chill is hardly useless.

Kocoff.7582:

Taobella.6597:

just pointing out how strong gunk can be

https://youtu.be/BeTmSGt3pFU

That’s my point exactly. When your target is gonna stand there and take all those stacks with a smile on his face, let me know.

you did notice he was immobilized first 6 seconds making only able to get out of last 2 pulses.

I’d like stolen skills that are not highly situational (and therefore useless).

And especially stolen skills that are not countered by the opposing class. (Blind / Block / Dodges on Guard & Ele, hard to hit those two)

I’d take Ice Shard Stab over the much more useless Tooth Stab any day, it may be a 1 minute bleed but with the nerf to condi damage that’s only like a whopping 20 damage per second that can easily be cleansed.

Throw Lava Rock is also pretty crappy in a non-condi build since the June 23rd patch.

As for Throw Gunk honestly even after adding an F2 to steal I still throw this one away as soon as I get it, the tiny amount of damage it does causing reveal makes it too risky to use, even if the enemy just stood in it for the full duration.

Much rather see it replaced with Throw Gear or Throw Net or even Shoot Rifle for the engineer steal, which make much more sense anyways imo.

In case you need to be reminded what these do see: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Steal

If you will not or can not use the Combo field throw gunk provides that hardly means it useless. Any that try to hide after throwing Gunk , I just really do not know what to say.

In a power build I use throw Gunk for chaos armor. I can get 10 seconds. In a condi build I use it for confusion. No one has to remain standing on the gunk in order for a thief using it to gain these benefits.

The other stolen weapons are generally PVE. I find it does not really make a lot of difference there what you get. Pve is what it is.

The Combo Field provided by throw gunk in only really useful if you run Dagger Storm for the whirl, which I (and many others in WvW/PvP) do not, yes you can leap through it with a dagger main-hand to gain chaos armor for 2 seconds but that only applies to dagger, and even then since the field lasts 5 seconds, in order to get the 10 seconds you would need to leap over it 5 times and in doing so use all 15 of your initiative to get that.

I do recall once upon a time where I would use the field in combination with unload to stack confusion, but alas since both condi damage and P/P was nerfed that no longer seems to be worth it.

Edit* My bad It seems I was thinking of something else, Chaos does originally apply 5 seconds on leap but only 2 seconds for every leap thereafter, meaning I’d only take ~4 leaps to stack up 10 seconds.

I see the thread is very divided when it comes to their opinions on Throw Gunk. It’s quite interesting really. The argument were definitely compelling on both side.

as for Ice Shard Stab. If I fight a skillful ele, I know i’ll spend the entire time missing a stupid Ice Shard Stab, and if by miracle I make it ( a lucky Daze + F2), it’s not going to have any impact on the fight whatsoever.

I just wish the Stolen items were more generalized and had compelling consequences on the ennemy like mentioned earlier such as: whirl axe on warrior, sun on guardian, fear on necro.

I just don’t see that impact on ele and engis. It’s almost as if, we they get stolen 5 times in a row, they will still be like “meh”.

Edit: Also guys, let’s keep it PvP and on topic. thank you.

Nomad.4301:

The Combo Field provided by throw gunk in only really useful if you run Dagger Storm for the whirl, which I (and many others in WvW/PvP) do not, yes you can leap through it with a dagger main-hand to gain chaos armor for 2 seconds but that only applies to dagger, and even then since the field lasts 5 seconds, in order to get the 10 seconds you would need to leap over it 5 times and in doing so use all 15 of your initiative to get that.

I do recall once upon a time where I would use the field in combination with unload to stack confusion, but alas since both condi damage and P/P was nerfed that no longer seems to be worth it.

Edit* My bad It seems I was thinking of something else, Chaos does originally apply 5 seconds on leap but only 2 seconds for every leap thereafter, meaning I’d only take ~4 leaps to stack up 10 seconds.

I am talking about two uses using Improv for chaos armor. I do not think it worth it do subsequent leaps after the first added to that it something you have to time. Ie if you are going to use an HS toss the gunk and then HS.

Confounding bolts hit 900 away and yes they better for a condition build.

You can also get 3 seconds of chaos on teamates and if using a sb can usually get three blasts off. Again the biggest issue is the size of the field is a bit small.

Now when looking at INI spent to do a whirl one can not just count the Confusion from a d/D DB. For the same INI you are also putting on bleeds. You are also putting on poison (if traited) and also putting on weakness. That makes that same INI do a lot more damage and if you can do an HS as well you will get even more conditions applied (such as blind/cripple) and be receiving regen or protection or switfness,.

I see any combo field as a blessing as using them effectively is stretching your INI farther. Gunk provides us an etheral field which is a good thing in addition to our smoke poison and dark. . (We also get a water field with the ranger stolen item)

one good thing to remember about ice shard is it 170 range skill on an instant cast it not as flashy as a lot of other bundles but it a great finisher if you need cheap dmg.

An if we talking about effective way to use gunk you preset turret to x hp throw it on top of it force gunk to kill turret making it so thief does not hit knockdown status.

Taobella.6597:

one good thing to remember about ice shard is it 170 range skill on an instant cast it not as flashy as a lot of other bundles but it a great finisher if you need cheap dmg.

An if we talking about effective way to use gunk you preset turret to x hp throw it on top of it force gunk to kill turret making it so thief does not hit knockdown status.

Wat

Lol Tooth Stab is really the worst, I agree.

Btw Ice shard is pretty good but now ele D/D has an amazing condi removal so it’s not very effective.

Throw gunk is good on downed people or immobilized people (with a blast or leap)

Pretty curious about revevant stolen skill (it should be something to slow down the Energy gain or it would be cool if thief could stolen counter legend skill, depended on which legend is active)

philheat.3956:

Lol Tooth Stab is really the worst, I agree.

Btw Ice shard is pretty good but now ele D/D has an amazing condi removal so it’s not very effective.

Throw gunk is good on downed people or immobilized people (with a blast or leap)

Pretty curious about revevant stolen skill (it should be something to slow down the Energy gain or it would be cool if thief could stolen counter legend skill, depended on which legend is active)

Well in theory we should know this. When they beta tested the Rev does anyone recall what the stolen item was?

I do not think a stolen item should work JUST against the class one stole it from. All of the others can be used against any class so I doubt a counter legend skill would be doable.