Guild Wars 2

hi there,
i have started to make a video on thief builds in wvw
why?
as i play from the beginning as a wvw thief and experience in all kind of builds out there (and few of my own) i want to examine which build is useable for each situation (and also as many ppl here just qq or say one build is not good without explaining why or prove it by video of their own)

the first one is on condi thief solo and group play (yes group play)

it has few tips for newcomers and also few tips in the end and if you watch closely you can see and learn how to counter it (many ppl qq on condi thief these days)
i intentionally put video where i did a lot of mistakes so you can know how to counter p/d
and also in group play as ppl qq that enemies cleanse condition so fast. you can see 5k burning dmg to 1-5 enemies.

hope you like it as much as i do and feel free to ask question

to be continued on power builds

(p.s. as for now the condi thief and power thief in group play (not gvg) manage to do the same sdps and down ppl equally. at least for me)

after few questions i have been asked what i think on the p/d set in general here are my comments

p/d set is not cheesy. dont forget that the only “buff” it got from the last patch is 5 stacks of confusion. with perplexity runes it was 3 stacks.
the krait rune ppl using isnt such big deal as it gives only bleeding duration which the thief has already got AA which does an easy stacks so to get 80%-100% bleeding duration isnt much important at all.
the power d/d and condi p/d has the same mechanism. you need cnd to land to do your “burst” skill.
if ppl dont try to dodge/blind/block/evade it they will get sneak attack or backstab in the face.
i have fought few guardians which defend really nice with blind and block while doing nice pressure to me . also as you can see above the mesmer using evades.

but yes its more easy weapon than power d/d as you got more hp and toughness which give more room for mistakes but your burst is bit lower/slower than the power d/d

also the build above i am using is
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAqYVl0MpppdPx0J8PNhMRxdO8C3g3bxY8haFAA-TVyCABAcIAq4IAcy+DHfCAQRTwL6B8R9nEVCmlyPSBAzcA-w

i took poison duration for more pressure, also balthazar runes are so good if you know to withdraw forward (also runes of grenth with chill)

the seconds build i use is http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAqYVl0MpppVNxrJ8PNRMhw9uY98qr2NWEA-TVyCABAcIAq4IAcy+DHfCAQRTwL6B8R9nEVCmlyPSBAzcA-w

the immobilize alone is just an enemy killer

also steal health build http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQRAqY6Yl0MpppFNx7J8PNRMhw9uf98qr2NWEA-TFyCABNqEEgjAgFPAA82f4F9D+o+TDnEgqU+RIAzzBA-w
you will be amazed by the lifesteal you can do… (if sneak attack connect its about 6-7k dmg and heal without considering the bleeding, poison, torment dmg (about +9k dmg)

messiah.1908:

i took poison duration for more pressure, also balthazar runes are so good if you know to withdraw forward (also runes of grenth with chill)

Just skip the whole “withdraw forward” thing and use a costume brawl capable tonic to activate balthazar runes. If you are going to run an op build go all out. Also, you said that p/d is not cheesy. Coming from someone who only plays p/d tonic thief let me tell you with 100% certainty that p/d is the most cheesy and broken weapon set in the game. I can burst 18k of condis every 10 seconds without using venom. That is undoubtedly OP. Anyone in NA t2 who has fought me or other thieves using a similar spec can attest to how broken it is.

Regards,

Babylonian Assassin

Ismael.6074:

messiah.1908:

i took poison duration for more pressure, also balthazar runes are so good if you know to withdraw forward (also runes of grenth with chill)

Just skip the whole “withdraw forward” thing and use a costume brawl capable tonic to activate balthazar runes. If you are going to run an op build go all out. Also, you said that p/d is not cheesy. Coming from someone who only plays p/d tonic thief let me tell you with 100% certainty that p/d is the most cheesy and broken weapon set in the game. I can burst 18k of condis every 10 seconds without using venom. That is undoubtedly OP. Anyone in NA t2 who has fought me or other thieves using a similar spec can attest to how broken it is.

Regards,

Babylonian Assassin

Is it always that easy to land CnD or are the opponents of lower experience?

not its not
it depend if you 1v1 or 1vX . the more enemy the more pressure but more target you have
ele got aura to defend them
guardian block and blind
warrior bit block and blind but good immunity to conditions
engi good aoe pressure
mesmer stealth and clone to negate dmg
necro good aoe pressure with DS second life
ranger – poor ranger
thief -stealth blind as you do
also if your enemies know when and how to blind/block with aegis they can take you down fast or at least chase you away

@ismael – i know it but dont use it as this trick is cheesy. also usually i play 1vx so no build is cheesy in outnumbered situation
i dont know why you say its broken. your 18k burst is maybe in 6 seconds so 3k dps which is like power d/d which can cnd+bs+AA every 4 seconds
engi who put too many conditions is broken also ?
diamond d/d ele which can heal fast is broken also?
s/s lb warrior broken also?

and i tend to see that power build in group fight are less effective than condition as group tend to stick together so you cannot come close to them with 2500 armor and below. you spend most of the time dodging /running /stealthing while in condi build you can do much more sustain dmg and help the group with immobilize the weak

or maybe i am poor power thief player

Ismael.6074:

messiah.1908:

i took poison duration for more pressure, also balthazar runes are so good if you know to withdraw forward (also runes of grenth with chill)

Just skip the whole “withdraw forward” thing and use a costume brawl capable tonic to activate balthazar runes. If you are going to run an op build go all out.
Babylonian Assassin

OK, I don’t follow you here. What tonic are you talking about and how does this “activate” the runes?

And about the build being cheese, well, against a D/D Ele using diamond skin, condi thieves have a rough time.

Going to 100% agree with Babylonian, I’ve fought the spec it’s broken as kitten. P/D condi in general is broken and easy to play, if you think it’s hard you have some problems and are not a good thief.

fight against 2, 3 and 4 not 1v1 as i said it an easy set
try to down fast and not troll with stealth like pu mesmer etc

100% agreeing with Amonatory agreeing with Babylonian. P/D condi can be played blind folded. No class is meant to take on more than one equally skilled player at a time. If it can, its cheese as kitten. He’s made two posts already where he tries to convince otherwise O.o If you don’t get it by now you probably never will.

i agree with quinn agreeing with amonatory who agrees with baby hahahaha.

but when you win against a p/d thief as a d/d power… you can’t help but to get up and do a little dance!

i agree with 3 out of the 4 last posters its not like warriors, necro ,guardian etc saying its broken its the thief community that is agreeing with those other classes when you have thieves agreeing with other classes after all the QQ on the forums and all the nerfs from the QQ but this is one build that should be nerfed

fabz.4736:

i agree with 3 out of the 4 last posters its not like warriors, necro ,guardian etc saying its broken its the thief community that is agreeing with those other classes when you have thieves agreeing with other classes after all the QQ on the forums and all the nerfs from the QQ but this is one build that should be nerfed

Be careful what you ask for. Its the runes change,dire gear and crit damage nerf that made p/d condi builds rise in comparison to power thieves, not the actual weapon set or traits.

messiah.1908:

not its not
it depend if you 1v1 or 1vX . the more enemy the more pressure but more target you have
ele got aura to defend them
guardian block and blind
warrior bit block and blind but good immunity to conditions
engi good aoe pressure
mesmer stealth and clone to negate dmg
necro good aoe pressure with DS second life
ranger – poor ranger
thief -stealth blind as you do
also if your enemies know when and how to blind/block with aegis they can take you down fast or at least chase you away

@ismael – i know it but dont use it as this trick is cheesy. also usually i play 1vx so no build is cheesy in outnumbered situation
i dont know why you say its broken. your 18k burst is maybe in 6 seconds so 3k dps which is like power d/d which can cnd+bs+AA every 4 seconds
engi who put too many conditions is broken also ?
diamond d/d ele which can heal fast is broken also?
s/s lb warrior broken also?

and i tend to see that power build in group fight are less effective than condition as group tend to stick together so you cannot come close to them with 2500 armor and below. you spend most of the time dodging /running /stealthing while in condi build you can do much more sustain dmg and help the group with immobilize the weak

or maybe i am poor power thief player

i dont think you undterstand y this build or the condi meta is so broken.

condi – the more tanky you go the more dmg you get

power- the less tanky the more dmg you get

Karolis.4261:

fabz.4736:

i agree with 3 out of the 4 last posters its not like warriors, necro ,guardian etc saying its broken its the thief community that is agreeing with those other classes when you have thieves agreeing with other classes after all the QQ on the forums and all the nerfs from the QQ but this is one build that should be nerfed

Be careful what you ask for. Its the runes change,dire gear and crit damage nerf that made p/d condi builds rise in comparison to power thieves, not the actual weapon set or traits.

the 5 stacks of confuion on steal very broken

A compilation of condi thief builds lol. Now I’ve seen everything.

>Implying thief condi specs are not cheese.
>Implying the set isn’t handicap mode for scrubs.
>Not accounting nerf to crit specs could mean a buff as a whole to condi specs.

I agree with a few comments made earlier. Condi P/D is extremely efficient in terms of risk vs. reward, as it poses little risk with low skill cap to the player with good rewards. It is without question the easiest set out there, even more so that the D/P gimmick. At least it’s only really effective in WvW roaming and nothing else.

fabz.4736:

messiah.1908:

not its not
it depend if you 1v1 or 1vX . the more enemy the more pressure but more target you have
ele got aura to defend them
guardian block and blind
warrior bit block and blind but good immunity to conditions
engi good aoe pressure
mesmer stealth and clone to negate dmg
necro good aoe pressure with DS second life
ranger – poor ranger
thief -stealth blind as you do
also if your enemies know when and how to blind/block with aegis they can take you down fast or at least chase you away

@ismael – i know it but dont use it as this trick is cheesy. also usually i play 1vx so no build is cheesy in outnumbered situation
i dont know why you say its broken. your 18k burst is maybe in 6 seconds so 3k dps which is like power d/d which can cnd+bs+AA every 4 seconds
engi who put too many conditions is broken also ?
diamond d/d ele which can heal fast is broken also?
s/s lb warrior broken also?

and i tend to see that power build in group fight are less effective than condition as group tend to stick together so you cannot come close to them with 2500 armor and below. you spend most of the time dodging /running /stealthing while in condi build you can do much more sustain dmg and help the group with immobilize the weak

or maybe i am poor power thief player

i dont think you undterstand y this build or the condi meta is so broken.

condi – the more tanky you go the more dmg you get

power- the less tanky the more dmg you get

Please say crit instead of power there are pure power builds out there and the more tanky they are the more power they get. You know what you are getting if you gear up zerker like many of the “pve” users says:" I rely on skills to survive…"
Other sets exist in game….

messiah.1908:

i dont know why you say its broken. your 18k burst is maybe in 6 seconds so 3k dps which is like power d/d which can cnd+bs+AA every 4 seconds
engi who put too many conditions is broken also ?
diamond d/d ele which can heal fast is broken also?
s/s lb warrior broken also?

so about the same dps as a d/d thief… while the d/d thief has lower armor, lower hp, less dodges, less gap openers, and has to stay in melee range to actually do the damage you are comparing the condi burst to :P

to all the ppl who likes to qq – this is condi meta deal with it. until anet change it again not likely)

@emi – both sets have same dodges gap closer (p/d has the opposite). tha main difference as i think it should be the d/d can do in short time huge burst dmg rather the p/d can do the same but in longer time. so hight risk high reward as it should be

also i agree above that the condi thief like every condi class got “buff” by the crit nurf .
the confusion trait buff replace the perplexity rune so no major buff here imo.

i dont want to take this agrument if its cheese (most thread here say it so.. so be it if you think it)
i also said its an too easy set 1v1. so dont play it 1v1. thief never meant to be 1v1 in wvw imo. it should go deep in the enemy and scout, harras, and kill periphery fast. if you looking for 1v1 roaming there are better class to do so.

also i put group play build which imo is same/better than d/d power set

and i would love to see some buff on d/d set but not nerf on p/d

even yesterday when i play with my guild 20v40 we won and some enemy qq how we are zerg with condi thief. i dont get it they want me to play build which you can kill me easily with 2k armor 15k health … if its work it work.

it amaze me how it is the only thread with most qq is the thief’s one. and the thieves player are the qqing.
instead of suggesting how to change or buff the other set you just qq.

but i still hope you like the video. and i will make power one soon i hope.
so get ready for s/d qq and stealth qq d/p

messiah.1908:

to all the ppl who likes to qq – this is condi meta deal with it. until anet change it again not likely)

@emi – both sets have same dodges gap closer (p/d has the opposite). tha main difference as i think it should be the d/d can do in short time huge burst dmg rather the p/d can do the same but in longer time. so hight risk high reward as it should be

also i agree above that the condi thief like every condi class got “buff” by the crit nurf .
the confusion trait buff replace the perplexity rune so no major buff here imo.

i dont want to take this agrument if its cheese (most thread here say it so.. so be it if you think it)
i also said its an too easy set 1v1. so dont play it 1v1. thief never meant to be 1v1 in wvw imo. it should go deep in the enemy and scout, harras, and kill periphery fast. if you looking for 1v1 roaming there are better class to do so.

also i put group play build which imo is same/better than d/d power set

and i would love to see some buff on d/d set but not nerf on p/d

even yesterday when i play with my guild 20v40 we won and some enemy qq how we are zerg with condi thief. i dont get it they want me to play build which you can kill me easily with 2k armor 15k health … if its work it work.

it amaze me how it is the only thread with most qq is the thief’s one. and the thieves player are the qqing.
instead of suggesting how to change or buff the other set you just qq.

but i still hope you like the video. and i will make power one soon i hope.
so get ready for s/d qq and stealth qq d/p

Honestly, Id love to see the power gameplay. After watching a minute of that I stopped, it looked like awful play in general so I doubt your power spec will make it any better.

Prepare to see a sea of uplevels getting slain by S/D 33333333333333.

i have nothing to say to you both. so just dont watch it

Dont worry, not many will.

:) lol i dont see your vid getting either

stop troll

A quick Question.
Power/Critical Vs Condition Thief
In which situation we use them? Zerg Solo Pve Fractal?
And whats the difference on the damage they do to enemies? Which Kill faster? Can thieves support power/crit builds?
Thx in advance

Ismael.6074:

…Also, you said that p/d is not cheesy. Coming from someone who only plays p/d tonic thief let me tell you with 100% certainty that p/d is the most cheesy and broken weapon set in the game.

Uhm, you’re saying that while exploiting tonics and on-heal runes, neither of which are tied to the P/D weaponset. Using the ‘cheesy’ tonics is what makes your use of p/d ‘cheesy’.

Klaus.8326:

A quick Question.
Power/Critical Vs Condition Thief
In which situation we use them? Zerg Solo Pve Fractal?

Condition is for roaming, for everything else you use Power. Most DPS is berserker set with daggers. And every rule of thumb should be ignored when you feel like it

thief can role what ever and be best in it

most ppl will say condition for roaming as now the meta is so condi bias, but also power one are viable like s/d d/d d/p

for group its the same. most say go power but it really depends on you and the enemy you playing against (wvw)
if the enemy move really tight goind melee power wont help you much as you will take too much hit to do good dmg so range will mostly do better so p/d condition will be more effective
the more the group less orgenize go power

for me its the same as i noticed i down more or less the same numbers at the same time frame

regarding which will kill faster it really depends when you start counting the seconds
power will do short huge burst but will have to stealth/dodge away until the next burst
while condi can do constant dmg which yield the same sustain dps over time

Every class has some easy builds, so this is the one for thieves. And it’s called cheese for some reasons:

-useless in pve
-useless in pvp
-useless in zerg vs zerg (thief has only one job, casterkiller)

So for roaming and some 1vs1 it is op. I have beaten better players than me with this spec. On the other hand, i think everyone can just outrun a p/d thief, so there no reason for fighting such a spec. It’s like a pu condi mesmer, if you leave them alone, they cannot achieve much.

with some trait/utilities variation in zerg v zerg the condi thief can do the same as power one

messiah.1908:

with some trait/utilities variation in zerg v zerg the condi thief can do the same as power one

No, an organized zerg has too much coni remove. With a casterkiller group you can kill targets within a split second. Show me how you do this with a condi group.

I am a little bit curious why you defend this spec so much. If this brings you the most fun, have fun. It is a game, and this is the most important part. But if you want that others consider you as a great player, this is maybe the wrong spec.

apocom.3172:

… And it’s called cheese for some reasons …

Yeah, reason is scrubs don’t l2p.

A year ago p/d was a weak weaponset, it’s the thief’s best option (without getting buffed) but now the rest is nerfed and it is suddenly OP. It’s exactly as was predicted back then, whatever weaponset is currently seen as the strongest set a thief has is automatically ‘cheese’ and ‘op’ and will get nerfed.

panicbutton.1053:

100% agreeing with Amonatory agreeing with Babylonian. P/D condi can be played blind folded. No class is meant to take on more than one equally skilled player at a time. If it can, its cheese as kitten. He’s made two posts already where he tries to convince otherwise O.o If you don’t get it by now you probably never will.

Pd condi is a 1v1 dueling build assuming other players are build for the same reason no way a pd condi can take on two players of equal skill.

fabz.4736:

i agree with 3 out of the 4 last posters its not like warriors, necro ,guardian etc saying its broken its the thief community that is agreeing with those other classes when you have thieves agreeing with other classes after all the QQ on the forums and all the nerfs from the QQ but this is one build that should be nerfed

Nerfed why? its not even that strong. Game is not balance around 1v1 pd condi is a bad choice for group play, bad for zerg play, bad in any form of serious spvp how does it need a nerf? Also dp zerk counters pd and is much better for a small havoc squad.

vincecontix.1264:

fabz.4736:

i agree with 3 out of the 4 last posters its not like warriors, necro ,guardian etc saying its broken its the thief community that is agreeing with those other classes when you have thieves agreeing with other classes after all the QQ on the forums and all the nerfs from the QQ but this is one build that should be nerfed

Nerfed why? its not even that strong. Game is not balance around 1v1 pd condi is a bad choice for group play, bad for zerg play, bad in any form of serious spvp how does it need a nerf? Also dp zerk counters pd and is much better for a small havoc squad.

That the akward thing when using p/d I ‘ll do better against s/d then d/p. There are not much options for thief for zerg play anything with stealth to take down unaware foes 1 by 1 seems to work better than s/d based on what I’ve saw so far.

vincecontix.1264:

fabz.4736:

i agree with 3 out of the 4 last posters its not like warriors, necro ,guardian etc saying its broken its the thief community that is agreeing with those other classes when you have thieves agreeing with other classes after all the QQ on the forums and all the nerfs from the QQ but this is one build that should be nerfed

Nerfed why? its not even that strong. Game is not balance around 1v1 pd condi is a bad choice for group play, bad for zerg play, bad in any form of serious spvp how does it need a nerf? Also dp zerk counters pd and is much better for a small havoc squad.

venom share condi build is great for zerg play you give out 12sec of immob to 5 players including yourself try running as a full condi v/s thief and party up with your casters it works great in locking down there front line with caltrops

@apocom – where you saw me saying i am great player. i am an average player.
i play thief from the beggining and run all spec before ppl knew them as i love theroy craft and to experiment new things.

i am try to defend this weapon set as ppl imo dont truly understand if they just say it cheesy without explaining why. if its because they are so great which enable them to kill fast other enemies maybe its not of the weapon set. for me s/d build is much “cheesier” with perma evades and dodges.
i have killed few p/d as d/d and as other proffession so i dont think its cheesy.
yes this set is very easy 1v1. but try play against guardian and it will be harder.
also i dont like to play common build that why i love theorycraft.
also in zerg as state above full venom is very strong – countless times i heard the necros asking me to change to my panicond build (i wish anet could change that you could see the dmg done by your venom share). but some other group which dont spec accourdinly rather me to go full power build.

also zerg imo is not orgenized group . gvg it is. so yes in gvg dont go condition build. in zerg i always can stack condition for 5-10 seconds without being cleanse( sure i use on backliner and not warrior with shout) also when it get cleanse i can put immideatly other stacks (thief initiative spamming skills)

p/s i remember the day ppl qq on backstab thief

I apologize for the tone of my previous post, I have a nasty habit of flipping tables once I’m forced to fight a condi thief. I don’t have any right to tell you to stop playing condi but I can tell you that you will be frowned and looked down upon by many players. You can buy the gear and invest into the build but I promise you that outside of you group play, once you get bored and start roaming or dueling, no one will want to fight you. Its very typical for new players to start with condi, but once you flourish like the beautiful theif flowers that you are, you’ll look elsewhere for a faster and more tactical build

What newer players often overlook is the investments needed between condi and power to deal the appropriate amount of damage. To be successful at power, one must invest into three different stats. To be successful at condi, you only need one damage stat. It just so happens that because condi requires less, they can heavily invest in defensive stats which is all they need. If you combine massive amounts of damage with lots of defense and access of creating distance between you and the enemy whenever you want — you have a spec that is considered to be a little to OP by most of the community. Don’t believe me? Try to /m and ask people what they think of people running PD conditions.

It’s not your fault, anet left it that way. They wont do any serious balancing around it in WvW because zerging in a group can’t be balanced. It will also never be fixed because PD condi has no place in any serious PvP besides delaying the inevitable — them dying to any power based class.

true , power build are more harder and require you to play smarter and faster
i am also hate when i get down by p/d thief. but that’s life. i rarely duel and look for 1vx so far my best win was 1v5 and again after 15 min its kinda boring so i try to took it for group play and some time its fun to hear your group shouting “omg see how many conditions messiah stack on this poor guy”

but so far why dont you think full venom share with group play cant work?

It can work and it does work — there’s a bunch of venom share builds floating around. Typically for zergs, people prefer to AoE direct damage since it would be faster than waiting for any conditions. Same thing happens in dungeons, right? Would you bring condition builds to a fractal? The same logic applies in wvw zergs.

The build you use would be best for small group roaming imo. It would tear gaps in zergs or other groups. Though to fully utilize the procs, wouldn’t your other team members have to be conditions to do any decent damage with your venom share?

the condition dmg done by venom share is scale by the party condi dmg and not mine. but the venoms i use are immobilize and chill for cc to catch ppl off guard so my team can burst on them fast and easy. the torment is for both spec. condition and power which get vulnerability which is nice +4% dmg buff but if some attack the same target it can be higher so its advantage

Yeah I figured it was based on individuals. If I were in a competition I would just bring a necromancer instead. Spite + Epidemic has more utility apart from even using the staff skills. I think that’s the reason you won’t see venom share builds as often — other classes do it better.

Say you had two teams of five players. One has a venom sharing thief and the other has a condi necro. I’m certain the condi necrosis team would overpower the other team in conditions alone. They have fear utility and access to all conditions with without waiting on cooldowns.

fabz.4736:

vincecontix.1264:

fabz.4736:

i agree with 3 out of the 4 last posters its not like warriors, necro ,guardian etc saying its broken its the thief community that is agreeing with those other classes when you have thieves agreeing with other classes after all the QQ on the forums and all the nerfs from the QQ but this is one build that should be nerfed

Nerfed why? its not even that strong. Game is not balance around 1v1 pd condi is a bad choice for group play, bad for zerg play, bad in any form of serious spvp how does it need a nerf? Also dp zerk counters pd and is much better for a small havoc squad.

venom share condi build is great for zerg play you give out 12sec of immob to 5 players including yourself try running as a full condi v/s thief and party up with your casters it works great in locking down there front line with caltrops

You don’t have to be condi thief to run venom share build its better off running a power version and running immob and basilisk venom. In organized group play power beats condi it simple more dps.

my intuition tell me that in 5v5 the condit thief will over power the necro condi.
he can steal and use aoe fear. he can gank the necro 1v1 while his team have access to cc with venom share. the necro survivability base on his team while thief can role alone from the outside. also group always try to burst the necro first as he is easy pray. while thief can stealth away

@vinc – power venom share has few drawback – hp and armor is low . low movement abilities so he must at least 2 utilities . so to go venom share just for immobilize and stun . i dont know. but i will try it again

I can tell you don’t fight very good players because you have never met a tanky necro. A thief drops much faster than a necro. Try and run some games of PvP?

There is a reason venom share was introduced so long ago but people have not bothered utilizing it. Giving immobilize to your group does not make you a king — There are so many skills the negate immobilize, and you’re lucky to get most of its duration to stick even if you land it. Any other venoms a thief provides are sub par and extremely weak(in the hands of venom share). Like many have already said, thats why you’ll be more useful actually dedicating yourself to a normal spec instead of relying on long useless cooldowns.

messiah.1908:

my intuition tell me that in 5v5 the condit thief will over power the necro condi.
he can steal and use aoe fear. he can gank the necro 1v1 while his team have access to cc with venom share. the necro survivability base on his team while thief can role alone from the outside. also group always try to burst the necro first as he is easy pray. while thief can stealth away

@vinc - power venom share has few drawback - hp and armor is low . low movement abilities so he must at least 2 utilities . so to go venom share just for immobilize and stun . i dont know. but i will try it again

Venom share not even that great straight up power thief is much better either dp, SD, or sp. You can easily drop your targets twice as fast. This is also why you see top teams in tpvp with a power thief and not a condi thief.

Necro beats condi thief for condi pressure no contest. Also necro fears, better boon removal and can share enemy fire. Thief can steal fear from a necro but that’s only dependant if there is a necro to steal from.

Its quite a normal experience for a PD thief to be the sole survivor of his group when two enemy forces of even skill and size clash. This then causes the thief to think he is good and his team mates stuffed up. What actually happen is PD condi thief don’t pull there on weight and a lot of the time causes his allies to die(serious havoc squads).

PD condi thief has its uses but in group play its sub optimal kinda of like a condi pu staff\scepter\torch mesmer but its harder to play. There are set up where its good but still not a ideal choice.

The strength of condi PD thief is not its condition pressure but its DPs to survivability ratio(lots of survivability).