Guild Wars 2

It goes..

1. get killed by a thief
2. alt + f4
3. whine on forums.

Sithaco.4673:

It goes..

1. get killed by a thief
2. alt + f4
3. whine on forums.

But the thief killed me because I am a GC. I don’t want to L2P, I want thieves nerfed and L2P being handed to me because I am a baddie.

Lordryux.9785:

they demand thief nerfs simply because your the most irritating class in the game. able to go into battle with no risk at all and 3 shot players. and get out alive. able to disengage the fight anytime you wish by simply using C&D. You can spam heartseeker and do 3k to 5k damage per hit. plus more if crit.

Basically any new person can create a thief go into pvp and auto attack ppl to death without even using any skills with a basic GC build. thats why people are mad at you enjoy the complaining xD lol

This is the problem in a nutshell. 0 risk engagement and disengagements and an easy 75% burst.

grandjudge.4129:

This is the problem in a nutshell. 0 risk engagement and disengagements and an easy 75% burst.

No risk engagements? I suppose there’s not much risk for the few seconds it takes you to sneak up on someone, but the moment you’re attacking you cannot stealth for the duration of the Revealed debuff. Given that GW2 relies on an active combat system, they want you to pay attention and react to what’s going on around you.

Let’s say you’re strolling along in WvW, doing whatever you do in WvW. Suddenly, someone you didn’t see hits you. What do you do? Stand there? Let them get a free, high-damage ability off on you instead of, say, dodging? Because that’s all you really have to do to stop a thief from getting their initial backstab. Hell, if you get good enough, you can completely mitigate their stealth and leave them even more vulnerable (dodging as soon as they hit you with steal, so their CnD doesn’t connect). Sure, it takes some practice to get used to, and can be harder with some higher skill players, but it’s not impossible to mitigate almost all of a thief’s initial burst (their strongest burst, typically).

“But Ansi, what if they use Basilisk Venom?” you may ask. Well, to be frank, every class has a stun break. Why don’t you carry one? It doesn’t matter what profession I’m playing, I almost always have one stun break on my bar except for completely situational circumstances. Hell, it amazes me at the -warriors- who complain about thieves. They have a tech that makes them invulnerable for a full 5 seconds and breaks stun.

Let’s say a thief wants to disengage. Their primary mechanic for doing this is their stealth, which again can be countered. Popped Shadow Refuge? Drop an AoE on their AoE, if the thief leaves then the stealth breaks and they’re stuck out of stealth for the full Reveal debuff, if not they’re tanking a chunk of damage when they are already trying to disengage. If they’re running Hide in Shadows (the only heal that stealths them), that means their means of getting rid of mobility debuffs (cripple, chill, immobilized) are severely limited. If they have Shadowstep (most newer Thieves running the full GC BS build won’t have this) they may still be able to get away, but other than that their options are now pretty limited.

Red Falcon.8257:

It’s the WoW player logic:
Die -> forums -> cry for nerfs
instead of
Die -> L2P -> win

Unfortunally it’s not always a L2P issue, if 2 gladiators fights, 1 with no weapons against 1 with an awesome pistol, the one with no weaps have few chances to win. If you want balance the fight you’ll nerf the guy with the pistol or buff the guy with no weap.

I also think if some ppls crying for nerf, on the other side some ppls crying for no nerf… and if someone cry for no nerf, an other will cry for a nerf… so what, are we all crying ? nerd war ? It’s not about a WoW logic or something else, it’s just human logic: ppls reporting their feeling.

To me the both side (for nerf and against nerf) have good reasons to complaint.

Sithaco.4673:

It goes..

1. get killed by a thief
2. alt + f4
3. whine on forums.

I’m not asking a Thief nerf, but you shouldn’t post this when your class allow you to:
lost -> stealth -> run out of combat -> health regen -> come back -> repeat
If I follow your unfair idea I could write:
1. try to kill someone
2. fail, stealth and run away
3. try to find a less skilled player
If ppls are mad whiners, some others are mangy sheep killers.

I don’t think a nerf on Thief is good, a rework would be.

People are just terrible at the game.

I fought a bunch of Thieves last night throughout all the BLs and EB (solo). Guess what, most of those were backstab builds and I beat their burst all night. Stun-breakers are great at messing their big burst up. Stun Breaker and I roll far enough away to get my setup rolling.

People seriously need to learn to play against Thieves instead of asking the devs to make a profession worse, because they are too stupid to carry a stun-breaker and act a little more defensively.

chtiyonki.6284:

Red Falcon.8257:

It’s the WoW player logic:
Die -> forums -> cry for nerfs
instead of
Die -> L2P -> win

Unfortunally it’s not always a L2P issue, if 2 gladiators fights, 1 with no weapons against 1 with an awesome pistol, the one with no weaps have few chances to win. If you want balance the fight you’ll nerf the guy with the pistol or buff the guy with no weap.

I also think if some ppls crying for nerf, on the other side some ppls crying for no nerf… and if someone cry for no nerf, an other will cry for a nerf… so what, are we all crying ? nerd war ? It’s not about a WoW logic or something else, it’s just human logic: ppls reporting their feeling.

To me the both side (for nerf and against nerf) have good reasons to complaint.

Sithaco.4673:

It goes..

1. get killed by a thief
2. alt + f4
3. whine on forums.

I’m not asking a Thief nerf, but you shouldn’t post this when your class allow you to:
lost -> stealth -> run out of combat -> health regen -> come back -> repeat
If I follow your unfair idea I could write:
1. try to kill someone
2. fail, stealth and run away
3. try to find a less skilled player
If ppls are mad whiners, some others are pro-nubs-killers.

I don’t think a nerf on Thief is good, a rework would be.

Cripples and Stuns work wonders on a fleeing Thief, just sayin’.

You won the fight if you got a Thief thinking about escaping.

Immobilize and knockdowns, don’t blow em at once force em to use up escape CDs.

Does anyone else here note the delicious irony of a THIEF lecturing others that if they run a glass cannon, they’re automatically a baddie, l2p and deserved to die anyway?

>looks to see what forum he’s on<

Didn’t think so.

The GC == baddie argument applies to ALL classes, even the thief……

Cloacking = cowardness. Not wanting to pay repair bills. Cheating in a fight you actually almost lost.

Combine that with Heartseeker, Backstab and Cloack and dagger, and you got whining XD I think it’s definitely deserved on the mentioned skills (the complaints), otherwise thief seems ok-ish.

But i still don’t see why thief should pay less repair cost then other profesisons.

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Cloacking = cowardness. Not wanting to pay repair bills. Cheating in a fight you actually almost lost.

Combine that with Heartseeker, Backstab and Cloack and dagger, and you got whining XD I think it’s definitely deserved on the mentioned skills (the complaints), otherwise thief seems ok-ish.

But i still don’t see why thief should pay less repair cost then other profesisons.

Really? Did you just type that and hit reply thinking that it was a good post?

Repair cost only matter WHEN you die, not if you get hit or downed. You can take my stealth away if and only if you give me the same HP pool and Armor rating as a Warrior. Our stealth is our damage mitigation. Have you seen a Thief tank build? If you have, you would notice that it is a Sword Pistol build using blinds to face tank the mob. IF we do get hit, even stacked with Toughness and Vitality. We get WRECKED. That is why we have all of these mobility and evasion moves, to give us survivability.

We aren’t cheating, you are just bad at awareness. Good players usually always know where the Thief and or Mesmer is.

As far as the skill you want nerfed. GUESS WHAT! Those three have been nerfed multiple times. I don’t think that they are going to nerf them again. You are going to destroy our burst capability with anymore nerfs and the backstab build will be useless and our role further diminished in the meta.

Well you can have the lower repair bills, but the Op-burst must be looked at, on the skill I mentioned. And sorry to hear you are hurt by what I say, fellow thief. But their must be a reason, you and many others keep choosing the thief over other professions. It won’t be for PVE reasons i’m sure of that. If they decide to keep Thief as it is, i’ll soon make mine lvl 80. Not because I like it, not becaus it’s my playstyle, but Because in pvp it’s the only viable profession against thief, (wich are their a lot now).

And yeah they nerfed my precious Guardian. I adapted and still played. Not to hard. Why are you so hurt by the fact op-skills got nerfed? Those skills give thiefs easy kills. Do you get satisfaction, by single button pressed, to get victory? I can tell you, on my other profs, i must press over 25 buttons to kill an enemy. At least. (1 vs 1).

I think thief is just a little to easy now, combined with cloacking (most popular effect in every game) and it’s obviously very popular in pvp. To popular imo.

Try to do 15k damage with a warrior in 4 secs. (Don’t mention Eviscarate/Kill shot, those are way to easy to dodge, thief skills are very hard to dodge, so it must be similar ‘hard to dodge combo’). Try to do same with ele. I tell you you will fail in both cases. So why should you be able to do what no other prof can do?

And stop whining about squishyness. You got MEDIUM armor, not light armor. That makes more of a difference then you realize now. And low hp, don’t make me laugh. you got 100% crit rate in stealth trait. That means you only need Valkyrie armor to complement. This gets you easely over 18k hp.

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Well you can have the lower repair bills, but the Op-burst must be looked at, on the skill I mentioned. And sorry to hear you are hurt by what I say, fellow thief. But their must be a reason, you and many others keep choosing the thief over other professions. It won’t be for PVE reasons i’m sure of that. If they decide to keep Thief as it is, i’ll soon make mine lvl 80. Not because I like it, not becaus it’s my playstyle, but Because in pvp it’s the only viable profession against thief, (wich are their a lot now).

And yeah they nerfed my precious Guardian. I adapted and still played. Not to hard. Why are you so hurt by the fact op-skills got nerfed? Those skills give thiefs easy kills. Do you get satisfaction, by single button pressed, to get victory? I can tell you, on my other profs, i must press over 25 buttons to kill an enemy. At least. (1 vs 1).

I think thief is just a little to easy now, combined with cloacking (most popular effect in every game) and it’s obviously very popular in pvp. To popular imo.

Try to do 15k damage with a warrior in 4 secs. (Don’t mention Eviscarate/Kill shot, those are way to easy to dodge, thief skills are very hard to dodge, so it must be similar ‘hard to dodge combo’). Try to do same with ele. I tell you you will fail in both cases. So why should you be able to do what no other prof can do?

And stop whining about squishyness. You got MEDIUM armor, not light armor. That makes more of a difference then you realize now. And low hp, don’t make me laugh. you got 100% crit rate in stealth trait. That means you only need Valkyrie armor to complement. This gets you easely over 18k hp.

Nice try, see what you are trying to do there (implying some kittenedness on my part). I’m not upset in the slightest. Go ahead and nerf the Thief, it isn’t the big numbers that have me playing Thief (I am talking about these QQ about burst because there are others that like to play it and people are misrepresenting the facts).

I actually play a tanky Thief. I like the playstyle of the Thief. I like being all over the map and ducking in and out doing hit and run tactics. It is fun to me. I also play it in PvE and am wildly successful at it and like how it performs in PvE.

It might blow your mind, but I actually agreed with most of the Thief nerfs. Heartseeker needed to be nerfed because it benefited to much from spamming, not now. You see someone spamming Heartseeker, then you are looking at a bad Thief and a free kill. I agreed with the reveal debuff (people could almost spam Backstabs and it was OP it did adversely affect people with Pistol on the main hand because it limited stacks of bleeds with the stealth attack.) and I think that they should increase the timer to like 5-8 secs, but if they do that they need to increase the effectiveness of stealth attacks. Mainly because it will drop DPS considerably and I think that 5-8 secs is more than enough time for someone to CC and burst me down. Cloak and Dagger damage nerf didn’t really matter to me or any good thief, why? Because it is more for the utility than the damage. 3 stack of vulnerability isn’t that big of a deal and the damage really wasn’t that high to begin with.

As a Warrior, it is easy to hit high burst (I have one). Yes you do use abilities like Killshot and Eviscerate, sorry that you want to exclude those because it devalues your argument. I have no problem hitting people with 100 Blades and Eviscerate. People that are having issues with those, is because of skill. Not an inherent imbalance to the skills. If you are a glass cannon Warrior, you don’t just run willy nilly into the fray and expect to burst down one person when 3-5 others are standing there with him. You let the tankier people engaged and then suprise buttsecks the enemy with your burst combo. Build adrenaline and wait what remains of your 8 sec CD and do it again. You go down quick when you stack Pow/Pre, so all those dumb glass cannonWarriors QQing about their abilities being telegraphed will get no sympathy from me. Your enemy shouldn’t see you coming in the first place.

As for Thief squishyness. Yes we have medium armor, but look at our utility skills. We don’t have anything that gives us protection, stability or any other effects that make it easy for a face to face fight. Hence why we have stealth, shadowstep/return, infiltraitors strike/return and condition removals. Our damage mitigation comes from evasion. We have medium armor only because most of our most damaging abilities are done in melee range.

Oh and if you are having problems with repair bills, then you have to learn how to sell to vendors or something. I have completely broken everything and it costs very little to repair. This isn’t WoW, as much as some would like it to be.

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Try to do 15k damage with a warrior in 4 secs. (Don’t mention Eviscarate/Kill shot, those are way to easy to dodge, thief skills are very hard to dodge, so it must be similar ‘hard to dodge combo’). Try to do same with ele. I tell you you will fail in both cases. So why should you be able to do what no other prof can do?

Both of those classes (Warrior/Ele) can do 15k damage or more when built as a GC, and both of those classes can do so with PB AoE. Engineers, and Mesmers can also do this as GC (Haven’t seen Rangers do this yet, or Necros. Only Guardians I’ve seen do this is to people that stand still next to their whirl…which is 100% L2P). Take a look at Youtube to find many videos about this. Try looking up “[class] does no damage” if “GC [class]” doesn’t bring you any results.

And I have done so with an Ele, many many times (I’ve also had this done to me…many many times).

As for “hard to dodge” if you can’t see the thief coming at you from 900 range…how do you ever see the “KS war” from 1500? And don’t say it’s an obvious set up, cuz so is a thief running at you then POOF he disappears and you take the first part of his spike…guess what hes doing? Improve your twitch response and dodge or use your stun breaker.

I’m ignoring your comment about thieves taking 100% crit from stealth, as most GC thieves aren’t taking that (they want 20% more damage when you be < 50%). 100% crit from stealth only affect at best 1/3 of thier attacks, probably closer to 1/4 or 1/5, where 20% more damage affects a little less then half of their attacks against you.

People QQ about thieves simpy because of stealth.

Thief will always receive the most QQ because no one likes getting killed by an invisible force.

Dee Jay.2460:

If you have 1 QQ thread about a class every other day, that’s normal and to be expected in an MMO. But having 2+ active threads in just about every relevant forum complaining about Thieves, you know they might be on to something.

people are so lazy to learn how to counter the thief class, do you expect them to search for threads already talking about it? of course not, they’ll go the lazy route and create a new one.

this also gives them more attention. you know people craaaaaave attention. so instead of being buried in page 5 of a thread, they’ll start a new one and get direct responses to them

What is it with people demanding Thief BUFFS?

Thief is at a really good place right now. Just like Mesmer (and arguably Warrior). If you tweaked them either way they would either be super OP or unplayable.

Once the culling issue gets taken care of, the supposed thief imbalances will be solved.

CrazyAce.3842:

What is it with people demanding Thief BUFFS?

Thief is at a really good place right now. Just like Mesmer (and arguably Warrior). If you tweaked them either way they would either be super OP or unplayable.

Once the culling issue gets taken care of, the supposed thief imbalances will be solved.

I wish it was that simply. Players have been crying about us Thieves since beta. This is the way it is and always has been.

It is getting pretty ridiculous though. Every day there are at least 2 new QQ Nerf threads on our forums.

I really wish that the Mods would come in here and close them and direct them to the feedback thread. Most of them are not constructive and borderline rude and insulting.

I’m sorry for wanting to go something else other than a GC… that’s why i’m asking for a buff in the first place. Because right now you either go GC or GG.

DigitalMaster.4870:

I’m sorry for wanting to go something else other than a GC… that’s why i’m asking for a buff in the first place. Because right now you either go GC or GG.

P/D is purty fun in PvE, SPvP and TPvP.

I love just popping in and out of stealth. It is hilarious that I have 3-5 people trying to fight me on one point while my team is killing the other 1 or 2 guys leftover and we are slowly building a huge lead.

Sure I might not be killing all of them or I kill a couple that are just really bad, but they are distracted by little ole me and didn’t realize that they are 50- 75 points further away while trying to kill me.

Heard that S/D is pretty fun too. I might try that one next.