Guild Wars 2

We try harder, be proud that you play a class that no one understands. When someone tells you to reroll a warrior, just practice and learn other classes so you can handle them better. The nerfs will keep coming, just stay positive and know that you are better than they are because you wont succumb to the pressure of leaving our cherished class.

Have hope, we can pull through this.

See that upper level off to the right of his zerg? Kill him

I kill enemies with regen all the time, so I don’t agree with you. This patch only nerf the scrub builds that rely on perma stealth. Perma stealth was an abuse of the mechanics. It’s been fixed. I like these changes.

Keep playing Thief to the best of your ability, even if you fail over and over from 1shots and lockdowns. Maybe they’ll show pity and realize how much of a beaten dead horse they are and do something. ;/ I’ll keep on using broken skills and utilities, even though I apparently get them nerfed, but they’re bound to realize something rational eventually.

Maybe I should whip out some trap builds again. Maybe I’ll get needle trap nerfed and make the devs look supicious.

Sanduskel.1850:

I kill enemies with regen all the time, so I don’t agree with you. This patch only nerf the scrub builds that rely on perma stealth. Perma stealth was an abuse of the mechanics. It’s been fixed. I like these changes.

Explain the sword nerfs and making a build that sucks vs conditions suck even more vs conditions.

Doggie.3184:

Keep playing Thief to the best of your ability, even if you fail over and over from 1shots and lockdowns. Maybe they’ll show pity and realize how much of a beaten dead horse they are and do something. ;/ I’ll keep on using broken skills and utilities, even though I apparently get them nerfed, but they’re bound to realize something rational eventually.

No! Dont make them pity us! When that happens, they win. Right now they are jealous of us, our movement, our high damage and whatnot. MAKE THEM HATE US, not for the class, but for our brotherhood.

RISE UP FELLOW THIEFS AND BE PROUD OF ONE ANOTHER.

We should be out there in swarms slaughtering warriors and guardians, and when they nerf us down again, we get right back up and do it again!

All I’m trying to say is to be proud of what we have.

Doggie.3184:

Keep playing Thief to the best of your ability, even if you fail over and over from 1shots and lockdowns. Maybe they’ll show pity and realize how much of a beaten dead horse they are and do something. ;/ I’ll keep on using broken skills and utilities, even though I apparently get them nerfed, but they’re bound to realize something rational eventually.

Maybe I should whip out some trap builds again. Maybe I’ll get needle trap nerfed and make the devs look supicious.

Sanduskel.1850:

I kill enemies with regen all the time, so I don’t agree with you. This patch only nerf the scrub builds that rely on perma stealth. Perma stealth was an abuse of the mechanics. It’s been fixed. I like these changes.

Explain the sword nerfs and making a build that sucks vs conditions suck even more vs conditions.

YOu need to be clearer. I honestly cannot understand what you wrote.

lkol at these be proud posts… seriously does any other class have to perfect their skill level so kittening high just to be decent on a class like this. With all these nerf bats coming in and thief being in an already kitten state we are guna get kitten on even more with barely no roaming potential left.

ALl the top tier thief players are leaving this game, caed quit one of the only good spvp d/p thiefs, yishis ditched his thief for engi and lux the rank 9 thief hasnt even logged into his thief for a week.

GG man

Honestly i just want what I had in wow, shamans where in the same boat as thiefs, but we stayed strong and got buffed pretty decently… but I could really care less, im quitting gw as soon as eso comes out.

While I agree that now we will be more vulnerable to conditions, don’t forget that the main source of those conditions (Necros, Engis) will have their overall condi power slightly decreased.
This does not affect Condi Wars (BUT they can only apply 3 conditions so we won’t have much problems with that) and PU Mesmers (which will be even more deadly after the patch).

Sanduskel.1850:

Doggie.3184:

Keep playing Thief to the best of your ability, even if you fail over and over from 1shots and lockdowns. Maybe they’ll show pity and realize how much of a beaten dead horse they are and do something. ;/ I’ll keep on using broken skills and utilities, even though I apparently get them nerfed, but they’re bound to realize something rational eventually.

Maybe I should whip out some trap builds again. Maybe I’ll get needle trap nerfed and make the devs look supicious.

Sanduskel.1850:

I kill enemies with regen all the time, so I don’t agree with you. This patch only nerf the scrub builds that rely on perma stealth. Perma stealth was an abuse of the mechanics. It’s been fixed. I like these changes.

Explain the sword nerfs and making a build that sucks vs conditions suck even more vs conditions.

YOu need to be clearer. I honestly cannot understand what you wrote.

Sword is extremely vulnerable to condition damage when built around evasion instead of stealth.

In desperate situations you can spend ini on shadow return one or more times to quickly drop some, but it’ll have a cast time now, making it take longer and cause even more risk. Signet of Agility alone is practically useless when you have a million necro and/or mesmer conditions on you. Meow.

They’re doing the same pointless nerf to sword that they did to Shadow Trap, a completely innocent utility skill barely anyone uses.

I actually use Sigil of Generosity to reduce the condition hell I face but since it procs regardless of if you have them on you or not it doesn’t always work out. It’s awesome when it does though, wish they’d buff/fix it. :x

and more meow.

FrownyClown.8402:

See that upper level off to the right of his zerg? Kill him

^This
Tooshort.

FrownyClown.8402:

See that upper level off to the right of his zerg? Kill him

See the Arena mark on that f****ng char in the zerg??? Bite it!!

i understand that permastealth needed a nerf and that the s/d evasion was slightly too much but the problem with the upcoming nerfs is that they also affect other builds…

the only two builds remaining are d/d and p/d conditions.
p/d will still be decent but d/d is just not enough anymore because of blocks blinds or simply dodging.

i dont think we will see buffs good enough to get us out of the mud again… i hope i will be proven wrong.

Sanduskel.1850:

I kill enemies with regen all the time, so I don’t agree with you. This patch only nerf the scrub builds that rely on perma stealth. Perma stealth was an abuse of the mechanics. It’s been fixed. I like these changes.

1. Only scrubs call winning builds scrub builds.
2. The patch nerfs evasion builds to genius.

How does thief survive during combat in wvw? There are three ways as I see it: stealth, evasion and shadow stepping.

All three survival methods are getting hit with the Dec. 10 patch. They must want thieves to die more.

grubnick.7849:

How does thief survive during combat in wvw? There are three ways as I see it: stealth, evasion and shadow stepping.

All three survival methods are getting hit with the Dec. 10 patch. They must want thieves to die more.

I think they want you to teleport yourself INTO the zerg while trying to stomp the straggler u downed. Lol in all seriousness in its current state I will never use hard to catch which is wat seems to be getting forced on us. Should be called hard to justify.

TsukiNoEi.4570:

in zerg wars, we have lowest armor with low regen (and only regen in stealth)
in 1v1, we can only stealth and run away, none with regen can be kill by a thief

so, what the **** can we do in WVW?

this shows 90% thief players play the class for its broken mechanics rather than relying on skill try using your shortbow for once in wvw

as for the regen comment your joking right ? thief is pretty much the only class landing up to 7-10k hits without might on players with 3k armor .

what to do in wvw hmm

Scouting,Assasinating ,support,build stuff,fix stuff ,whatever you feel like doing

I’m roaming with my thief since blobVSblob aint fun at all. And i doubt smth will change after patch.

Tho I agree thief will be hitted hard if the patch goes live.

Hahhaha, hilarious to see all these perma stealth scrubs crying xDD

Rezzet.3614:

TsukiNoEi.4570:

in zerg wars, we have lowest armor with low regen (and only regen in stealth)
in 1v1, we can only stealth and run away, none with regen can be kill by a thief

so, what the **** can we do in WVW?

this shows 90% thief players play the class for its broken mechanics rather than relying on skill try using your shortbow for once in wvw

as for the regen comment your joking right ? thief is pretty much the only class landing up to 7-10k hits without might on players with 3k armor .

what to do in wvw hmm

Scouting,Assasinating ,support,build stuff,fix stuff ,whatever you feel like doing

That “broken” mechanic is the only way to make sense in WvW and not get overwhelmed by conditions and guard/warrior damage. Scouting and Assassinating dont happen near as much without that build. PvP is the reason people play WvW so using repairs, building siege that you cant even stand in place to use is pretty much the lamest defense I’ve ever heard to why those nerfs make sense.

You don’t play thief and if you do, you certainly dont play it well. Spamming shortbow 4 and 2 in a zerg the epitome of effortless. I could do that successfully with 1 hand and my eye’s closed.

So I sat here and banged out my opinion on the forecasted nerfs. Reread it. Was about to post it. Then I thought, they don’t care. Saw it in the past. Was the reason I stopped playing gw1. Looks like history is going to repeat itself. They didn’t learn from the first go ‘round and I’m probably going to quit. I’m sure the above average to poor players are going to be happier knowing another thief is thinking about quitting.

Edit: You may want to get someone to re-write this as evasion and stealth will be a thing of the past

Every major update I am glad that I stopped investing in my thief. Still my favorite class but constant big nerfs are too much for me.

Hope it improves for the class but not holding my breath.

Blood~

Bloodgruve.6038:

Every major update I am glad that I stopped investing in my thief. Still my favorite class but constant big nerfs are too much for me.

Hope it improves for the class but not holding my breath.

Blood~

Every time update is nerfing,
Every time update, I am disappointed.

Neoheart.2750:

Lol in all seriousness in its current state I will never use hard to catch which is wat seems to be getting forced on us. Should be called hard to justify.

Hahahaha, this is something I can get behind! I won’t be traiting hard to justify in my s/d build after this patch… I’ll just be shelving it completely.

Hype.8032:

Neoheart.2750:

Lol in all seriousness in its current state I will never use hard to catch which is wat seems to be getting forced on us. Should be called hard to justify.

Hahahaha, this is something I can get behind! I won’t be traiting hard to justify in my s/d build after this patch… I’ll just be shelving it completely.

And a few more nerf, you won’t shelving any weapon set again.
You will just shelving thief, or shelving GW2

Well done Anet, you win!!!

In WvW, I usually end up spamming cluster-bomb (shotgun style), since I don’t like roaming/scouting. But one of the two things happens when I do that… either I go in just a bit behind the frontliners (guards/warriors) and get quite a bit of kills but almost surely get downed (or even die) at which point i get called out by our commander … OR i go in with the backliners and barely pick up any kills either because they all got trampled by the frontline or the other backliners are able to do more AoE then my cluster and kill em before I can even tag em-bomb….

While I understand that scouting/roaming is fun for some people, it’s not fun for me and it’s also A LOT less rewarding. If anything, being requested to roam/scout is like a punishment to me.

So I think, my thief will become a berry picking mining lumberjack. But I hear that thieves are OP for that as well, as they are able to chop trees, pick berries, and mine vines faster then other classes! Even faster in stealth! So they will eventually, probably, get nerfed in that respect as well.
(Watch out crafting thieves! they’re coming after you as well! we all know you can craft 100 items a second when you stealth and craft)

Zero Day.2594:

In WvW, I usually end up spamming cluster-bomb (shotgun style), since I don’t like roaming/scouting. But one of the two things happens when I do that… either I go in just a bit behind the frontliners (guards/warriors) and get quite a bit of kills but almost surely get downed (or even die) at which point i get called out by our commander … OR i go in with the backliners and barely pick up any kills either because they all got trampled by the frontline or the other backliners are able to do more AoE then my cluster and kill em before I can even tag em-bomb….

While I understand that scouting/roaming is fun for some people, it’s not fun for me and it’s also A LOT less rewarding. If anything, being requested to roam/scout is like a punishment to me.

So I think, my thief will become a berry picking mining lumberjack. But I hear that thieves are OP for that as well, as they are able to chop trees, pick berries, and mine vines faster then other classes! Even faster in stealth! So they will eventually, probably, get nerfed in that respect as well.
(Watch out crafting thieves! they’re coming after you as well! we all know you can craft 100 items a second when you stealth and craft)

Well why did you roll a thief when you clearly actually wanted to play warrior?

They want all thieves play Glass Cannon.

I start to retake my old Glass Cannon build for the next update. I will expect a lot of QQ incoming XD

I dont like permastealth, but i think was fun play with a D/P build based on stealth.

Master of Timespace.2548:

Zero Day.2594:

In WvW, I usually end up spamming cluster-bomb (shotgun style), since I don’t like roaming/scouting. But one of the two things happens when I do that… either I go in just a bit behind the frontliners (guards/warriors) and get quite a bit of kills but almost surely get downed (or even die) at which point i get called out by our commander … OR i go in with the backliners and barely pick up any kills either because they all got trampled by the frontline or the other backliners are able to do more AoE then my cluster and kill em before I can even tag em-bomb….

While I understand that scouting/roaming is fun for some people, it’s not fun for me and it’s also A LOT less rewarding. If anything, being requested to roam/scout is like a punishment to me.

So I think, my thief will become a berry picking mining lumberjack. But I hear that thieves are OP for that as well, as they are able to chop trees, pick berries, and mine vines faster then other classes! Even faster in stealth! So they will eventually, probably, get nerfed in that respect as well.
(Watch out crafting thieves! they’re coming after you as well! we all know you can craft 100 items a second when you stealth and craft)

Well why did you roll a thief when you clearly actually wanted to play warrior?

Huh? Warrior can roam/scout and zerg, but thief can only roam/scout? Would you say to a warrior you clearly wanted to play a thief if the warrior says he wants to roam?

Watching what the Thief is going through in GW2 reminds me exactly of what every other Rogue has gone through in MMO’s past.

In particular, I played a Witch Elf in WAR for the longest time – same story.

In the end, I don’t think that Rogues make good classes for MMO’s – we are inherently a solo class – and PvP is a group activity.

The Thief should actually do more of what the Warrior does – the problem is simply that whoever designed these classes got them mixed up.

The Warrior should do something else – I don’t know what.

But after playing a Sword/Sword Warrior to 25 – I now understand what the Thief is missing in general.

If you’re trying to push in with the zerg as a Thief, you’re gonna have a bad time.

FrownyClown.8402:

See that upper level off to the right of his zerg? Kill him

This guy’s on the mark. As a Thief, you play the role of the skirmisher, the backline hitter, the ganker. Its not your job to faceroll through a wall of red nameplates and come out unscathed.

Its your job to find the staff Elementalist in the back and drop her sorry kittens, before her buddies know what happened to their water fields!

Its your job to pick at the heels of a zerg before they collide with your allied zerg.

Its your job to herd those kittens into a false sense of security, to put them so off-balance, to make them so focused on you that they don’t see the Warrior coming up on their blindside to smash them into the dirt!

TsukiNoEi.4570:

none with regen can be kill by a thief

You are wrong here, completely wrong. Speak for yourself.

The thiefs main capability lies in scouting and havoc. Exactly what it was designed for. Few if any other classes are as durable far from a way point. A couple of thieves can basically starve supply out of most keeps.

After all that, thieves are still a sight to behold in skirmish play. Groups that employ one gain great burst and surprise attacks that frequently turn fights.

In a zerg we are limited, but Signet of Malice with Dagger Storm and Cluster Bomb is fairly powerful. It has great AoE and heals like a machine. After that back to clean up duty.

deepwinter.9015:

If you’re trying to push in with the zerg as a Thief, you’re gonna have a bad time.

FrownyClown.8402:

See that upper level off to the right of his zerg? Kill him

Its your job to find the staff Elementalist in the back and drop her sorry kittens, before her buddies know what happened to their water fields!

Its your job to pick at the heels of a zerg before they collide with your allied zerg.

Its your job to herd those kittens into a false sense of security, to put them so off-balance, to make them so focused on you that they don’t see the Warrior coming up on their blindside to smash them into the dirt!

All of that would be awesome if the Thief excelled at it, but it doesn’t.

We would need a lot more move speed and evasion for that to work consistently.

ipan.4356:

deepwinter.9015:

If you’re trying to push in with the zerg as a Thief, you’re gonna have a bad time.

FrownyClown.8402:

See that upper level off to the right of his zerg? Kill him

Its your job to find the staff Elementalist in the back and drop her sorry kittens, before her buddies know what happened to their water fields!

Its your job to pick at the heels of a zerg before they collide with your allied zerg.

Its your job to herd those kittens into a false sense of security, to put them so off-balance, to make them so focused on you that they don’t see the Warrior coming up on their blindside to smash them into the dirt!

All of that would be awesome if the Thief excelled at it, but it doesn’t.

We would need a lot more move speed and evasion for that to work consistently.

Don’t know if you guys played GW1 and remember BoA (Burst of Aggression) build on Assassins (errr… yeah Assassin – sin) prior to it’s nerf(s) … but that build was pretty well defined for an assassin/assassination… it worked along the lines of: the sin would pick a target (ele), engage them with some form of a shadow step (which returned them back to the starting position after the target died), drop the target in ~3 seconds, when the target dies the sin is returned to their starting position and has a stupid “long” CD (on BoA i think it was) of 45 seconds, for the 45 seconds the sin is relatively useless/harmless (usually meaning they would disengage or DIE).

So the problem was (a bit of calibration to the damage), the sin would drop medium and light armor targets in ~3 seconds and would half heavy armor targets (making it OP)… when it probably should drop light targets in ~3 seconds, half medium targets and scratch heavies. The CD might have been a bit too low too (depending on context). But all in all, they did what they were named to do and that is to assassinate (and then gtfo or die like a proper assassin). Another problem is that people don’t really want to be assassinated by said assassins, rather they want to fight (and not be dropped in ~3 seconds). Those people that didn’t want to be killed like that also didn’t understand that the sin, when running that build, was ONLY meant to do that (and if he’s average he would get 1 kill per death).

(TL/DR:) Guess what I’m trying to say is…

People don’t want to be dropped in 3 seconds, regardless of what it means for the person that’s killing them (or the over-all/global context).

Also… :| a bit of smart-kitten -ier.
:D A thief is a thief, they steal things, maybe hurt/kill things along the way. Assassins, assassinate.

Now… i would totally love to play that assassin style thief, but they WILL be called OP.

:D found a video of that gw1 build:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKAiodYdUbQ
For some reason I thought it was BoA… guess not, maybe it was a variant. Anyways, it’s not a montage it’s just an AB match… sometimes he underestimated/shouldn’t have go in… but hey, it’s OP when it works… right?

perm stealth thief in wvw is simply op…

Sanduskel.1850:

I kill enemies with regen all the time, so I don’t agree with you. This patch only nerf the scrub builds that rely on perma stealth. Perma stealth was an abuse of the mechanics. It’s been fixed. I like these changes.

Sanduskel please stop with permastealth hate.

You are in every single thread talking trash about this build.

If you don’t like it just don’t play it, there are a lot more complains of perma evade than this.

There are a lot of “Thieves” here talking trash of according to them cheesy builds . . . stop already let people to play what ever they want.

Every good build in this game can be considered as cheesy so remember that and stop showing no sense hate everywhere.

SoLeciTO.3490:

Every good build in this game can be considered as cheesy so remember that and stop showing no sense hate everywhere.

Well said.

ipan.4356:

Watching what the Thief is going through in GW2 reminds me exactly of what every other Rogue has gone through in MMO’s past.

In particular, I played a Witch Elf in WAR for the longest time – same story.

In the end, I don’t think that Rogues make good classes for MMO’s – we are inherently a solo class – and PvP is a group activity.

I dunno, DAoC did pretty good(which is what lured me here in the 1st place), there were entire stealth wars while the main skirmishes were going on, was quite exciting. The different tiers of stealth made for some compelling gameplay.

Fletch.3572:

DAoC did pretty good(which is what lured me here in the 1st place), there were entire stealth wars while the main skirmishes were going on, was quite exciting. The different tiers of stealth made for some compelling gameplay.

How did it work in DAOC? Could GW2 thieves for example have a level 25 Shadow Arts minor trait that allows them to see enemy stealthed players like they see allies. Something like that could help with the attitude towards long stealths in wvw.

SoLeciTO.3490:

Sanduskel.1850:

I kill enemies with regen all the time, so I don’t agree with you. This patch only nerf the scrub builds that rely on perma stealth. Perma stealth was an abuse of the mechanics. It’s been fixed. I like these changes.

Sanduskel please stop with permastealth hate.

You are in every single thread talking trash about this build.

If you don’t like it just don’t play it, there are a lot more complains of perma evade than this.

There are a lot of “Thieves” here talking trash of according to them cheesy builds . . . stop already let people to play what ever they want.

Every good build in this game can be considered as cheesy so remember that and stop showing no sense hate everywhere.

I am sorry that you are upset. I just hate all the negativity about a wonderful patch (imho anyway).

to subject of cluster bomb and choke spam: my necro can do as much and even better…. while having 50k HP (in plague, 25ish K outside) and absurd amount of toughness

related to topic: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/Most-useless-class-in-WvW/first#post3154059

ipan.4356:

deepwinter.9015:

If you’re trying to push in with the zerg as a Thief, you’re gonna have a bad time.

FrownyClown.8402:

See that upper level off to the right of his zerg? Kill him

Its your job to find the staff Elementalist in the back and drop her sorry kittens, before her buddies know what happened to their water fields!

Its your job to pick at the heels of a zerg before they collide with your allied zerg.

Its your job to herd those kittens into a false sense of security, to put them so off-balance, to make them so focused on you that they don’t see the Warrior coming up on their blindside to smash them into the dirt!

All of that would be awesome if the Thief excelled at it, but it doesn’t.

We would need a lot more move speed and evasion for that to work consistently.

Perhaps that’s how things work in your league, but I have great success in my Gold league hunting backline casters.

Then again, I work with a team of people on voice chat and have a partner thief to pick off targets. Scattering the sheep is just as much our job as slaughtering the strays. If our teammates get the stomp instead of us, then we set up the next lamb.

Before the season, my team didn’t run any thieves. The first week we introduced two (myself and my partner) and we’ve been crushing groups twice our size – in no small part because of the Thief’s excellent ability to harass casters and scatter enemy positions.

Falassion.8031:

They want all thieves play Glass Cannon.

I start to retake my old Glass Cannon build for the next update. I will expect a lot of QQ incoming XD

I dont like permastealth, but i think was fun play with a D/P build based on stealth.

The thing is, you can currently be BOTH glass cannon and perma stealth d/p. To perma stealth as a thief, you need nothing but d/p set and 10 points in the stealth trait line.

Huh? Warrior can roam/scout and zerg, but thief can only roam/scout? Would you say to a warrior you clearly wanted to play a thief if the warrior says he wants to roam?

You can zerg as a thief but your role will not be the same as that of a warrior. A good zerg thief harasses the enemy backline casters and provides stealth to downed allies, for example. Of course it will not yield as much loot as spamming #1 in the middle of a blob, but that is just a very general flaw of Guild Wars 2 reward system where the easiest thing gives most loot.

Mika.9815:

Fletch.3572:

DAoC did pretty good(which is what lured me here in the 1st place), there were entire stealth wars while the main skirmishes were going on, was quite exciting. The different tiers of stealth made for some compelling gameplay.

How did it work in DAOC? Could GW2 thieves for example have a level 25 Shadow Arts minor trait that allows them to see enemy stealthed players like they see allies. Something like that could help with the attitude towards long stealths in wvw.

Kinda like that yeah. The “assassin” archetype had the highest level of stealth, which no normal character could typically find. so they could lurk, kill, and gtfo.

They could also detect the “scout” archetype, which had stealth, but not as powerful, and their break stealth attack wasn’t as powerful. They could however spec to detect the assassins and ruin their day, or plink off reinforcements with their range attacks.

It was fun, you could basically spec to be an anti insta gibber character. It’s been quite a few years, but that’s kinda how it worked in a nutshell.

Zero Day.2594:

ipan.4356:

deepwinter.9015:

If you’re trying to push in with the zerg as a Thief, you’re gonna have a bad time.

FrownyClown.8402:

See that upper level off to the right of his zerg? Kill him

Its your job to find the staff Elementalist in the back and drop her sorry kittens, before her buddies know what happened to their water fields!

Its your job to pick at the heels of a zerg before they collide with your allied zerg.

Its your job to herd those kittens into a false sense of security, to put them so off-balance, to make them so focused on you that they don’t see the Warrior coming up on their blindside to smash them into the dirt!

All of that would be awesome if the Thief excelled at it, but it doesn’t.

We would need a lot more move speed and evasion for that to work consistently.

Don’t know if you guys played GW1 and remember BoA (Burst of Aggression) build on Assassins (errr… yeah Assassin – sin) prior to it’s nerf(s) … but that build was pretty well defined for an assassin/assassination… it worked along the lines of: the sin would pick a target (ele), engage them with some form of a shadow step (which returned them back to the starting position after the target died), drop the target in ~3 seconds, when the target dies the sin is returned to their starting position and has a stupid “long” CD (on BoA i think it was) of 45 seconds, for the 45 seconds the sin is relatively useless/harmless (usually meaning they would disengage or DIE).

So the problem was (a bit of calibration to the damage), the sin would drop medium and light armor targets in ~3 seconds and would half heavy armor targets (making it OP)… when it probably should drop light targets in ~3 seconds, half medium targets and scratch heavies. The CD might have been a bit too low too (depending on context). But all in all, they did what they were named to do and that is to assassinate (and then gtfo or die like a proper assassin). Another problem is that people don’t really want to be assassinated by said assassins, rather they want to fight (and not be dropped in ~3 seconds). Those people that didn’t want to be killed like that also didn’t understand that the sin, when running that build, was ONLY meant to do that (and if he’s average he would get 1 kill per death).

(TL/DR:) Guess what I’m trying to say is…

People don’t want to be dropped in 3 seconds, regardless of what it means for the person that’s killing them (or the over-all/global context).

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Say, the thief was redesigned to be an assassin. Let’s allow them to drop light armor targets in 3 seconds, at the expense that they need to strike medium targets twice while also not being able to kill heavy targets, and they can only do that every 60 seconds (during the 60 seconds “CD” they’re very harmless). So when zergs enage and thieves jump on eles/mesmer/necs and insta-gib (drop/kill) them, then in the 60 seconds CD most likely get trampled to death by warriors/guards/rangers/enginees/other-thieves, the eles/mesmers/necs will complain on the forums (“thieves OP, they drop me in a blink”) regardless of context or what happened to the thief after.

Also… :| a bit of smart-kitten -ier.
:D A thief is a thief, they steal things, maybe hurt/kill things along the way. Assassins, assassinate.

Now… i would totally love to play that assassin style thief, but they WILL be called OP.

:D found a video of that gw1 build:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKAiodYdUbQ
For some reason I thought it was BoA… guess not, maybe it was a variant. Anyways, it’s not a montage it’s just an AB match… sometimes he underestimated/shouldn’t have go in… but hey, it’s OP when it works… right?

Fully agree.

This is what makes this kind of class inherently unstable in any MMO – and sheds a very clear light on the current Thief problems.

A class like this is meant to be OP – if it isn’t then it fails in every other regard, and hence we get the “Roll a Warrior” comments.

Makes perfect sense.

I miss DAoC… Such a great game.

While a Warrior can roam, he doesn’t have access to shadow refuge (the most powerful ability for roamers) to slip away from zergs. With his easy access to cleave abilities, high health, and armor his role just simply serves a better purpose in a large-scale battle. Just like a Thief can run in a large-scale battle, but cannot stand toe-to-toe unless the enemy is caught offguard – backline disruptor. A thief’s role serves better as a roamer in WvW. This is called opportunity cost.

You do not need perma-stealth to roam. You just need to have some brains to figure out where you are needed most, and know where the enemy zerg is in relation to you and your roaming team.

Effective roamers are usually the reason why a zerg server can take an entire map in 15 mins. It’s just unfortunate that the rewards are not scaled as such so most people avoid roaming. Most people are just after that wixpie. For those who want to have a personal enjoyment in knowing that their efforts are the primary reason why their server holds an entire map, then for those people they choose roaming over getting as much wixpie as possible. Of course there are others out there who simply want to gank people – those would be the perma-stealth thieves who care little about how their server is doing, and more about how many people they can take on outnumbered. Good Riddance.

A system designed to actually support having teams of roamers in WvW instead of solo-gankers concerned only for themselves and their personal kill record… hmm, what a thought.

Looking forward to seeing 4-man roamer teams: 2 wars, 2 thieves. Wars bring killshot and speed boosts, thieves bring the stealth and immobs. Sniper team 10 gogo.

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No! Dont make them pity us! When that happens, they win. Right now they are jealous of us, our movement, our high damage and whatnot. MAKE THEM HATE US, not for the class, but for our brotherhood.

RISE UP FELLOW THIEFS AND BE PROUD OF ONE ANOTHER.

We should be out there in swarms slaughtering warriors and guardians, and when they nerf us down again, we get right back up and do it again!

All I’m trying to say is to be proud of what we have.[/quote]

YEAH! I’m going to try this, get an all thief group and go around steamrolling all other servers!