Guild Wars 2

I currently run a D/D Glass cannon thief, like most seem too. Im wondering is there something better? I dont want to lose my killing power and i would like to stick to daggers ( personal preferance ).

But i feel when i run in a group, as i and my guildie often do, im nothing but a hinderance. I can down enemies quickly, no question, but what have i got after that? Im the first to go down because of my low health pool and armor.

What i want to know is.
What are some popular or viable builds/armor sets that allot me to dish it out without being squishy. ( i like to be able to solo aswell )

What are you running in WvW? and how do you like it.

Thanks.

This is what I usually rock for WvW.
(Full Zerker exotic armor/weapons/jewelry)

http://www.intothemists.com/calc/index.php?build=Vc33V-FGSwkZ0J5VOFd0;9;49TT;02;029B45A;45Nl0-Nl6G3G3G3G35BFR

Con’s:
-Low HP (11.5k)
-Low(ish) Armor (2.2k)
-No AoE aside from Cluster Bomb spam
-12 Initiative “pool”.

Pro’s:
-#1 slot chain usually totals for 6-7k.
-7-8k backstabs, 9-10k+ if Fire procs.
-BP is an awesome emergency Stealth.
-SR is a Might stacking machine + Group Stealth/Heal/Stomp-Stopper.
-Cloak and Dagger returns 2 Initiative when it Stealths you.
-Whenever you gain the Stealth buff:
—You blind enemies near you (240 Radius, 5s Blind).
—You gain roughly ~302hp/sec while Stealthed with only 300 Compassion from traits.
—You gain 2x 15s Might when you enter Stealth.
—You gain +2 Initiative.
(These effects compound when 2 Thieves sharing this build run a “Wolfpack”, as all the benefits are universal upon gaining Stealth. The source of the Stealth you gain is irrelevant.)

With the Rejuv effect from Stealth plus high-end burst damage, this build can easily 1v4/5 against equally geared/leveled opponents (assuming it isn’t a premade team w/ voice comms. If you’re good/lucky it’s still doable, but you have enough Stealth escapes that if you can’t beat them- you can safely bug-out or shadow them for a more opportune moment to strike.)

It’s still glass, but the excessive Stealth makes your survivability skyrocket. You could probably replace a lot of the Zerker gear for Knights and retain similar effectiveness, but with the 4s of Stealth and free Blinding Powder Blind every time I stealth, I’m not really getting focused enough to warrant any additional toughness.

However, if you are facing a lot of Condition-oriented builds, swap Cloaked in Shadow for Shadow’s Embrace.

Thankyou for the detailed reply. I dont know why i didn’t just fall back to this. I used to run this very build, granted a few traits options we’re different and it really is an amazing build.

Thanks again, happy hunting.

Edit: Though when i ran it i was using Valkyrie armor for some added Vitality. It will be interesting to see how the full zerker goes.

Bren Ranger.3725:

Thankyou for the detailed reply. I dont know why i didn’t just fall back to this. I used to run this very build, granted a few traits options we’re different and it really is an amazing build.

Thanks again, happy hunting.

Edit: Though when i ran it i was using Valkyrie armor for some added Vitality. It will be interesting to see how the full zerker goes.

Going from Valk to Zerk, you’ll notice a massive increase in critical hit occurance (and spikes from Sigil of Fire) but you’ll also notice that this build is far less forgiving and you’ll have to plan your ambushes in advance. Hitting a group with more than 2 heavy armor classes is almost guaranteed to end poorly.

D/D wise there’s not much you can really do for your team other than take out the most dangerous target right away. Then your forced to stealth or suffer a similar fate, and every second your stealthed is a second your not helping your team. Even if being stealthed is healing you.

If you have shortbow in your other slot you should switch to it when fighting with your friends. 15 points in deadly arts means the poison cloud will be AoE weakness (and destroys the enemies heals) which really helps your group out, and clusterbomb (don’t burst them)/trickshot do a serious amount of AoE damage while keeping out of the direct line of fire.

I run a no stealth Semi-glass cannon ( enough valk equipment and 20 points in acrobatics takes me to 1kittenealth). This is because I run with my guild often in WvW in quick 3-4 man raiding parties. Using sword/pistol because it gives amazing amounts of interrupt and immobilize to hold guys down while my team wails on them. Sword auto attack crits for 3k (6k on the last hit) and pistol whip regularly hits 10k.

I’m using pistol whip most often not because of the damage (it is worse than auto-attack), but because the evades help keep me alive while constantly tripping someone up. This is excellent for chasing those runners because of the immobilize and brief stuns. Basically my survival comes from being able to dodge roll very often when I get targeted (signet of agility helps), and flickering back and forth with #2 on the sword (which also removes stuns) makes me pretty immune to melee guys while still doing my job.

You should try setting your ultilities to mobility and relying on C&D for the stealth. Shadowstep/Infiltrators signet/X tends to work very well since people simply stop targeting me once I get far away from a fight even though I can come right back just as fast.

In WvW you should usually be running in a group so most styles are viable. I jump back and forth between a 10/30/30/0/0 P/P S&B thief (cause c&d is just plain cheese..so I don’t use it) and a 10/30/15/0/15 P/P S&B thief.

SB cause obviously it’s OP when your defending/attacking keeps. Clusterbomb ftw. Even out in the open you can rush forward..throw out a 1200 range clusterbomb and dive back. Do that a few times and watch that zerg vs zerg stalemate push back some.

The first build is more a stay alive build. You won’t be able to pump out unloads like crazy but if you run your stealth heal, aoe stealth and refuge in utilities…you’ll constantly be healing and out of sight when need be.

The 2nd build allows you to unload…unloads. While it doesn’t have that wtf just hit me burst..it has consistent over time damage and you STAY in battles. You don’t waste a guy and then go sit on your butt waiting on cooldowns. Plus deadshot is handy at stopping folks from stomping your downed friends. Finish them off with a mugged steal while fury is activated (under 50% health trait) and the steal will give fury again with might/swiftness and 3 more initiative to steal/unload finish em.

Plus the mere fact your ranged with stealth makes you a pain to kill. I’ve watched my entire 25-40 man zerg get wiped out..be one of the last 5 alive…and still get away.

I prefer a mix of soldier/knights. Particularly, weapons and armor are soldier, with Emerald orbs in armor. And Emerald (knight’s) jewelry. Still have a little over 50% crit chance with stacked sigil and with power being primary stat on soldiers have that in ample supply. But, I also have over 3k armor and 17.5 (with food buff) HP. Typicaslly run this as a S/D, but I don’t see why you couldn’t adapt it to D/D with some tweaks in the traits……

I run a short bow venom share build in WvW. Lots of tools for zerg offense and defense.

http://www.intothemists.com/calc/index.php?build=VcV-33FGSw-d0S5FOFd0;9;4T-T9-247;137B1;36-V0LNl6G3G3G3G35BFb

Mix and match traits as needed.

Thieves have 2 viable options in a WvW environment, that is condition/venomshare or full glass cannon.

Condition/venomshare is extremely fun to play imo and pretty kitten nice for group play.
Glass cannon is just what it says, big numbers on them and small numbers on yourself (low armor/toughness/hp).

Whatever anyone says soldier/knights is not viable in WvW in any way shape or form. You will still die relatively fast however you can’t even kill critters..

I have a full Berserker set, full Carrion set, full Invader set and some Valkyrie pieces.
The Valkyrie pieces I made was to see if creating a slightly bigger health pool would make for more survivability as a burst thief, it doesn’t.
Invader set is useless for Thieves. Berserker for glass cannon and Carrion for cond/venomshare.

Ignore “same” he has no clue what he’s talking about. I run a balanced s/d spec and murder everyone. Takes skill.

Yes please ignore me, while he “murders” everyone.. with a swabstick.. while they are afk.. fired at by siege weaponry.. and a zerg.

A full invaders set like I said doesn’t do anything but make everyone with half a brain and WvW experience lol and either walk away while you dance around them with a weaponset of which 2 buttons are absolutely useless (you know, #2 and #4) and do just enough damage for him to kill his opponent by the time WvW resets for the next matchup.

“Balanced” sets which basically means “lets toss all kinds of crap on this mofo” don’t work well on thieves. We are squishy, have an insanely low basic health pool and yes by adding a metric kittenton of vitality and toughness helps, little bits of it don’t. You want survivability go for a cond build with 30 in Shadow Arts that gives you a nice +300 vit and +300 toughness toss a set of Carrion on that bad boy and you have yourself a lean mean killing machine that no “balanced” S/D spec wants to mess with.

That’s just moronic, Same….. I’ve lost count of how many 1v2 vs you berserker thieves I’ve absolutely dominated on my S/D tank thief. Maybe YOU can’t make it work, but don’t assume there aren’t those of us who can.

I’m not a berserker thief. I stepped away from it months ago, I’m full condition damage 0/0/30/20/20 any S/D tank thief that tries will always end up running away because he/she won’t kill me.

I have played S/D myself in tanky invader gear and even in a balanced set but after the tiny slap on the wrist we got from the update in november I got pulled away from it.
S/D fully soldier/knight is amazing for holding points in PvP but even there you won’t kill anyone with half a brain.
I prolly have done more autoattack timing and daze locking than you will do while running the build because it is indeed a hard build to execute properly and requires constant attention and little to no kitten ups.
Especially now with dancing dagger nerfed to kitten and flanking strike still not working as intended it’s a hollow weaponset that requires a lot of effort to get something done, most other sets get done in half the time or less.

EDIT: Also if you seriously beat 2 berserker back stab burst thieves they must’ve sucked monkeyballs because its pretty kitten hard to eat two 4-4,5k mugs (this is about right with invader gear iirc) two 4-5k CnD (gotta love it being unchanged in WvW) and two 6-7k backstabs. Which basically means you got hit for approx 28-33k. Sure thing sweetheart.

I will admit I have beaten two backstab burst thieves aswell, but I will then immediately admit they were out of their mind bad at playing their role.

Same.4687:

Yes please ignore me, while he “murders” everyone.. with a swabstick.. while they are afk.. fired at by siege weaponry.. and a zerg.

A full invaders set like I said doesn’t do anything but make everyone with half a brain and WvW experience lol and either walk away while you dance around them with a weaponset of which 2 buttons are absolutely useless (you know, #2 and #4) and do just enough damage for him to kill his opponent by the time WvW resets for the next matchup.

“Balanced” sets which basically means “lets toss all kinds of crap on this mofo” don’t work well on thieves. We are squishy, have an insanely low basic health pool and yes by adding a metric kittenton of vitality and toughness helps, little bits of it don’t. You want survivability go for a cond build with 30 in Shadow Arts that gives you a nice +300 vit and +300 toughness toss a set of Carrion on that bad boy and you have yourself a lean mean killing machine that no “balanced” S/D spec wants to mess with.

Condition builds excel at small scale fights so that has to be kept in mind.

The P/D condition spec in the hands of a good player is pretty much untouchable at this point.

Run into a zerg or a siege situation, and your capabilities are seriously hampered.

Find a spec that excels at everything – decent 1vX capability, usefulness in a zerg or siege, etc. – hint: it does exist

It’s not a P/D condition spec – unless you are traited specifically for venom share – of course losing one the most powerful part of the P/D spec (healing during stealth).

spif.7580:

Find a spec that excels at everything – decent 1vX capability, usefulness in a zerg or siege, etc. – hint: it does exist

It is called any viable main-set with a shortbow swap, being useful in a zerg/siege is not hard at all.

Tulisin.6945:

spif.7580:

Find a spec that excels at everything – decent 1vX capability, usefulness in a zerg or siege, etc. – hint: it does exist

It is called any viable main-set with a shortbow swap, being useful in a zerg/siege is not hard at all.

Excels at everything is the key. Being useful isn’t quite the same thing. A low level ranger can be “useful” in a zerg.

GC thieves – spend a lot of time down when they get caught out of position. Lots of damage, but very fragile in an environment with tons of AoE.

Condition thieves – don’t do enough direct damage and conditions don’t scale as well in this situation.

Same.4687:

its pretty kitten hard to eat two 4-4,5k mugs (this is about right with invader gear iirc)

Last night I got hit with Mug alone for 7k, with Basilisk Venom for the stun, while in full exotics with 1450 toughness (pretty high for a thief). Clearly working as intended.

With over 3k armor though and 17k HP, no mug chain is gonna make a dent lol. That’s the whole point of a tank build, to be unburstable. And daze still works just fine, you simply have to be a bit smarter about timing your tactical strikes, tbh being able to perma daze is a bit OP anyway. As for flanking strike, it’s simply a matter of understanding how it will react at various facings. Do I always land it? No. But it is somewhere in the 90% range. It pwns vs shield block warriors since it’s unblockable.

Also i keep a shadow return on the ground 100% when roaming so if i get turned to stone i immediately hammer it and break the stun, wasting the backstab thief’s attempt.

I will admit I’ve never killed a P/D thief with t his build, but haven’t been killed, or ran from one. We generally just call it a draw after 5 min or so.

This is what I usually rock for WvW.
(Full Zerker exotic armor/weapons/jewelry)

http://www.intothemists.com/calc/index.php?build=Vc33V-FGSwkZ0J5VOFd0;9;49TT;02;029B45A;45Nl0-Nl6G3G3G3G35BFR

I’d also carry a sword on the zerg put the Rage sigil on it. also the sword unlike the Dagger gives you an Aoe frontal allowing you to punish other stealherThieves. And its 2 skill with proper use can have you be the absolute most annoying thing in the world to target and track. ah the good ole set up Shadow return attack run away for like 6 seconds pop cloaking powder and then hit shadow return run in oppisite direction to leave a bunch of people looking like fools.

Plaxy.4617:

I’d also carry a sword on the zerg put the Rage sigil on it.

Why? Theoretically sword is probably the best weapon to use Rage on, but it is still a bad sigil.