Guild Wars 2

someone help me?

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAqYVlsMp8pdOx7JsPNBNhwdtVz8O83yaFA-TVSAwAaUCq4EAkTfAEzfAeAAXV+hU9HPHBge7PQKAYmGB-w

Above is an overall good build, though I would recommend switching thrill of the crime for uncatchable (adds bleeds) or longreach (improves the use of steal). Also, this build doesn’t have the best condition damage, so you can put the sigil of corruption on the shortbow and replace it with a sigil of bursting for 6% more condi damage. Other runes you can try out are perplexity, balthazar, and afflicted. I recommend tweaking each build you come across to fit your own playstyle, which you can easily do in spvp.

P/D perplex with the new trickery grandmaster trait is stupidly OP. I tried it out, it’s easy mode game

johnpoc.8732:

P/D perplex with the new trickery grandmaster trait is stupidly OP. I tried it out, it’s easy mode game

I was gonna try that out with p/p since you can use headshot for the interrupts that you give up from sleight of hand.

As far as p/d builds go, here’s a gimmicky one that uses venoms: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAqYVlsMpopNNxrJsPNRMhw9uf986s2NWEA-TVyCABA8AAO+EAs3+DooPYiDBwNq/koSwsU+RxRAgUAwMNC-w

The basic idea is to go stealth (i.e. steal + CnD combo), summon thieves guild, pop all venoms which share with the NPC thieves, and then use sneak attack on the enemy to overload them with conditions. Follow up with a shadow strike or two, and apply a few body shots if you want to keep them immobed longer when the original immob is almost done.

I’ve tried it with runes of the scavenger which work ok for bigger condi damage. Could also slot perplexity and x/p in the other slot to headshot them if they try and do anything.

If you’re with a group, you can slot the venom heal and basilisk venom and share all of them around for a bunch of condis and such everywhere.

As I said, still gimmicky, but you can condi overload individuals and just watch them melt sometimes. Might get a bit boring to play though.

I’m not playing P/D condi build cause it’s way too OP. Sticking to my good ol’ D/D power build

johnpoc.8732:

P/D perplex with the new trickery grandmaster trait is stupidly OP. I tried it out, it’s easy mode game

That doesn’t even make sense. You don’t gain any extra confuse stacks because you are ignoring the interrupt aspect of perplex. Sacrificing the 6 part of the rune set while simultaneously sacrificing an instant interrupt only to generate the same amount of confuse stacks is really foolish.

Mordecai.6318:

johnpoc.8732:

P/D perplex with the new trickery grandmaster trait is stupidly OP. I tried it out, it’s easy mode game

Sacrificing the 6 part of the rune set while simultaneously sacrificing an instant interrupt only to generate the same amount of confuse stacks is really foolish.

It’s a trade off – With sleight of hand the confusion is not guaranteed but the interrupt to trigger perplexity is easier to pull off

With bewildering ambush the confusion is guaranteed, but triggering perplex is harder to pull off with basilisk or d/p headshotting. I’ve stacked bewildering ambush + throw gunk + perplex (4) and (6) to get 18 stacks of confusion

slender.1482:

Mordecai.6318:

johnpoc.8732:

P/D perplex with the new trickery grandmaster trait is stupidly OP. I tried it out, it’s easy mode game

Sacrificing the 6 part of the rune set while simultaneously sacrificing an instant interrupt only to generate the same amount of confuse stacks is really foolish.

It’s a trade off – With sleight of hand the confusion is not guaranteed but the interrupt to trigger perplexity is easier to pull off

With bewildering ambush the confusion is guaranteed, but triggering perplex is harder to pull off with basilisk or d/p headshotting. I’ve stacked bewildering ambush + throw gunk + perplex (4) and (6) to get 18 stacks of confusion

At that same time, I’m sure all the planets in our solar system would align.

Azure Prower.8701:

slender.1482:

Mordecai.6318:

johnpoc.8732:

P/D perplex with the new trickery grandmaster trait is stupidly OP. I tried it out, it’s easy mode game

Sacrificing the 6 part of the rune set while simultaneously sacrificing an instant interrupt only to generate the same amount of confuse stacks is really foolish.

It’s a trade off – With sleight of hand the confusion is not guaranteed but the interrupt to trigger perplexity is easier to pull off

With bewildering ambush the confusion is guaranteed, but triggering perplex is harder to pull off with basilisk or d/p headshotting. I’ve stacked bewildering ambush + throw gunk + perplex (4) and (6) to get 18 stacks of confusion

At that same time, I’m sure all the planets in our solar system would align.

^

I lol IRL.

Alternatively you could run with a power p/d build and actually challenge yourself

thx all , my enlish so ban . hard playing

Easy mode is 0/0/6/4/4 with full dire gear. I’m currently testing a more bursty and glassy build, 6/0/2/0/6 carrion gear. The condition burst is just insane, but my survivability is more limited…

johnpoc.8732:

P/D perplex with the new trickery grandmaster trait is stupidly OP. I tried it out, it’s easy mode game

Where are you getting your interrupts from to make the 6th rune viable and functional?

slender.1482:

With bewildering ambush the confusion is guaranteed, but triggering perplex is harder to pull off with basilisk or d/p headshotting. I’ve stacked bewildering ambush + throw gunk + perplex (4) and (6) to get 18 stacks of confusion

How exactly? you’re using D/P? so how are you stacking anything from gunk when you need to fire through it? Also, WHY would you use D/P on a condi perp build? This would also be purely situational on getting gunk from an engi or an NPC as well as having the #3 trigger, so it’s not exactly something you can pull of reliably or often.

So, judging that you’re using P/D on one set, you’re saying you steal into your enemy for 5 stacks and C&D (I would expect), throw gunk (which would then reveal yourself and not give you a stealth shot) or you click off target and throw it between you and the target hoping that they stay between you and the gunk, then stealth shot, then headshot and also get hit to trigger the #3? I’m with the guy on planetary alignment.

Perplexity runes are ain’t only the 5 stacks on interrupt, you apply 3 when struck + the confusion duration.
I used D/P for Head Shot

johnpoc.8732:

Perplexity runes are ain’t only the 5 stacks on interrupt, you apply 3 when struck + the confusion duration.
I used D/P for Head Shot

Obviously it’s not, but that was the main draw of them initially (as well as the chance used to be a proc when you hit the enemy, not vice versa), you’re also having to count on a lot of situational circumstances to get the claimed 18 stacks of confusion.

I’ll chime in here (btw the build up top looks good, I could definitely work with that build). I’ve played P/D from launch and it is all that I’ve played, if i was force to do anything else I wouldn’t play thief. So you can take or leave my advice, but I feel I have a pretty good grasp on the play style. I am just back after a 4-5 month absence so I’m still catching up to all the new changes but it hasn’t affected my WvW play in the least so far. I actually feel quite a bit better than I was when I left, I guess that is due to the changes made (yes the ones I’m unaware of, lol). Anyway, I’ve posted what my build has been since day one, except for the new traits obviously. I go for max cond duration as apposed to cond damage. I go full Dire on everything. I stole this concept from Wild Bill, feel free to check out his YouTube channel for tips. Never the less this build is made for suitability and to out last you opponent and to avoid them at all cost, the longer you can stay under and let the bleeds tick (from max cond duration) the better off you are, especially when you get into a 1v3-1v5 situations. Its also a great build to toy with the back end of zergs. I’ve found the use of the confusion on steal and the #3 torment to be excellent additions to the original p/d thief on launch. It makes it hard for classes that can remove condi when you have so many cover up condi’s. Anyway I’d be glad to answer any questions on here or in game. I love talking p/d thief Take care!

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAq4alsMp0pdPxzJsPNBNRxdNsCzg312YshaFAA-TVSAABgcQAUUPg0nAAAeAAoq+zkKBHT5XP7P0nGhAAIAzsMjMDG6QH6QH6QbmzcozcozsUAwMNC-w

slender.1482:

Mordecai.6318:

johnpoc.8732:

P/D perplex with the new trickery grandmaster trait is stupidly OP. I tried it out, it’s easy mode game

Sacrificing the 6 part of the rune set while simultaneously sacrificing an instant interrupt only to generate the same amount of confuse stacks is really foolish.

It’s a trade off – With sleight of hand the confusion is not guaranteed but the interrupt to trigger perplexity is easier to pull off

With bewildering ambush the confusion is guaranteed, but triggering perplex is harder to pull off with basilisk or d/p headshotting. I’ve stacked bewildering ambush + throw gunk + perplex (4) and (6) to get 18 stacks of confusion

If you’re using steal with a purpose and watch for animations then your sleight of hand is pretty much always going to hit as its an instant daze. Losing the steal cooldown, an interrupt for heals, mass invis’, etc. is not just worth it if you’re worth your salt.

Azure Prower.8701:

At that same time, I’m sure all the planets in our solar system would align.

18 stacks is the max possible its definitely rare, you can also look for mes chaos bubbles/rings and shadowstep position yourself so the field is between you and your target.

my method to throw gunk is to drop targets before throwing it. Without a target the gunk throws at your feet and won’t break stealth. Plan ahead to use gunk; CnD/HiS/BP- create distance while dropping target – throw gunk – re target – sneak attack

Static.9841:

How exactly? you’re using D/P? so how are you stacking anything from gunk when you need to fire through it? Also, WHY would you use D/P on a condi perp build? This would also be purely situational on getting gunk from an engi or an NPC as well as having the #3 trigger, so it’s not exactly something you can pull of reliably or often.

So, judging that you’re using P/D on one set, you’re saying you steal into your enemy for 5 stacks and C&D (I would expect), throw gunk (which would then reveal yourself and not give you a stealth shot) or you click off target and throw it between you and the target hoping that they stay between you and the gunk, then stealth shot, then headshot and also get hit to trigger the #3? I’m with the guy on planetary alignment.

It’s definitely planetary alignment for 18 but 13 or 15 is very doable. I practice the combo on sentry because you can predict their first 2 casts and the longer cast heals: start from stealth – drop gunk at feet – sneak attack(5) – switch to D/P or P/P – interrupt bola or charge(10) – steal to get into melee(15) – perplex proc on hit (18).

Trueshots.9456:

I’ll chime in here (btw the build up top looks good, I could definitely work with that build). I’ve played P/D from launch and it is all that I’ve played, if i was force to do anything else I wouldn’t play thief. So you can take or leave my advice, but I feel I have a pretty good grasp on the play style. I am just back after a 4-5 month absence so I’m still catching up to all the new changes but it hasn’t affected my WvW play in the least so far. I actually feel quite a bit better than I was when I left, I guess that is due to the changes made (yes the ones I’m unaware of, lol). Anyway, I’ve posted what my build has been since day one, except for the new traits obviously. I go for max cond duration as apposed to cond damage. I go full Dire on everything. I stole this concept from Wild Bill, feel free to check out his YouTube channel for tips. Never the less this build is made for suitability and to out last you opponent and to avoid them at all cost, the longer you can stay under and let the bleeds tick (from max cond duration) the better off you are, especially when you get into a 1v3-1v5 situations. Its also a great build to toy with the back end of zergs. I’ve found the use of the confusion on steal and the #3 torment to be excellent additions to the original p/d thief on launch. It makes it hard for classes that can remove condi when you have so many cover up condi’s. Anyway I’d be glad to answer any questions on here or in game. I love talking p/d thief Take care!

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAq4alsMp0pdPxzJsPNBNRxdNsCzg312YshaFAA-TVSAABgcQAUUPg0nAAAeAAoq+zkKBHT5XP7P0nGhAAIAzsMjMDG6QH6QH6QbmzcozcozsUAwMNC-w

I also played P/D in the start. I have tried all weapon sets, but it was the one I felt for I guess. Wild Bill have inspired my style a lot! I play close to the same build (caltrops on evade and richochet instead). I usually swap around utilities, but I always have spider venom on my skill bar. Poison works wonders as a cover up for my bleeds as well as neglecting them a lot of healing.

Anyways, glad to see that I’m not the only one running this build for a long time ;p

I too have been using and experimenting with various P/D specs over the last year or so and would like to add some points to this discussion. As always, what I’m writing here is based solely on my experience and opinion (I emphasise this so I don’t have to write “imo” a hundred times)—please don’t be agitated if you happen to find yourself in disagreement with me; I’m open for discussion.

That being said, I will speak strictly from a WvW-roaming perspective.

Sleight of Hand vs. Bewildering Ambush
In most cases, SoH beats BA in terms of utility and versatility. Even when running a spec without Perplexity, its instant interrupt (which can be used while stunned) and 20% CD reduction for Steal are far superior to 5 stacks of confusion since a shorter CD both means more frequent usage of our class’ F1 skill and more potential precasting opportunities in general. With a CD of only 21.5 seconds, Steal can become pretty powerful; especially with traits such as Thrill of the Crime, Bountiful Theft, and possibly Mug.
BA gets into “decent” territory when running a P/D-D/P Perplexity build that relies on Headshot for interrupts or setups without D/P that rely on Basilisk Venom (or even Scorpion Wire) for this, but these setups come with some distinct drawbacks I will not fully elaborate on in this post (for brevity’s sake).

Uncatchable vs. Thrill of the Crime
To me, TotC seems more beneficial than Uncatchable in most situations. With Steal on an already short CD because of Trickery and SoH, the frequent applications of Swiftness help one maintain a decent amount of speed in and out of combat while Fury increases one’s possibly very low Critical Chance to a at least decent amount (the effect of this is greater when one’s gear consists mostly of Carrion items however), thereby increasing one’s physical damage output. TotC is also useful for buffing allies such as other players or even the NPCs summoned by Thieves Guild. Uncatchable is pretty short-lasting, inflicts negligible bleeds and—against semi-experienced players and better ones—does not hit that often (that clink sound it makes also drives me nuts). For hybrid builds, TotC is almost essential as a frequent (and reliable) source of Fury and because of its Swiftness effect, Signet of Shadows becomes less useful and open for replacement.

Trickery Master Traits
The Master Traits of the Trickery line is where personal preference seems to be the biggest factor when opting for a certain trait. Bountiful Theft is my favourite since it rips two boons off one’s opponent and grants Vigor, which in turn allows for more dodging. BT also makes it possible for SoH to interrupt skills such as Dagger Storm and Stomp—skills that grant Stability on activation. Ricochet offers a sort of gimmicky compromise: for losing one’s ability to steal two boons and gain Vigour, one’s pistol attacks can hit multiple enemies. This, of course, is pretty much useless in any 1v1 scenario (meh against Mesmers, one would probably be better off with more dodging), but its main strength lies in fighting outnumbered—one once ricocheting bullet means a free hit (and bleed) on another enemy, it even applies combo effects such as Burning to every hit as long as the original projectile was affected by them. However, the ranges of said projectiles are pretty limited and your experience with Ricochet may vary; I consider it highly situational.

Weapon Sets
Since P/D is the subject of this topic, I’m going to assume that one weapon set is always P/D; for the second slot, there are many options with different drawbacks and benefits:

P/D: A second P/D set allows frequent usage of Weapon Swap Sigils such as Sigil of Battle, Doom, Geomancy, Hydromancy, or Energy. However, one sacrifices the mobility that comes with D/D and SB (along with their respective skills) in return, which, by some players, might be considered more essential for their play style.

D/P: Mostly used for Headshot as a substitute for or along with SoH when running Perplexity, this set allows one to stealth freely without having to land Cloak and Dagger or use Utility Skills. However, the damage output of this set in terms of conditions is (Perplexity aside) abysmal and I consider it a niche weapon set for a standard P/D build. In terms of mobility, it is on par with D/D but some players might consider it superior to the latter due to easier access to multiple stacks of stealth for getaways or ambushes.

Shortbow: Aside from access to damaging conditions (Bleed and Poison) and an on-demand evasion skill (Disabling Shot), the SB provides good (albeit costly) mobility with Infiltrator’s Arrow. It is the most commonly used secondary weapon for condition thieves and almost always a good choice.

Utility Skills
I will not cover every single Utility Skill of the Thief class here—instead, I am going to focus on those skills I’ve used for a long time myself (I’ve never used Poison Skills extensively) and try to give reasons as to why I think they benefit a Condition Thief or not.

Shadow Refuge: Pretty much the most used Thief Utility Skill there is, the reason(s) for why this is should be obvious. Some of its drawbacks are a long CD and the possibility of one being pushed out of it prematurely. That being said, I rarely use it myself.

Signet of Shadows: Mostly used for its movement speed increase, it’s also useful for instantly blinding opponents trying to interrupt one’s stomp (which can also be achieved on a single target by interrupting them via SoH). Basically a long-range AoE blind with a nice passive effect, but regular access to Swiftness pretty much negates what makes this skill so useful.

Shadowstep: Stunbreaker with a long-range teleport that can be used twice in a 10-second interval. May also be used for precasting on moving enemies (given proper “training”), creating gaps between one and one’s enemies, or closing up on the latter. I highly recommend using Mouse Targeting for this skill since it reduces the amount of keystrokes needed to one.

Infiltrator’s Signet: Basically a watered-down Shadowstep with a lower CD. While its passive effect is decent, its main utility lies in its precasting potential (and stunbreaker functionality of course)

Blinding Powder: A watered-down Shadow Refuge without a heal, multiple pulses of stealth, and an area of effect but a shorter CD. Unlike SR, it can be used when stunned and act as a pseudo stunbreaker. Even though it may seem far more situational than SR, I prefer it over the latter (as with the weapon sets, this choice is mostly based on personal preference).

Caltrops: Highly situational skill with practically no use against high-mobility opponents. Few enemies will fall for it—even fewer will stay inside its AoE long enough for it to dish out decent damage. It can be used to keep some players at bay and precasting it is an option, but it rarely pays off. It’s pretty nice to “pin” down downed opponents with it, but doing so is rarely necessary. However, it does come in handy for Healing Power builds designed solely for trolling or larger fights, as it triggers Signet of Malice once for every opponent within its AoE each second.

Healing Skills

Hide in Shadows: The standard Healing Skill of the Thief class. It has a fairly long CD of 30 seconds and an activation time of one second, making it interruptible. Its healing capabilities are good (it removes damaging conditions before the heal is applied) and stealth is always nice, whether one prefers it over Withdraw comes down to one’s play style.

Withdraw: A very short CD of only 15 seconds makes this skill superior to HiS in terms of health per second (disregarding the possible heal and condition removal through stealth), though it does not remove damaging conditions such as Poison before its heal triggers. On the other hand, it offers a long-distance dodge roll for 0.75 seconds and removes mobility-impairing conditions. Its animation can be interrupted manually by switching weapons and proper alignment of one’s character allows it to function as a situational gap-closer—speaking of interruptions, this skill’s heal cannot be interrupted due to its nonexistent activation time. Furthermore, traits such as Vigorous Recovery are more useful with Withdraw due to its shorter CD mentioned above.

Signet of Malice: Its passive healing capabilities depend on how many hits one manages to land and its active effect is rather weak compared to HiS and Withdraw as it does not have any effects beyond the heal it provides. That being said, it shines when used with proper traits und Utility Skills like Ricochet and Caltrops, as every hit (no matter what caused the attack, be it a trait or a skill) heals one once. Last time I checked, it actually healed for far more than what it said in its description (the passive heal at least). Pretty fun for trolling enemies, just stack Toughness and Healing Power along with some Vitality and you are ready to go.

That pretty much covered everything I wanted to say. As I said, the above text is just my opinion on the matter and I don’t claim to have any “authority” or anything like that regarding how the Thief class should be played.

my panicond build (post above) 30,0,30,0,10 full venom OP in 1v1, ok in 1v2, bad in 1vX, good in group play
torment build with torment runes 0,0,30,20,20 easy mode good in 1vX
confusion build with confusion runes x,0,30,x,30 easy mode good in 1vX
or take krait rune with hidden thief +elite skill

over all P/D easy mode 1v1 but hell of fun mode if you manage to do 1vX

I got several build for a p/d thief I’ve been playing sense game release. So I’m well experience on how it works. I’m a selfish prik too because i also don’t feel like giving my build away so easy.

Jeezologist

Well, with all this arguing over who’s Condi ticks for more while you stand there drinking your margarita, I will offer you a more active, involving play style that doesn’t include letting them hit you to damage them, or standing still while your condis go to town.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Build-Oscuro-s-LRB/first#post3948773
This is a power p/d build. I urge you to at least look into it! It is still more than viable after the frog damage nerf, and has high sustained DPS and some decent burst (not as good as Backstab, but close). This is a rare build but is very effective. Again, I urge you to try this build. I have successfully used it in COUNTLESS 1v1’s and a decent amount if 1vX’s.
I hope you enjoy it!

The key to an effective condition build isn’t maximizing your condition damage or duration.

It’s about getting as many different types of condition on your enemy. 10 stacks of bleeding are just as easy to cleanse as 25 stacks. But add Poison, Confusion and Burning to the mix and you’re causing serious trouble.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQRAqY4Yl0Mp7pNNxrJ8PNRMRx1O4dXUGho2HQuFAA-T1hOABY+EAKZ/h3U/RLlgAofQFlfZeSACAgA4oH9oH9oHtZOzZOzZOzSBsoyK-w

This my own build currently being used.

The focus is on as many types as conditions as possible along with MAXXED durations which inhibits the ability for the enemy just to let one of the cover conditions expire.

I have swapped to 15 in shadow arts and used 25 in DA but find I really do not need that extra time in stealth. When against condition heavy I take out bursting and put in purity and or take one of the venoms out and replace with shadowstep. Shadowstep is likely running 50 percent of the time. Devourers is a nice stack of Immobs that you can get to 12 seconds.

As pointed out success depends on the number of conditions laid down. When a single steal fives 10 sec confusion 20 of poison 8 of weakness your bleeds are in much better shape to continue ticking and with 8 second bleeds from the pistol or 20 second bleeds from a DB you will get a lot more stacks on.