Guild Wars 2

Sizzle Hint.1820:

AikijinX.6258:

Tonikor.5637:

The mini-heartseeker are not worth doing.

Losing awareness of your enemy’s location during a fight just for one extra heartseeker is NOT worth it.

He probably would have won more duels if he didn’t do it.

I’ve met all sorts of “perplexors”, from the s/p asuras with the ranged daze and 30 trickery to the p/d+d/p stealth spammers that also add bleeds and torment to the mix (hardest so far). Not one of them won though.

Beating perplexity thieves is easy, especially as a condi-removing-superhero-30SA-d/p.
All you need is constant pressure, knowing where the other thief is by not moving ur camera to show only yourself while you spam mini heart seekers is a start. One tip: Shadowshot.

So what is it are you exactly saying? Are you saying you are better than Coloxeus?, are you saying you’re better than me?, Do you really believe that he could have won more if he didn’t do an extra HS?, Did you realize he was 30 SA, Shadows embrace?, did you realize what he actually did to get those wins off?, Do you truly believe Shadow shot is all you need to beat me, and/or any other SMART skillful perplexity rune thief? Did you not think Coloxeus kept constant pressure? what happened? Did you realize i was none of the weapons sets you stated above. I’m P/P one of the hardest weapon sets to master, and time. Every initiative counts in that set. So if we were to duel if we were matched up, your strategy is to always try to locate me, by what? Staying stealthed, abusing the mechanic, and waiting for my stealth to ware off? This ain’t Stealth wars 2. Please do answer these questions.

How exactly is P/P hard to master? Especialy if u run it with perplex? You just spam 4 and ur utilitys for stealth + sneak attack… 5 here and there if you need defense (or waste a stealth utility)

You might want to try 0 0 10 30 30 P/P P/P for massive ini regen + massive amount of dodges and spam 4 all day long (like you did in that video), see how broken it really is. Because really, 30 into SA is a complete waste on P/P, even if you use all stealth utilitys. (Use the 10 into SA for the con remove) Or am i missing something here?

Try 10 0 0 30 30 double D/P full zerk/valk, now that is hard to master. (not saying i did master it)

Good suggestion. But this is where i concur and disagree. In what world would Vitality ever trump Toughness, there has to be a balance between the two. I chose 30 in SA not only for the extra useful traits, but also for the added toughness. As it stands right now i have a 2.9k armor rating, while still maintaining a good 18-19k Life pool(depending on World buff), and still manage to gain high desirable condition damage. So against a melee class, i.e, Warrior/Thief (D/P) I can still manage to take them down while maintaining good defense, and a stronger offence. Well unless the D/P Thief just chooses to chain stealth, than that’s when it gets tiresome, and lackluster. I would only choose P/P-P/P if I wanted to set a death wish, and suicide. And by the way I don’t “waste” any stealth skills, every motion, and skill use of mine have a purposes.

AikijinX, you are arrogant and condescending and the saddest part is, that you really think your build or coloxeus d/p build require any skill to be pulled off.

Your attitude in the threads you become part of is tiring

+1

Void.4239:

Marduh.4603:

Permastealth vs Permaconfusion.
Exploit vs Exploit.
Certainly interesting to see. But normal people just run past.

-2) CLEARLY shows what is wrong with BP/HS combo. ( trait should change to : get 2 ini when you enter stealth by using a skill, not when you already in stealth)

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Infusion_of_Shadow

Zumy.6318:

AikijinX, you are arrogant and condescending and the saddest part is, that you really think your build or coloxeus d/p build require any skill to be pulled off.

Your attitude in the threads you become part of is tiring

I am not going to engage in any argument against my community, but just let me say this, If i by any way gave off the impression that i was talking down to people, because that’s what condescending means Or being arrogant. Then I apologize. I don’t give attitude to people who are sincere and nice, and who don’t deserve it. But being arrogant,condescending, and attitudinal was not my intention at all. Now on the build part. I only said it takes skill to pull off 4 HS in black powder consecutively. I said this before and I’ll say it again. Chain stealth builds are easy mode. That’s exactly why I transitioned back into D/D-SB then to S/D-SB, and now P/P. And on my build. if think that this build takes no skill then that is your own opinion. I don’t spam HS, i wait and time for good efficient interrupts. If that’s what you think this build is designed for (the spamming of HS). Then You’ve got the idea completely wrong. But like I said it’s your own opinion.

Well this way it sounds completely different. Apologies.

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Void.4239:

Marduh.4603:

Permastealth vs Permaconfusion.
Exploit vs Exploit.
Certainly interesting to see. But normal people just run past.

-2) CLEARLY shows what is wrong with BP/HS combo. ( trait should change to : get 2 ini when you enter stealth by using a skill, not when you already in stealth)

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Infusion_of_Shadow

That or a succesfull combo should put revealed on you if you already in stealth.
Atm Bp/Hs ini regain combo is the source for all the hate against stealth.

panicbutton.1053:

I’ve been running this build for a week now. Confirming that confusion stacking on people is extremely effective even outside of duels. This is by NO means a zerging build, but rather the ultimate roaming build. Why ultimate you say — because I have never died to any class so far. Any class that used to be a problem is now a complete easy kill. The worst case scenario that has happened so far is a very few that pick up on the confusion stacking tactic, and simply stop attacking you and run away. This build is obviously built around the thief taking damage so this becomes a problem once they realize this however normally it’s too late for them. When this happens I just follow them as they run, and pew pew them annoyingly until they die.

The perplexity rune has to get nerfed… it’s pretty ridiculous how easy it is to kill. Just vit/tough/cond stack and face tank ANYthing on purpose opposed to running away. Watch warriors and other d/p thieves get burned down by their own damage.

Well i’m glad you had a positive experience with the build

i’m glad this thread is now getting morethan 2.2k views lol

I am glad too Haha.. whoops just made it bump back to first page.

Good job to Both Coloxeus and you. Saw the awsome duel video and i’m trying out the p/p confusion build right now(though it’ll get some getting used to). Its been a great help diversifying my options as a thief and I also saw that you took the time to answer every comment that was made.

On the otherhand, It’s actually quite amusing to find out that there will always be people to discredit you however good your intentions maybe. I was pleasantly surprised that you kept your cool on that one.

Anyways, keep up the good work.
We need more people like you

From what I have read in a few threads about perplexity, the 5 confuse on interrupt is supposed to have a 15 second internal CD, which seems both reasonable and the end of this particular version of P/P viability when they finally do so. Imo.

5 seconds would have been a good internal cooldown. 15 seems too much.

Fahrenheit.7935:

Good job to Both Coloxeus and you. Saw the awsome duel video and i’m trying out the p/p confusion build right now(though it’ll get some getting used to). Its been a great help diversifying my options as a thief and I also saw that you took the time to answer every comment that was made.

On the otherhand, It’s actually quite amusing to find out that there will always be people to discredit you however good your intentions maybe. I was pleasantly surprised that you kept your cool on that one.

Anyways, keep up the good work.
We need more people like you

Thank you very much for your kind words, and positive feedback. I always love to hear from community members like yourself. And yes I love answering all comments even if they’re from trolls. Feeding trolls really isn’t in my nature, I keep calm and talk respectively.

Rafahil.2857:

5 seconds would have been a good internal cooldown. 15 seems too much.

Are you really defending these runes? They’re the most broken thing to ever enter this game. You see thieves facerolling everyone spamming 4 for the lulz. God, I hate ignorant people that can’t play normally and need a crutch to rely on. I hope these get nerfed to hell. No rune should suddenly make a class that has no confusion the master of confusion. Otherwise I demand a rune that lets me deal 5k damage whenever I auto attack.

vinceftw.5086:

Rafahil.2857:

5 seconds would have been a good internal cooldown. 15 seems too much.

Are you really defending these runes? They’re the most broken thing to ever enter this game. You see thieves facerolling everyone spamming 4 for the lulz. God, I hate ignorant people that can’t play normally and need a crutch to rely on. I hope these get nerfed to hell. No rune should suddenly make a class that has no confusion the master of confusion. Otherwise I demand a rune that lets me deal 5k damage whenever I auto attack.

I sense an angry Mesmer amongst us. I’m guessing that’s your main class. And what do you have to say about stun lock warriors?

Spam more 5 and 2. Skillz! ZzzzzzzzzzzZZZzzzZZZzzzzzZZzzzz

AikijinX.6258:

vinceftw.5086:

Rafahil.2857:

5 seconds would have been a good internal cooldown. 15 seems too much.

Are you really defending these runes? They’re the most broken thing to ever enter this game. You see thieves facerolling everyone spamming 4 for the lulz. God, I hate ignorant people that can’t play normally and need a crutch to rely on. I hope these get nerfed to hell. No rune should suddenly make a class that has no confusion the master of confusion. Otherwise I demand a rune that lets me deal 5k damage whenever I auto attack.

I sense an angry Mesmer amongst us. I’m guessing that’s your main class. And what do you have to say about stun lock warriors?

He might be angry, doesn’t change the fact that hes right, lol

Dynnen.6405:

AikijinX.6258:

vinceftw.5086:

Rafahil.2857:

5 seconds would have been a good internal cooldown. 15 seems too much.

Are you really defending these runes? They’re the most broken thing to ever enter this game. You see thieves facerolling everyone spamming 4 for the lulz. God, I hate ignorant people that can’t play normally and need a crutch to rely on. I hope these get nerfed to hell. No rune should suddenly make a class that has no confusion the master of confusion. Otherwise I demand a rune that lets me deal 5k damage whenever I auto attack.

I sense an angry Mesmer amongst us. I’m guessing that’s your main class. And what do you have to say about stun lock warriors?

He might be angry, doesn’t change the fact that hes right, lol

As a little Thief I’ve always dreamed of having a super power called confusion.

vinceftw.5086:

Rafahil.2857:

5 seconds would have been a good internal cooldown. 15 seems too much.

Are you really defending these runes? They’re the most broken thing to ever enter this game. You see thieves facerolling everyone spamming 4 for the lulz. God, I hate ignorant people that can’t play normally and need a crutch to rely on. I hope these get nerfed to hell. No rune should suddenly make a class that has no confusion the master of confusion. Otherwise I demand a rune that lets me deal 5k damage whenever I auto attack.

It’s not like p/p has anything else going for it. I agree that there needs to be an internal cooldown, but 15 seconds is too long and would render the build based on these runes useless.

I would be happy with a middle ground where we could meet.

Rafahil.2857:

vinceftw.5086:

Rafahil.2857:

5 seconds would have been a good internal cooldown. 15 seems too much.

Are you really defending these runes? They’re the most broken thing to ever enter this game. You see thieves facerolling everyone spamming 4 for the lulz. God, I hate ignorant people that can’t play normally and need a crutch to rely on. I hope these get nerfed to hell. No rune should suddenly make a class that has no confusion the master of confusion. Otherwise I demand a rune that lets me deal 5k damage whenever I auto attack.

It’s not like p/p has anything else going for it. I agree that there needs to be an internal cooldown, but 15 seconds is too long and would render the build based on these runes useless.

I would be happy with a middle ground where we could meet.

The 15 second CD isn’t too long. The 6th bonus makes up for all of what the 4th bonus lacks. But obviously don’t spam. You need to effectively, and in a timely fashion interrupt when you see an opportunity, on top of adding the other conditions.

Fahrenheit.7935:

Good job to Both Coloxeus and you. Saw the awsome duel video and i’m trying out the p/p confusion build right now(though it’ll get some getting used to). Its been a great help diversifying my options as a thief and I also saw that you took the time to answer every comment that was made.

On the otherhand, It’s actually quite amusing to find out that there will always be people to discredit you however good your intentions maybe. I was pleasantly surprised that you kept your cool on that one.

Anyways, keep up the good work.
We need more people like you

thank you for appreciating and positive feedbacks! just subscribe to my channel to keep updated . well i accept criticism and i appreciate em! it’s just i ignoring any act of discredit. waste of time replying and arguing with em talking non sense just like the previous comment here “spam more 5 and 2 skill! Zzzz..” LOL really haha

I just duel against @AikijinX and his thiefsmer build.

Is just refreshing to see good thieves as him that use the brain and creates this unique builds.

Just amazing man, thanks for teaching me your build, is really powerful.

Duel him like 6 times, not even close to kill him.

We will see a lot of people running this build in future, the runes will be a lot more expensive xD.

I posted here because the original thiefsmer post doesnt allow me to post.

SoLeciTO.3490:

I just duel against @AikijinX and his thiefsmer build.

Is just refreshing to see good thieves as him that use the brain and creates this unique builds.

Just amazing man, thanks for teaching me your build, is really powerful.

Duel him like 6 times, not even close to kill him.

We will see a lot of people running this build in future, the runes will be a lot more expensive xD.

I posted here because the original thiefsmer post doesnt allow me to post.

Thanks for the feedback my friend. It’s always good hearing positive feedback, and positive reactions. I aim to please.

How about using ‘Scorpion Wire’ with this build?
Perhaps instead of the venoms maybe?

Since disrupting your foes and stacking confusion is the bread and butter for this build,
I think it may give you another option as it can also when timed right, disrupt your enemies(or at least briefly stun them like a shorter but ranged version of basilisk venom), not to mention that it has a relatively short 20 sec CD, and a decent 1,200 range to pull enemies from trying to run away from you with a truckload of confusion and bleeds. As people with confusion stacked normally try to just avoid you or get out of your pistol range, thought this might be useful for keeping up the pressure.

BTW, I’m having a ball with this build.. Even on PVE, its pretty fun to see 20+ confusion stacks on bosses who then punch themselves so hard LOL

Fahrenheit.7935:

How about using ‘Scorpion Wire’ with this build?
Perhaps instead of the venoms maybe?

Since disrupting your foes and stacking confusion is the bread and butter for this build,
I think it may give you another option as it can also when timed right, disrupt your enemies(or at least briefly stun them like a shorter but ranged version of basilisk venom), not to mention that it has a relatively short 20 sec CD, and a decent 1,200 range to pull enemies from trying to run away from you with a truckload of confusion and bleeds. As people with confusion stacked normally try to just avoid you or get out of your pistol range, thought this might be useful for keeping up the pressure.

BTW, I’m having a ball with this build.. Even on PVE, its pretty fun to see 20+ confusion stacks on bosses who then punch themselves so hard LOL

That’s what makes me happy, producing things that people like. Thanks for the feed back~~

Now with the scorpion wire, im not knocking it. But scorp wire gets interrupted all on it’s own. I’m surprised it’s not yelling nerf these runes. This skill gets interrupted, stopped, obstructed and canceled by various levels of terrain. A small rock can stop your wire, a whistle of grass, a crack in the corner.. You get my point.. Now i rather equip a guranteed utility rather than another broken(needs fixing) utility like scorpion wire.
Let me explain my build in a couple words. My Thiefsmer build is solely dependent on the interrupts, yes. And yes the bread and butter is the confusion. But the icing on the cake is the extra conditions i do on top of the confusion, hence the reason i use venom’s. My spider venom(poison) does 300+ a tick, and 5 stacks of that will stack in duration, and if you don’t cleanse that poison. The poison itself can kill you. While dueling I equip Skale venom and Spider venom, because there is only so many conditions some one can remove with their heal. So before they get to cleansing off the confusion, I rack up all the other conditions after my confusion hits. Think of it as I am protecting my confusion and coating it with other conditions.
Confusion- bread and butter, Cookie cutter
added other conditions- Icing on the cake, finishing touch

Rafahil.2857:

vinceftw.5086:

Rafahil.2857:

5 seconds would have been a good internal cooldown. 15 seems too much.

Are you really defending these runes? They’re the most broken thing to ever enter this game. You see thieves facerolling everyone spamming 4 for the lulz. God, I hate ignorant people that can’t play normally and need a crutch to rely on. I hope these get nerfed to hell. No rune should suddenly make a class that has no confusion the master of confusion. Otherwise I demand a rune that lets me deal 5k damage whenever I auto attack.

It’s not like p/p has anything else going for it. I agree that there needs to be an internal cooldown, but 15 seconds is too long and would render the build based on these runes useless.

I would be happy with a middle ground where we could meet.

The duration of the applied confusion should be 5 or 3 seconds in order to be onpair with other skills that cause confusion…

i dont think perpexlity rune are op , i think ppl should know how to play against them
as for now ppl got used to spam skills and now confusion makes them think twice before spamming

i fought 3 times against confusion engin and won 3 times with s/p+p/p (or p/s)
i just time his skills and wait to catch him with pistol whip (indeed hard fight as he got me 25% hp few times)

even with 8 stacks of confusion which alone not op (as mesmer can put it on you with no runes) if ppl just spam skills like hs thieves they will die with or without the runes

i had hard time against d/p+p/p thief with his perma stealth but got him always below 25% hp when he just use shadow refuge and re-enter the fight

if the OP can put video of the p/p play style could be great

hey dude nice video you got there I would love to make a video with you since i own a youtube channel myself (maybe a duel video?) pm me

Sensotix.4106:

hey dude nice video you got there I would love to make a video with you since i own a youtube channel myself (maybe a duel video?) pm me

Yes I would love that. My IGN is AikijinX. I’ve heard and seen some of your videos. So i am aware of your works. I’m flattered.

AikijinX.6258:

Rafahil.2857:

vinceftw.5086:

Rafahil.2857:

5 seconds would have been a good internal cooldown. 15 seems too much.

Are you really defending these runes? They’re the most broken thing to ever enter this game. You see thieves facerolling everyone spamming 4 for the lulz. God, I hate ignorant people that can’t play normally and need a crutch to rely on. I hope these get nerfed to hell. No rune should suddenly make a class that has no confusion the master of confusion. Otherwise I demand a rune that lets me deal 5k damage whenever I auto attack.

It’s not like p/p has anything else going for it. I agree that there needs to be an internal cooldown, but 15 seconds is too long and would render the build based on these runes useless.

I would be happy with a middle ground where we could meet.

The 15 second CD isn’t too long. The 6th bonus makes up for all of what the 4th bonus lacks. But obviously don’t spam. You need to effectively, and in a timely fashion interrupt when you see an opportunity, on top of adding the other conditions.

Nah I was talking about if the 6th bonus were to get a 15 second cooldown.

Rafahil.2857:

AikijinX.6258:

Rafahil.2857:

vinceftw.5086:

Rafahil.2857:

5 seconds would have been a good internal cooldown. 15 seems too much.

Are you really defending these runes? They’re the most broken thing to ever enter this game. You see thieves facerolling everyone spamming 4 for the lulz. God, I hate ignorant people that can’t play normally and need a crutch to rely on. I hope these get nerfed to hell. No rune should suddenly make a class that has no confusion the master of confusion. Otherwise I demand a rune that lets me deal 5k damage whenever I auto attack.

It’s not like p/p has anything else going for it. I agree that there needs to be an internal cooldown, but 15 seconds is too long and would render the build based on these runes useless.

I would be happy with a middle ground where we could meet.

The 15 second CD isn’t too long. The 6th bonus makes up for all of what the 4th bonus lacks. But obviously don’t spam. You need to effectively, and in a timely fashion interrupt when you see an opportunity, on top of adding the other conditions.

Nah I was talking about if the 6th bonus were to get a 15 second cooldown.

Then they would need to put a lesser or no CD on 4th bonus

I’m going to be honest, I wasn’t overly impressed by the duel/video. I’ve seen some really good thieves since launch…..and these builds aren’t at the top of my list thus far.

Trueshots.9456:

I’m going to be honest, I wasn’t overly impressed by the duel/video. I’ve seen some really good thieves since launch…..and these builds aren’t at the top of my list thus far.

Everyone has a preference.

Two off the builds that show in what kind of horrible state GW2 pvp is. → Longer CD on stealth (finishers) + give perplex rune conf a 10 sec cd.

You seem to be very much in love with your build, and thats okay. But I am going to criticize for a second…

This style of build is the ultimate noob build. You say that you have to ‘time’ your interrupts.. but you realise that there are very few abilities in this game that are instant. Auto attacks can be interrupted, most skills can. So yeah you may have to time your #4 against top skill opponents, but for your average foe in wvw, you can spam 4 and win.

I also cannot personally understand how you can defend the runes either.. considering you already admitted they make or break this build. That right there should tell you that they are broken.

The only thing about it that really impresses me is your creativity, so Ill say nice job!

Watched the video. Was already aware of this kind of playing (tried Perplexity myself on a D/P thief with just 300Condi Damage and still wreaked havoc on a lot of people), so I was not impressed at all by your build – of course, had I seen the video before, I would have been indeed impressed.

I agree with the guy who said that 4HS into BP were the reason Coloxeus lost a few fights. I know how to chain 4HS in a BP (I actually even know how to chain 5 HS, but that’s really situational), but I rarely do that in a 1v1 because you must always be aware of your surroundings, even if your opponent is stealthed.

Imho the main flaw of your fight is that you fought using your “own” rules.
I’ll explain: if I were to fight you, I would know that you couldn’t have many sources of stealth outside of the Steal one and Shadow Refuge. I usually fight my battles by keeping in mind the CDs of the utilities my opponent is using – I know that after a SR, I have 45 seconds to attack and kill the thief before he uses SR again (for example). That’s why I won’t hesitate to go and stay in stealth unless an opportunity for dealing damage arises.
You said “it’s not stealth wars 2”. I agree, but with some opponents, especially against condi based opponents, as a D/P you must abuse of your stealth in order to stay alive – whereas I am more inclined to autoattacking and Shadowshot-ing when I am fightning a Warrior, a Guardian or a Ranger.
It’s simple strategy. If I were to fight you, you would get “bored” because I would stay stealthed until I felt safe enough not to be killed. Rule #1 in competitive play is staying alive after all. Not saying I would stay stealthed for 30seconds or so, just that I would have acted differently from Coloxeus.
That’s what I am meaning when I say that you played by your own rules.

Anyway, nice video, was pleasant to watch.

(Do note that I am not implying in any way that I am a better player than you, as most things feel “easy” when you are watching a video, but the decision making is really different when it is YOU who is fightning).

Stx.4857:

You seem to be very much in love with your build, and thats okay. But I am going to criticize for a second…

This style of build is the ultimate noob build. You say that you have to ‘time’ your interrupts.. but you realise that there are very few abilities in this game that are instant. Auto attacks can be interrupted, most skills can. So yeah you may have to time your #4 against top skill opponents, but for your average foe in wvw, you can spam 4 and win.

I also cannot personally understand how you can defend the runes either.. considering you already admitted they make or break this build. That right there should tell you that they are broken.

The only thing about it that really impresses me is your creativity, so Ill say nice job!

Yes I do love my build, but I also love people that support and give positive feedback from playing it. It makes me feel just as good.

I do believe there should be a slight change to the rune, maybe in the stacks that the 6th bonus gives on interrupt. But as to a CD. Then the 4th bonus would have to it’s CD removed, and increased chance to 40%.

And i treat any “average foe in wvw” as if they are skilled. Because you will never know until you actually fight them. I don’t ever underestimate anyone. So i would never spam #4. As i said before I time my interrupts, while also applying different conditions to try to protect the confusion and have it stay there will the fullest extent of it’s duration.

hihey.1075:

Watched the video. Was already aware of this kind of playing (tried Perplexity myself on a D/P thief with just 300Condi Damage and still wreaked havoc on a lot of people), so I was not impressed at all by your build – of course, had I seen the video before, I would have been indeed impressed.

I agree with the guy who said that 4HS into BP were the reason Coloxeus lost a few fights. I know how to chain 4HS in a BP (I actually even know how to chain 5 HS, but that’s really situational), but I rarely do that in a 1v1 because you must always be aware of your surroundings, even if your opponent is stealthed.

Imho the main flaw of your fight is that you fought using your “own” rules.
I’ll explain: if I were to fight you, I would know that you couldn’t have many sources of stealth outside of the Steal one and Shadow Refuge. I usually fight my battles by keeping in mind the CDs of the utilities my opponent is using – I know that after a SR, I have 45 seconds to attack and kill the thief before he uses SR again (for example). That’s why I won’t hesitate to go and stay in stealth unless an opportunity for dealing damage arises.
You said “it’s not stealth wars 2”. I agree, but with some opponents, especially against condi based opponents, as a D/P you must abuse of your stealth in order to stay alive – whereas I am more inclined to autoattacking and Shadowshot-ing when I am fightning a Warrior, a Guardian or a Ranger.
It’s simple strategy. If I were to fight you, you would get “bored” because I would stay stealthed until I felt safe enough not to be killed. Rule #1 in competitive play is staying alive after all. Not saying I would stay stealthed for 30seconds or so, just that I would have acted differently from Coloxeus.
That’s what I am meaning when I say that you played by your own rules.

Anyway, nice video, was pleasant to watch.

(Do note that I am not implying in any way that I am a better player than you, as most things feel “easy” when you are watching a video, but the decision making is really different when it is YOU who is fightning).

Well let me thank you for the feedback number 1.

Let me start off with this. I myself before this meta, I was an avid elite D/P user. I know all the tricks to it, and i have even created a little trick that i had shown coloxeus which he has in his Thief tricks video on youtube. Now anyway. How i will tell you how i was fighting and going about dueling colo. I knew and understood that he was going into this fight with a heavy set of crit damage 0/30/30/0/10. So I had to do things carefully and concisely. Every utility that I had used (Hide in shadows heal, Shadow refuge, Caltrops, Skale venom, Spider poison, Shadow trap, Bassilick venom) was used to full effect and never used with out meaning. Because with this build there is little to no room for failure, or for that matter any P/P builds. I know and understand the mechanic for D/P is very limited to what you can do. #5+#2 stealth. or while you’re in stealth #3 + autoattack to get a backstab. #4+#2 +steal+autoattack to get a dazed backstab. I understand that d/p offers stealth, but to sleep and eat breakfast in stealth is beyond me. I’ve watched the video numerous times, and the moments where Coloxeus chained stealthed just to keep stealth to try to find someone who has limited access to stealth (myself), while he has no conditions to cleanse, just wants to be able to catch me when I appear is beyond me. (by no means am I calling Colo bad or any of that nature he’s one of my good friends.) It is competitive play as you said, but keeping me perma blinded would’ve worked just as good, then leaving me perma bored.

And thank you again, I am sure you are just as good as myself and coloxeus. but yes the perspective does change when you’re the one that’s in the hot seat, and fighting a D/Pilist like Colo.

“Little to no room for failure”

That’s what I’m talking about… this build has incredible room for failure, its a noob build.

1) High vitality and very high toughness. When I tried this build, I actually dropped some toughness for power because I was too durable, and wanted a bit more damage. Any build that has such high passive survivability will have increased room for error compared to builds without double survival stats on gear.

2) Ranged. All your attacks in this build are at 900 range, other than select utilities. Much easier to land attacks compared to melee builds that can be kited/snared etc. You don’t even have to try and CnD like P/D does.

3) Initiative management. This build uses little initiative compared to most thief builds. You use #4 as your main damage source, and other than that, you rarely need initiative. You can use black powder situationally, or hit unload for minor damage, but running out of initiative is pretty hard to do, especially with 20 sec cd steal.

There other reasons, but those are the obvious ones. Every metric you can use to judge how much skill it takes to play a build, this build rates EASY.

And no, the runes dont need to be ‘tweaked’, they need to be nerfed hard. They need to at least be brought down to the level of other rune sets. Its no coincidence that they are so popular and widely hated.

Stx.4857:

“Little to no room for failure”

That’s what I’m talking about… this build has incredible room for failure, its a noob build.

1) High vitality and very high toughness. When I tried this build, I actually dropped some toughness for power because I was too durable, and wanted a bit more damage. Any build that has such high passive survivability will have increased room for error compared to builds without double survival stats on gear.

2) Ranged. All your attacks in this build are at 900 range, other than select utilities. Much easier to land attacks compared to melee builds that can be kited/snared etc. You don’t even have to try and CnD like P/D does.

3) Initiative management. This build uses little initiative compared to most thief builds. You use #4 as your main damage source, and other than that, you rarely need initiative. You can use black powder situationally, or hit unload for minor damage, but running out of initiative is pretty hard to do, especially with 20 sec cd steal.

There other reasons, but those are the obvious ones. Every metric you can use to judge how much skill it takes to play a build, this build rates EASY.

And no, the runes dont need to be ‘tweaked’, they need to be nerfed hard. They need to at least be brought down to the level of other rune sets. Its no coincidence that they are so popular and widely hated.

Okay, well i’m not going to get confrontational with you. If you don’t like the build leave this thread and move on. Thanks

So you welcome feedback as long as its positive? If you post a build for everyone to see, you have to be willing to accept criticism.

I do ‘like’ your build. I tried it, thought it was really easy to ‘learn’, really easy to win 1vX with, and I had a blast. But I stand by my opinions, the runes are way too strong, and it is an easymode build.

I wasn’t trying to be confrontational, I was just expressing my opinions.

Stx.4857:

So you welcome feedback as long as its positive? If you post a build for everyone to see, you have to be willing to accept criticism.

I do ‘like’ your build. I tried it, thought it was really easy to ‘learn’, really easy to win 1vX with, and I had a blast. But I stand by my opinions, the runes are way too strong, and it is an easymode build.

I wasn’t trying to be confrontational, I was just expressing my opinions.

Really no point in arguing against the build. There is nothing in it for you.

i have tested the build my self and even took it further to hybrid dmg condition with p/d+s/p (or p/p as unload more suitable for power and not condition)
here is my opinion:
1. this build is fun to play and easy learn how to be offensive 1v1
2. this build is not easy to learn how to be defensive 1v1
3. this build is hard to fight 1vX as p/p arent meant to do so without stealth ability like d/p or d/d
4. like every thief build you have to adapt the play style according to your opponents ie against melee, condition, clones, aoe dmg etc. if you get wrong your chances to win dropping down fast…
5. i dont think perplexity rune for thieves are op (for engineer yes). the average stacks i manage to pull was 8 so about 1k dmg per skill use. against new player i manage to put 18 stacks but that was because they just stand and spam skills like crazy. so yes you have to time your skills use right against average player to get him interrupt
6. i do think they should put short cd on #6 ability in the rune to make ppl to think b4 they spam #4
7. confusion is condition thus build that negate condition can shut down this build. like warrior necromancer guardian with -60% condition duration so 10 seconds become 4 seconds so maybe 2k dmg average which is not op
for spammer this build is boring like the HS users (with the lucky strike who put you down )
i had hard time against d/p myself with all the stealth and won 40% of the time just because i enable to caught him with pistol whip but every time i confused him he just stealth and cleanse

against mesmer who pulled 13 stack of confusion on me why isnt op? again it isnt its just the game you have to adapt

gg for the build , adapt play style

Stx.4857:

So you welcome feedback as long as its positive? If you post a build for everyone to see, you have to be willing to accept criticism.

I do ‘like’ your build. I tried it, thought it was really easy to ‘learn’, really easy to win 1vX with, and I had a blast. But I stand by my opinions, the runes are way too strong, and it is an easymode build.

I wasn’t trying to be confrontational, I was just expressing my opinions.

Thank you for your opinion, and well yes everyone has a specific preference with build selections. This one just isn’t yours. No problem mate.

I had some good WvW roaming success over the weekend (with a P/D partner) running Perplexity runes with S/P, mostly Carrion gear, and 20/0/20/0/30 traits. I may slide SA up to 25 or 30 if I can find a good way to replace the Power and Condition duration from DA.

It was nice to have the chasedown options of a stun and a Shadowstep. Towards the end I started using Tripwire, just to be a kitten. Keeping my health up could sometimes be a problem, but the ability to take people down quickly was very good. It’s quite amazing how many people will panic-spam and give me free interrupts with Pistol Whip. I think that survival will improve as I learn to use the defensive tools of S/P properly.

I had one particularly funny sequence: some poor noob got away from me clean, but didn’t know what Confusion was, and helped to down himself by using abilities. Whoops.

Interceptor.2653:

I had some good WvW roaming success over the weekend (with a P/D partner) running Perplexity runes with S/P, mostly Carrion gear, and 20/0/20/0/30 traits. I may slide SA up to 25 or 30 if I can find a good way to replace the Power and Condition duration from DA.

It was nice to have the chasedown options of a stun and a Shadowstep. Towards the end I started using Tripwire, just to be a kitten. Keeping my health up could sometimes be a problem, but the ability to take people down quickly was very good. It’s quite amazing how many people will panic-spam and give me free interrupts with Pistol Whip. I think that survival will improve as I learn to use the defensive tools of S/P properly.

I had one particularly funny sequence: some poor noob got away from me clean, but didn’t know what Confusion was, and helped to down himself by using abilities. Whoops.

Put up some nice video clips, lets see how you play it ?

AikijinX.6258:

Put up some nice video clips, lets see how you play it ?

Probably I play it poorly; I am not very experienced in WvW yet, only just hit Recruit recently. Also, I don’t have video recording capability at the moment in any case.

But basically I will gap-close with Steal (which sticks at least three conditions), and try to get a panic-interrupt out of someone with Pistol Whip. I have Long Reach traited, and tend to approach from blind spots, so this works most of the time. I’ll use Headshot if I have to (i.e. someone created distance, or I need something that comes out faster), but generally avoid it because the damage is garbage.

A successful initiation puts 8 stacks of Confusion on the target (PW has nine hits, it nearly always procs the on-hit Confusion as well), and from there it depends on the situation. I’ve got enough juice for a few more PWs, there’s Black Powder if I have to fight in melee with autoattacks, and Shadowstep on the 2-slot can be used to either chase or engage/disengage.

I’ve started running with Tripwire lately, since it’s pretty easy to get someone to hit it, and getting knocked down for 3s in melee range means that you’re eating a whole bunch of damage in a short period of time. I’ll use Skale when I don’t use Tripwire, as a condition-clogger. Dagger Storm is my chosen Elite, as it gives me a way to stick some bleeds/cripples if I need to.

Since I have a buddy, usually we can take out small groups between the two of us. We’ll generally win 2v2s unless we are out-matched skillwise, and loners have no chance.

Interceptor.2653:

AikijinX.6258:

Put up some nice video clips, lets see how you play it ?

Probably I play it poorly; I am not very experienced in WvW yet, only just hit Recruit recently. Also, I don’t have video recording capability at the moment in any case.

But basically I will gap-close with Steal (which sticks at least three conditions), and try to get a panic-interrupt out of someone with Pistol Whip. I have Long Reach traited, and tend to approach from blind spots, so this works most of the time. I’ll use Headshot if I have to (i.e. someone created distance, or I need something that comes out faster), but generally avoid it because the damage is garbage.

A successful initiation puts 8 stacks of Confusion on the target (PW has nine hits, it nearly always procs the on-hit Confusion as well), and from there it depends on the situation. I’ve got enough juice for a few more PWs, there’s Black Powder if I have to fight in melee with autoattacks, and Shadowstep on the 2-slot can be used to either chase or engage/disengage.

I’ve started running with Tripwire lately, since it’s pretty easy to get someone to hit it, and getting knocked down for 3s in melee range means that you’re eating a whole bunch of damage in a short period of time. I’ll use Skale when I don’t use Tripwire, as a condition-clogger. Dagger Storm is my chosen Elite, as it gives me a way to stick some bleeds/cripples if I need to.

Since I have a buddy, usually we can take out small groups between the two of us. We’ll generally win 2v2s unless we are out-matched skillwise, and loners have no chance.

I will be looking forward to seeing the build mate.

I would pay to never see a d/p cheese thief video again, like big money..