Guild Wars 2

Like title said, 9300 in just one hit, really? not in wvw, just in spvp. As a glassy cannon thief, I never had any single skill damage above 6k actually, warrior has heavy defense skills, huge HP advantages, insane regeneration, heavy armor and surely hits harder too.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Final_Thrust

so basically this skill is “full adrenaline Axe Eviscerate” if your target is under 50% HP, even with this Eviscerate has better chances to pull off than Final Thrust.

+10k damage Eviscerate is so common.

You have blinds, stealths, evades, and abilities to easily jump in and out of melee range. Even if you don’t take all of these into your build, most glass Thieves are hard to deal with 1v1 because you can’t pin them down long enough to land any useful amount of damage.

Of course, if you can pin a thief down long enough, they’re glassy enough to drop in just a couple hits or solid crit.

That’s how glass thieves have been for a while. You got hit by a hard-hitting skill with a telegraphed wind-up that managed to crit you while you were under 50% health, that’s fatal to a build like yours.

It’s a very faulty skill, but powerful.
Misses easily with a moving target, always needs to be set up to land, like immobile, stun. It’s always a gamble if not set up properly.
Ad as a glassy thief you now know what final thrust looks like to move away from next time! A really telegraphed thrust! Lol

Semi-relevant, I hit a 17k final thrust on a mesmer in WvW.

Brought a tear to my eye tbh. Gotta love that damage coefficient.

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

As a glassy cannon thief, I never had any single skill damage above 6k actually, warrior has heavy defense skills, huge HP advantages, insane regeneration, heavy armor and surely hits harder too.

You may be the only person in gw2 who thinks warriors have the upperhand over thieves when it comes to dueling.

A tanky regen warrior is absolutely not putting out 9300 with Final Thrust. I run full zerk gear, but do have max defense line for key traits, and I don’t put out that much with FT. My armour is around 2500 and my healing sig is 370/s or so. Glass thieves can easily burst that down.

As a thief, you have lots of tools to shred down a warrior. Face tanking isn’t really one of them, though a good sword/dagger player can stand toe to toe with one.

Backstab is dagger thief’s best burst, you guys want to see how much the damage is from it in just one game? I have all here, enjoy

only 4 backstabs in this game I can see, 3 from me, and another one from an enemy thief in next pic

this is the backstab exchange with another thief playe, thief is just a glass now, no cannon burst anymore

my final thrust does only 1k damage, i have screenshot so im right. final thurst is weak,buff please.

Lmao, you must be a troll. In case not, here is literally the first video I pulled when I googled “backstab thief gw2 youtube” (set to the point of the first fight):

http://youtu.be/aX1O1V-M-hw?t=26s

First battle’s against a thief in which he gets in a couple hits above 8.5k, and does over 40k in 10s (which includes the start of the fight and bursting through downed to dead). Next battle is against a guardian where he has at least one hit at almost 9k. Next battle is against a ranger, and he gets over 10k. And so on.

The cooldown on final thrust is 15s and it has an obvious telegraph. What’s the CD and telegraph on backstab again? Oh yeah….

If this is a serious post, and I don’t think I can believe it is, then you may just need more practice and better build design. The numbers you’re showing aren’t the numbers for a properly built glass thief.

Choppy.4183:

Lmao, you must be a troll. In case not, here is literally the first video I pulled when I googled “backstab thief gw2 youtube” (set to the point of the first fight):

http://youtu.be/aX1O1V-M-hw?t=26s

First battle’s against a thief in which he gets in a couple hits above 8.5k, and does over 40k in 10s (which includes the start of the fight and bursting through downed to dead). Next battle is against a guardian where he has at least one hit at almost 9k. Next battle is against a ranger, and he gets over 10k. And so on.

The cooldown on final thrust is 15s and it has an obvious telegraph. What’s the CD and telegraph on backstab again? Oh yeah….

If this is a serious post, and I don’t think I can believe it is, then you may just need more practice and better build design. The numbers you’re showing aren’t the numbers for a properly built glass thief.

You are truly the troll here, we are talking about Spvp here, you put a WvW video there from Aug, few patches ago, who is the troll, you tell me. btw, you know the difference between spvp and wvw, don’t you?

I put the evidence there and not just open my mouth like you did, please, either put something here that can show the truth, or just keep reading and be quiet. people can bla bla whatever they want like you just did, show me what’s the numbers for a properly built glass thief after this new patch.

Simon.3794:

my final thrust does only 1k damage, i have screenshot so im right. final thurst is weak,buff please.

Yeah, put your screenshot right here, can you?

Lol, ok buddy. Since you need me to hold your hand:

Here’s that guy’s thief build when converted to pvp:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoYVlsMp0pdPxxJ8PNRLBt9Ii+L88MxRzHEAA-TpRBwAROCAX3fYxhAgcZAAnAgHPAAA

Backstab base damage: 2336

Here’s a sword warrior with the same gear and trait distribution, and a fairly standard stance loadout:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fJAQJAscjMdUFaZIehwJagfgyYAkAnrgU46VOH5OA-TJRBwAX3fgcZAAnAgHPAAA

Final Thrust base: 2581

Then compare the auto attacks, the other weapon skills, the stats (power, crit, etc) and the relative mitigation options.

Now, what are you crying about again?

Choppy.4183:

Lol, ok buddy. Since you need me to hold your hand:

Here’s that guy’s thief build when converted to pvp:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQNAoYVlsMp0pdPxxJ8PNRLBt9Ii+L88MxRzHEAA-TpRBwAROCAX3fYxhAgcZAAnAgHPAAA

Backstab base damage: 2336

Here’s a sword warrior with the same gear and trait distribution, and a fairly standard stance loadout:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fJAQJAscjMdUFaZIehwJagfgyYAkAnrgU46VOH5OA-TJRBwAX3fgcZAAnAgHPAAA

Final Thrust base: 2581

Then compare the auto attacks, the other weapon skills, the stats (power, crit, etc) and the relative mitigation options.

Now, what are you crying about again?

Are you serious here? you put a signet on thief side to add 180 power, but didn’t put the same might signet for the warrior, and came up with these numbers here, even so, thief’s BS is still weak than FT, don’t play game here and pretending being smart… you really have that kind of sneaky personality don’t you lol

here is the number I got after removing power signet on thief and add it on warrior.
Backstab 2161
Final Thrust 2789

and warrior has 23472 HP vs, thief 15525,
warrior has 2093 armor vs thief 1995.

and I am done discussing with you, I don’t really like your tricky behavior, you are probably better suit for a thief since you are this sneaky…

Sure, so now let’s look at what you gave up to get the Might signet: 4s of invulnerability and 6s of vigor. Good trade, you think?

As it is, pretty much nobody would play the warrior spec I put there. Do you know why? Because the mitigation outside of the stances (one of which you’ve removed) is poor… armor is low, damage pressure is low, mobility is average, and cc is low (except the hard to land burst, which the thief can port out of). Those are your main class damage mitigation options as a warrior.

But that thief build, that’s a viable glass dagger build. You have plenty of class damage mitigation: stealth, teleportation, basilisk, and insane damage pressure. That’s good entry, unload, and exit opportunity. People would (and do) use that spec.

But let’s ignore all of that and go with exactly what you’ve posted. How many times can you backstab in 15s (the CD of Final Thrust). How about the Heartseekers after the initial burst, which the thief controls through a teleport into the fight, a poison to clamp down on the warrior healing, and an unshakeable cc?

And what will the perma-weakness from the thief do to that Final Thrust assuming he manages to somehow get the thief below 50% health to use and actually land it with that telegraph? Oh yeah, an average of -25%.

It’s become abundantly clear where your troubles are coming from, and it’s not from “OP warriors”, it’s that you have no idea what you’re doing. I suck on my thief, but I’d chew that warrior up all day. The screen shots you posted as a “glass thief” barely reached the base backstab damage of your signet-less thief build, and ONLY when you crit.

NOBODY runs the glass sword build I posted. Quite a few people use the thief build though, and the good ones dominate with it. That’s what we call proof of concept.

This is hilarious. A glass cannon thief is complaining about getting hit for 9K Final Thrust. Guess what a Backstab will do almost that equivalent amount of damage. And Backstab has zero cooldown, easier to land and doesn’t require the opponent to be under 50% HP. So what are you complaining about?

Here let me take screenshots of backstab doing 700 damage omg please buff it must be true! Omg let me take screenshots of a 20K Killshot omg OP please nerf. A shatter mesmer waved his/her greatsword and I got 2 shot nerf please.

Warrior does have the most armor, most HP, decent regeneration, hitting harder it is debatable. Yet Warriors aren’t on every top competitive team, yet Thieves represent Warriors more on these teams, yet the top team won with a Thief and with NO warriors.

Guess what, Thieves have stealth, insane mobility, hit really hard, a billion and 1 dodges, have easier to set up bursts, blinds, dazes and steal which gives them a billion different benefits if you spec 6 into trickery. Nobody runs Berserker Warriors but most people run Berserker Thieves. There is a reason why one functions much better(Thief) and the other doesnt (Warrior). Nobody runs glass Warriors seriously, and a tanky warrior isn’t going to hit you for a 9.3K Final thrust.

/end thread please

Hello,

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

Like title said, 9300 in just one hit, really? not in wvw, just in spvp.

The warrior does have a few skills which can hit pretty hard, yes. Whirling Axe and Hundred Blades can hit above that figure quite easily, and Eviscerate does equivalent damage.

Reaching 9.3k with Final Thrust is not an easy feat, though. You need to stack a lot of might to do so, then you need to plan the skill, either with control or anticipating the movement of your foe, as it has quite a long cast time.

Note that I don’t think that you need to run berserker to obtain such a result; a celestial warrior with good might stacking capabilities (say, a sword/warhorn+longbow one) can do it. Interestingly, a berserker build without might stacking won’t make more than 7k damage with Final Thrust.

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

As a glassy cannon thief, I never had any single skill damage above 6k actually, warrior has heavy defense skills, huge HP advantages, insane regeneration, heavy armor and surely hits harder too.

This paragraph is the reason you’re getting some aggressive reactions from my fellow warriors. Sure, I understand that you feel a bit disheartened about being hit by such a high figure, but I think that anybody has had this experience, from any class, not only warrior. Sure, a thief does less instant damage; but its particular mechanics (weapon skills bound to initiative, with no CDs) lets him apply superior damage in short times.

Balance isn’t an easy thing. While warriors have good base stats and decent regeneration, they have no teleports nor stealth, and few blocks/evades on their weapons. All in all, this means that you can kite them (especially as S/D thief), all the more that most PvP warrior builds do not embark lots of mobility.

I play a berserker warrior myself, and I’ve trained a lot with an expert thief. What he told me is that provided he took his time and kited appropriately (using the bow regularly), he’d be confident in winning; but that, in counterpart, a single mistake would cost him the fight. I somehow agree with that, which is why I love fighting against thieves: can I put enough pressure to have them crack and make that very mistake, giving me the match?

Regards.

When the stars align and I can actually hit a decent Thief with a final thrust, I better get some sort of pay-off.

If you walk even without swiftness the skill misses. What kind of thief are you staying so close for so long? Do you facetank hambows too?

I use a Celestial warrior with axe/X and with Eviscerate (but traited, then it’s a little more good than FT) I can deal 7k+ damage to berserker enemy like some mesmers and thiefs. I can deal 8k+ to them if I use berserker Amulet.
But you need to see that: with the same berserker equip a Warrior’s FT have 2200 of skill power, but you need to take the enemy under 50% HP have 3/4 sec of casting, 130 of range (you move and the warrior miss) and 15 sec of cooldown, and if you use Eviscerate (almost same skill power) you need to full 3 bars of Adrenaline to use it (same skill casting but more range and lesser cooldown).
A thief’s Backstab have 1800 of skill power that you do with 1/4 sec casting ( it’s = no casting, then you don’t miss the enemy) and you have not delay, you can use it every time you hide, then you can do it twice in 1.x second (backstab – cloack and dagger – backstab) and the enemy can’t see you when you use Backstab!
Because if the enemy see you use FT or Eviscerate he just evade, block, blind or knock you and all your damage is gone. But if the enemy can’t see you he can’t block you.
And a Thief can use Backstab when he want without problems, but a warrior need 3 bars of Adrenaline or need to take down the enemy healt to perform that damage.

Then, the high damage is also granted by the large amount of Might that a warrior can stack (expecially with some builds).

I’ve find some bunker classes that make me cry with my little 1000 of Eviscerate Critical hit (with always a lot of might on).

Final truth is also a powerfull skill on a Condition Damage Weapon. The warrior need to be a Condition Damage Dealer to reduce your HP to 50% and use FT and that make they’re other damage skills lesser good to fight you. Because ok, they deal 6k with FT but also they deal 400 with the auto attack…

Actually a warrior to fight someone in sPvP can Only fight with Bust Skills like Eviscerate, Final Thrust (or 100Blades in some builds). If he don’t do that he can only try to use the Hammer to make you unable to fight then, but if you evade 3 attacks you can kill them easy.

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

Simon.3794:

my final thrust does only 1k damage, i have screenshot so im right. final thurst is weak,buff please.

Yeah, put your screenshot right here, can you?

Thief OP, nerf please.

Simon.3794:

Thief OP, nerf please.

You’d better report that guy, because he’s definitely using haxx!! We know that because, as Keyboardwarrior’s evidence clearly shows, the max backstab damage from a glass cannon thief is about 2500 on a crit, but is normally more like 700-800. So, yeah, definitely hax.

Meanwhile, "we’ve got warriors runnin’ around using Final Thrust for 9300 all over this place, snatchin’ your people up, tryin’ to kitten ‘em. So y’all need to hide your kids, hide your wife, and hide your husband cause they’re rapin’ everybody out here! " – Antoine “Keyboardwarrior” Dodson

Supreme.7352:

When the stars align and I can actually hit a decent Thief with a final thrust, I better get some sort of pay-off.

That video would reach a million views on YouTube in a month.

We’re seriously being accused by thieves that we hit too hard, now?

A thief is complaining about a telegraphed attack that only hits hard when below 50% health? What on earth?

This complaint is coming from someone who can do similar damage every time he goes into stealth with a backstab that is SPAMABLE until it lands. I can use tactics and shield block your backstab but you can keep spamming it on my shield until it eventually lands when my block runs out. I can dodge roll constantly to avoid the backstab but you’ll spam the air with no consequence until it lands.

Your backstab being blocked should reveal you.

L2P. Warriors shouldn’t beat thieves.

Simon.3794:

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

Simon.3794:

my final thrust does only 1k damage, i have screenshot so im right. final thurst is weak,buff please.

Yeah, put your screenshot right here, can you?

Thief OP, nerf please.

Let you see who should be nerfed, more tanky, more stuns and more hp, but same and better burst, that’s totally unfair. it’s like 10k burst in 3 sec.

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

Simon.3794:

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

Simon.3794:

my final thrust does only 1k damage, i have screenshot so im right. final thurst is weak,buff please.

Yeah, put your screenshot right here, can you?

Thief OP, nerf please.

Let you see who should be nerfed, more tanky, more stuns and more hp, but same and better burst, that’s totally unfair. it’s like 10k burst in 3 sec.

You’re hilarious! It’s evident by the statements you’re making that you haven’t played very long and don’t understand the basic builds for each class.

Warriors are fine. In fact, they’ve been hit pretty hard by nerfs recently so just stop acting like they’re op or some crap. Try playing one and you’ll see fairly quickly.

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

Let you see who should be nerfed, more tanky, more stuns and more hp, but same and better burst, that’s totally unfair. it’s like 10k burst in 3 sec.

Lol @ QQ. But it’s not faaaaaairrrrr!

Buddy, as has been pointed out repeatedly, thieves have better DPS by a lot. They also have blinds, stealth, and evades, all of which negate the warrior skills you’re whining about. In trade to get those shiny toys, you have a low health pool and medium armor.

If you’re losing to warriors regularly as a thief, look to your own failings. You can (and should) post your concern about OP warriors who outclass thieves on every measure in the Thief section of the forums, and then watch as you get laughed right out of the section. Their may even be demands from other thieves that you delete your character.

This is a l2p moment, kiddo. In fact, I’ve already said that I’m trash on my thief, but here’s an offer. I’ll play the above glass spec and you can play the above warrior spec and see if you can beat me even once. Then I’ll beat you with a condi spec….

Let me know when you’re up for that.

Thief have good chances to do high damage, but it’s best isn’t in the single skill damage (but Backstab hurt!), it’s best is in the number of attacks that you can perform while the enemy can’t see/hit you by hide, blind and evade. There’s a lot of theif that make me a lot of problems because I can’t hit them, I can’t see them, I can’t fight them.
A thief that don’t use hide and blind is easy for me to kill (but that’s for every class, I think), but a good thief that know how to hide and attack, evading all my skills, is a finger in the a***.
As the same way I focus on Adrenaline and F1 skills to kill my enemy, using my class mechanics, if a Thief use it’s hide he can kill/survive everything.

You must have had like 100 stacks of vulnerability. The most I’ve ever hit anyone with it was about 5k and they were full zerker.

Those videos were kinda silly. WvW was terribly inaccurate as a representation of what thieves can hit for, and thieves in sPvP can hit around 9k stabs without too much difficulty.

Just they’re not hitting those numbers or even close to them at all without something like my build, which is not at all viable in sPvP.

Also noteworthy is that getting crits that high in sPvP in general is difficult, as critical damage is effectively capped much below that of PvE/WvW.

Stupid to be having a thief vs warrior hate thread. I recently picked up a S/S war using celestial/krait, and it works wonders in sPvP. FT hurts glassy players, but it’s not some kind of crazy mega-nuke skill, either. Berserker war focusing on FT for damage is going to have just as much luck as a berserker signets D/D thief such as my WvW build building for pure backstabs; might work in WvW, does not work in sPvP.

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

Simon.3794:

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

Simon.3794:

my final thrust does only 1k damage, i have screenshot so im right. final thurst is weak,buff please.

Yeah, put your screenshot right here, can you?

Thief OP, nerf please.

Let you see who should be nerfed, more tanky, more stuns and more hp, but same and better burst, that’s totally unfair. it’s like 10k burst in 3 sec.

Let you see who should be nerfed, more dodges, remove boons, no cool down on skills, stealth, auto pilot but same and better, easier to hit burst.
that’s totally unfair. it’s like 13k burst in less then 2 seconds and i’m not even full glass.

Nerf thief, thank you.

DeceiverX.8361:

Stupid to be having a thief vs warrior hate thread.

I don’t think that’s what’s happening here, really. It’s one guy QQ about getting beat up by warriors, and everyone else telling him he has a L2P issue.

I personally like where thieves and warriors are, atm. Sure, they could both use some tweaks here and there, but I don’t see any real balance issues personally.

I do see thieves having the advantage in duels and straight out single target ganking, but that’s kind of their role thematically. Warriors can bring all sorts of value to team play in particular, and are viable on their own too generally speaking.

The video I linked was just to counter his claims of max thief damage way under performing warrior damage (via Final Thrust). The later build links were to show how close they were damage wise in pvp.

DeceiverX.8361:

Those videos were kinda silly. WvW was terribly inaccurate as a representation of what thieves can hit for, and thieves in sPvP can hit around 9k stabs without too much difficulty.

Just they’re not hitting those numbers or even close to them at all without something like my build, which is not at all viable in sPvP.

Also noteworthy is that getting crits that high in sPvP in general is difficult, as critical damage is effectively capped much below that of PvE/WvW.

Stupid to be having a thief vs warrior hate thread. I recently picked up a S/S war using celestial/krait, and it works wonders in sPvP. FT hurts glassy players, but it’s not some kind of crazy mega-nuke skill, either. Berserker war focusing on FT for damage is going to have just as much luck as a berserker signets D/D thief such as my WvW build building for pure backstabs; might work in WvW, does not work in sPvP.

Well i will first say that iam pretty much a noob at this gam, but still, i tried out thief in sPvP again, and what ever target i attacked i couldnt get close to get 9k backstabs, how do you do that? mine where at a silly number of 3,5k, but then again i could have done something wrong, and i don’t agree with 2 shotting classes either, but when you are facing terrible players, that actually were worse then iam, and i still couldnt kill them, its kinda silly.
I just felt like the skillcap of thief is waaay higher then other classes, i could be wrong, but still, if that is the case, isnt that unfair?

And people saying stealth is good is also silly, i rather take more hp and more defense over stealth anytime, sine that you can’t aoe and autoattack threw.

Iam not trying to whine or Q_q, i just want to learn, and i don’t think thief is the class for me, going to try warrior, but don’t like the so called meta spec and rather play with a GS/LB combo.

robertul.3679:

If you walk even without swiftness the skill misses. What kind of thief are you staying so close for so long? Do you facetank hambows too?

This. Its not like the skill is exactly difficult to avoid. It has a range of 130 and an obvious tell. the only way you could get hit by it is if you were hugging the warrior, and as a class with evades, ports, stealths and the like built in, that seems very unlikely to do on routine.

Warriors hit hard. At least, they used to. People keep hugging them and complaining when they melt.

Wanash.2794:

I just felt like the skillcap of thief is waaay higher then other classes, i could be wrong, but still, if that is the case, isnt that unfair?

And people saying stealth is good is also silly, i rather take more hp and more defense over stealth anytime, sine that you can’t aoe and autoattack threw.

It just takes practice, and some things come more naturally to some people than others. I regularly play with someone who has a harder time getting in the groove with melee classes (heavies in particular) but does great with eles, etc. I’m the opposite, though I actually took to my engineer faster than my warrior (though warrior’s now my main).

Stealth is amazing though, especially if you trait for it and play your character like a thief rather than a warrior. A stealthless thief with warrior health would be one dead thief (same with the reverse… though hammer lock from stealth sounds delicious).

Wanash.2794:

…going to try warrior, but don’t like the so called meta spec and rather play with a GS/LB combo.

Play what you like, and if you find it doesn’t work in the particular aspect of the game you’re playing and/or you aren’t interested in what does work, just play a different class or area of the game.

Comparing Thief and Warrior is like compare a cannon and a gatling.
- Warrior can charge up and use Adrenaline skills or reduce the enemy defence then use FT to deal high damage, but they need to fight a lot to obtain that damage (to build up adrenaline or to reduce enemy hp), and the attack speed of a warrior is slow and easy to evade/block/blind/interrupt. But when a warrior hit the damage is huge.
- Thief need to stealth to backstab the enemy but a thief can start the fight in stealth and have a lot of skills that hide the thief, making him able to backstab the enemy another time quickly. Thief BS is hard to block/evade/blind/interrupt because you don’t see the thief, it’s attack speed is istant and after the first hit a thief can turn hide istant (or after few seconds). Thief can perform a very high dps, mucjh more than a warrior, expecially in spvp, because it’s unpredictable, quickly, with no cooldown and have traits that grant them to backstab with 100% chance to critical hit (a warrior to crit with Eviscerate or FT need to use the signet of intelligence and swap weapon or hope that it’s skill deal a critical hit).

I’m playing a warrior with axe/shield and LB and trust me when I say that theres some thiefs that deal me more than 10k of damage in 4 seconds and that I can’t hit them ’cause of blind, hide and dodge.

If you go to see the damage of a single skill you’re not able to see how powerful that skill or that class is. You need also to see the delay of the skill, the chance to hit/miss, how fast is and how many attacks you can perform in 5 sec.

A warrior from the start of a fight need 10 sec (more or less) to perform Eviscerate and much more to deal high damage with Final Thrust. A thief don’t need more than 1 sec to perform it’s backstab and can do it easy every x sec, and have a lot of very good damage skills activable during the wait for the hide. After using Eviscerate or FT a warrior can’t deal all that damage that a thief can, expecially agasint a thief, and need to wait for the cooldown of the skill or/and untill it’s Adrenaline is at it’s top to active it’s powerful skill.

killahmayne.9518:

This is hilarious. A glass cannon thief is complaining about getting hit for 9K Final Thrust. Guess what a Backstab will do almost that equivalent amount of damage. And Backstab has zero cooldown, easier to land and doesn’t require the opponent to be under 50% HP. So what are you complaining about?

So much missinformation in here….. Backstab has ofc a cooldown, its at least 4.x seconds in sPvP, because when your hit a backstab you are REVEALED and thus, cannot get back into stealth for the next 4 seconds !!!

Also, you know how much dmg a backstab does that does not flank ?
Less than a dagger autoattack-

I don’t want do defend thiefs or anything, but you ppl saying a glass thief does the same dmg and has so much more abilities to hit and run are just wrong.

I see so many good players and streamers play thiefs and fail horrible with it, b/c its not as easy as ppl tend to make it.

Granted Final Truest often fails, but S/x warrior, specced for dmg has more dmg than thief, but it’s also another playstyle.

You can perhaps in theory get more dps out of Backstab but you cannot run such a build in sPvP.
The times where you ran D/D 25/30/0/0/15 with assassin signet (the old one) are long gone.

Silv.9207:

I’m playing a warrior with axe/shield and LB and trust me when I say that theres some thiefs that deal me more than 10k of damage in 4 seconds and that I can’t hit them ’cause of blind, hide and dodge.

Perhaps you should play some thief, and understand it’s mechanics then.
If he does dodge he cannot hit you, if you are blinded you should perhaps not stand in BP, you also have zerker stance which you perhaps should pop earlier and not when you are already blinded, this will normally force and D/P thief to backoff.

“Hide” does no dmg to you, and you might want to still AA while you cannot see the thief, you will wonder how many thiefs will be revealed dead by your feet …

It’s like i wrote before, if you did not play the profession yourself please do not judge it, you don’t have a clue what you are talking about.

Wanash.2794:

DeceiverX.8361:

Those videos were kinda silly. WvW was terribly inaccurate as a representation of what thieves can hit for, and thieves in sPvP can hit around 9k stabs without too much difficulty.

Just they’re not hitting those numbers or even close to them at all without something like my build, which is not at all viable in sPvP.

Also noteworthy is that getting crits that high in sPvP in general is difficult, as critical damage is effectively capped much below that of PvE/WvW.

Stupid to be having a thief vs warrior hate thread. I recently picked up a S/S war using celestial/krait, and it works wonders in sPvP. FT hurts glassy players, but it’s not some kind of crazy mega-nuke skill, either. Berserker war focusing on FT for damage is going to have just as much luck as a berserker signets D/D thief such as my WvW build building for pure backstabs; might work in WvW, does not work in sPvP.

Well i will first say that iam pretty much a noob at this gam, but still, i tried out thief in sPvP again, and what ever target i attacked i couldnt get close to get 9k backstabs, how do you do that? mine where at a silly number of 3,5k, but then again i could have done something wrong, and i don’t agree with 2 shotting classes either, but when you are facing terrible players, that actually were worse then iam, and i still couldnt kill them, its kinda silly.
I just felt like the skillcap of thief is waaay higher then other classes, i could be wrong, but still, if that is the case, isnt that unfair?

And people saying stealth is good is also silly, i rather take more hp and more defense over stealth anytime, sine that you can’t aoe and autoattack threw.

Iam not trying to whine or Q_q, i just want to learn, and i don’t think thief is the class for me, going to try warrior, but don’t like the so called meta spec and rather play with a GS/LB combo.

Not building into shadow arts or acrobatics, and not going trickery 6 and building a 5/6/0/0/3 signet build will. But as I said, it’s not at all viable in sPvP due to many, many critical damage reductions and nerfs to thief’s overall damage throughput in general.

Using something like my build posted here:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Post-Your-Build-Thread/page/4#post4647153

Will allow for huge damage spikes.
It is correct in most cases, especially for D/D, that the skill : output effectiveness ratio is often lower than other classes, but this is how the class was designed to an extent; if it becomes too easy, it becomes too good. That said, it’s also heavily-dependent on the player. I consider myself to be a very good thief and a build pioneer, but I straight up admit to being a terrible tank and a sub-par guardian. A friend of mine is the opposite; he’s a fantastic tank and guard player but a dreadful glass thief, and seemingly no matter how much practice we dump into each other’s professions, neither can come close :P

Thief doesn’t suffer from a lack of damage as much as it suffers from a lack of viable builds in general in sPvP, and its relevance stems almost entirely from specific setups designed to directly counter what’s within the current metagame. In its current state, there is no universally-effective thief build that works against all foes in all environments equally the same and remains effective; all existing thief builds are both viable and no viable in all of the formats. As such, it’s not problems with the thief class or warrior class as much as it is specific ways of playing the game that create an environment unfavorable to most thief specs in sPvP.

And I genuinely do not believe that the thief is for you, either, as you said it yourself: you’d rather take hp and defense over stealth and agility. There are no damage sacrifices really to be made as much as it is the fact that your preferred style of play is not conducive to the requirements of how the professions must be played.

Wow, just about fell off my chair laughing when i read this…hehehehehe…. I’ve had thieves drop every single condi on me in one hit, then stunlock me to death. It was great! Not to mention most the thieves that have some sorta perma-invis hack going on(in sPvP). Yeah, my heart goes out to you and your “Final Thrust” argument, buddy! ROFLMAO

Now, how many stacks of might did this warrior have. Can’t believe I posted in this thread.

Shame to be killed by the most useless skill in Warrior’s weapon skill set.

I love hitting squishies with final thrust

Eques Scutio.4307:

Are we totally forgetting about the first screenshot “keyboardwarrior”, (aptly named btw.) being posted from Edge of the Mists? Or are we not going there?

Haven’t seen it.
Be so kind and share x3

Keyboardwarrior.8021:

Like title said, 9300 in just one hit, really? not in wvw, just in spvp. As a glassy cannon thief, I never had any single skill damage above 6k actually, warrior has heavy defense skills, huge HP advantages, insane regeneration, heavy armor and surely hits harder too.

I’ve hit for over 9k BS with thief, given that my target was another glassy thief but that’s besides the point. Final thrust can be seen from a mile away, the only annoying thing is that flurry applies its effects before it actual hits anything. Sometimes I feel like magic immobilizing someone with my sword and then start cutting them down. This, of course, leads to a very easy final thrust.

Unless I’ve overlooked it, nobody has pointed out how rare it is to see a power-based sword Warrior. Axe you see a good amount of but Sword? Pretty rare. The AA isn’t super amazing unless you take Leg Specialist.

Not that it’s a bad build. I used to have some decent success with this build. It would be really good vs Thieves due to how much Immob it has and landing Final Thrust would be much easier because even if Shield Bash misses you still have the AA or your leap which gives you just enough time to land FT. If you wanna be even more annoying you can drop Endure Pain for Bolas. Just make sure to chain it with another immob because it sucks on its own.

NinjaEd.3946:

I’ve hit for over 9k BS with thief, given that my target was another glassy thief but that’s besides the point. Final thrust can be seen from a mile away.

This.

It’s almost like players that fight warriors think they’re not -allowed- to be strong or something, while thieves can Backstab a kitten-ton of damage with very little, if any tell and that counts as “fair and proper mechanics”.

Wars are already stupid-weak in most builds that dont pour absolutely everything they’ve got into damage.

People, can we stop talking about the OP’s 2.7k backstab? Stop calling it a backstab. He said he hit that much on a glass thief. You guys know what that means? He didn’t do a backstab…He did a frontstab like a pleb. OP clearly doesn’t understand thieves. Can we move on? Thanks. Stop discussing backstabs when it’s really a frontstab.