A look at the "Signet Build"

A look at the "Signet Build"

in Warrior

Posted by: Dingle.2743

Dingle.2743

Before I start, I’d like to state this thread is intended to be a discussion of the issues with the signet build; what causes it to be popular with under-informed players, and why it’s so poor in end-game. There’s a brief tl;dr version at the end of the post.

As I’m sure most of you are aware, there exists a very simplistic setup for warriors that revolves around the trait “Deep Strikes” and having as many signets active as possible. This build is extremely effective at early levels, and then starts to get worse as the character levels up. Let’s take a look at it.

At the earliest possible point Deep Strikes can be unlocked, level 20, the player will have access to the following:
1) 100 precision from the trait line itself
2) 30 precision from Signet of Fury
3) 4 equipped signets, worth 40 precision each (total unlock cost is 14 SP minimum, which is lower than the SP awarded by level 20)

This leads to a total of 290 precision, which isn’t scaled down in level 20 zones.

At level 20, according to the wiki Precision is worth 1% crit per 3.16; this means that at level 20 the signet setup by itself is worth 91.77% crit rate, plus 4% base crit.

Obviously, that’s quite a ridiculous amount of crit – a new warrior comes across it by accident at level 20, and thinks to themself “Holy kitten, this build is amazing” – a single trait and 4 skill slots grants an overall DPS increase of nearly 50%

At this point, the build really is amazing. There’s no other minor trait that can give such a huge benefit – at level 20. Levelling up from here is where the build falters.

Firstly, the precision granted by the setup only increases by 1 point per level, and only when the player isn’t downscaled. The only exception is at level 30 when the player gets an elite signet. After level 30, the precision carries on increasing by 1 point per level, and possibly 100 additional points at level 40 and 60 when the player gets access to master and grandmaster traits.

However, with the precision increasing so slowly, the crit rate begins to fall – at level 30, the setup grants 340 precision. At level 30, 4.96 precision grants 1% crit rate – the setup’s crit rate has dropped to 68.55%, and from here on, it only gets worse.

So it’s fairly apparent that the build significantly gets worse a the character levels up. What’s less immediately obvious is that the build does not return to it’s prime when the character is scaled down – the additional precision from Deep Strikes and the trait points is treated as part of the character’s total stats and reduced upon returning to a level 20 zone.

As a result, we’re left with a build with somewhat of a paradox – it’s most effective at lower levels, and yet it’s only effective if your level is not reduced in any way.

We can also look at the signets in the same way. The dolyak signet, signet of fury and signet of might all drop off similarly as the character levels up, although these specifically downscale correctly. The issue here is that the stat increase granted by the signet increases linearly, while the stats themselves increase at an exponential rate as the character levels.

For example, again at level 20:
A character has 128 base power
Signet of Might adds 30 power
Therefore, Signet of Might increases power by (30/128=23.44%) of the base

At level 80:
A character has 916 base power
Signet of Might adds 90 power
Therefore, Signet of Might increases power by (90/916=9.825%) of the base

The same applies to all raw-stat signets; a precision signet grants around 10% crit at level 15 and 4% crit at level 80, and so on. The value significantly declines as the character gains levels.

This all adds up to what I think the core of the issue with the signet build is: Players new to the class are unaware of the build significantly decreasing in effectiveness as they level up, and by the time they reach level 80, they’ve gotten used to the build being “good”.

tl;dr: I believe that ANet need to have another look at stat-increasing signets and traits, decide on a base level of effectiveness for those signets and traits, and then apply scaling appropriately so that this base effectiveness is true at all levels, instead of changing over time. As things are, new players get a false impression of how effective these traits and signets are, and may end up with a build that’s subpar because they don’t know it’s become worse over time.

A look at the "Signet Build"

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Posted by: Ivanov.8914

Ivanov.8914

That won’t happen.There are and there have been many other issues that are far more important to fix (GS 5, Bull’s charge and Shield 4 missing cuz of pathing is just the start) and even those haven’t been properly addressed…

The debates over this build have come and gone.The general consensus is that you use this build to power level, and after lvl 60 or so , switch to something more appropriate.
Warriors have a few things to be fixed , but sadly this isn’t one of them.

A look at the "Signet Build"

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Posted by: sinzer.4018

sinzer.4018

I think your claim about new players is far too general.

I’ve only been playing a few months and warrior was the first character i was levelling. At level 20 i did go for deep strikes and i was amazed. However, as someone not completely new to RPGs i was constantly looking at my characters stats anyway and noticing the decrease each level. By the time i got to level 40 i thought it was no longer worth having the utility slots go unused and so i switched my build.

Of course this isn’t to say everyone’s like me and pays attention to the character sheet, i have seen warriors at level 80 with a signet build but it just takes looking once in a while to see it gets progressively worse as you level.

A look at the "Signet Build"

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Posted by: vorpal.1497

vorpal.1497

I don’t want to see this build be made viable. You SHOULD be punished for picking 5 passive utilities that you never (or rarely) activate. It’s lazy.

A look at the "Signet Build"

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Posted by: Ozzrel.9825

Ozzrel.9825

I don’t want to see this build be made viable. You SHOULD be punished for picking 5 passive utilities that you never (or rarely) activate. It’s lazy.

Instead of buffing the passives, they should redesign the activation effects. Right now they are just a (bad) copy of other skills. Just buffing the active effects won’t do either, they need to be changed completely.

A look at the "Signet Build"

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Posted by: TheGuy.3568

TheGuy.3568

I don’t want to see this build be made viable. You SHOULD be punished for picking 5 passive utilities that you never (or rarely) activate. It’s lazy.

The devs did say they wanted builds where you could just sit back and let the passives work (think it was the last sotg but don’t quote me on that). Signet builds should be viable as long as the active effect is worth blowing the passive for if the passive is good enough to keep up all the time (the various healing signets in the game are a decent example).

All that being said I agree to a degree signet builds could be considered “lazy”.

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