Guild Wars 2

Pros: Free condition clears /w cleansing ire with any weapon now, not just log bows.
edit I have been told the above is not true. So there is no saving grace in this change.
Cons:

A. Burst skill balancing so far has revolved around making them highly telegraphable. I am not saying this should change I am saying this combined with the proposed changes create a stiff penalty and will make using a burst skills more unforgiving than anything else I know of in the game. Perhaps this is the intention but good intentions are not always good.

B. Some skills like eviscerate for example work like rush, any movement impairing conditions effect this skills ability to land. Hammer stun is very buggy and fails to work where the terrain is not flat. Point being there are many issues with burst skill mechanics adding this change will make them totally unwieldy.

C. Kill shot is a good example of a highly telegraphed burst skill. Not only is the wind up long with an obvious tell but now you are telling me not only will we give other players every opportunity to dodge or kite your burst skill but we will also severely penalize you for trying to use one that anyone with a bare minimum of practice can avoid.

D. Burst skill nerfs we have also seen several burst skill nerfs that were totally unnecessary and everyone knows this, Hammer and longbow to name two but there are others. So you are telling me new warrior balancing.

E. Low damage burst skills, that are highly telegraphable with obvious tells that severely penalize and punish the player attempting to use them GG ANET Rekt…

TY for reading ANET. I liked most of the other changes and didn’t mind some of the other adrenaline rework however this one is too much and has too many issues.

Edit: F skills like blind will totally punish warriors worst than any other profession it will be over the top.

No free cleansing. Karl clarified in chat that Cleansing Ire will not proc on a miss. Combustive Shot’s interaction was not mentioned.

so.. in other words basically no pros thank you for clarification.

This change is great. I don’t see how people can be oblivious to that.
Now a Warrior won’t actually get benefits from not landing his skills (Adrenal Health), but will get punished if the opponent is decent. You claim that burst skills are now:
Highly Telegraphed
Low Damage
Basically useless.
Then let’s take a look at the cooldown for a second.
10 seconds is standard for any burst skill, and can be lowered to 7 3/4 with Burst Mastery. The damage on some Burst Skills are among the highest base damages in the game.
So. What you’re actually mad about is that the warrior’s burst skills now function more like any other high-reward/high-risk skill.
Like for instance; Fire Grab.
Base damage against burning foes is slightly lower than eviscerate, but has a 45 second CD compared to the base 10 of Eviscerate. Eviscerate is also a gap-closer.
Seems fine, since the warrior’s class-mechanic obviously has to be better than a random ele-skill.
But I seriously do not get your whine.

If Cleansing Ire still procs on missing Combustive Shot, nothing will ever change.

Rym.1469:

If Cleansing Ire still procs on missing Combustive Shot, nothing will ever change.

I really hope the whole skill will fail if it does not hit, and therefore not proc Cleansing Ire. Otherwise it would just be kittened.

This is a type of change where I would actually have to see it go live in order to form a complete opinion about it.

Warriors didn’t really receive anything that you would call buffs to the class in general. Maybe the Arcing Slice is truly the only buff. Most of the other "buffs" are to increasing diversity in grandmaster trait lines or to things that are either situational or seldomly used. Like the mace auto still looks horrid, rifle still isn’t a weapon to be taken serious, it is more like a DPS shift than an increase.

But obviously the impact of warrior changes will have to be seen in the context of upcoming balance changes to other classes to really make an opinion.

KrisHQ.4719:

This change is great. I don’t see how people can be oblivious to that.
Now a Warrior won’t actually get benefits from not landing his skills (Adrenal Health), but will get punished if the opponent is decent. You claim that burst skills are now:
Highly Telegraphed
Low Damage
Basically useless.
Then let’s take a look at the cooldown for a second.
10 seconds is standard for any burst skill, and can be lowered to 7 3/4 with Burst Mastery. The damage on some Burst Skills are among the highest base damages in the game.
So. What you’re actually mad about is that the warrior’s burst skills now function more like any other high-reward/high-risk skill.
Like for instance; Fire Grab.
Base damage against burning foes is slightly lower than eviscerate, but has a 45 second CD compared to the base 10 of Eviscerate. Eviscerate is also a gap-closer.
Seems fine, since the warrior’s class-mechanic obviously has to be better than a random ele-skill.
But I seriously do not get your whine.

Going to only respond to this one post since I red what you said and I dont think you know what you are talking about.

First thing you said was claim I sad the following
Highly Telegraphed True
Low Damage True
Basically useless. You Lied here. Pretty dishonest.

Burst skills have short CDs 10 seconds is standard for any burst skill, and can be lowered to 7 3/4 yes and no.

Burst skills have 10 sec CDs currently However it is 10 secs + 30 strikes of adrenaline. Post patch they will Have zero CD and Be regulated basically by Adrenaline
Adrenaline Gain > simple CDs. Besides the 2 utilities to instantly get adrenaline To get 3 bars of adrenaline normally without cleasin IRE or any trait that grants extra adrinaline typically 1 strike of adrenaline per 1 hit that lands. So here you really don’t understand game mechanics.

Eles cool downs are long becasue they have how many 20 skills? and How many utilites.

Warriors have 10 skills at anyone time. Thanks for reading

Highly Telegraphed???
did you even fight asuras?

Anton.1769:

Highly Telegraphed???
did you even fight asuras?

Lmao this is so true. Good luck squinting your eyes trying to dodge those “highly telegraphed” bursts from min size asura warriors, which is 99% of warriors nowadays.

In all honesty, were Warriors really expecting any pros from this balance? Given that Warriors are widely considered the most face-rolly OP profession in the game as things stand, it shouldn’t surprise you guys. I personally have no problems against Warriors so I couldn’t have cared less about the skillbar as long as they weren’t buffed more, but I think nerfs this time round were to be expected.

RyanDancePls.7351:

Anton.1769:

Highly Telegraphed???
did you even fight asuras?

Lmao this is so true. Good luck squinting your eyes trying to dodge those “highly telegraphed” bursts from min size asura warriors, which is 99% of warriors nowadays.

u cant dodge Kill shot uninstall the game. 99% of warriors are assuras? doesn’t even sound like a believable statement. And how about balancing assuras then siince any class can abuse the small size. Nerf necros cuz all necros are assuras and assuras are OP kk.

Nerfs were to be expected but why not just give burst skills a longer CD.

I believe warrior will be much more weak to conditions with those changes. Almost every burst skill can be avoided easely so you can make warrior keep the conditions on him as long you evade / blind his bursts.

The time to use burst skills will also be increased because you will not keep the adrenaline from last fights and if you miss a burst you will need to gain it again, so 7+ seconds with conditions.

I believe this changes will change the meta build for warrior.

Warlord.9074:

RyanDancePls.7351:

Anton.1769:

Highly Telegraphed???
did you even fight asuras?

Lmao this is so true. Good luck squinting your eyes trying to dodge those “highly telegraphed” bursts from min size asura warriors, which is 99% of warriors nowadays.

u cant dodge Kill shot uninstall the game. 99% of warriors are assuras? doesn’t even sound like a believable statement. And how about balancing assuras then siince any class can abuse the small size. Nerf necros cuz all necros are assuras and assuras are OP kk.

Nerfs were to be expected but why not just give burst skills a longer CD.

there are no skillshots at pvp,sorry. Try to read when asura use eviscerate and compare it to human eviscerate .
“And how about balancing assuras then siince any class can abuse the small size. "
The most “Telegraphed” class is warrior…so it receive the main bonus from being asura.

I got a message from someone clarifying that your adrenaline is spent regardless hit or miss so this is actually a buff/nerf. So in all reality it is maybe not so bad if this is true.

However if it is true that it does not as other posted. Warrior going to have a very difficult time with sustain. Not becasue they are not geating cleasin ire but because of cc/damage reduction w/ reduction of adrinal healing making it probably one of the weaker professions in pvp especially at high levels of game play..

Everyone needs to understand there is a huge differnce between giving a skill lets say a 20 second cd or whatever CD it is and a skills CD based on 30 bars of adrenaline. Which bares the question if you cannot land a burst skill on somone becasue they are good at dodging than what is the likely hood of you landing attacks on them to build another 30 bars. And if your burst skill is dodged becasue the other player is good than I think its going to be GG for the warrior.

This is exactly what warrior needed. They have WAY too forgiving of mechanics.

Have terrible positioning and got bursted? How about a free Endure Pain to save your stupid kitten

Like throwing Kill Shots around until they finally land? Don’t worry, we won’t take your stuff until you actually hit.

Don’t like taking damage while going in for melee damage? No problem! Here’s utilities that can make you invulnerable to w/e it is you want (condis, damage and CC). Use em all at once and go to town! Or space them out and live for kittening ever.

Want to apply a stupid amount of torment with a skill that has a terrible animation and actually looks almost exactly like a certain Axe Throw skill? How does Impale sound for a name?

This was a long time coming, and I’m glad it’s finally here. Warrior is becoming skillful again.

Anyways so instead of crying about nerfs my suggestion to ANET is this.

Increase the recharge of burst skills from 10 seconds to 20 seconds if a burst skill is missed. Approaches the same problem. Similar to Ride the Lighting nerf. And that if you land RTL the cool down is normal.

This way it penalizes players for missing but not in a adverse way.

This is an interesting discussion. Can Anet just balance PvE and PvP separately?

IvanTheGrey.2941:

This is an interesting discussion. Can Anet just balance PvE and PvP separately?

This is an issue in PvE as well. Warriors simply leave themselves will a full bar of adrenaline and spam skills. Now they’re encouraged to use their bursts and make sure they hit. PvE just got a tiny bit more skillful, and that’s good. Warriors are still probably kings of PvE, but at least they aren’t Tyrants.

They have been nerfing burst skills since this game came out. Now they’re “reworking” adrenaline so basically you will be punished for “missing”. If a guy is a foot lower then me I will “miss”. The creators of this game still haven’t fixed the mechanics that make these burst skills miss all the time for no reason. If you’re going to make using adrenaline a higher risk, make it higher reward when I actually hit someone with it. Also… Fix your game. Steps and drops should not be the bane of earthshaker…

This is actually pretty severe the more I think about it.. Non longbow warriors rely on the ability to weapon swap and burst again to even have a snowballs chance in hell against condition pressure… This really cuts into build diversity forcing wars to go longbow cleansing ire or ignore conditions altogether and go full glass

There’s nothing even skillful about it with as many random blind/block/evade effects as are thrown around these days

Good thing. Now people cant just spam Eviscerate/Hammerstuns when they are ready just to make their opponent waste dodges and still retain the regen granted by Adrenaline Health.

More brain required for one of the most braindead classes in the game.

(And I play warrior a lot in PvP)

Hambow is one thing, but for every other warrior, simply missing the skill at all without additional penalty was enough to make you lose a fight. Axe/mace are practically gimmick weapons only propped up by the sheer power of their burst skills

Warlord.9074:

I got a message from someone clarifying that your adrenaline is spent regardless hit or miss so this is actually a buff/nerf. So in all reality it is maybe not so bad if this is true.

However if it is true that it does not as other posted. Warrior going to have a very difficult time with sustain. Not becasue they are not geating cleasin ire but because of cc/damage reduction w/ reduction of adrinal healing making it probably one of the weaker professions in pvp especially at high levels of game play..

Everyone needs to understand there is a huge differnce between giving a skill lets say a 20 second cd or whatever CD it is and a skills CD based on 30 bars of adrenaline. Which bares the question if you cannot land a burst skill on somone becasue they are good at dodging than what is the likely hood of you landing attacks on them to build another 30 bars. And if your burst skill is dodged becasue the other player is good than I think its going to be GG for the warrior.

How can it be anything but a nerf? There are no positive changes being made to how adrenaline works.

Unless you don’t play a warrior I guess then I’m sure these looks like great buffs.

Cleansing Ire is nice, but is sure as hell doesn’t make warriors immune to conditions. In pvp that stuff can easily get reapplied faster then its removed. The adrenaline change is going to make warriors far more susceptible to conditions….again. All risk, zero increase in reward . Its a bad idea.

I watched the video on twitch and I notice something interesting. They don’t explain their reasoning for these nerfs.

Probably because it feels like they throw darts at a dart board that had all the abilities on it and that’s how they chose what gets buffed and nerfed.

5 second of Signet of Rage? For what purpose?

17% damage increase for axe #5? Pretty sure axe auto attack is still going to out damage it in most scenarios.

Mace third attack buff? Super. Barely anyone uses mace but a buff is a buff, I guess?

Impale torment nerf? Great. Who actually uses that?

Greatsword changes. Okay, who didn’t see that coming after all the complaints over the last 2 years it’s (wrongly) gotten.

And the biggest one of all, the adrenaline changes? All downsides and no upsides yet they’re trying to sell it like there is some. People saying it will make the warrior rely on better positioning? Have you guys actually played this game, with all its aoe abilities flying around constantly? Besides that we’re talking about warrior here, not thief.

At the very least if they’re going to change how adrenaline works they could buff adrenal healing. That seems like a fair suggestion. Since its usefulness will be drastically reduced in both pve and pvp.

Healing Surge is another skill that is taking an indirect nerf from the adrenaline change as well.

Lots of shortsighted nerfs by anet. GFG.

fellyn.5083:

I watched the video on twitch and I notice something interesting. They don’t explain their reasoning for these nerfs.

Probably because it feels like they throw darts at a dart board that had all the abilities on it and that’s how they chose what gets buffed and nerfed.

5 second of Signet of Rage? For what purpose?

17% damage increase for axe #5? Pretty sure axe auto attack is still going to out damage it in most scenarios.

Mace third attack buff? Super. Barely anyone uses mace but a buff is a buff, I guess?

Impale torment nerf? Great. Who actually uses that?

Greatsword changes. Okay, who didn’t see that coming after all the complaints over the last 2 years it’s (wrongly) gotten.

And the biggest one of all, the adrenaline changes? All downsides and no upsides yet they’re trying to sell it like there is some. People saying it will make the warrior rely on better positioning? Have you guys actually played this game, with all it’s aoe abilities flying around constantly? Besides that we’re talking about warrior here, not thief.

impale who uses that?.. is that real question or troll?.. impale is what makes celestial warrior do wtf amount of condis.

Mace was bad, with this in place no body uses it anymore. I mean if they want to nerf adrenaline or make it useful at least make our f1 more fun and less clunky to use.

Lifestealer.4910:

fellyn.5083:

I watched the video on twitch and I notice something interesting. They don’t explain their reasoning for these nerfs.

Probably because it feels like they throw darts at a dart board that had all the abilities on it and that’s how they chose what gets buffed and nerfed.

5 second of Signet of Rage? For what purpose?

17% damage increase for axe #5? Pretty sure axe auto attack is still going to out damage it in most scenarios.

Mace third attack buff? Super. Barely anyone uses mace but a buff is a buff, I guess?

Impale torment nerf? Great. Who actually uses that?

Greatsword changes. Okay, who didn’t see that coming after all the complaints over the last 2 years it’s (wrongly) gotten.

And the biggest one of all, the adrenaline changes? All downsides and no upsides yet they’re trying to sell it like there is some. People saying it will make the warrior rely on better positioning? Have you guys actually played this game, with all it’s aoe abilities flying around constantly? Besides that we’re talking about warrior here, not thief.

impale who uses that?.. is that real question or troll?.. impale is what makes celestial warrior do wtf amount of condis.

So one build in one specific part of the game that the vast majority of the player base ignores. Good example. And even then, most warriors don’t use it that I’ve seen. Most are either axe/shield or warhorn with longbow, or hambow.

Meanwhile, in pve and wvwvw…

The Adrenaline change needed to happen. Adrenaline reliance is supposed to be a weakness of the Warrior profession (as stated by ANet themselves), but right now, you literally cannot waste it. Resource management as a weakness only is meaningful if the resource can be used poorly. Adrenaline cannot be used poorly right now.

This change will separate the great Warriors from those FotM Warriors, but more importantly, will introduce meaningful weaknesses to the profession instead of “Use F1: did you hit? If yes, awesome! If no, well, no biggie, you still get bonus health regen/crit chance/damage and can even try again immedietly if you want on your other weapon.” Now adrenaline will have to be carefully managed because if you use it wrong, you are in trouble.

That said, it also opens the door to other buffs that currently would be broken.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

The Adrenaline change needed to happen. Adrenaline reliance is supposed to be a weakness of the Warrior profession (as stated by ANet themselves), but right now, you literally cannot waste it. Resource management as a weakness only is meaningful if the resource can be used poorly. Adrenaline cannot be used poorly right now.

This change will separate the great Warriors from those FotM Warriors, but more importantly, will introduce meaningful weaknesses to the profession instead of “Use F1: did you hit? If yes, awesome! If no, well, no biggie, you still get bonus health regen/crit chance/damage and can even try again immedietly if you want on your other weapon.” Now adrenaline will have to be carefully managed because if you use it wrong, you are in trouble.

That said, it also opens the door to other buffs that currently would be broken.

So this is a crutch that only 1 specific class has to worry about? Seems fair.

One of the changes by themselves would have been okay. But all of them together is a massive nerf.

And if as you said it leaves the door open to other buffs then the changes should be delayed until they’re all in at the same time.

fellyn.5083:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

The Adrenaline change needed to happen. Adrenaline reliance is supposed to be a weakness of the Warrior profession (as stated by ANet themselves), but right now, you literally cannot waste it. Resource management as a weakness only is meaningful if the resource can be used poorly. Adrenaline cannot be used poorly right now.

This change will separate the great Warriors from those FotM Warriors, but more importantly, will introduce meaningful weaknesses to the profession instead of “Use F1: did you hit? If yes, awesome! If no, well, no biggie, you still get bonus health regen/crit chance/damage and can even try again immedietly if you want on your other weapon.” Now adrenaline will have to be carefully managed because if you use it wrong, you are in trouble.

That said, it also opens the door to other buffs that currently would be broken.

So this is a crutch that only 1 specific class has to worry about? Seems fair.

One of the changes by themselves would have been okay. But all of them together is a massive nerf.

And if as you said it leaves the door open to other buffs then the changes should be delayed until they’re all in at the same time.

Necros and Mesmers are the other resource management classes, and if they blow their life force/illusions poorly, they suffer HARD. All this is doing is bringing Warriors in line.

As for why not delay until the buffs are ready? Two reasons.

1. They don’t know exactly how this change will impact the game. Any buffs they implemented may end up being far too powerful because the actual impact of the adrenaline change was much lower than was predicted (both by ANet and players).

2. This is ANet we’re talking about. Remember that Ferocity was a step toward phasing out the Zerker meta in PvE (and nothing has followed that up yet).

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

fellyn.5083:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

The Adrenaline change needed to happen. Adrenaline reliance is supposed to be a weakness of the Warrior profession (as stated by ANet themselves), but right now, you literally cannot waste it. Resource management as a weakness only is meaningful if the resource can be used poorly. Adrenaline cannot be used poorly right now.

This change will separate the great Warriors from those FotM Warriors, but more importantly, will introduce meaningful weaknesses to the profession instead of “Use F1: did you hit? If yes, awesome! If no, well, no biggie, you still get bonus health regen/crit chance/damage and can even try again immedietly if you want on your other weapon.” Now adrenaline will have to be carefully managed because if you use it wrong, you are in trouble.

That said, it also opens the door to other buffs that currently would be broken.

So this is a crutch that only 1 specific class has to worry about? Seems fair.

One of the changes by themselves would have been okay. But all of them together is a massive nerf.

And if as you said it leaves the door open to other buffs then the changes should be delayed until they’re all in at the same time.

Necros and Mesmers are the other resource management classes, and if they blow their life force/illusions poorly, they suffer HARD. All this is doing is bringing Warriors in line.

As for why not delay until the buffs are ready? Two reasons.

1. They don’t know exactly how this change will impact the game. Any buffs they implemented may end up being far too powerful because the actual impact of the adrenaline change was much lower than was predicted (both by ANet and players).

2. This is ANet we’re talking about. Remember that Ferocity was a step toward phasing out the Zerker meta in PvE (and nothing has followed that up yet).

Necros and mesmers class mechanics are not hard countered by an easily spammable condition, though.

They have the ability to hotfix things any time they want, if something turns out to be too strong. That’s poor reasoning.

Remember when certain siege weapon skills made people invulnerable in wvw? They fixed that in a few hours.

Hotfixing is reserved for things that are actually breaking the game’s functioning. Overpowered stuff is not hotfix material.

Certain siege weapon skills making people invulnerable breaks the game’s functioning. Mesmer paratroopers breaks the game’s functioning. Event chains not resetting breaks the game’s functioning.

Warriors being OP? Well, it’s been over a year, so clearly, that does not break the game’s functioning.

Reason why hotfixes are reserved for literally game-breaking issues is because those immedietly negatively affect play and have a very clear resolution. Balance changes require extra thought and time to figure out what the ideal change is.

For example, it’s easy to say that Healing Signet was healing for too much (some say it still is, but that’s irrelevant). Great, so it needs reducing. How much of a reduction? That takes a lot of time and tweaking to decide. Not hotfix material.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

IvanTheGrey.2941:

This is an interesting discussion. Can Anet just balance PvE and PvP separately?

This is an issue in PvE as well. Warriors simply leave themselves will a full bar of adrenaline and spam skills. Now they’re encouraged to use their bursts and make sure they hit. PvE just got a tiny bit more skillful, and that’s good. Warriors are still probably kings of PvE, but at least they aren’t Tyrants.

It’s really not an issue in PvE. If you use your burst skill as a DPS warrior, you’re an idiot. Bursts will always hit if you’re targeting something in PvE. Period. I’m sorry, but this (not your response) is pathetic. Fix Rush. FIX YOUR kitten GAME. This PvE nerf was neither wanted or needed.

IvanTheGrey.2941:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

IvanTheGrey.2941:

This is an interesting discussion. Can Anet just balance PvE and PvP separately?

This is an issue in PvE as well. Warriors simply leave themselves will a full bar of adrenaline and spam skills. Now they’re encouraged to use their bursts and make sure they hit. PvE just got a tiny bit more skillful, and that’s good. Warriors are still probably kings of PvE, but at least they aren’t Tyrants.

It’s really not an issue in PvE. If you use your burst skill as a DPS warrior, you’re an idiot. Bursts will always hit if you’re targeting something in PvE. Period. I’m sorry, but this (not your response) is pathetic. Fix Rush. FIX YOUR kitten GAME. This PvE nerf was neither wanted or needed.

Not that I don’t disagree with you but I think that’s kind of the point of these changes. They WANT people to use burst skills.

But they seem to have forgotten (in pvp at least) that conditions are so common and easily spammable that warrior burst skills miss as often as not.

Burst Mastery is going to be a must have now. In WvW and PvP that is.
Yet, you should also use Brawlers Recovery because of the condition cleansing nerf that comes with it.
We have a problem here. If we could you both at the same time I would care less.

But as it is right now. Holy kitten, playing a warrior in WvW is going to be harder. Glad those pesky thiefes got nerfed too.

that cleansing ire change, I’ll feel good when a skilled warrior beats me now

Burst skills such as Eviscerate, Kill Shot or Skull Crack will never be on a meta build with these changes. A random blind, block or dodge will negate the burst skill effect, put it on CD, lose the Adrenal Health trait effect and negate any condition cleansing with CI, way too much punishment imo.

Warriors are going to be condi food now just like when they were trash tier.

Every Warrior uses Longbow not becouse it makes Warriors immune to conditions, but becouse it’s madatory to withstand condi preassure at all.

The change to Signet of Rage will make this change less of a problem. The combination of SoR and Berserker Stance will see you gain a larger amount of adrenaline overtime, especially if you’re smart enough to use your adrenaline early before the duration of BS (haha, BS) expires.

Khenzy.9348:

Burst skills such as Eviscerate, Kill Shot or Skull Crack will never be on a meta build with these changes. A random blind, block or dodge will negate the burst skill effect, put it on CD, lose the Adrenal Health trait effect and negate any condition cleansing with CI, way too much punishment imo.

Warriors are going to be condi food now just like when they were trash tier.

Every Warrior uses Longbow not becouse it makes Warriors immune to conditions, but becouse it’s madatory to withstand condi preassure at all.

So…bring additional cleanses? My god, it might mean you don’t run triple-stance anymore and have to make choices on your defense.

Additional cleanses are already the norm. Most warrior builds use Berserker Stance, Signet of Stamina, and Balanced Stance. The signet can be popped for a one time cleanse, zerker stance once for delayed condi pressure, and then cleansing ire for sustain.

With all those tools warriors can still easily fall to condi pressure. It’s a legitimate worry that burst skills will be wasted. Most of warrior burst is literally burst skills. If adrenaline generation is curbed and misses negate it all then you will see a large drop in both warrior damage and increased susceptibility to condi pressure.

It’s already the case that axe warriors bait out dodges before committing to eviscerate. But, if you add in blind spam into the picture then it could look pretty bad for the slow large effect burst skills and their associated specs.

Khenzy.9348:

Burst skills such as Eviscerate, Kill Shot or Skull Crack will never be on a meta build with these changes. A random blind, block or dodge will negate the burst skill effect, put it on CD, lose the Adrenal Health trait effect and negate any condition cleansing with CI, way too much punishment imo.

Warriors are going to be condi food now just like when they were trash tier.

Every Warrior uses Longbow not becouse it makes Warriors immune to conditions, but becouse it’s madatory to withstand condi preassure at all.

Actually no, your meta build GS + Hammer with Brawler’s recovery is going to be pretty good with conditions. AS is easier to hit with pretty high damage + 1 condition cleanse every 5 sec.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fJMQJARSjMdUFaZIehwJagfgC9t3C7gpAQ9bkGdPA-TlCBABQ8AAwS5HAXAAPOCA5pLIBTQToEMT1f6Z/hNOEAkBgZBA-w

Thaelias.7432:

Additional cleanses are already the norm. Most warrior builds use Berserker Stance, Signet of Stamina, and Balanced Stance. The signet can be popped for a one time cleanse, zerker stance once for delayed condi pressure, and then cleansing ire for sustain.

With all those tools warriors can still easily fall to condi pressure. It’s a legitimate worry that burst skills will be wasted. Most of warrior burst is literally burst skills. If adrenaline generation is curbed and misses negate it all then you will see a large drop in both warrior damage and increased susceptibility to condi pressure.

It’s already the case that axe warriors bait out dodges before committing to eviscerate. But, if you add in blind spam into the picture then it could look pretty bad for the slow large effect burst skills and their associated specs.

I keep running into triple-stance warriors, but I guess I just don’t play enough PvP

In any case, average adrenaline gain is actually going up a bit due to Signet of Rage’s changes and no nerfs on the attack speed front (faster mace auto and whirling axe being more frequent are good for adrenaline gain too). The Beserker Stance hurts, but it really was too much. Just think if necros had a skill that instantly refilled their life force (Locust Swarm can completely refill life force on its own, but it requires 5 opponents in melee range for 10 seconds to do so) or Mesmers had a 3-clone skill.

Burst skills aren’t going to be any tougher to land than they are now, there’s just going to be some risk involved to missing them.

It does look to decay a little too fast out of combat, however. Half the shown speed would probably be better.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

or Mesmers had a 3-clone skill.

But… mesmers have a 2-clone skill though

Time your F1’s and use them wisely, thx anet.

Atoss.1056:

Time your F1’s and use them wisely, thx anet.

+1

time your F1’s. if you’r playing against a dps guard. and it has wasted it’s 2 dodges already. if you try hitting your hammerstun(or evi, or skull bash) and because of the very slow animation the guardian can pop a block.. you are going to be kittened and spiked afterwards.
Against a thief, even tough they are badly nerfed, they still have unlimited dodges ( if properly used ). your timing will all play part for the teamfight, but in 1v1, a warrior will not make any chance.
Against a ranger. Ranger also has a lot of dodges with sword/Dagger/shorbow/greatsword(new). Making it superior to warrior, if combined with a sigil of energy. If we will want to cleanse condis, it will have to be against the pet, but we lose a lot of pressure on the ranger itself because of this.
Mesmer : Not really any changes here since you’ll just hit the clones.

so what this actually means:
How to beat a warrior?
1) apply small condi pressure ( prefered cripple or freeze since low mobity if not running gs so he is obliged to cleanse it )
2) kite away and play a bit with his balls
3) wait for a burst skill, dodge since slow animations, and condi spike afterwards
4) kite , if you’re not near him, he wont be able to cleanse his condis
5) win!

Anyways, for everyone telling that warrior wont be condi-food. In a team fight, we wont, since guard will support us with light fields.
In 1v1, or 2v2 without a guardian. we will be for sure. Since adrenaline will become so much more needing, a berserker stance will be nescessary again.

This patch tried really to balance everything, but there are still a lot problems by this.
Something might to be reconsidered would be reducing the CD’s of the burst skills so we can actually still cleanse or condi’s by using utilities for adrenaline.

Dirame.8521:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

or Mesmers had a 3-clone skill.

But… mesmers have a 2-clone skill though

True, but it doesn’t quite compare to Warriors having 3 skills which can all fill adrenaline to max (Healing Surge, Signet of Fury, Berserker’s Stance)

Dirame.8521:

The change to Signet of Rage will make this change less of a problem. The combination of SoR and Berserker Stance will see you gain a larger amount of adrenaline overtime, especially if you’re smart enough to use your adrenaline early before the duration of BS (haha, BS) expires.

50% increased adrenaline from SoR is a very minor buff. You’re only going to see a benefit from it if a fight lasts more than 45+ seconds. You’re still getting more out of using it instead of waiting on the passive.

It’s almost like they thought they had to give us something to compensate for all the nerfs and chose the most useless way to do it.