Guild Wars 2

I am looking for a DPS-Build for PVE / Dungeons / Fractals.

I know that the curent meta is 30/25/0/0/15 with GS and axe/mace (although I would like a range option and would switch axe/mace to longbow and sometimes to rifle for single target DPS).

So my build would look something like that:
Build V1: DPS/GS/100 Blades

Is this build OK or are there some improvements that I can make?

Unfortunatly there are some points that I don’t like in this build:
- the minor traits in arms 5 and 15 are weak IMHO
- the 250 condition damage from arms is kind of useless
- 100 Blades is kind of “boring” cause so many play it (and is highly dependent on positioning and targets standing still)

So I looked for an alternative and came to 30/0/0/10/30
In this build, the crit chance no longer comes from precision but from “Hightened Focus” in discipline and I switched to axe/mace as primary weapons.
Build V2: DPS/axe/mace

What do you think of this build?

Pro:
+ nearly the same crit chance on full adrenaline
+ 25% higher crit damage (15% from discipline; +10& from axe mastery)
+ great vulnerabiliy stacking
+ high autoattack from axe mainhand
+ no longer dependent on targets standing still during 100 Blades
+ 10 points free to spend (I choose lowered CD on shouts and about +1K HP by spending them in tactics)
+ axe burst skill kind of usefull instead of useless GS burst skill
+ higher flexibility due to free choice of offhand weapon (e.g. sword for blocking, horn for buff/debuff)
+ minor traits in discipline IMHO better that arms (e.g. faster weapon switch)

Con:
- lower direct damage (-10% from forceful greatsword and -10% from attack of opportunity)
- no mightstacking (no GS autoattack and forceful greatsword)
- some mobility lacking (no GS whirlwird and rush)

So IMHO it looks like a good bargain. But obviously so many warriors choose GS. Did I miss something?

I am looking forward to many answers and an interesting and enlightening discussion.

This build is arguably better than the “meta”. The meta only stands because of the huge “supply” of people playing Warrior, so banners can be spread ‘cause people lazy. But for a solo Warrior group, the build I linked is better group DPS. It’s also an incredible PUG carrier, it is far better than playing the meta in PUGs even with multiple Warriors.

Reasons this is better than 30/25:

• Empowered Allies is still overpowered
• Higher group DPS
• Inspiring Banners is available, making less organised PUGs much more manageable
• Stronger Bowstrings if you ever, for some reason, require it.
• No clumsy rooting Greatsword.
• You will no longer need to choose between Mace or Warhorn.

Annoyances:

• No Fast Hands – this took some getting used to
• Lower personal DPS (but as I said, this is easily offset by the group DPS increase)
• If someone else is using an EA Warrior, you’re essentially worse off than 30/25
• Vitality/Boon Duration from Tactics line is so unfortunate.
• It’s less active than 30/25, due to being mostly on your Axe/Mace set for superior damage/vuln.

Your V2 build is pretty much null and moot. HF is an awful trait now it’s Grandmaster, those points are better invested into Arms for better personal and better group DPS. OMM/SIO are niche and should seldom see your utility slot for actual combat – meaning a waste of 10 points. You’re also lacking Rending Strikes, which is a such a good trait I can’t even begin to describe.

If you dislike my EA build and want pure-axe, 30/25/0/10/5 would be the best personal DPS (it is actually better than the meta) if might can be outsourced – i.e. by an Ele. Forceful Greatsword’s Might stacking is the main reason the Greatsword is a good combat weapon, Axe is better DPS under the same buff parameters.

You see the GS so much because people like big numbers, by the way.

I’ve always strongly disagreed on EA being the pug carrier. For me the answer has always been to go for maximum self efficiency instead of trying to give buffs for people who are struggling (as a warrior that is). When I feel like the job gets done faster solo than with the team EA is not an option.

First of all: Thank you for your answer, your explanations and your build advice.

Personally, I am not a friend of banners. They are so slow, tend to get in my way during looting and combat is so dynamic that I seldom stand 90 seconds on a place to get the full benefit of it.

Is rendering strike really necessary? I thought that I am able to stack up vuleranbility with axe/mace quite nice without it.

I am note quite sure why you dislike OMM and SIO. I always thought that SIO was one of the best warrior skills. And the shouts have such a nice low CD so that you can use them so often.

Fingolfin.6917:

First of all: Thank you for your answer, your explanations and your build advice.

Personally, I am not a friend of banners. They are so slow, tend to get in my way during looting and combat is so dynamic that I seldom stand 90 seconds on a place to get the full benefit of it.

Is rendering strike really necessary? I thought that I am able to stack up vuleranbility with axe/mace quite nice without it.

I am note quite sure why you dislike OMM and SIO. I always thought that SIO was one of the best warrior skills. And the shouts have such a nice low CD so that you can use them so often.

Use AOE loot to circumvent picking up bundles such as banners and ele conjured weapons. As for Banners, Strength & Discipline are too good to not have – they are the reason a Warrior is wanted in a group. Without them, Warriors really fall down the pecking order, you are not only gimping yourself but your team too if you do not use them. You can carry a Banner between groups, there really is no reason not to take them. If nobody is picking up the second banner between groups, then it is indeed a waste and should be slotted out for something like Signet of Fury.

SIO is 1 condition, and is not smart removal. Other classes have far better removal to the point where it’s more often than not a waste of a utility.

OMM is quite bad, the only time I would use it is if I only need to take 1 banner, and the group is lacking vuln. But if a Warrior only takes 1 banner, that means there is a second Warrior, so between the two Warriors, plus the other 3 professions whatever they are, there will be – or should be if people are built correctly – at least 15 stacks of Vuln, usually more. If there are more, OMM use is diminishing. It’s a complete waste of trash as it’s single target, and it’s only 5s of Vuln on bosses – which as stated earlier, likely isn’t needed.

Rending strikes has no ICD, and equates to roughly ~4 stacks of Vulnerability in Berserker. That’s a considerable team DPS for only a 10 trait point investment.

I do want to point out what you said here:

Is rendering strike really necessary? I thought that I am able to stack up vuleranbility with axe/mace quite nice without it.

This was your justification for not using Rending Strikes, but you use OMM. Counter argument to yourself – OMM really isn’t a very good skill.

I guess you really made up a good point.
Thanks again for the clarification.

As Flissy said, 30/25/0/10/5 is superior DPS to 30/0/0/10/30 in a pure axe build. Warrior’s personal dps is middling, and the reason to run warriors in a group at all is Banner of Discipline, Strength and Empower Allies.

Basically for warriors, if you are not running a banner or not running Empower Allies, you are pretty much just as much of a leech to your party as a random DPS necromancer.

I think the only time I’ve used OMM within a few months is against Lupi, when the group wants an immediate big stack of vulnerability to maximise reflection damage.

Konu.1826:

I’ve always strongly disagreed on EA being the pug carrier. For me the answer has always been to go for maximum self efficiency instead of trying to give buffs for people who are struggling (as a warrior that is). When I feel like the job gets done faster solo than with the team EA is not an option.

I completely agree with you, Konu. When you’re dealing with pugs you do not want to rely on them to get the job done.

However, Flissy does offer quite a lot of interesting suggestions to the table for those that wish to be more of a supportive role than they currently can be with the GS meta. I actually still don’t think it’s worth going that low in Arms ever for PvE, mostly for the same logic in your post.

So, you guys absolutly encouraged me to switch from GS to axe mainhand. And of course I understand why banners a supperior to shouts like OMM and SIO when playing with a group.

I only not quite sure why 30 in discipline is so much worse than 25 in arms. On paper it looks to me as if I get about the same crit chance but higher crit damage. Ok, so you get rendering strike in arms. Is this really the main reason to go that deep in arms and no go into discipline?

BTW: all builds we discuss here – including your suggestions are be bit lacking in the “stun breaker” and “condition removal” department.

I guess this is something you would expect from other team members. So maybe this is a real problem in PUGs?

just swap out signet of fury for a stunbreak if you think you need one, or banner of strength/fgj if you’re bringing both banners.

Fingolfin.6917:

I only not quite sure why 30 in discipline is so much worse than 25 in arms. On paper it looks to me as if I get about the same crit chance but higher crit damage. Ok, so you get rendering strike in arms. Is this really the main reason to go that deep in arms and no go into discipline?

You are missing out on a 10% damage modifier and Rending Strikes, which works out to a 3-4% damage modifer for your whole team.

Adding critical damage has diminishing returns. Increasing your Critical damage by 10 will add, say, 5% overall DPS. Adding another 10 will only incease your damage by 4%. and so on. A damage modifier like Attack of Opportunity will always be a 10% boost no matter what. And as your team stacks Might and banners and Frost Spirit the benefit of AoO is still 10%, 10% of a far larger number. Whereas 15% more critical damage is always just 15% critical damage, which is a smaller piece of the pie the more buffs you stack.

For a fully buffed team, the 30/25 build is roughly 3-4% better dps than the 30/0 build and that isn’t counting the 3-4 stacks of vulnerability from rending strikes, which is a 3-4% partywide dps increase or the 3-4 additional Might stacks that the build maintains thanks to FGS. In practice it turns out to be vastly superior.

Fingolfin.6917:

I only not quite sure why 30 in discipline is so much worse than 25 in arms. On paper it looks to me as if I get about the same crit chance but higher crit damage. Ok, so you get rendering strike in arms. Is this really the main reason to go that deep in arms and no go into discipline??

3/6 Assassin and 3/6 Berserker (current Meta – changing with balance patch), Berserker Weapons & Trinkets, Scholar runes & Night/Force Sigils – All ascended of course, I’m only using Versatile Simple infusions, no bonus stats from those.

30/25/0/0/15 usual meta for multiple Warriors. Those are the standard utilities because 30/25 is for a multiple Warrior group so you only take 1 Banner. Self buffed with no food I’m hitting 91% Crit chance. That’ll be 95% with Omnomberry Pie/Ghosts or 96% with the good stuff (curry butternut squash). With a pure axe build I would be at the cap because of Deep Strike.

That is why you don’t need Heightened Focus’ crit chance, it’s already absurdly high and you lose a 10% modifier from Attack of Opportunity & Rending Strikes.

If you were to take Rending Strikes in your build, taking the points from Tactics, you would be so far over the cap you’d be wasting precision, and either have to use Signet of Might (which is worse) or the more expensive Curry Butternut Squash soup. And you’d still be doing less damage.

Tree.3916:

As Flissy said, 30/25/0/10/5 is superior DPS to 30/0/0/10/30 in a pure axe build. Warrior’s personal dps is middling, and the reason to run warriors in a group at all is Banner of Discipline, Strength and Empower Allies.

Basically for warriors, if you are not running a banner or not running Empower Allies, you are pretty much just as much of a leech to your party as a random DPS necromancer.

What? Warrior don’t have the best DPS, but the come close second to the Ele. To say that a Warrior dps is middling is a bold statement.

^

From what I understand, a thief is capable of superior single-target damage with the support from a warrior (banners) and a ranger sword AA is better DPS with the appropriate support as well.

But yeah, I agree about that claim being pretty bold.

Tree.3916:

Adding critical damage has diminishing returns. Increasing your Critical damage by 10 will add, say, 5% overall DPS. Adding another 10 will only incease your damage by 4%. and so on.

What would you say is the “sweet spot” for crit damage a DPS warrior shoulf aim for?

aim for damage modifiers first, then if you want dump the rest of the points into crit dmg line.

the main reason why people take 15 disc is because of fast hands. signet cd is also nice to have.

Which EA build is imo the best?
30/10/0/20/10 without Evis, or this.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vIAQNAn5cjMd03Z3H2ewJagwoYIB58gKQh8JFlhMA-zACBYfC0kfAEEwUBgZmFRjt4qIas6aYKXER1kCIilRA-e
Fury comes from Ele, so signet of rage is not used. Evis on CD.
Looks for me like.

Losing 100 Power ~ 20% dmg (Berserkers Might and 10% critdmg) to get 320 precision, 150 power (bloodlust),10% dmg and Evis.
And u lose less dps if u can´t stack precision.

Are 10% less Vul-duration rly a problem? Usually 1/2 or 1/4second less duration should not rly matter.
E-Power say the first build is better, but it´s not good to compare diffrent rotations.
Practical tests (Golems, fullbuffed Giant will follow) tell me that 20/30/0/20/0 does a bit more dps.

Does anyone have some spreedsheet numbers? My excel skills are worse then my english…