Guild Wars 2

That means Rifle buffs incoming?

nicknamenick.2437:

Khenzy.9348:

That means Rifle buffs incoming?

i HOPE SO!! pls! :-P would be great

come on guys we all know rifle wont be taken cause we cant proc cleansing ire.

Seems like bad news for any kind of hybrid build in general.

I’m not very familiar with all the numbers as regards sPvP… the 700+ spot for equal or better condi damage isn’t going to be reached by any typical hybrid/power Warrior is it?

Hahaha… in PvP, if anything Shoutbow will be the only spec to go with for Warrior. The pulsing attack of F1 Combustive Shot is still power based and does roughly the same damage as an Adrenaline level 2 Eviscerate.

In PvE, if you aren’t using a GS build (Might boon sharing from PS/Vulnerability condition from GS) by the time the new traits drop, you’ll soon be out of meta.

What you all are forgetting is the bottom of the whole article. GS Whirlwind and GS Rush will no longer be affecting by movement impairing conditions. Huge buff to Warrior GS (especially in WvW).

Artaz.3819:

Hahaha… in PvP, if anything Shoutbow will be the only spec to go with for Warrior. The pulsing attack of F1 Combustive Shot is still power based and does roughly the same damage as an Adrenaline level 2 Eviscerate.

In PvE, if you aren’t using a GS build (Might boon sharing from PS/Vulnerability condition from GS) by the time the new traits drop, you’ll soon be out of meta.

What you all are forgetting is the bottom of the whole article. GS Whirlwind and GS Rush will no longer be affecting by movement impairing conditions. Huge buff to Warrior GS.

Does that also mean swiftness / warrior’s sprint wont affect distance traveled by dashes?

Anet is making sure that the most easy to play, high risk low reward specs (Dire/Rabid) are getting buffed, and buffed big time.

Such a poor way to balance a game IMO.

akaCryptic.2389:

Artaz.3819:

Hahaha… in PvP, if anything Shoutbow will be the only spec to go with for Warrior. The pulsing attack of F1 Combustive Shot is still power based and does roughly the same damage as an Adrenaline level 2 Eviscerate.

In PvE, if you aren’t using a GS build (Might boon sharing from PS/Vulnerability condition from GS) by the time the new traits drop, you’ll soon be out of meta.

What you all are forgetting is the bottom of the whole article. GS Whirlwind and GS Rush will no longer be affecting by movement impairing conditions. Huge buff to Warrior GS.

Does that also mean swiftness / warrior’s sprint wont affect distance traveled by dashes?

Correct. Except new-to-be-released Warrior’s Sprint will actually remove Immobilize as well when it is combined with Mobile Strikes (so no movement impairing conditions will stop the distance traveled with the trait).

Cygnus.6903:

Anet is making sure that the most easy to play, high risk low reward specs (Dire/Rabid) are getting buffed, and buffed big time.

Such a poor way to balance a game IMO.

If you can’t beat ’em, join ’em. Shoutbow, new-to-be-released Burning Arrows trait, faceroll, profit.

Dire for WvW and Sinister for PvE and Celestial (? depends on final stats) for PvP.

I love the conclusions without any actual numbers given other than when you start doing more damage at over 600 condi damage.

We still don’t even know the dmg per tick … how the meta might shift due to all the changes (it’s a boatload people … things are likely to change) … how stats strictly from gear is going to look … etc. etc.

But, sure, you all quite sure what ArenaNet is aiming, how bad it’s going to be, and what builds are going to be OP/UP.

./sigh

If you don’t think you need to prove anything when you make a claim, then you’re quite foolish. If you don’t prove it, it’s just your unsupported opinion and has as much weight as my bowel movements (probably less).

Yes, you know that you’ll do less condi damage if you have less than 600 condi damage on your gear. But do you know how much condi damage you’ll have on that Celestial Gear that is part of the current Shoutbow build? No, you don’t.

Do you know how much less you’ll do with less than 600 condi damage? No, you don’t. You have no clue whatsoever.

You also don’t know how the meta is going to change when all the Shoutbow shout traits are a single trait.

You don’t know how it’s going to change things when people can’t mix more than 3 traitlines but get 3 minor and 3 major traits in all 3 trait lines that they pick … more than they could before.

You don’t know how it’s going to change things now that longbow has a trait that is going to allow it’s auto-attacks to apply burning; the highest damage DoT in the game. Sure, it’ll do less than before, but you can now apply it far more easily. I could avoid the burning from a Warrior’s longbow in the current system, but with it being applied from the auto-attacks … not really an option … can’t regen endurance/blocks/etc. fast enough to evade each AA.

There are so many things that you don’t know. So many variables. Yet you’re just so sure of yourself … and you’re not needing to prove anything … because … logic … lol.

So…RIP solider Hambow?

@nicknamenick:
Let me repeat the parts that have nothing to do with Celestial/Shoutbow … since you either missed them or don’t have an answer to these points about your lack of information.

Burning will do less damage when you have less than 600 condi damage … but we don’t know how much less

We also don’t know what else can now be gained via the specializations that could make it still work … I’m unaware of any playtesting with this that’s been discussed.

We also don’t know if the additional sources of burning (traited Longbow AAs) will be able to make up for the lower condition damage.

We also don’t know how good Fan of Fire will be since it will be applying up to 3 stacks of burning instead of just 1.

These points are all valid regardless of Celestial/Power/Condi … Shoutbow or not Shoutbow.

Also, aren’t some of the defining features of the Warrior longbow:

• Might Stacking
• Easy use of Cleansing Ire

Those aren’t changing.

Lastly … let’s look at what you’re really complaining about … Longbow may be becoming more of a condi-weapon. Do you see Necromancers complaining about Scepter being bad in power builds? No. Do you see Engineers complaining about Pistol being bad in power builds? No.

If longbow becomes more of a condition weapon … so what?

Are you so new to MMOs that you’re not aware that part of their existence is changes like these and they are “issues” to you?

If you think I bring discussions down … lol … I’m not sorry that I think people should provide support for their opinions in the form of facts/logic.

Your first response … to me saying the following are not about celestial/shoutbow is to act like a child about me talking about celestial and shoutbow … lol

Less is less … if it did 10 less damage that would be a big difference from if it did 400 less or anything in between. “less is less” is a cop out.

Let’s keep what to its core? You do realize that traits have changed in several ways that I laid out … don’t you? …

Talking about additional sources of burning is not restricted to shoutbow. What you replied to with that garbage said not one thing about shoutbow.

3 stacks 1 second of burning is not the same as 1 stack of 3 seconds of burning … 3 stacks for 1 second will do the same damage over 1 second. It does the total damage faster and is less likely to have that damage cleansed.

I don’t care that you’re keeping it to a simple-minded, incomplete “discussion”. Those are valid points about the other things that Warrior longbow brings to a build. If you don’t want to discuss them, that’s fine. We’ll just make it a point that you’re ignoring the other nice things Longbow brings to a build when you’re discussing your opinion. Way to ignore facts.

You don’t know how much it will hurt power builds. Period. You are also ignoring the other benefits of the weapon. You also have no clue how the meta might change with the changes or if some of the specialization changes will compensate for this change to condi damage. You have so little information it’s pathetic.

I did not say that longbow will become. I said “so what if it did”. There is a big difference that you need to learn to wrap your head around.

Your “answers” can only be called that in the loosest of terms. I hope they at least illustrate to others the type of person they are getting an opinion from someone who appears incapable of maturely discussing something … nor supporting the opinion he is spewing.

Yeah, I sense some cognitive dissonance is owed certain posters in this thread…

Anyway, this objectively will hurt Berserker (or any non-condi stat amulet) Warriors. But longbow will still be more or less essential (probably more), it just means we’ll be doing less damage over time. A condi-cleansing fire field, a blind, and an immobilise are hard to argue with regardless.

But the reason I mentioned hybrid builds (insofar as they’re viable at all) is a ’Zerker axebow can still hit like a truck regardless of how significant condi damage loss is; but a hybrid sword thing might not have the stat numbers to make the trade-off in direct damage even remotely worth it now.

Artaz.3819:

Hahaha… in PvP, if anything Shoutbow will be the only spec to go with for Warrior. The pulsing attack of F1 Combustive Shot is still power based and does roughly the same damage as an Adrenaline level 2 Eviscerate.

In PvE, if you aren’t using a GS build (Might boon sharing from PS/Vulnerability condition from GS) by the time the new traits drop, you’ll soon be out of meta.

What you all are forgetting is the bottom of the whole article. GS Whirlwind and GS Rush will no longer be affecting by movement impairing conditions. Huge buff to Warrior GS (especially in WvW).

Also a nerf too because swiftness won’t affect the range anymore. This is especially true in big scale fight where swiftness is permanent and chill is none existent.

I’m not convinced that it’ll always do less damage for a power build. Per stack, sure, but now there is an option for stacking it more given the condi changes as well as the trait to apply burning with Longbow autos. We need to playtest that to truly know the state of things.

Nick keeps saying that he’s just talking about damage, but his OP says:

nicknamenick.2437:

Well this sucks for all power builds.. end of longbow for allot of us.

and

nicknamenick.2437:

Conclusion, only celestial/hybrid builds can still use this weapon.
All power builds are excluded by this change.

That is more than just talking about the damage.

Especially for a class that has access to 5 second weapon swaps, a weapon can be used for its utility … like Might stacking, CC, synergy with Cleansing Ire, etc.. Longbow isn’t losing any of this.

Also, for Longbow AAs to burn, yes you have to take that trait, but you’re getting more with less traits with the new system than you were before. You’re also getting more traits. You don’t take that into account whatsoever in what you’ve been saying.

You can still benefit from pin down’s immob just as much, and the #3 skill will hit as hard as ever.

Not to mention most people take it for the CI proc anyways, I highly doubt LB will suddenly disappear from builds due to this sole change.

nicknamenick.2437:

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/combat-changes-dotsanddashes/

You have to get allot more condition dmg to deal the same dmg as it is now..

Well this sucks for all power builds.. end of longbow for allot of us.

---

First they will reduce the burning dmg part (but it stacks now so it could be the same in the end)

But:

Essentially, conditions are too effective right now without investing points into the condition-damage stat. We will significantly lower the base damage on damaging conditions while increasing how much they scale with the condition-damage stat. This means at lower levels of condition damage you can expect to do less damage than you currently do, while at higher values you’ll do even more damage than you are currently able to. The formulas are still being adjusted, but to give you an idea, the break-even point before you start doing more damage is around 700 condition damage.

---

Conclusion, only celestial/hybrid builds can still use this weapon.
All power builds are excluded by this change.

It seeems that you need to have to invest 600 condition damage at least to be able to to do condition damage. Power builds will do less damage with conditions, its true.

In the same way conditions will be more rewarding in condition builds, i just hope they make those builds viable in the same way they make zerker ones, with 3 stats mandatory (power/precision/ferocity).

Cygnus.6903:

Anet is making sure that the most easy to play, high risk low reward specs (Dire/Rabid) are getting buffed, and buffed big time.

This is quite the nonsense : by definition, the high risk/low reward specs are not the easiest to play :/

Otherwise, as Sebrent said, no need to overhype those changes. Sure we do you that this will be a raw loss in DPS for Zerker builds, but this might be compensated a way or another by traits/new amulets stats/synergies etc. So no, OP, everything’s not over yet.

On a side note, I’d like to point out that they announced Cele stats would be nerfed as well so Shoutbow is not likely to be as viable as it is now.

Cygnus.6903:

Anet is making sure that the most easy to play, high risk low reward specs (Dire/Rabid) are getting buffed, and buffed big time.

Such a poor way to balance a game IMO.

I think you’re a bit inconsistent in your opinions… But indeed, Necromancer even with Dire stats is rather high risk, low reward, agree.

Rym.1469:

Cygnus.6903:

Anet is making sure that the most easy to play, high risk low reward specs (Dire/Rabid) are getting buffed, and buffed big time.

Such a poor way to balance a game IMO.

I think you’re a bit inconsistent in your opinions… But indeed, Necromancer even with Dire stats is rather high risk, low reward, agree.

I was looking for this comment lmao

My typo r8s 8/8 for b8 m8, that was gr8. Bit l8.