Guild Wars 2

Chaotic Storm.2815:

warriors aren’t OP. good,yes. One of the only classes anet says is where they want it, yes. defined by their 100blade crits, BINGO.
I’v seen players of almost every class that make my jaw drop with amazement at how skilled and good they can be if used right. warriors are the most popular for its easier learning curve (the sword stabs this way) and its 1 button high burst dps.

… You do understand that 100b is NOT burst damage, right? Whirling Attack and Rush are higher “burst” damage than 100b will ever be. 100b is sustained damage, not burst.

EDIT: Warriors dps is imba, imo, but their defence can’t compare to a Guardians (which makes sense.) Warrior support is fan-freakin-tastic, however. Banners (with regen if traited), shouts (with heals if traited), and warhorn can really help a group out.

Amiron.1067:

Warrior support is fan-freakin-tastic, however. Banners (with regen if traited), shouts (with heals if traited), and warhorn can really help a group out.

Just no… no… You invest to heavily for a very bad return. Most other professions already have nearly 100% up time of regen anyway, so you are really doing nothing for them. Healing shouts is mediocre at best. Heal five people for 1.1k-1.3k health… every… 20 seconds tops (if you run 3 shouts then 3.3k-3.9k health)… yeah there are a lot more things you could invest in that would keep them alive much longer and would be more useful. Such as…. grabbing a hammer and stunning the opposition for 2 seconds (stunning 5 targets for 2 seconds is denying a lot more than 4k health in damage).

To each his own I guess! But remember, Guild Wars 2 is not about healing; it is about the denial of damage. All classes (except Warriors) are good at healing themselves, however Warriors have a decent skill setup for crowd control. That serves us, and our allies, much better than the “support” traits.

seems devs replied to this question themselves.

what they said in short:
Are warrior and guardiasn stronger than any other profession in pve? yes
Are they OP? no we want other classes to be strong as warriors….

I havent read through all the posts so apologies if this was already mentioned but, Warriors are fairly sought after in certain content yes…

But if you really wanna feel loved, make a guardian. They’re almost necessary for all the high-end pve content, and a boon (hehe) to have on any team in any setting. One of the only classes I think Anet made perfectly tbh.

Warriors are the king of PvE. Whatever that means to anyone that doesn’t PvP. Warriors are probably one of the worst PvP classes. All of their utility spells are kittenty aside from shouts. Way too long of a cool down on everything else for them to be a viable duelist.

Warriors excel in large zerg fights in WvW and PvE. They aren’t overpowered.

No warriors are not op. They happen to be very good in PvE, But when it comes to WvW and sPvP they are very under powered. Most people in pvp know how to dodge, thus negating most warrior skills. I personally have a warrior with 900 hours on it, and find it very hard to play in sPvP/WvW 1v1 mesmer, necro, theif, and bunker guard situations. I have tried ele bunker builds, and guard builds in sPvP so far, and i absolutely own with them. Maybe it’s just me, but i have asked a few people about this question and have come up with what i am currently stating.

Sorry, just had to pop in to say that every time I read this thread title, I laugh.

In pve situations warriors could be considered as being “OP” with the ability to take out multiple npcs that another class might struggle with, however warrior is probably one of the weakest professions for wvw/spvp due to their lack of healing, condition removal and boon hate, this makes players have to use a full dps type of warrior, otherwise you will simpily end up with no kills, no warrior can ever beat a good self healing guardian, due to the fact we can’t do enough bursts nor can we outlast one.

So personally i wouldn’t mind taking a pve nerf for us to get a revamp to suit the profession more for wvw/spvp, the bugs the skills have are also a big problem for warriors, it feels almost as though the profession has only been made for pve situations, so to summerise my reply i’d like to say that i don’t think warriors are op, take mesmers for example, they have it good both ways, pve and spvp/wvw.

Warriors do need a PVE nerf. It will nerf us in zones like COF 1, however in zones like TA/Fractals it will be a huge buff.

PvE queens gonna keep this thread alive? Guess I’ll help as well. Warriors are so OP in PvE that equipping zerker gear and the right PvE weapon set you can do exactly the same damage as warriors on different classes. Warriors are so OP and bland that it’s nearly impossible to screw up the PvE dps although warriors take an amazing amount of skill to play in PvE.

I’d like to trade in Thousand Blades for more survivability, condition removal and an Arcing Slice that actually qualifies as a burst skill.

Warrior’s arent OP in pve, other classes are just UP, (save for mesmer and guardian). Its the same across the board, those 3 classes can just provide what others can and better. Thieves can provide dps, so can necromancers, albeit with conditions, so can rangers etc etc… Problem is, warrior out does them on this immensely, and while being slightly tankier. Most classes need a reworking or change here and there to excel in pve, like I said in another thread, they need to give them the chance to excel, like making a certain encounter require stealth to do most efficiently (Rather then using stealth to skip content) would make thieves useful. A ranger ability to send their pet out to ‘weaken’ the boss due to a dungeon mechanic would make them useful…etc etc…

So don’t hold out, pick what you like. If you want warrior pick them, just dont expect consistency in their popularity or lack of popularity, the meta is subject to a lot of changes down the line.

And now 1 year later from the last post, warrior is still massivly op in pve and pvp.

scirocco.9805:

And now 1 year later from the last post, warrior is still massivly op in pve and pvp.

the problem is that PvE is not balanced, not warrior.

warrior is balanced in sPvP.

Lulz balance in pve.. Anything is fine there. As for pvp they are fine. We have just gotten a bit more attention from devs and last patch eles got the attention. They just need to bring other classes up to snuff one by one and allow other builds to be viable. Hopefully that will happen now that they pumped out this living garbage.

scirocco.9805:

And now 1 year later from the last post, warrior is still massivly op in pve and pvp.

They have good support, sure. Still thinking warriors are OP is funny though.

Right now I would definitely put rangers and necros as “underpowered” but I don’t think any of the other classes fall within the range of “overpowered”, unless you think necro/ranger should be the norm and literally everyone else is overpowered.

the problem is that PvE is not balanced, not warrior.

PvE is plenty balanced besides a few outliers.

Lulz balance in pve.. Anything is fine there.

There are still balancing issues, so if you could be ever so slightly more constructive than making weak condescending remarks towards a game mode you most likely aren’t interested in.

—

The only time you could ever argue warrior is overpowered in PvE is for solo, but the game is balanced around group content so that literally doesn’t even matter.

Warriors and Guardians are too strong in PvE. There are too many situations where you have to think through an encounter on a class like a thief and then use skills and dodges at the right time. With a heavy class the solutions are really simple and you can blithely play through most problems without doing much more than swap a utility. When the going gets tough there is plenty of extra oomph still there in the traits as well. A while back I think the designers said that warriors were in a good place and other classes need to be brought up to that level. We’re still waiting.

You’re honestly over thinking things. Thieves honestly just stick on three passive signets that they never activate, elite of their choice and then utility skill of their choice for the last slot which might be haste or smoke screen. But beyond that it’s just repeating a rotation over and over again.

The thing with say, a warrior is that the thinking is more centred around weapon choice than utility choice and you then have to think through how you would deal with an encounter’s mechanics with your weapons rather than through utilities (you can mostly just run standard dps utilities). For guardians, switching utilities around is crucial and if a guardian doesn’t they literally might as well not even be in the group. They’re also extremely squishy so it’s not like you can brute force fights.

scirocco.9805:

And now 1 year later from the last post, warrior is still massivly op in pve and pvp.

you know what?

You know what? He’s right.

They -ARE- over powered. That is their selling point. They are supposed to deal incredibly high damage. they’re supposed to burst you down to 0 HP if they touch you. They’re -supposed- to be the leading or front-line soldiers in WVW zergs. That’s their shining point, that’s their playstyle; and for that reason complaining about “guuh, warrior hits too hard~” is frankly, ignorant.

That being said, they are very easily outmatched in PVP and WVW by classes that know what they are doing. Warriors depend heavily on weapon choices and being able to actively locate their target to be of any use. If their target knows how to -dodge-, or worse yet is a thief, they’re in trouble.

And they have no gimmicks and very little damage mitigation. you lock onto a warrior and you avoid their cc, and the fight is yours.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

scirocco.9805:

And now 1 year later from the last post, warrior is still massivly op in pve and pvp.

you know what?

You know what? He’s right.

They -ARE- over powered. That is their selling point. They are supposed to deal incredibly high damage. they’re supposed to burst you down to 0 HP if they touch you. They’re -supposed- to be the leading or front-line soldiers in WVW zergs. That’s their shining point, that’s their playstyle; and for that reason complaining about “guuh, warrior hits too hard~” is frankly, ignorant.
.

But they are not hitting that hard. ELementalist and Thief got between 10 and 35% more DPS depending on each build and guardian have about the same dps depending on the situation.They got the best passive defense, almost no active defense, average dmg and the best offensive support capability. Warrior are not op, they are balanced.

Thaddeus.4891:

Azure The Heartless.3261:

scirocco.9805:

And now 1 year later from the last post, warrior is still massivly op in pve and pvp.

you know what?

You know what? He’s right.

They -ARE- over powered. That is their selling point. They are supposed to deal incredibly high damage. they’re supposed to burst you down to 0 HP if they touch you. They’re -supposed- to be the leading or front-line soldiers in WVW zergs. That’s their shining point, that’s their playstyle; and for that reason complaining about “guuh, warrior hits too hard~” is frankly, ignorant.
.

But they are not hitting that hard. ELementalist and Thief got between 10 and 35% more DPS depending on each build and guardian have about the same dps depending on the situation.They got the best passive defense, almost no active defense, average dmg and the best offensive support capability. Warrior are not op, they are balanced.

This too. Elementalists and Thieves do hit incredibly hard.

whichever way you take it, they are far from being gamebreaking or insurmountable.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

scirocco.9805:

And now 1 year later from the last post, warrior is still massivly op in pve and pvp.

you know what?

You know what? He’s right.

They -ARE- over powered. That is their selling point. They are supposed to deal incredibly high damage. they’re supposed to burst you down to 0 HP if they touch you. They’re -supposed- to be the leading or front-line soldiers in WVW zergs. That’s their shining point, that’s their playstyle; and for that reason complaining about “guuh, warrior hits too hard~” is frankly, ignorant.

That being said, they are very easily outmatched in PVP and WVW by classes that know what they are doing. Warriors depend heavily on weapon choices and being able to actively locate their target to be of any use. If their target knows how to -dodge-, or worse yet is a thief, they’re in trouble.

And they have no gimmicks and very little damage mitigation. you lock onto a warrior and you avoid their cc, and the fight is yours.

Uh, you just described how warriors aren’t overpowered. I fail to understand your post. Easy to play =/= overpowered.

maha.7902:

You’re honestly over thinking things. Thieves honestly just stick on three passive signets that they never activate, elite of their choice and then utility skill of their choice for the last slot which might be haste or smoke screen. But beyond that it’s just repeating a rotation over and over again.

The thing with say, a warrior is that the thinking is more centred around weapon choice than utility choice and you then have to think through how you would deal with an encounter’s mechanics with your weapons rather than through utilities (you can mostly just run standard dps utilities). For guardians, switching utilities around is crucial and if a guardian doesn’t they literally might as well not even be in the group. They’re also extremely squishy so it’s not like you can brute force fights.

lol? are you serious?

Almost all warriors and guardians in pve camp GS, without a weapon on swap that fills the gap that weapon fills. Guardians generally have GS/staff, for might. Warriors in my pugs NEVER leave GS, and if the good ones carry LB for fire fields/pulling.

That being said, Alot of them could do SLIGHTLY better by switching utilities, but most of the time, all the guards/warriors run the same skills and you can clear all content with this “Safe” set up. WoR/Retreat/Stand your ground, iwth these three skills a guardian is 100% a great party mate already, skipping is easier, they have a button to give aegis in retreat, and they can make knockdown fights easier with stability. and WoR will have a use in numerous dungeons/places.

Warriors run a banner and FGJ, and they camp GS to do good damage, have good movement and good evades. And if PS, great party support.

A theif generally runs D/D for dps, S/P for trash if you are killing it, and SB for stealth skipping, and camp signets? you generally run SR/Smokescreen/Whatever cause smokescreen gives you more projectile block, SR is great for healing/rezzing downed dudes in combat, AND is great for skipping. They have to think about how they use these moves. WArriors just drop banner and press FGJ, placement of the banner is largely irrelevent. FGJ has no activation it just happens. their elite signet? same thing, its just press it, get huge boons for nothing. Atleast guardian has to time their aegis.

Are warriors op? Not really, they are just to stat reliant. As much as people complain about AI, the same is true of warriors in pve. They are so good because they are a PILE of stats. They press FGJ, elite sig, and drop banner, and they have given every fury, themselves 8 stacks of might right there, themselves even more fury, and their banner is most likely MORE crit chance and crit damage. Further putting them in a position of sheer stat wall.

My main is mesmer, in wvw i tried little bit war and i was feeling i am doing rock&roll.. Warriors try mesmer in large scale fights and compare how efficint u will be.. Better not use veil.. Be 2nd mesmer who is bot required for veil mesmer..

if i would say war balanced, what u think about mesmer.. And re think war in wvw Large organizations

Dice Dragon.4326:

maha.7902:

You’re honestly over thinking things. Thieves honestly just stick on three passive signets that they never activate, elite of their choice and then utility skill of their choice for the last slot which might be haste or smoke screen. But beyond that it’s just repeating a rotation over and over again.

The thing with say, a warrior is that the thinking is more centred around weapon choice than utility choice and you then have to think through how you would deal with an encounter’s mechanics with your weapons rather than through utilities (you can mostly just run standard dps utilities). For guardians, switching utilities around is crucial and if a guardian doesn’t they literally might as well not even be in the group. They’re also extremely squishy so it’s not like you can brute force fights.

lol? are you serious?

Almost all warriors and guardians in pve camp GS, without a weapon on swap that fills the gap that weapon fills. Guardians generally have GS/staff, for might. Warriors in my pugs NEVER leave GS, and if the good ones carry LB for fire fields/pulling.

WoR/Retreat/Stand your ground, iwth these three skills a guardian is 100% a great party mate already, skipping is easier, they have a button to give aegis in retreat, and they can make knockdown fights easier with stability. and WoR will have a use in numerous dungeons/places.

I’ll respond on behalf of a friend here since I just noticed this conversation. I main a guardian and this bothers me-

Ok firstly, that weapon setup for guardian in PvE is a disgrace. Staff should never be used outside of clearing TA blossoms or speed-buffing between fights.

Secondly, if you take those same 3 utilities into every fight, then you indeed are being less productive for many encounters. The fact that you have yet to mention either purging flames or hallowed ground or the use of blind spam via weapon and trait choices indicates to me that you may not be aware of the meta for pve guardian at all.

What’s my opinion on warriors in regard to this thread? I think they’re fine as is when it comes to a PvE setting.

-GMB

maha.7902:

Dice Dragon.4326:

maha.7902:

You’re honestly over thinking things. Thieves honestly just stick on three passive signets that they never activate, elite of their choice and then utility skill of their choice for the last slot which might be haste or smoke screen. But beyond that it’s just repeating a rotation over and over again.

The thing with say, a warrior is that the thinking is more centred around weapon choice than utility choice and you then have to think through how you would deal with an encounter’s mechanics with your weapons rather than through utilities (you can mostly just run standard dps utilities). For guardians, switching utilities around is crucial and if a guardian doesn’t they literally might as well not even be in the group. They’re also extremely squishy so it’s not like you can brute force fights.

lol? are you serious?

Almost all warriors and guardians in pve camp GS, without a weapon on swap that fills the gap that weapon fills. Guardians generally have GS/staff, for might. Warriors in my pugs NEVER leave GS, and if the good ones carry LB for fire fields/pulling.

WoR/Retreat/Stand your ground, iwth these three skills a guardian is 100% a great party mate already, skipping is easier, they have a button to give aegis in retreat, and they can make knockdown fights easier with stability. and WoR will have a use in numerous dungeons/places.

I’ll respond on behalf of a friend here since I just noticed this conversation. I main a guardian and this bothers me-

Ok firstly, that weapon setup for guardian in PvE is a disgrace. Staff should never be used outside of clearing TA blossoms or speed-buffing between fights.

Secondly, if you take those same 3 utilities into every fight, then you indeed are being less productive for many encounters. The fact that you have yet to mention either purging flames or hallowed ground or the use of blind spam via weapon and trait choices indicates to me that you may not be aware of the meta for pve guardian at all.

What’s my opinion on warriors in regard to this thread? I think they’re fine as is when it comes to a PvE setting.

-GMB

I was talking about pugs. Not your super cool story speed running. GS has a blind?. sword is the only other weapon that has a blind. And i hardly see sword run in pugs. its always greatsword or staff. And just because you CAN swap to make the fight slightly easier does not mean its a must or will cause you to fail.

I wasnt talking about guardians in entirety as in traits etc. I only mentioned weapon and utilities. Which they dont have blind spam utilities. that comes from traits. I know full well you use your virtures to spam blinds. That has nothing to do with the utilities you take. You could leave out those last two utilities and clear every dungeon with the utilities I listed in a fine time. Could you make runs more smooth? sure. But is it 100% neccassary with what guardian can already provide with the above listed utilities, all you miss out on is a condition clear, something Feedback from a mesmer/healing turret from an engi can suffice for. Hallowed ground is great for long fights where you need buttloads of stability, but my point is to illustrate even a BAD guardian not swapping his utilities will provide a crapload to a party, just like a warrior. Why do you think pugs look for heavy classes so much? they dont have much give when they get things. what do I lose by taking stand your ground over hallowed ground? I get an INSTANT stuck break 5 second stability instead of the longer cd longer duation hallowed ground. I lose stability for longer fights, im using something worse, and still not being 100% discredit to team.

ill admit guardian is way harder to play then warrior. it alteast requires timing. But both classes have extremely easy time making a dungeon a breeze. Everyone who swaps to warrior/guardian after playing something else can tell you this. I find both heavy classes entirely boring myself. Ive cleared dungeons in pugs with staff guardians faster then with no guards. I had a party, 1 ranger, 2 guardians, me an engi, and both guardians camping staff, and I cleared it way faster and smoother then when we had zero guardians. Cause thats how good the heavy classes are honestly. or maybe they are just godly players?

Dice Dragon.4326:

I was talking about pugs. Not your super cool story speed running. GS has a blind?. sword is the only other weapon that has a blind. And i hardly see sword run in pugs. its always greatsword or staff. And just because you CAN swap to make the fight slightly easier does not mean its a must or will cause you to fail.

I wasnt talking about guardians in entirety as in traits etc. I only mentioned weapon and utilities. Which they dont have blind spam utilities. that comes from traits. I know full well you use your virtures to spam blinds. That has nothing to do with the utilities you take. You could leave out those last two utilities and clear every dungeon with the utilities I listed in a fine time. Could you make runs more smooth? sure. But is it 100% neccassary with what guardian can already provide with the above listed utilities, all you miss out on is a condition clear, something Feedback from a mesmer/healing turret from an engi can suffice for. Hallowed ground is great for long fights where you need buttloads of stability, but my point is to illustrate even a BAD guardian not swapping his utilities will provide a crapload to a party, just like a warrior. Why do you think pugs look for heavy classes so much? they dont have much give when they get things. what do I lose by taking stand your ground over hallowed ground? I get an INSTANT stuck break 5 second stability instead of the longer cd longer duation hallowed ground. I lose stability for longer fights, im using something worse, and still not being 100% discredit to team.

ill admit guardian is way harder to play then warrior. it alteast requires timing. But both classes have extremely easy time making a dungeon a breeze. Everyone who swaps to warrior/guardian after playing something else can tell you this. I find both heavy classes entirely boring myself. Ive cleared dungeons in pugs with staff guardians faster then with no guards. I had a party, 1 ranger, 2 guardians, me an engi, and both guardians camping staff, and I cleared it way faster and smoother then when we had zero guardians. Cause thats how good the heavy classes are honestly. or maybe they are just godly players?

Yes, the idea is to run Sword/Focus and Greatsword. The Focus is the third weapon with a blind called Ray Of Judgement. The focus also includes a blast finisher which applies might when used in a fire field.

Even if your run is just a simple pug and not some ‘uber cool speed run’, as a Guardian it is important to take the correct utilities for each fight, and it’s really not hard to swap them, even for a mindless pug. There’s also another benefit to the preference of hallowed ground and purging flames. They are fire fields.

I can’t disagree with you about these classes being easy to play, they most certainly are. I believe that more content should be designed and added to really challenge players of all classes. I also believe that there needs to be changes to get some classes up the pecking order, for example the necromancer.

I am finding it hard to pinpoint what you are trying to convey but if it is that even a guardian running a staff, who doesnt swap up utilities and is doing jack all is better than something like a necro or ranger doing the same thing, I agree with you there as well. There is certainly some imbalance there.

-GMB

maha.7902:

Dice Dragon.4326:

I was talking about pugs. Not your super cool story speed running. GS has a blind?. sword is the only other weapon that has a blind. And i hardly see sword run in pugs. its always greatsword or staff. And just because you CAN swap to make the fight slightly easier does not mean its a must or will cause you to fail.

I wasnt talking about guardians in entirety as in traits etc. I only mentioned weapon and utilities. Which they dont have blind spam utilities. that comes from traits. I know full well you use your virtures to spam blinds. That has nothing to do with the utilities you take. You could leave out those last two utilities and clear every dungeon with the utilities I listed in a fine time. Could you make runs more smooth? sure. But is it 100% neccassary with what guardian can already provide with the above listed utilities, all you miss out on is a condition clear, something Feedback from a mesmer/healing turret from an engi can suffice for. Hallowed ground is great for long fights where you need buttloads of stability, but my point is to illustrate even a BAD guardian not swapping his utilities will provide a crapload to a party, just like a warrior. Why do you think pugs look for heavy classes so much? they dont have much give when they get things. what do I lose by taking stand your ground over hallowed ground? I get an INSTANT stuck break 5 second stability instead of the longer cd longer duation hallowed ground. I lose stability for longer fights, im using something worse, and still not being 100% discredit to team.

ill admit guardian is way harder to play then warrior. it alteast requires timing. But both classes have extremely easy time making a dungeon a breeze. Everyone who swaps to warrior/guardian after playing something else can tell you this. I find both heavy classes entirely boring myself. Ive cleared dungeons in pugs with staff guardians faster then with no guards. I had a party, 1 ranger, 2 guardians, me an engi, and both guardians camping staff, and I cleared it way faster and smoother then when we had zero guardians. Cause thats how good the heavy classes are honestly. or maybe they are just godly players?

Yes, the idea is to run Sword/Focus and Greatsword. The Focus is the third weapon with a blind called Ray Of Judgement. The focus also includes a blast finisher which applies might when used in a fire field.

Even if your run is just a simple pug and not some ‘uber cool speed run’, as a Guardian it is important to take the correct utilities for each fight, and it’s really not hard to swap them, even for a mindless pug. There’s also another benefit to the preference of hallowed ground and purging flames. They are fire fields.

I can’t disagree with you about these classes being easy to play, they most certainly are. I believe that more content should be designed and added to really challenge players of all classes. I also believe that there needs to be changes to get some classes up the pecking order, for example the necromancer.

I am finding it hard to pinpoint what you are trying to convey but if it is that even a guardian running a staff, who doesnt swap up utilities and is doing jack all is better than something like a necro or ranger doing the same thing, I agree with you there as well. There is certainly some imbalance there.

-GMB

thats what im conveying yes. Ive run with alot of mindless pugs, and Guardians/Warriors are just really trong classes. Guardians cause well, they are well designed as crap and just plain do what they do, support. Despite how I posted, I dont think guardians are op, they do what they are supposeded to. I dislike how warriors are designed because they are big ole fat stat piles, all they do is spam weapon abilities, their utilities are generally just that as well, big ole stat piles like I mentioned, FGJ, banners, etc. they are just more stats n boons. Stats n boons. Timing? haha whats that, spam them anytime they are off cooldown. I spam 1/2 on GS, 20 might for everyone! Dont use Adren? MORE STATS/HEALS, dont use my signets? MORE CRIT.

Warriors just overrun content with sheer stats. its like hard dps checks, they are lame.

Warrior are Guardian seem superior in pugs because they are easy profession. A lot of profession can be superior to those two when played right. But for pugs, playing one of those profession usually end up in poor result.

I don’t know if you guys saw the show Extra Credits? I don’t remember the episodes or the name they used, but at one point they talked about an easy powerful tools. A specific unbalance in a game put there on purpose. What is that purpose? To help noobs feel powerful and push them further into the game rather than discourage them. You can see that with the noobs tube in CoD or with the Hundred Hands Slap in Street Fighter. They are powerful and easy to use for noobs, but they are not the best options of the game. They are specific unbalance in a game to allow new players and people with less skills to compete with higher level player so they can feel great playing the game and continue to play, maybe get better at it and discover more complex but more powerful stuff later.

For me the Warrior is exactly that. It feel overpower because its an easy powerful tool. But once you master more of the game, Warrior still have a great place, but its not the best option in the game.

The problem with this argument in general is (1) do you think any class is ‘hard to play’ ? and (2) what makes the non-warrior class ‘hard to play’ ?

If you think about it, it is reaction timing related to the pace of the game. That’s it. It is nothing more than the time it takes you to learn an opponent’s skills and how you should respond to them. Warrior is just more forgiving to learning the pace (but that is also countered with the Warrior doesn’t have the same variety in its toolset as any other class).

As an example, against a pistol/dagger thief in WvW/PvE, how hard is it to really be effective in the setup to learn and play (same iWin rotation) with the proper gear setup. (FYI, as an owner of all 8 classes, I’ll give you a clue … a few hours tops). IMO, all classes are relatively very very easy to play. Blind spam (i.e. Thief pistol offhand)/Aegis ‘spam’ (chaining with blocks and excessive heals)/Dodge spam (hello, vigor boon or even just the food)/Evade spam (i.e. Ranger melee)/Clone spam/distance kiting/etc., it is all done with the same purpose and boils down to basically one/two/three defensive options available to every class.

You all are really arguing over something that is purposely designed to be very simple for every class or for every playstyle. Warriors are easy to play. But so is every other class.

Artaz.3819:

The problem with this argument in general is (1) do you think any class is ‘hard to play’ ? and (2) what makes the non-warrior class ‘hard to play’ ?

If you think about it, it is reaction timing related to the pace of the game. That’s it. It is nothing more than the time it takes you to learn an opponent’s skills and how you should respond to them. Warrior is just more forgiving to learning the pace (but that is also countered with the Warrior doesn’t have the same variety in its toolset as any other class).

As an example, against a pistol/dagger thief in WvW/PvE, how hard is it to really be effective in the setup to learn and play (same iWin rotation) with the proper gear setup. (FYI, as an owner of all 8 classes, I’ll give you a clue … a few hours tops). IMO, all classes are relatively very very easy to play. Blind spam (i.e. Thief pistol offhand)/Aegis ‘spam’ (chaining with blocks and excessive heals)/Dodge spam (hello, vigor boon or even just the food)/Evade spam (i.e. Ranger melee)/Clone spam/distance kiting/etc., it is all done with the same purpose and boils down to basically one/two/three defensive options available to every class.

You all are really arguing over something that is purposely designed to be very simple for every class or for every playstyle. Warriors are easy to play. But so is every other class.

I think you give too much credit to the average pug. Is most profession easy to play? For me ya, and for you too obviously. But that’s doesn’t change the fact that Warrior is the easiest profession to play good. The warrior is pure Stats, you don’t need to blind, put aegis, use utilities to survive, and its a bit more forgiving for mistake. Warrior is all about passive. Passive defense and passive offense. So does most profession are relatively easy to play? Ya, but I play the game for almost 2 years now. A lot of ppl play a couple hours from times to times, they don’t know the encounters at all and don’t master the game or their specific profession. And that’s where the Warrior found its place as an easier profession.

You can also reroll Guardian, which is as awesome as Warrior

Thaddeus.4891:

Artaz.3819:

The problem with this argument in general is (1) do you think any class is ‘hard to play’ ? and (2) what makes the non-warrior class ‘hard to play’ ?

If you think about it, it is reaction timing related to the pace of the game. That’s it. It is nothing more than the time it takes you to learn an opponent’s skills and how you should respond to them. Warrior is just more forgiving to learning the pace (but that is also countered with the Warrior doesn’t have the same variety in its toolset as any other class).

As an example, against a pistol/dagger thief in WvW/PvE, how hard is it to really be effective in the setup to learn and play (same iWin rotation) with the proper gear setup. (FYI, as an owner of all 8 classes, I’ll give you a clue … a few hours tops). IMO, all classes are relatively very very easy to play. Blind spam (i.e. Thief pistol offhand)/Aegis ‘spam’ (chaining with blocks and excessive heals)/Dodge spam (hello, vigor boon or even just the food)/Evade spam (i.e. Ranger melee)/Clone spam/distance kiting/etc., it is all done with the same purpose and boils down to basically one/two/three defensive options available to every class.

You all are really arguing over something that is purposely designed to be very simple for every class or for every playstyle. Warriors are easy to play. But so is every other class.

I think you give too much credit to the average pug. Is most profession easy to play? For me ya, and for you too obviously. But that’s doesn’t change the fact that Warrior is the easiest profession to play good. The warrior is pure Stats, you don’t need to blind, put aegis, use utilities to survive, and its a bit more forgiving for mistake. Warrior is all about passive. Passive defense and passive offense. So does most profession are relatively easy to play? Ya, but I play the game for almost 2 years now. A lot of ppl play a couple hours from times to times, they don’t know the encounters at all and don’t master the game or their specific profession. And that’s where the Warrior found its place as an easier profession.

“Passive” offense is conditions. If you want to stretch the definition of passive offense further, that is every single auto-1 attack on every class (not just warriors). Bombing/burst DPS is even more exacerbated with Warriors (with hard CC combos) and that’s what makes Warriors actually a bit skilled (rotation required) to play actually since the skill execution is typically slow/telegraphed.

My issue with ‘Warrior is easier’ defensively though is Blind and Aegis timing isn’t any harder than dodge rolling. I wish there was something more to it but honestly the level of skill is virtually the same even for PUG players. If you can dodge roll effectively, you can just as easily hit the other attack mitigation button.

I agree with the stat (specifically high health with auto-regen from Healing Signet) thing which is far easier to learn as there is no learning curve. It just happens if you gear for it/select the skill. But that is no different than learning any class.

And the difference in learning is just so minor. As soon as a new player figures out the definition of Blind/Evade/Block/Lifesteal, etc. skills or boons like Aegis/Protection/Regen, I can’t imagine the learning curve being more than a few hours of playtime in any case. You want to talk about noob friendly, I would argue easily that Ranger Bear pet in PvE or Engineer turrets or Necro minion master/lifesteal or Guardian auto-Protection Hammer/AH or Mesmer PU builds, etc. are all just as easy to play and in some cases, even more forgiving than a Warrior stat pool.

Ok passive offense was not the best way to put it. Its just that its easy with a warrior to do good damage. That’s also why it was view as the best dmg in the game for a long time when the game was launched. PPl didn’t figure out how to play the game exactly and the first good setup was 4 warriors and 1 mesmer. Why? 4 OMM and 4 FGJ will give you a pretty good base of Vulnerability and Might, while fury wasn’t a much a problem. Its easy to get high dmg with a party of warrior.

And ya, you are right, if you want to max the dmg of a warrior, you gonna have to master a rotation that most ppl can do. But normal dmg is easy to reach on a warrior. I guess it get back to the defense of the warrior. Ppl feel more comfortable to go full berserk on a warrior because of all the HP pool and the heavy armor. Its kind of psychological, but its there. It pretty standard for ppl on a warrior to have a lot of zerker gear on them even if they are casual, but go on an Elementalist and you gonna see ppl with defensive gear and trait that try to get 14-18k hp on them just to feel safe. I’m not saying that out of nowhere, even within the best dungeon guild back in the days, the Warrior was view as the best dps of the game. Not only because of pure personnal dps, but because of all the offensive support they can bring wihtout much problem. The change in mentality from ‘’Warrior is best dps of the game’’ to ‘’Ele is best dps of the game’’ is not that old. We started to hear about LH build about a year ago, but at that time the build was view as interesting, but not as good as Warriors.

Ya blind, aegis and such are as easy as dodging, or almost as easy. But, again you’ll be surprise at the number of ppl not that good at dodging. Its not about the act of dodging itself, but to recognize the situation and knowing when or not to dodge. Active Defense need to be balance. You can’t just through them all back to back or you’ll run out of it. On a warrior, its easy to dodge at the very big attack, and then let your hp pool and heavy armor do the rest of the job. Again, I think you give too much credit to the average joe. They are not necessary bad, but a lot just don’t care. They are there to have fun so lets go on a Warrior its easier. Again i’m not making that up. Not so long ago, there were tread on forum about how many topic there were on Warrior or go home. Ppl were whining about Warrior was always the answer and this suck. And even if this mentality is dying because ppl figure out this wasn’t true, old habits are hard to scrap. And the reason why the community as a whole thought of the Warrior as the best profession a year ago, is still the same reason why normal pugs still think that.

Ya some build like bear bow or minion master or engineer turrets or AH guardian are even more easy than a Warrior. But Warrior shout too is super easy. You can always do a super easy build with pretty much any profession. But on the warrior you can have an easy build that do a decent job DPS wise. While on the other hand a bearbow, AH guardian, etc are pretty much known to be pathetic build for dungeon.

Warrior has a bunch of defense utilities and heavy armor and high health but:

1) Heavy armor is only like 5% more defense than medium armor and 10% more than light.
2) You won’t be using those defensive utilities in any group meta build. Even if you’re making heavy DPS sacrifices it’s still not that amazing since most of them are just the average stun breaker on long cooldown.
3) High health means you can take 1-2 more hits than a medium or low health profession but that’s really all it is.

Apart from that, their heal skills aren’t very good (Healing Surge recovers a lot of health but has a relatively long cooldown, Heal Sig has a good regen rate but the active sucks) and warriors lack easy access to defensive boons. They don’t get vigor normally (although they do have an extra, shorter dodge with WWA), they don’t get access to regen (apart from the Heal Sig passive), they don’t have blinds or aegis or weakness or protection, etc.

On top of all of that, if you’re using a GS like most pugs are prone to doing, you’re rooted a good 40% of the time which means you will be taking WAY more damage than anyone else.

every class is OP in the right players hands. no need to make wall of texts. just mostly too many bad players in gw2 period. That if they were half as good at playing their class as to do QQing about warriors they could beat one.

Hambows and axebows. Catch an earthshaker or an eviscerate and it’s gg for you. Meanwhile the warrior just walks through damage and conditions with blanket immunity and passive regen to heal up one of the highest health pools in the game. I can’t be the only one that thinks this class is just absurd. Is anyone here defending the class who doesn’t play warrior?

Warrior is probably one of the easiest classes to pick up and be effective with. It’s somewhat forgiving due to it’s durability when in the fray. It does not, however, have more DPS than most classes. People see 30k tallied damage from Hundred Blades and figure it’s a DPS champ but that’s in ideal circumstances and the damage is over time.

It also has some nice defensive utility skills but on the other hand there’s very little defense built-in to it’s weapon skill sets. Balanced Stance/Dolyak Signet are among the best stun breaks in the game due to the fact that they provide stability. Berserker’s Stance will provide some condition immunity albeit with a small window and Endure Pain will provide some immunity to damage but the warrior will still be susceptible to conditions and disables. The larger picture here is that a warrior has to operate at melee range(primarily a melee class) and sustain damage from opponents at the same time since it doesn’t really have built-in evasion, invulns or other tools to keep it upright and alive.

Warriors are a nice low skill cap class for PvErs in what’s generally considered a low skill cap PvE game by the MMORPG community. Warriors are survivable in PvP but the skill cap is much higher here if you want to be successful.