Guild Wars 2

What’s the point in them? Is it just easy mode?
Seriously, run into 4 or 5 of them last night and it was just easy mode compared to any form of stunlock warrior, against which I have to time every dodge properly and have to be 100times more careful.
This is from a Thief&Mesmer PoV. Still haven’t met them with my S/D Ele.

So wait… you’re playing a Thief, a class notorious for being able to cleanse conditions at an alarming rate, and you come here talking about how Condition Warriors, a build notorious for not having a high output of conditions in the first place, is easy?

Yeah…

Olba.5376:

So wait… you’re playing a Thief, a class notorious for being able to cleanse conditions at an alarming rate, and you come here talking about how Condition Warriors, a build notorious for not having a high output of conditions in the first place, is easy?

Yeah…

You forgot the Mesmer part, a class on which I have absolutely 0 condition cleanse. I only have 20% condition duration reduction for Hoelbrak runes, but that’s it.

condition war doesnt bring enough stuff to the table for the team. sure it works great on hotjoin or 1v1 vs not so good player in wvw or duel room. condi spam is the meta now, deal with it, get -condi dura food rune because i assume you play wvw. everyone who complaints about warrior in this section are wvw player from what i know.

hihey.1075:

Olba.5376:

So wait… you’re playing a Thief, a class notorious for being able to cleanse conditions at an alarming rate, and you come here talking about how Condition Warriors, a build notorious for not having a high output of conditions in the first place, is easy?

Yeah…

You forgot the Mesmer part, a class on which I have absolutely 0 condition cleanse. I only have 20% condition duration reduction for Hoelbrak runes, but that’s it.

if you think mesmer only has the runes to cleanse condi and think that condi warrior is your worst enemy, you should learn your class or quit it all at once.

Lighter.5631:

hihey.1075:

Olba.5376:

So wait… you’re playing a Thief, a class notorious for being able to cleanse conditions at an alarming rate, and you come here talking about how Condition Warriors, a build notorious for not having a high output of conditions in the first place, is easy?

Yeah…

You forgot the Mesmer part, a class on which I have absolutely 0 condition cleanse. I only have 20% condition duration reduction for Hoelbrak runes, but that’s it.

if you think mesmer only has the runes to cleanse condi and think that condi warrior is your worst enemy, you should learn your class or quit it all at once.

I beg your pardon?
I’ve clearly stated that I have 0 condition cleanse on MY mesmer; tell me where I said mesmers have no access to condition defense, please.
Seriously, people on the Warrior forums really need to improve their reading abilities, out of 3 replies I had 2 were totally out of place.

Guys, what I am asking is the purpose of a condi warrior. Granted, maybe the opponents I met were not so skilled, but I really had no problems against them, both as a thief and as a mesmer. I would include as an Elementalist too, since it is by far the class which has the best condi cleanse at my disposal.
What classes/combinations should be afraid of LB/S+S condi warriors? Guardians maybe?

It is by far not easy mode. However, condition builds output a stable, steady stream of damage that is unavoidable (unless you step off the cap point to avoid the fire) and the damage is true damage, meaning it cuts straight through defense. This may give the impression that they are easy to play but the combos take a lot of timing and coordination, and there is plenty of room for counter-play.

Honestly, I don’t think condition warriors are a big issue either. I have a set that I run sometimes, but the lack of active defenses and mobility on both weapon sets really doesn’t make a great build. If you get apothecary gear you could potentially build into a regen tank hybrid, but due to the lack of protection it won’t be that effective either. Of course conditions do kill random Zerglings, kittenty players; however that doesn’t make it a good set.

hihey.1075:

Lighter.5631:

hihey.1075:

Olba.5376:

So wait… you’re playing a Thief, a class notorious for being able to cleanse conditions at an alarming rate, and you come here talking about how Condition Warriors, a build notorious for not having a high output of conditions in the first place, is easy?

Yeah…

You forgot the Mesmer part, a class on which I have absolutely 0 condition cleanse. I only have 20% condition duration reduction for Hoelbrak runes, but that’s it.

if you think mesmer only has the runes to cleanse condi and think that condi warrior is your worst enemy, you should learn your class or quit it all at once.

I beg your pardon?
I’ve clearly stated that I have 0 condition cleanse on MY mesmer; tell me where I said mesmers have no access to condition defense, please.

Yea, i stopped reading here, you basically saying that you are getting owned by conditions without spec ing any in condition defense. that’s like saying i keep getting killed by enemy attacks because i don’t use my heal, my enemy must be easy mode.
don’t know if you are trolling or just being an idiot.

Well, sorry to say so, but unless the mesmer entirely commits himself to condition cleanse, it’s an auto-win for the condi warrior.

/edit: Also the mesmer has to either take GS or be heavily specced for damage as warriors just outheal any damage otherwise.

Lighter.5631:

Yea, i stopped reading here, you basically saying that you are getting owned by conditions without spec ing any in condition defense. that’s like saying i keep getting killed by enemy attacks because i don’t use my heal, my enemy must be easy mode.
don’t know if you are trolling or just being an idiot.

hihey.1075:

I beg your pardon?
I’ve clearly stated that I have 0 condition cleanse on MY mesmer; tell me where I said mesmers have no access to condition defense, please.
Seriously, people on the Warrior forums really need to improve their reading abilities, out of 3 replies I had 2 were totally out of place.

Guys, what I am asking is the purpose of a condi warrior. Granted, maybe the opponents I met were not so skilled, but I really had no problems against them, both as a thief and as a mesmer. I would include as an Elementalist too, since it is by far the class which has the best condi cleanse at my disposal.
What classes/combinations should be afraid of LB/S+S condi warriors? Guardians maybe?

Read again. He says that he can beat them easily with his mesmer.

Iavra.8510:

Well, sorry to say so, but unless the mesmer entirely commits himself to condition cleanse, it’s an auto-win for the condi warrior.

/edit: Also the mesmer has to either take GS or be heavily specced for damage as warriors just outheal any damage otherwise.

mesmer dont need to spec heavily in condition cleanse against warrior because warrior is not the one who keeps throwing down multiple ranged AoEs with all type of conditions.

Turamarth.3248:

Lighter.5631:

Yea, i stopped reading here, you basically saying that you are getting owned by conditions without spec ing any in condition defense. that’s like saying i keep getting killed by enemy attacks because i don’t use my heal, my enemy must be easy mode.
don’t know if you are trolling or just being an idiot.

hihey.1075:

I beg your pardon?
I’ve clearly stated that I have 0 condition cleanse on MY mesmer; tell me where I said mesmers have no access to condition defense, please.
Seriously, people on the Warrior forums really need to improve their reading abilities, out of 3 replies I had 2 were totally out of place.

Guys, what I am asking is the purpose of a condi warrior. Granted, maybe the opponents I met were not so skilled, but I really had no problems against them, both as a thief and as a mesmer. I would include as an Elementalist too, since it is by far the class which has the best condi cleanse at my disposal.
What classes/combinations should be afraid of LB/S+S condi warriors? Guardians maybe?

Read again. He says that he can beat them easily with his mesmer.

So what’s this threads purpose? he made a thread saying that condition warriors are easy mode, and that his mesmer doesnt have condition removable.

then he says thakittens so easy to kill condition warriors.

what?

perhaps he should question himself about his thread making ability rather than our reading ability.

If that means that that’s what mesmers do, then no, they aren’t. If you mean necro…actually those are doable because they are more easily kited than warriors.

Warrior bleeds from autoattack alone have about 15-16s duration (and that’s not even counting torment/burning/poison from weaponswap or 9 stacks confusion on interrupt), when properly specced. Mesmer cleanses are on high cds which basically means the warrior only has to kite (remember: warriors are about tied with thief for the best mobility while mesmers have the worst apart from moving around in a small spot) while the conditions do their work.

I have to admit, my condition warrior eats mesmers in WvW.

@Lighter
He says condition warriors are easy to beat for him despite the fact he uses no condition cleanse on his mesmer.
Therefore his question why we use such a apparently weak build.

Turamarth.3248:

@Lighter
He says condition warriors are easy to beat for him despite the fact he uses no condition cleanse on his mesmer.
Therefore his question why we use such a apparently weak build.

see? now thats how to start a thread

The problem are conditions, they are broken, so yeah, condition warrior is more faceroll than a CC build, whoever complains about CC has no reason to, they are just crappy players that dont slot stun breakers, dont dodge, dont evade, just expect to faceroll warrior… whoever complains about condition warrior, has a point because by now everyone pretty much agrees and knows even if they dont admit it, that conditions are just broken.

lmao, how is condition warrior broken? It’s called condition removal.

I remember pre-Dogged March/Cleansing Ire/Mending buff/Berserker’s Stance buff warriors complaining about conditions everyday :P

Sil.4560:

lmao, how is condition warrior broken? It’s called condition removal.

For lots of classes that’s
-you get 12 stacks of confusino put on you
-you hit condition removal (which triggers those confusion stacks)
-those confusion stacks get reapplied in the next few seconds :P

Thing is, condition warrior must apply conditions at range through projectiles.
If you manage to have a clone between you and the warrior, you will not be hit by that Torment. Basically, you will only be suffering bleeds.
It’s called positioning, which is really important as a Mesmer.
During the entire fight, I did never have more than 2 conditions applied at once. Sure, it was definitely a harder fight then with my thief, but I still managed to kill him.

IMHO if you want to play a condi warrior you are doing something wrong.

I think every class deserves a version of their own condition build, including warrios. I’ve met some decent ones in WvW, they are able to keep a good amount of pressure on me with bleeds/burning. Never had problem killing them myself though (I main Mesmer).The amount of bleeding stacks they can apply in a short time frame seems a bit strong, but it’s a single condition after all. Just bring Arcane Thievery and you’re good.

At least that worked for me.

hihey.1075:

Thing is, condition warrior must apply conditions at range through projectiles.
If you manage to have a clone between you and the warrior, you will not be hit by that Torment. Basically, you will only be suffering bleeds.
It’s called positioning, which is really important as a Mesmer.
During the entire fight, I did never have more than 2 conditions applied at once. Sure, it was definitely a harder fight then with my thief, but I still managed to kill him.

IMHO if you want to play a condi warrior you are doing something wrong.

Sounds like you havent played against a good one yet imo. A constant AOE fire burst skill on 7 1/2 sec that is perpetually up that is the size of the node, with good access to stability, good self cleanse (ire) respectable defense (3.7k shaman am). You stand in the fire you are subject to combo finishers, lots of immob that keeps you in the fire, and a very good hp regen rate to keep him up. If that war goes 0/10/30/30/0 and takes banners to add further regen gl. Is it the best? No, i think necros have that title in spvp. Is it good enough? In proper hands i would say so. You can easily defend a node against any one player. In wvw, same idea you lay a constant fire field out for you and your team mates to combo on, lots of bleeds and burning, and heavy access to immob to pain train your teams target. This is assuming s/s +LB.

I don’t know. I’ve had quite a bit of success as a condi Warrior lately. Sure, it’s not an ideal setup to bring into group sPvP, where everyone has a defined role, but just for running around in SoloQ and lighting people up? It’s great.

Eating Pin Down while roasting on my fire pan AoE pretty much ends a lot of Thieves for me. Sure, good Thieves will dance in and out, dodging my big attacks, but even they can’t avoid the burning or chew through my 2k Tuf and regeneration so easily.

Mesmers… I don’t know. Been fine against them. Again, good ones will counter my condi bombs and just perma stealth somewhere away from the fire, while their clones do all the work, but if I manage to survive through their cooldowns and catch them with Pin Down/Flurry they are in trouble.

Eles, on the other hand, been giving me a bit of trouble with their huge condi cleansing and mobility.

As a condition warrior the only real troubles I have are against certain mesmer builds (some I can kill quit easily, I can’t keep enough pressure on others), necros ( the good ones), and the stun lock warrior. Thieves are so so but most of the time they aren’t a problem unless they are accompanied by another player since they pretty much all run the same build and are predictable as hell..

Julie Yann.5379:

As a condition warrior the only real troubles I have are against certain mesmer builds (some I can kill quit easily, I can’t keep enough pressure on others), necros ( the good ones), and the stun lock warrior. .

If you follow my 30 seconds of stability condition build, you shouldn’t have any issues vs stunlock warriors. In fact, my build actually hard-counters the stunlock build. They only have 10 seconds of defense vs your conditions, while you have 30 seconds of immunity vs their build. It works out in the condition warrior’s favor nicely.

condi warriors would be fine if you could actually kill them. the toughness/regen/healing signet is what makes them op.

my first burst may hurt them a bit but if it takes an average of 10 seconds for the burst to recharge, they regen a minimum of 4k health, thats 2k health every 5 seconds completely passive and coupled with the ability to dish out loads of condi damage at the same time. thats just too much

inb4 spec condi removal
why do i have to roll an awkward crappy condi removal spec sacrificing utilities and damage just to survive a condi warrior who is dropping people like flies, and plus, as i said, unless you are packing some seriously high burst, you wont kill them anyway

You do realize that is how pvp works. It is an ever changing field where you need to adjust your builds to counter theirs. The funny thing is, your side slots a few more condition removal skills, you make a condition warrior obsolete. It is you refusal to adept that makes them over-powered. You are to worried about topping the charts with high kills and dps.

so my options are spec some gimpy condi removal spec (has to be heavy removal or its pointless) that cant put a dent in his defenses and die slowly to reapplications which will easily overrun my removals

or

run extreme glass cannon and maybe make him actually flinch before he condi-bursts me down in 5 seconds and his health easily regens back to full.

youre basically telling me to adapt to something being invincible and having massive burst. how exactly does that work?

Roll a warrior, spec him to one of the various condition builds and try it out. Learn it’s strengths and weakness cause there are weaknesses to the build then go back to your other character and modify you build/playstyle. That’s what warriors have been doing all the other classes since last year when we became the fighting joke.

Warrior condi build is finally semi viable and people demand nerfs right away. Most people want Warriors to be a free kill and nothing more.

if they run double swords they are weak against conditions and most likely not into healing power so weak against sustained power damage aswell. if they run longbow – that can be dodged/avoided easily if you know the skills. if they run sword / warhorn bunkerish they dont burst. if they run confusion stacking they dont use full condition weapons. warriors cant have everything aswell.

it is not the condi that is the problem, its the defense that is coupled with it.
you can run full condi with high toughness, naturally high hp, heavy armor, and a healing signet which is healing for a minimum of 2k hp every 5 seconds completely passive and uninterruptible (not including banner regen or dolyak runes)

and yes they are weak to conditions but that only further exacerbates the horrible condition based meta we are experiencing.

i have played warrior plenty, i was one moaning for buffs, but the tankiness, more specifically the healing signet, is providing too much defense for such high offensive capabilities.

Tellah.8073:

it is not the condi that is the problem, its the defense that is coupled with it.
you can run full condi with high toughness, naturally high hp, heavy armor, and a healing signet which is healing for a minimum of 2k hp every 5 seconds completely passive and uninterruptible (not including banner regen or dolyak runes)

and yes they are weak to conditions but that only further exacerbates the horrible condition based meta we are experiencing.

i have played warrior plenty, i was one moaning for buffs, but the tankiness, more specifically the healing signet, is providing too much defense for such high offensive capabilities.

I play that build and I play it well but I still get killed 1v1 sometimes. Usually by someone equal or better than me and there are some builds which I can’t do a thing against. There is nothing OP about it, you just haven’t learned to counter it yet.

Tellah.8073:

it is not the condi that is the problem, its the defense that is coupled with it.

So, you believe condition builds should be as sturdy as wet toilet paper? No sir, that’s not how PvP works in GW2. Even Necros have good survivability when fully specced as glass cannon condtion bursters, and Necros have arguably the strongest ranged conditions in the game.

In order for most builds to be viable in PvP competitively, there must be a certain degree of offense mixed with survivability. By the way, shaman amulet-using condition builds are not bursty; they deal damage over quite a long period of time, giving you a lot of room for counter gameplay. If you lose to a shaman amulet warrior, that is simply a case of being outplayed.

yes, if they can dish out so much dps, they need to be squishy. thats the trade off when you spec glass cannon, you die quick. signet warriors are putting out heavy burst yet are very tanky. to be fair im seeing this done with other combos.. tanky heal sig with hammer/mace etc. i seen this last night, a tanky sig warrior was absolutely walloping me with hard crits and cc but i couldnt get him down past 1/5 of his hp after full dps rotations. so its not the condis its the tankiness

i really dont understand how you can find it within you to justify 400-1k healing per second for any build for anyone. healing signet should be dropped to 250-300 per second, or make it 400 every time you land an attack (1 sec cd). being able to passively heal yourself for up to 5k per 5 seconds without giving up any offensive posturing whatsoever is just stupid

That is how rock, paper, scissors works. While you play a certain class that totally destroys one build, you have a problem vs another. While it is a problem for you, it is very easy for someone to beat a condition warrior. Some classes that come to mind are necro, engineer, certain mezmers, and sceptre/focus elementalist. I die so fast against a sceptre/focus elementalist it isn’t funny. They have crazy amounts of reflect damage coupled with hard hitting direct damage. I have had them take me out in like 8 seconds. Necro’s can do it also; just not as fast. Good thing fighting a nerco is he can’t catch you.

I think your problem is, you think you are a good player. If you win, it is because you are good, naturally. If you lose, it is because the other class/build is op. A good player realizes some classes he cannot beat and is fine with it. Most MMO players are like you.

a GOOD condition warrior will own a mesmer 11/10 times.

Ljiona.9142:

While it is a problem for you, it is very easy for someone to beat a condition warrior. Some classes that come to mind are necro, engineer, certain mezmers, and sceptre/focus elementalist.

I don’t have problems with any of these when running condition.

Azure.8670:

a GOOD condition warrior will own a mesmer 11/10 times.

Actually, not quite true. There is a build in WvW that I played against which I could not keep the pressure on long enough to stack enough conditions to hurt him. It was a stalemate. We fought for about 4 mins then his friends showed up and 1 vs 3 good players still near impossible. I’ve never played the class so I can say what kind of build it was.

Tellah.8073:

yes, if they can dish out so much dps, they need to be squishy. thats the trade off when you spec glass cannon, you die quick. signet warriors are putting out heavy burst yet are very tanky. to be fair im seeing this done with other combos.. tanky heal sig with hammer/mace etc. i seen this last night, a tanky sig warrior was absolutely walloping me with hard crits and cc but i couldnt get him down past 1/5 of his hp after full dps rotations. so its not the condis its the tankiness

i really dont understand how you can find it within you to justify 400-1k healing per second for any build for anyone. healing signet should be dropped to 250-300 per second, or make it 400 every time you land an attack (1 sec cd). being able to passively heal yourself for up to 5k per 5 seconds without giving up any offensive posturing whatsoever is just stupid

Condition builds take time to ramp up their DPS. They need to be tanky in order to do so. This not a Skullcrack-100b insta kill build. We have to stack bleeds and burns which get cleared easily so we have to do it over and over again until you run out on condition removal. Then we can watch you slowly die. If we are lucky we can give you a little torment which speeds up the process a little since most people have a hard time staying still.

Staying still just means they’re bleeding more anyway. =)

Sil.4560:

Staying still just means they’re bleeding more anyway. =)

Yes, torment is a kitten. It really puts you between a rock and a hard place but when you get it, cleanse it before running. I love to see just stack up on you as you are trying to make a break for it.

The best part about Impale is that it applies the condition at different times, so either way it’s going to do some damage.