Guild Wars 2

Much respect to Cygnus(critical hammer) and Shinryuku (Hamtastic)

I would like the communities perspective on these two builds.
They both are good but one feels definitely more user friendly for a newer warrior.

Here are the builds.

Shinryuku Hamtastic -GS(impact/doom) /Hammer(air/hydro)
Traits 4 (3+7) 0 4(2+9) 2(1) 4 (5+8)
Healing sig, Bal stance, Endure pain, Bulls Charge, Sig of Rage
Berserk all. Melandru Runes. Lemongrass

With this build, nothing slowed me down, conditions were not a problem. I never ran into a condi user that could reliably apply enough conditions to kill me. It was great for keeping pressure on targets.

Cygnus Y Critical Hammer
GS(Fire/Air) hammer (impact/perception)
Traits 0 4 6 0 4
Healing sig, bal stance, berserk stance, Dolyak sig, Sig of rage
Berserk armor/weapons
Hoelbrak Runes
zerk ammy, zerk back, knight, soliders, cavalier trink-etc
Omnomberry Ghost

As much as I enjoyed Cygnus gameplay, this build felt lacking compared to the first.
It felt like it hit harder. I was much more reliant on my utilities for condi management. It also seemed like it was easier for people to kite me.

What’s the deal? 103 people looked at the post and no one has an opinion?

Cygnus, no thoughts? You’re here all the time.

I don’t play with hammer so I don’t know what is going on.
I am thinking of playing with a hammer though
so I will be watching this thread intently.
If someone can also use a build editor to show me the actual builds?

Thanks!

Neither of them seem optimal, tbh. And that’s no disrespect to the players, but the build choices seem off to me.

Shinryuku:

In no way is Leg Specialist more valuable than the options available on the Strength, Defense or Tactics trees there. I personally go Defense for Armored Attack and Merciless Hammer, but it’s not the only route.

The sigils are messed up too. Putting air on hammer and not gs makes no sense, and their are far better choices than impact on the gs too. Energy, Fire, Fury, Cleansing (if you need more condi removal), etc. I also put Intelligence on my hammer personally, to ensure those big hits on a stun lock.

Cygnus:

My only gripe on this is, based on the numbers, 4 points into Strength instead of Arms makes way more sense. You don’t stack enough might using Forceful Greatsword to outweigh the dps of Slashing Power so, unless you really need the better cooldown for some reason that isn’t dps, it’s not the optimal route.

I think he’d get more mileage out of full zerk if he can handle it too, but to each his own. Hammer sigils are also weird to me… again, Intelligence would be a better choice than Impact since you only have 4s of stun or knockdown at +10% vs all your big hits (well, the first 3) landing a guaranteed crit. It’s no contest.

Again, that’s no disrespect to the players and I’m a proponent of people doing what they find works for them and is fun. But numbers-wise, I think they both have better options.

Based on your experience of both, changing Cygnus’ food for Lemongrass would give you practically the same condi resistance. No idea why you’d find it easier to get kited on his build either… that 1s immob every 5s from Leg Specialist isn’t that decisive, and Cygnus would have lower CD on the gs movement skills.

Choppy.4183:

Neither of them seem optimal, tbh. And that’s no disrespect to the players, but the build choices seem off to me.

Shinryuku:

In no way is Leg Specialist more valuable than the options available on the Strength, Defense or Tactics trees there. I personally go Defense for Armored Attack and Merciless Hammer, but it’s not the only route.

The sigils are messed up too. Putting air on hammer and not gs makes no sense, and their are far better choices than impact on the gs too. Energy, Fire, Fury, Cleansing (if you need more condi removal), etc. I also put Intelligence on my hammer personally, to ensure those big hits on a stun lock.

Cygnus:

My only gripe on this is, based on the numbers, 4 points into Strength instead of Arms makes way more sense. You don’t stack enough might using Forceful Greatsword to outweigh the dps of Slashing Power so, unless you really need the better cooldown for some reason that isn’t dps, it’s not the optimal route.

I think he’d get more mileage out of full zerk if he can handle it too, but to each his own. Hammer sigils are also weird to me… again, Intelligence would be a better choice than Impact since you only have 4s of stun or knockdown at +10% vs all your big hits (well, the first 3) landing a guaranteed crit. It’s no contest.

Again, that’s no disrespect to the players and I’m a proponent of people doing what they find works for them and is fun. But numbers-wise, I think they both have better options.

Based on your experience of both, changing Cygnus’ food for Lemongrass would give you practically the same condi resistance. No idea why you’d find it easier to get kited on his build either… that 1s immob every 5s from Leg Specialist isn’t that decisive, and Cygnus would have lower CD on the gs movement skills.

can you link a good hammer build on build editor?

Choppy.4183:

Neither of them seem optimal, tbh. And that’s no disrespect to the players, but the build choices seem off to me.

Shinryuku:

In no way is Leg Specialist more valuable than the options available on the Strength, Defense or Tactics trees there. I personally go Defense for Armored Attack and Merciless Hammer, but it’s not the only route.

The sigils are messed up too. Putting air on hammer and not gs makes no sense, and their are far better choices than impact on the gs too. Energy, Fire, Fury, Cleansing (if you need more condi removal), etc. I also put Intelligence on my hammer personally, to ensure those big hits on a stun lock.

Cygnus:

My only gripe on this is, based on the numbers, 4 points into Strength instead of Arms makes way more sense. You don’t stack enough might using Forceful Greatsword to outweigh the dps of Slashing Power so, unless you really need the better cooldown for some reason that isn’t dps, it’s not the optimal route.

I think he’d get more mileage out of full zerk if he can handle it too, but to each his own. Hammer sigils are also weird to me… again, Intelligence would be a better choice than Impact since you only have 4s of stun or knockdown at +10% vs all your big hits (well, the first 3) landing a guaranteed crit. It’s no contest.

Again, that’s no disrespect to the players and I’m a proponent of people doing what they find works for them and is fun. But numbers-wise, I think they both have better options.

Based on your experience of both, changing Cygnus’ food for Lemongrass would give you practically the same condi resistance. No idea why you’d find it easier to get kited on his build either… that 1s immob every 5s from Leg Specialist isn’t that decisive, and Cygnus would have lower CD on the gs movement skills.

I’m glad you mentioned it. I’m not a seasoned warrior.

I thought maybe it was the combination of
-condi duration food
+ melandru instead of hoelbrak
-10% Incoming Condition Duration.png Condition Duration; -10% Incoming Stun Duration
(5): +100 Toughness.png Toughness
(6): -15% Incoming Condition Duration. -15% Incoming Stun Duration
+ leg specialist

What are you playing now if you don’t mind me asking?

EnderzShadow.2506:

As much as I enjoyed Cygnus gameplay, this build felt lacking compared to the first. It felt like it hit harder. I was much more reliant on my utilities for condi management. It also seemed like it was easier for people to kite me.

Sorry for the late response, I was on vacation Greece is great this time of year.

When it comes to my build, you have to realise the reasoning behind it. I try to explain it in the video, but there is one thing I’d like to add.

The idea behind such a high crit chance and slightly lower power/crit damage (then what you would get with full zerk and Strength Traits) is that my build does higher sustained damage with similar burst (thanks to sigil of impact), while you maintain the element of surprise.

The high crit chance allows you to discard sigil of intelligence, which is a very weak Sigil when you fight an opponent with some skill. When you swap, you get an icon saying dodge/block/blind/kite/w/e my next three attacks or you lose. Whereas my build allows you to maintain maximum flexibility as to when you will unleash, instead of always right after swapping. In outnumbered fights, you will also notice more attacks getting randomly aegis’d or blinded, which hurts more when you rely on intelligence.
Also, Intelligence only boosts your hammer attacks. The surprise factor is often what wins you a fight if it’s a kittene, and my GS attacks hit like a truck.

Choppy.4183:

Cygnus:
feedback

I very much like Choppy’s feedback, one should always think about what suits your playstyle. If the maximum numbers matter to you, then by all means, adjust to that.

On to your comments;

4 in Arms is way better in my opinion. I stated a couple reasons to get a high crit chance above, and to get that, you need 4 in Arms. Not only does this net you ~10% crit chance from the traitline, but you also get higher fury uptime and an additional 10% crit chance on Burst Skills.

Let’s compare Arms to Strength more indepth;

The Strength minor traits are very meh, IMO. Reckless dodge is funny, but one can hardly rely on this seriously for DPS. In any case, I don’t think it does that much more DPS then Precise Strikes, which also adds a layer of condi to shield your more important conditions (weakness, cripple). If you used a dodge for DPS, then you might as well just AA’d.
Building Momentum used to be great, but now it is very mediocre and does not outway extra endurance gained by Furious Reaction.

The Adept traits you can select pretty much end with Greater Fortitude, which adds HP. To a warrior. With the highest HP in the game.

So you generally pick Strength for the flat 10% DPS boost. Now let’s compare that to Forceful GS.
Let’s ignore the cooldown reduction and focus on the might on crit. With my build, you get 80% crit chance (when stacked) with Fury, of which you have near permanent uptime (perma if you use Acring Slice every so often). This means 4 out of 5 attacks will give you 30 power and 30 condi damage. If we take 2500 power as our starting point, one would need 8,33 stacks of might to do 10% increased damage from this trait alone (8,33*30=250 which is 10% power). This is not possible with a 6,5 second duration. Besides, realisticly, in a 1v1 situation you will hit your opponent 5-7 times when your on GS before swapping to Hammer. So let’s say you get 5 stacks from it, which would be a ~6% DPS increase. The beauty of it is though, that just like perception stacks, this benefits not just the weapon the sigil is placed in, but also your secondary weapon. When talking about build viability, you should not always look at numbers alone. If I am fighting an outnumbered situation, I can get way more stacks then 5, up to crazy amounts if I cleave a downed or stunned person with HB. It is in these moments that the DPS from Forceful GS outways that of Slashing power.

And then there is the 20% cooldown reduction.

As for the battle between intelligence and impact, on my build obviously impact wins (because of the high crit chance). Generally speaking, impact is a sigil that not only allows the hammer warrior to have more burst, but is also very fun to me. I like it when I hit 5k+ hammer skills on my target. All in all, Force would probably be better still. Although the surprise high hits with hammer definitely win you fights.
On the Strength variant of the build, Intelligence would be good. Just remember the added telegraphing of your playstyle.

I used to play with lemongrass. Couple reasons made me switch to Ghost. For one, the added precision is better then vitality IMO. Stealing health means both DPS and survivability. It steals health on critical hit, of which I dish out a lot. And finally, lemongrass is weaker when you are fighting low condi classes or larger fights (in 5vX for instance, there is more condi cleanse flying around).
It takes a while to get used to less condi-reduction, but I like it.
By the way, I have been testing sigil of Hydromancy with Leeching on GS lately. Combined with Ghost, it adds a lot of sustain and I can definitely recommend it to anyone.

I do use zerk on many builds, even Hammer/GS (although I generally use 20624 when using zerk). The build I released aims for a wider public, as many people find zerk to be too glassy for their playstyle. Also, in an outnumbered situation, added toughness is no luxury, as we are warriors and tend to eat more damage then other classes.

@Cygnus and @EremiteAngel
Here’s the hammer roamer I’ve been using for a while now. I usually cheap out and use saffron bread and hardened sharpening stones though, the linked build is just more optimal. It works for me anyway.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fJAQJARSjMdU2ZZIWhwJagfgC9t3C7gxAYAU+G5OA-TVCFABVfEAQ4QAAwFAoQ1fuSJISK/qZ/h00FswDAIAACwNvZ28mBOv5Nv5Nv55m38m38m3sUAMp1C-w

@EnderzShadow
Well, Cygnus’ build has more toughness by the traits alone (and gear, if you take that route), and switching the food gives you almost as much condi reduction as the other build (the difference is only 5%). The food choice doesn’t appear to be integral to Cygnus’ build, so if you like his damage output better and only found the condis to be a problem, switching the food should hook you up nicely.

For Cygnus, he doesn’t find condis to be a problem, so Omnom is the better choice. It could be personal style, or it could be that you’re coming up against more condis. Either way, experiment to see what feels right to you.

Cygnus.6903:

…lots of great points…

Strength Route:
+200 Power
+Crittable 864 damage to five targets (Reckless Dodge)
+2.5k health or so (agreed, traits are meh. Though Death from Above can be hilarious)
+15 endurance on burst through Building Momentum (pretty meh)
+10% damage on gs

Arms Route:
+200 Precision
+158 through 3s of non critting bleed damage 33% of the time (Precise Strikes)
+10s fury/vigor every 30s
+10% crit chance on burst skills
+might on gs crit and -20 gs CD

I have to run, so I’ll have to do the math later. The above is just for reference. Some notes on your points though:

- Reckless Dodge is actually no joke. Being zerk, I’m obviously dodging around a bunch. It usually crits, and that has me doing 2.5k-3.2k to up to five targets which is better than an air sigil by a lot. I pulled 4.3k on a mesmer last night, but I have no idea why… he wasn’t an uplevel, so maybe had broken armor? No idea. Shouldn’t have been possible.

- You’d need 6.67 stacks of might just to match the 200 power from the trait line, which you might be able to maintain through FG but that’s with landing some of a 100b and Whirlwind. You won’t really begin to start chipping into the +10% from SP via FG, even if you’re working kitten your gs to do it (which you won’t, because the hammer’s awesome). But, yeah, I get what you’re saying with multiple targets and that probably helps a lot if you manage to cleave people going for a rez with 100b or whirlwind through a group.

- Also, keep in mind, Slashing Power isn’t +10% power but +10% damage, which is much better.

- The extra precision you get from the Arms tree is good for about 9.5% crit chance. Good, but at our already high crit rates it doesn’t represent as much of damage increase as does the 200 power from strength

For the rune choice, Hoelbrak is certainly helping you with the might stacking, particularly while running FG. Before switching to Pack runes, I actually ran Strength runes with FG but found I was better off overall with what I’ve got going now.

Like you say though, it’s not all about what the straight numbers look like. There are a lot of variables out there (like the number of targets to proc FG, the condis you’re up against when choosing food, etc), and then there’s play style and ability (like how you made choices to create a more accessible build). And then fun… fun trumps everything.

Choppy.4183:

- Reckless Dodge is actually no joke. Being zerk, I’m obviously dodging around a bunch. It usually crits, and that has me doing 2.5k-3.2k to up to five targets which is better than an air sigil by a lot. I pulled 4.3k on a mesmer last night, but I have no idea why… he wasn’t an uplevel, so maybe had broken armor? No idea. Shouldn’t have been possible.

- You’d need 6.67 stacks of might just to match the 200 power from the trait line, which you might be able to maintain through FG but that’s with landing some of a 100b and Whirlwind. You won’t really begin to start chipping into the +10% from SP via FG, even if you’re working kitten your gs to do it (which you won’t, because the hammer’s awesome). But, yeah, I get what you’re saying with multiple targets and that probably helps a lot if you manage to cleave people going for a rez with 100b or whirlwind through a group.

- Also, keep in mind, Slashing Power isn’t +10% power but +10% damage, which is much better.

- The extra precision you get from the Arms tree is good for about 9.5% crit chance. Good, but at our already high crit rates it doesn’t represent as much of damage increase as does the 200 power from strength

-Obviously you dodge around, more often then not will you be dodging away from your target, meaning reckless dodge does kitten all.

-When compairing the power from strength to the condi and precision from arms, the power does add more damage. Like I explained earlier though, the crit chance allows for different choices and more flexibility in your burst timing. Obviously, the highest number won’t be achieved through precision.

-As for slashing power being 10% damage, I believe an increase of 10% in power (so, for instance, going from 2500 to 2750 like I used in my earlier calculations) actually represents a 10% increase in damage. I would have to check the damage calculator for that, but I think it’s correct, and thus means more power has diminishing returns. So my earlier comparison does apply here.

Edit: looked up the wiki damage formula, and what I’m saying is correct. So a 10% increase in power is just as good as a 10% increase in damage. In fact, the power increase is better if you could get the might needed to get the 10% increase, as you get it on both weapon sets.

Choppy.4183:

- Also, keep in mind, Slashing Power isn’t +10% power but +10% damage, which is much better.

Put another point to Arms and you can get your +10% damage back.

but i agree with you on the awesomeness of Reckless Dodge

@Cygnus
If you go down that page a bit you’ll see the multiplier applies to the entire value of weapon damage, so you’re short changing the trait a bit by only applying the bonus to power. Also, multipliers have a multiplicative effect on each other, so it ends up being a touch more than 10%.

You actually have to dodge into your enemy to proc reckless dodge, so I try to do exactly that when in melee range. It really is a fantastic trait, imo.

@juba
I almost included that very point in my last comment. That if someone went through Arms, putting one more point in might be worth it.

But then he’d have to give up DotE or Merciless Hammer, plus add an Earth sigil to ensure good bleed uptime to make it work and I didn’t have the time to calculate if it was worth the trades required.

Choppy.4183:

@Cygnus
If you go down that page a bit you’ll see the multiplier applies to the entire value of weapon damage, so you’re short changing the trait a bit by only applying the bonus to power. Also, multipliers have a multiplicative effect on each other, so it ends up being a touch more than 10%.

You actually have to dodge into your enemy to proc reckless dodge, so I try to do exactly that when in melee range. It really is a fantastic trait, imo.

@juba
I almost included that very point in my last comment. That if someone went through Arms, putting one more point in might be worth it.

But then he’d have to give up DotE or Merciless Hammer, plus add an Earth sigil to ensure good bleed uptime to make it work and I didn’t have the time to calculate if it was worth the trades required.

Well, math is not my strongest suit, but rather my experience led me to this version of the build.

About DotE versus AoO, when you don’t apply regular bleeds, it is a waste to take AoO. Often, DotE is better then AoO anyway, as many classes run 4+ boons. On my Sword/Shield build I do take it because I am almost guarantueed to have a bleeding target.

Switching out a sigil is not worth it IMO, as the sigils I chose have a very distinct purpose and they function that much better when combined.

By the way, not having Merciless Hammer on a hammer build is a waste. This trait is simply too powerful not to get on any hammer build really. It saddens me that having both Merciless Hammer and Burst Mastery in one build won’t be possible after the xpac, an uncalled for nerf if you ask me. But I will take MH regardless.

I surely don’t understand why Shinryuku prefers stuff like Distracting Strikes over MH. It makes his build unique, I guess?

Just popping in to say that…

Weapon Strength 1100.00
Power: 2500.00
Crit Chance: 0.50
Crit Damage: 1.20
Damage Mods: 1.75
Coefficients: 1.00

Base DPS: 1847.72

Total DPS: 2956.36

with 10% more damage mod…

Total DPS: 3251.99

how much Might is needed to equal this dps?

8 stacks = 3240
9 stacks = 3275

It’s very debatable in a PvP / WvW scenario that you will get 8-9 stacks of might from FGS consistently enough to make it better without strength or hoelbrek runes.

But above you can see I used hypothetical stats for each build (2500 power which isnt a real number and crit chance 50% which isn’t accurate either) if you would like I can calculate DPS for each build if you provide me with the accurate unbuffed base Power / Crit chance / crit damage for each.

Cygnus.6903:

About DotE versus AoO, when you don’t apply regular bleeds, it is a waste to take AoO. Often, DotE is better then AoO anyway, as many classes run 4+ boons. On my Sword/Shield build I do take it because I am almost guarantueed to have a bleeding target.

Switching out a sigil is not worth it IMO, as the sigils I chose have a very distinct purpose and they function that much better when combined.

Yeah, I figured the same. If we’re wrong on that, we’re wrong together. (Between you and me, I’m pretty sure we’re right).

NikeEU.7690:

But above you can see I used hypothetical stats for each build (2500 power which isnt a real number and crit chance 50% which isn’t accurate either) if you would like I can calculate DPS for each build if you provide me with the accurate unbuffed base Power / Crit chance / crit damage for each.

Wow, thanks for this! Saved me a bunch o’ time.

Could you run it again using +200 power and the +10% gs trait on the one hand, and +9.5% crit chance and the FGS trait on the other to see how much extra might is needed for the former to match the latter?

Also, to be clear, your 1.2 crit damage number is +1.2 not x1.2, right? As in, 220%? If so, that’s about in line with the builds we’re talking about. The other variables are gear selection, so can be ignored for the calc. Thanks again.

Base stats

Weapon Strength 1100.00
Power: 2500.00
Crit Chance: 0.50
Crit Damage: 1.20
Damage Mods: 1.00
Coefficients: 1.00
Base DPS: 1057.69

Total DPS: 1692.31

4 in Str

Weapon Strength 1100.00
Power: 2700.00
Crit Chance: 0.50
Crit Damage: 1.20
Damage Mods: 1.10
Coefficients: 1.00
Base DPS: 1256.54

Total DPS: 2010.46

4 in Arms with 9 Might

Weapon Strength 1100.00
Power: 2770.00
Crit Chance: 0.60
Crit Damage: 1.20
Damage Mods: 1.00
Coefficients: 1.00
Base DPS: 1171.92

Total DPS: 2008.68

Conclusion: if all you care about is offense, I would say the 4 in Strength has a fairly good advantage unless you have might duration boosting gear in which case the Arms might be superior since at least some of the FGS Might would carry over into the Hammer set which will boost your Hammer damage by a fair amount.

Thanks Nike, that’s awesome.

The base might duration from FGS is only 5s, and with Hoelbrak runes that works out to 6.5s.

The only way someone’s going to get 9 stacks of might within 6.5 seconds is by cleaving multiple targets with 100 blades, and they’d have to maintain it throughout combat to match the dps of the Slashing Power route.

Some might will undoubtedly carry over to the hammer skills but, realistically, it’s not going to be more than a few stacks for a few seconds.

So if I read this correctly, should you get 9 stacks of might, the DPS is actually the same? Only higher crit chance means more consistent damage whereas higher flat modifiers means higher burst…

Honestly, after these calculations, which I am sure are correct, even having only 5 stacks of might from FG totally beats going 4 into strength, even if you want to focus on offense. Don’t forget that Arms also gives you more Fury (which boosts crit chance and thus damage even further) and that the Slashing Power trait is absolutely useless when switched to hammer. Whereas FG still provides extra damage, even if it is a small and temporary increase.

And then there is the cooldown reduction. And the crit chance on Earthshaker and Arcing slice.

Fun fact; after the expansion, all this does not matter as everybody will go into Strength and pick up both

The dps is the same only when you can maintain 9 stacks of might through FGS (no other sources). To do that, you need to maintain an average of nine crits on your gs per 6.5s throughout combat.

The might from FGS does help your hammer a bit, but not as much as you might think. A few stacks for a few seconds at most, and it won’t be nearly as much as you’re losing by not maintaining the 9 stacks from FGS while on your gs.

The extra Fury you get in your line is only 10s. That’s one extra Arcing Slice than you’re presently using to maintain it all the time, and keep in mind that my build has 100% uptime without using AS due to rune choice.

To each their own, of course, but dps wise the Arms route is inferior to the Strength route between these builds. The Arms route is a bit better for mobility (shorter cooldowns) and you can output a tonne of group might if you combine it with Phalanx (I’ve never managed find an optimal place for it though).

After the expansion… yes, that will be phenomenal. They really did the gs a solid with that… and shield, it got some serious love too.

Choppy.4183:

The dps is the same only when you can maintain 9 stacks of might through FGS (no other sources). To do that, you need to maintain an average of nine crits on your gs per 6.5s throughout combat.

The might from FGS does help your hammer a bit, but not as much as you might think. A few stacks for a few seconds at most, and it won’t be nearly as much as you’re losing by not maintaining the 9 stacks from FGS while on your gs.

The extra Fury you get in your line is only 10s. That’s one extra Arcing Slice than you’re presently using to maintain it all the time, and keep in mind that my build has 100% uptime without using AS due to rune choice.

To each their own, of course, but dps wise the Arms route is inferior to the Strength route between these builds. The Arms route is a bit better for mobility (shorter cooldowns) and you can output a tonne of group might if you combine it with Phalanx (I’ve never managed find an optimal place for it though).

After the expansion… yes, that will be phenomenal. They really did the gs a solid with that… and shield, it got some serious love too.

I don’t know man, just looking at the numbers, Strength seems to have only a slight edge.

About the might stacks carrying over to hammer, you can also say Slashing Power is only a 5% overall DPS boost (provided you spend an equal amount of time on both weapons. 5% damage is more like 5 stacks of might, which you can actually maintain on GS and it carries over a bit to hammer, so that already shows the DPS difference is smaller then you would think.

And having to use either Arcing slice or Pack runes to get more fury is still a disadvantage, as you will be losing out on condition reduction.

The cooldown reduction is not only better for mobility, you can sometimes squeeze out an additional Whirlwind while using your GS (when you open with it you can use it again 8 seconds later, which is a common time to spend on one weapon, whereas 10 seconds is a lot longer, 25% to be exact). These flow of battle differences also impact DPS.

It’s an interesting discussion and obviously both have pro’s and cons.

And yes, after the xpac, we won’t be talking about this. Although I feel warriors actually get shafted when you look at some of the treats other classes are getting. We still don’t know everything off course though, so let’s wait and see I guess.

Honestly, the best thing you can be doing for your DPS, especially if you go into Arms for FGS, is use Might stacking runes and sigils. Sigil of Battle even in nerfed form is so overwhelmingly more powerful than any other sigil in conjunction with Fast Hands and Might duration runes that it seems criminal not to use it.

Now, I don’t know your builds if you use Melandru runes (I think Shin does) but if you can get the Toughness from a few pieces of Cavaliers instead of berserker or the condi reduction from food you should really think about it swapping it around to focus on Might stacking a bit more. If the condi-reduction of melandru is irreplaceable it is what it is, but I would be inclined to do whatever I could to use a Might stacking runeset and sigil of battle in a build using Forceful GS.

Yes the whole idea for going FG is to carry that might to another set.

With the might nerf, FG really got a hit since it already gives a low duration might, 5s gets dropped really quick unless going Strength/Hoelbrak, and made Slashing power even better.

But still in the “perfect scenario” i hit my opponent with Final Thrust with 22 stacks of might (+660 power VS +770 power pre nerf) , if he got any kind of AI it gets even better, and since I’m not using a hammer but sword, no need for MH also 5 in arms gives me that +10% damage back with almost perma bleed thanks to Sword AA + Precise Strikes .

I think the might stacking could would work with Juba’s gs/s build (leads into Final Thrust) or an Eviscerate from an axe. A sword is probably the best choice to pair with it, not just because of FT but also because it goes so well with Arms generally. You can justify putting in the extra point for Attack of Opportunity, and Flurry supports the gs as well as FGS supports Final Thrust. Plus the ridiculous mobility.

But with a mere 5s base from FGS you’re not going to keep that might for much longer after swap… maybe only 3s after having cleaved a bunch of people with 100b immediately before, so you need to hit that burst quick. For that reason, you’re not going to get a huge amount of gain when paired with a hammer, imo.

Again, I’m not saying it’s a dog, I actually think it’s a very good build. But I believe the numbers bear out that Str is more optimal than Arms in an h/gs pairing.

As for conditions, my build actually has better management than yours only because I have Lemongrass as the food whereas you have omnomberry. I pesonally think you’d be better off running Fried Golden Dumpling though for the extra might and boon duration buff.

I agreed from the top that the CD reduction is good, but it’s not much of a dps gain for the gs, to be honest. It’s more utility. And Slashing Power certainly doesn’t help the Hammer at all, but the 200 extra power plus an intelligence rune sure does!

Also, I downed three guys via one Reckless Dodge last night! 2.5-3k each!

Definitely agree on FG working better with a set that has one high damage skill, like Sword or Axe. Problem is, in my opinion, both these weapons are inferior in outnumbered situations. Honestly, Sword/GS feels more and more gimmicky, as anything with half a brain will know when to use a utility to cleanse the immobilise. Axe is just so telegraphed, again, anything with half a brain will dodge the Obvious evis, especially combined with Intelligence.

Whereas Hammer provides AoE stun, which means they will do nothing but eat damage while your Healing Signet keeps you alive. If you manage a good CC chain, you will essentially be fighting 1v1 (in a 1v2) if you can lock one person down, as far as incoming damage goes.

However, you will still receive incoming damage, because you are a warrior. This is why I think having some degree of toughness, wether it is from Melandru or cavalier/knight’s, is not a luxury on warrior. Sure, Zerk will net you slightly higher crits, but the difference is less notable in outnumbered fights.
Same goes for the Ghost food. The life steal helps tremendously with regening back our HP, which is in fact what a warrior needs to do to stay in a fight.

The fried dumpling food is new to me, I should try to keep track of new foods a little better (like the one I use on my Sword/GS build).
Do the boonduration and might duration from my runes apply to the might on crit as well?

I think we can agree on a lot of things and my conclusion is that DPS wise, Strength does have an advantage, however small this may be. Arms, with more utility and DPS consistency remains superior in my opinion.

With the coming changes i think we will drop lemongrass food and Strength runes will be a thing , fried dumpling (imagine +65% might duration + extra might stacks) and omnomberry ghost will be seen much more.

Cygnus.6903:

The fried dumpling food is new to me, I should try to keep track of new foods a little better (like the one I use on my Sword/GS build).
Do the boonduration and might duration from my runes apply to the might on crit as well?

Yep, though I really think if you go Strength runes you want Lemongrass to avoid condi hell. But if you ever want to yolo strength runes, + fried dumplings would be 8.25s might stacks from GS crits.

NikeEU.7690:

Yep, though I really think if you go Strength runes you want Lemongrass to avoid condi hell. But if you ever want to yolo strength runes, + fried dumplings would be 8.25s might stacks from GS crits.

And two might from every crit. Combine that with Phalanx Strength in a party with someone else providing condi clear and… wow.

@Cygnus
You just described exactly why I moved from gs/a+sh to gs/h, though zerk still works well enough for me , personally. Still, the axe is very effective… possibly better in 1v1 situations unless the person doesn’t know how to dodge hammer (axe auto is insane), but definitely inferior in outnumbered situations.

As for sword, I actually run a different trait layout with a warhorn and gs that has insane mobility and works pretty well in disorganized group fights but, yeah, I personally have to go back to h/gs in more serious fights or when I need to speed flip camps (30s). I haven’t tried it with the might stacking though.

Right, so I logged on and bought the food. Build is the same (hoelbrak), but I swapped sigils on the GS to battle and Strength. The result is pretty hilarious.

The food gives 7,5 seconds, FG gives 7,5 seconds, Sigil of Strength gives 15 seconds and battle 30. SoR gives 5 stacks for ~40 seconds as well. At one point, i was fighting a pve warrior who ate my Full hundred blade combo. And without the battle sigil, I went up to 24 stacks of might…

Fun stuff.

LOL yeah the fried dumpling food was new to me too. I saw it in a YouTube vid last week. Bought a stack to play with and its crazy on my warrior. Using Forceful Greatsword plus sigil of strength on the GS plus this food and Hoelbrak runes makes for some crazy might stacking,

When the new content drops, a Strength-Tactics-Discipline build running FGS, might sigils, runes, and food along with Phalanx Strength could be a hilarious (and viable) might generating machine. XD

Something like this, maybe: http://dulfy.net/gw2traits#build=AggB5ARcBbQ~

Wouldn’t be the most optimal solo, of course. But you’d become the Oprah Winfrey of might stacks with allies around you…. “You get might stacks, and YOU get might stacks, and YOU get might stacks…. EVERYBODY GETS MIGHT STACKS!”

Might be awesome. <yuk yuk>

Choppy.4183:

When the new content drops, a Strength-Tactics-Discipline build running FGS, might sigils, runes, and food along with Phalanx Strength could be a hilarious (and viable) might generating machine. XD

Something like this, maybe: http://dulfy.net/gw2traits#build=AggB5ARcBbQ~

Wouldn’t be the most optimal solo, of course. But you’d become the Oprah Winfrey of might stacks with allies around you…. “You get might stacks, and YOU get might stacks, and YOU get might stacks…. EVERYBODY GETS MIGHT STACKS!”

Might be awesome. <yuk yuk>

This made me lol ^^