Guild Wars 2

so the meta hammer build

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-s;4NKkP0e4NL-60;9;59T-T;13;0189;125An-FAC;16TsW6TsWh-kc0-gYO0;1wV1X6Y9ZH4Ma2i-HV1a;9;9;9;9;9;9;14-6k

after Dec 10 patch will be transformed to this

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=Vt;4NKkP0e4NL-60;9;5JT-J;153-189;125-n;56TsW6TsWh-kc0;6wV1X6Y9ZH4Ma2i-HV1aN

what will you loose ?

• 10% crit damage from traits (global)
• 10% Burst damage from Burst mastery (global burst)
• 20% earth shaker nerf (hammer burst)

earth shaker Dec 10 damage = (-10% crit damage (-10% Burst damage(-20% earth shaker)))

so if your earth shaker crit damage now is 4000 after the patch it will be 2592.

a 35% nerf

just gonna throw this out there but your maths is way off.
10% increase in dmg is a 9.1% decrease
20% dmg is a 16.66% decrease
Just going to assume lets say a 50% CD? add that to a 50% base, that means crits do 100% dmg, so lets assume you go from 100 to 90 CD, its a 5% decrease in dmg (1.9/2)

anyways formula goes like
1x 1.052 × 1.1 x = 1.15789
.8/1.15789=.69 or 31% decrease

God, i made so many mistakes, someone should make sure my maths isnt off D;

Yes. Staggering blow/earth shaker are being hit heavily. The reason stated was, “We don’t mind warrior doing big damage. We don’t mind them doing massive Cc..we just don’t want them to do both easily.”

The irony being all major lvl bosses are defiant/unshakable. Hell, theire is even add’s in HoTW that aren’t bosses and they are immune to CC…so basically against any type of over size or boss target in PvE..you’ve been nerfed hard. Be glad you never invested in the juggernaut on warrior..cause it is soon to become a near obsolete weapon in dungeons/fractals.

A lot of the hate towards hammer came from WvW and PvP. WvW is a fair source to get feedback from. PvP has a population of o.5%..so not exactly a large crowd of people to base a nerf off..especially one that is not a mere shave.

I forgot to add..I play axe sometimes and invest heavily in burst mastery for it. This nerf also affects axe users adversely..for the simple reason they wanted to separate the damage from the CC on hammer f1.

i totaly agree with that nerf. i maining a warrior (because ranger dont have dmg, cc or anything) you cant have everything but warriors still have the most

McWolfy.5924:

i totaly agree with that nerf. i maining a warrior (because ranger dont have dmg, cc or anything) you cant have everything but warriors still have the most

i totally agree +1

Juba.8406:

so the meta hammer build

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-s;4NKkP0e4NL-60;9;59T-T;13;0189;125An-FAC;16TsW6TsWh-kc0-gYO0;1wV1X6Y9ZH4Ma2i-HV1a;9;9;9;9;9;9;14-6k

after Dec 10 patch will be transformed to this

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=Vt;4NKkP0e4NL-60;9;5JT-J;153-189;125-n;56TsW6TsWh-kc0;6wV1X6Y9ZH4Ma2i-HV1aN

what will you loose ?

• 10% crit damage from traits (global)
• 10% Burst damage from Burst mastery (global burst)
• 20% earth shaker nerf (hammer burst)

earth shaker Dec 10 damage = (-10% crit damage (-10% Burst damage(-20% earth shaker)))

so if your earth shaker crit damage now is 4000 after the patch it will be 2592.

a 35% nerf

the second meta is exactly what I been using for a long time and is perfect. Even after the nerf hammer will still be good.

@OP , if you want to understand why Anet nerfs this you need to go and play a different profession in sPvP and fight against these kind of warriors.

Then you will understand.

lvis.3824:

@OP , if you want to understand why Anet nerfs this you need to go and play a different profession in sPvP and fight against these kind of warriors.

Then you will understand.

i play thief and ele and i find ranger necro and engis more annoying then a warrior with their aoes condi spamming.

I’m fine with taking a damage nerf if it means keeping the sustain that we need to remain viable, I just don’t agree with them nerfing skills that aren’t related to the Hambow build. Burst Mastery is a really useful trait for builds outside of the intended target. Someday Warrior burst could be a popular option but nerfing Burst Mastery hits those kind of builds much harder.

Same with the Combustive Shot change, I’ll still use it for Cleansing Ire but the proposed changes hurts more builds than just Hambow. I like to run GS/LB DPS and that build will take a much bigger hit. Warrior has the most viable builds atm so why would you want to undo that?

I would say scrap changing Burst Mastery and Combustive shot and instead mess with Merciless Hammer’s bonus damage to disabled foes and them make damage nerfs to hammer skills alone. This would reduce the DPS on Hambow without punishing unrelated builds. I like the playstyle of Hambow especially if you make use of the combo fields but the proposed changes make it seem like they want to destroy it rather than toning back the damage.

Nerfs are deserved, I like what they are doing next patch.

Hammer damage was way to high compared to the CC it dealt.

MiLkZz.4789:

Nerfs are deserved, I like what they are doing next patch.

Hammer damage was way to high compared to the CC it dealt.

Why are they not nerfing Fear on necros too ?

Unblockable.From range.Instant.Does damage.No animation.

MiLkZz.4789:

Nerfs are deserved, I like what they are doing next patch.

Hammer damage was way to high compared to the CC it dealt.

Most aren’t complaining about the hammer damage nerf though, it’s the nerf to non-hammer traits and skills that I disagree with.

After the nerf, hammer will only be good for PvP/WvW… Just make the PvP damage different from the PvE damage like with the Axe 5 skill. Hammer and mace are supposed to be CC-based weapons but there aren’t many mobs in PvE that are meaningful to use them on. All the PvE boss mobs are immune to CC without ripping off lots of Defiant stacks first or the CC is not worth the damage trade when they stand still and can get hit for oodles more damage by Hundred Blades. Doesn’t it get repetitive using GS all the time in PvE? Or add new weapon types that can compete with GS melee PvE damage.

Arnekun.6170:

\Or add new weapon types that can compete with GS melee PvE damage.

Axe says hi. And no, i don’t mean the shower gel. Olny hb is strong on gs in terms of dps anyway, rest is meh

mini.6018:

MiLkZz.4789:

Nerfs are deserved, I like what they are doing next patch.

Hammer damage was way to high compared to the CC it dealt.

Why are they not nerfing Fear on necros too ?

Unblockable.From range.Instant.Does damage.No animation.

because Fear doesn’t output excessive amount of damage compare to Earthshaker, that’s why.’

Would you say a snowball is the same as a rock?

(snowball-Fear) same (rock-Earthshaker)??

Fear
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVMmrlZWjPc

vs

Earthshaker
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZVLkgs-Hvw

Scoobaniec.9561:

Arnekun.6170:

\Or add new weapon types that can compete with GS melee PvE damage.

Axe says hi. And no, i don’t mean the shower gel. Olny hb is strong on gs in terms of dps anyway, rest is meh

Axe is great if ur specced to burst and only fighting one mob but otherwise it’s not that great when you can use HB to hit multiple mobs and Rush on a single mob(which does moderately good burst damage and doesn’t take much longer to cast at point blank than an axe leap) and if you get them in a corner or against the wall and cast whirlwind so that you spin in place, giving them the full brunt of Whirlwind dishes out about 1/3rd of Hundred Blade’s total damage in less than half the time and hits multiple mobs too.

If you’re not specced to either burst nor greatsword traits, you’ll still most likely get a lot more damage from Greatsword. If you are specced to GS, then the stacks of might you get from hitting stationary PvE mobs and especially crowds can reach like 15+ stacks with Signet of Rage and Great Justice. If the enemies moved around a lot, spread out from each other, frequently blocked attacks, or behaved like players, the burst from axe would probably be better, but the fact that they just crowd together, stand there, and take everything easily makes GS the most faceroll melee PvE weapon.

Arnekun.6170:

Scoobaniec.9561:

Arnekun.6170:

\Or add new weapon types that can compete with GS melee PvE damage.

Axe says hi. And no, i don’t mean the shower gel. Olny hb is strong on gs in terms of dps anyway, rest is meh

Axe is great if ur specced to burst but otherwise it’s not that great when u can use HB and Rush (which does moderately good burst damage and doesn’t take much longer to cast at point blank than an axe leap) and if you get them in a corner or against the wall and cast whirlwind so that you spin in place, giving them the full brunt of Whirlwind dishes out about 1/3rd of Hundred Blade’s total damage in less than half the time.

If you’re not specced to either burst nor greatsword traits, you’ll still most likely get a lot more damage from Greatsword.

Um..how to say i completely disagree with what u said here? GS aa is so weak to the point that even hammer has highter dps, the olny weaker weapon (slighty) is mace.

Hb won’t make up for weak aa of gs, while axe aa is about 90% dps of hb on no cd. For some reason i killing stuff much faster with axe than gs (check even my trained 1h sword kills faster), and im not trained for axe by any means.

Scoobaniec.9561:

Arnekun.6170:

Scoobaniec.9561:

Arnekun.6170:

\Or add new weapon types that can compete with GS melee PvE damage.

Axe says hi. And no, i don’t mean the shower gel. Olny hb is strong on gs in terms of dps anyway, rest is meh

Axe is great if ur specced to burst but otherwise it’s not that great when u can use HB and Rush (which does moderately good burst damage and doesn’t take much longer to cast at point blank than an axe leap) and if you get them in a corner or against the wall and cast whirlwind so that you spin in place, giving them the full brunt of Whirlwind dishes out about 1/3rd of Hundred Blade’s total damage in less than half the time.

If you’re not specced to either burst nor greatsword traits, you’ll still most likely get a lot more damage from Greatsword.

Um..how to say i completely disagree with what u said here? GS aa is so weak to the point that even hammer has highter dps, the olny weaker weapon (slighty) is mace.

Hb won’t make up for weak aa of gs, while axe aa is about 90% dps of hb on no cd. For some reason i killing stuff much faster with axe than gs (check even my trained 1h sword kills faster), and im not trained for axe by any means.

GS is still way better with crowds and that’s what most dungeons throw at you and axe AA does more than GS AA but doesn’t do that much damage compared to HB from what I see.

Arnekun.6170:

Scoobaniec.9561:

Arnekun.6170:

Scoobaniec.9561:

Arnekun.6170:

\Or add new weapon types that can compete with GS melee PvE damage.

Axe says hi. And no, i don’t mean the shower gel. Olny hb is strong on gs in terms of dps anyway, rest is meh

Axe is great if ur specced to burst but otherwise it’s not that great when u can use HB and Rush (which does moderately good burst damage and doesn’t take much longer to cast at point blank than an axe leap) and if you get them in a corner or against the wall and cast whirlwind so that you spin in place, giving them the full brunt of Whirlwind dishes out about 1/3rd of Hundred Blade’s total damage in less than half the time.

If you’re not specced to either burst nor greatsword traits, you’ll still most likely get a lot more damage from Greatsword.

Um..how to say i completely disagree with what u said here? GS aa is so weak to the point that even hammer has highter dps, the olny weaker weapon (slighty) is mace.

Hb won’t make up for weak aa of gs, while axe aa is about 90% dps of hb on no cd. For some reason i killing stuff much faster with axe than gs (check even my trained 1h sword kills faster), and im not trained for axe by any means.

GS is still way better with crowds and that’s what most dungeons throw at you and axe AA does more than GS AA but doesn’t do that much damage compared to HB from what I see.

My result from testing 3 weeks ago says something different (trained gs vs non trained axe) also axe aa was done just right in time the stun expired, while hb has still need a moment to land last hit. Btw. It is all about high risk vs high reward when its comes hb in pvp.

Scoobaniec.9561:

Arnekun.6170:

Scoobaniec.9561:

Arnekun.6170:

Scoobaniec.9561:

Arnekun.6170:

\Or add new weapon types that can compete with GS melee PvE damage.

Axe says hi. And no, i don’t mean the shower gel. Olny hb is strong on gs in terms of dps anyway, rest is meh

Axe is great if ur specced to burst but otherwise it’s not that great when u can use HB and Rush (which does moderately good burst damage and doesn’t take much longer to cast at point blank than an axe leap) and if you get them in a corner or against the wall and cast whirlwind so that you spin in place, giving them the full brunt of Whirlwind dishes out about 1/3rd of Hundred Blade’s total damage in less than half the time.

If you’re not specced to either burst nor greatsword traits, you’ll still most likely get a lot more damage from Greatsword.

Um..how to say i completely disagree with what u said here? GS aa is so weak to the point that even hammer has highter dps, the olny weaker weapon (slighty) is mace.

Hb won’t make up for weak aa of gs, while axe aa is about 90% dps of hb on no cd. For some reason i killing stuff much faster with axe than gs (check even my trained 1h sword kills faster), and im not trained for axe by any means.

GS is still way better with crowds and that’s what most dungeons throw at you and axe AA does more than GS AA but doesn’t do that much damage compared to HB from what I see.

My result from testing 3 weeks ago says something different (trained gs vs non trained axe) also axe aa was done just right in time the stun expired, while hb has still need a moment to land last hit. Btw. It is all about high risk vs high reward when its comes hb in pvp.

Hmm all right, I’ll go see for myself.

All right I untraited everything and HB hits for 5579, GS AA combo hits for 1895, axe AA combo hits for 3937. I underestimated axe’s dps. I’ll try it out in dungeons.

Fresh made ss in 30/24/0/0/16 (24 in arms to avoid extra dmg on bleeding) no slashing power/axe mastery. Olny forceful gs

Scoobaniec.9561:

Fresh made ss in 30/24/0/0/16 (24 in arms to avoid extra dmg on bleeding) no slashing power/axe mastery. Olny forceful gs

I usually use the Forceful Greatsword and the 10% damage to bleeding foes which does a lot of damage when comboed with Whirlwind and Rush, especially on reduced cooldowns, but Axe does a lot of dmg even untraited so it’s definitely stronger than I thought.

I’ve already started moving away from using my Hammer/Greatsword combo in PvE..goodbye Juggernaut I spent 6 months getting

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

Yes. Staggering blow/earth shaker are being hit heavily. The reason stated was, “We don’t mind warrior doing big damage. We don’t mind them doing massive Cc..we just don’t want them to do both easily.”

The irony being all major lvl bosses are defiant/unshakable. Hell, theire is even add’s in HoTW that aren’t bosses and they are immune to CC…so basically against any type of over size or boss target in PvE..you’ve been nerfed hard. Be glad you never invested in the juggernaut on warrior..cause it is soon to become a near obsolete weapon in dungeons/fractals.

A lot of the hate towards hammer came from WvW and PvP. WvW is a fair source to get feedback from. PvP has a population of o.5%..so not exactly a large crowd of people to base a nerf off..especially one that is not a mere shave.

I agree, one of the biggest problem anet did not do was keep PvE totally separate from WvW/sPVP.

lchan.2169:

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

Yes. Staggering blow/earth shaker are being hit heavily. The reason stated was, “We don’t mind warrior doing big damage. We don’t mind them doing massive Cc..we just don’t want them to do both easily.”

The irony being all major lvl bosses are defiant/unshakable. Hell, theire is even add’s in HoTW that aren’t bosses and they are immune to CC…so basically against any type of over size or boss target in PvE..you’ve been nerfed hard. Be glad you never invested in the juggernaut on warrior..cause it is soon to become a near obsolete weapon in dungeons/fractals.

A lot of the hate towards hammer came from WvW and PvP. WvW is a fair source to get feedback from. PvP has a population of o.5%..so not exactly a large crowd of people to base a nerf off..especially one that is not a mere shave.

I agree, one of the biggest problem anet did not do was keep PvE totally separate from WvW/sPVP.

Yup. I am not sure how they would have kept them separate entities, yet the made the whole game feel tightly knitted together..but nerfs are universal at this point (with some exceptions) So things that work well in wvw and pvp still cause havoc in PvE.

As a mostly zerk warrior using hamme/axe+shield for WvW, I do see how the damage from hammer is a little over the top. Especially, versus other glassy players with little to no access to protection.

What I don’t understand is how heavy they are bringing the nerfbat down on hammer dps. Wouldn’t it be wise to tweak the traits that make hammer go over the top instead of.... everything? This almost feels like a knee-jerk reaction and where they nerf hammer dps, they are not buffing the CC since this is suppose to be a CC weapon.

The hammer nerf is REALLY disappointing.

As of right now, Greatsword is superior to Hammer in PvE. I still choose to use Hammer as I love the animations. After the patch the difference between Hammer and Greatsword is going to be so great that it would be extremely inefficient to use Hammer over the other.

I can admit that the Hammer was extremely powerful in PvP and it should be altered, but removing damage isn’t the way to go. It should have some stun/KD/KB (whatever) removed. Or add an ICD to them. Lowering the damage of a weapon that is already relatively low compared to the others is baffling.

To those who were complaining.. where you complaining about being chain stunned or the damage dealt?

Sure the damage was high, but if you ignore the stuns, then any other weapon in the Warriors kitten nal can do that damage and more. It’s the CC effects that were the issue, not the damage it dealt.

Sigh.

I really, really dislike GS.. but I’m practically going to be forced to use it if I want to kill efficiently after patch.

Anet has it wrong.

The problem has never been having CC and damage.

The problem is that Warrior have big damage and CC while wearing a soldiers amulet. Seriously, if you run soldier’s on a warrior you will have almost as much damage as a zerker warrrior. It’s pretty broken. I think zerker hammer is pretty balanced compared to the rest of the meta (s/d thieves/ spirit rangers/ rabid bomb nade engis/dhumfire necros)

Maybe they should forget dmg nerf and do something about cc immunity and survivability. WWW is broken because everybody play warrior and guardian.

Some weapons superior in PvE, others in 1vs1 others in WvW

Deal with it. Or play another class.

Are condition classes complaining that they barely deal damage to bosses? Because they are useless there.

Hammer nerfs are more than deserved, my friend has 3.2k armor and crits 4k with hammer autoattack, 7k backbreakers, 6k staggering blows and 7k earthshakers. And keeps 5 people CCed down.

Yea…balanced? Besides they are only nerfing the damage on 2 skills of the hammer, the CC ones. So that even makes perfect sense.

MiLkZz.4789:

Some weapons superior in PvE, others in 1vs1 others in WvW

Deal with it. Or play another class.

Are condition classes complaining that they barely deal damage to bosses? Because they are useless there.

Hammer nerfs are more than deserved, my friend has 3.2k armor and crits 4k with hammer autoattack, 7k backbreakers, 6k staggering blows and 7k earthshakers. And keeps 5 people CCed down.

Yea…balanced? Besides they are only nerfing the damage on 2 skills of the hammer, the CC ones. So that even makes perfect sense.

Care to explain to me how he keeps 5 ppl cced down with 1 full stun every 10-15 sec and 1 nelee range kb that are both extremely telegraphed?.I teally don’t get how groups of ppl can be so that they can’t deal wiyh 1 warrior.I dind hammer warriors extremely easy to kill ans survive against and i play zerker builds.So many classes even have free blind and perma vigor access and yet they still fail hard.I really don’t understand.

Spvp 2 guards> 2 warriors 5 guards > everything while 5 wars = match lost 100%.Simetimes i wonder if people qqing are playing the same game.

MiLkZz.4789:

Some weapons superior in PvE, others in 1vs1 others in WvW

Deal with it. Or play another class.

Are condition classes complaining that they barely deal damage to bosses? Because they are useless there.

Hammer nerfs are more than deserved, my friend has 3.2k armor and crits 4k with hammer autoattack, 7k backbreakers, 6k staggering blows and 7k earthshakers. And keeps 5 people CCed down.

Yea…balanced? Besides they are only nerfing the damage on 2 skills of the hammer, the CC ones. So that even makes perfect sense.

Care to explain to me how he keeps 5 ppl cced down with 1 full stun every 10-15 sec and 1 nelee range kb that are both extremely telegraphed?.I teally don’t get how groups of ppl can be so that they can’t deal wiyh 1 warrior.I find hammer warriors extremely easy to kill and survive against and i play zerker builds.So many classes even have free blind and perma vigor access and yet they still fail hard.I really don’t understand.

Spvp 2 guards> 2 warriors 5 guards > everything while 5 wars = match lost 100%.Simetimes i wonder if people qqing are even playing the same game.

MiLkZz.4789:

Some weapons superior in PvE, others in 1vs1 others in WvW

Deal with it. Or play another class.

Are condition classes complaining that they barely deal damage to bosses? Because they are useless there.

Hammer nerfs are more than deserved, my friend has 3.2k armor and crits 4k with hammer autoattack, 7k backbreakers, 6k staggering blows and 7k earthshakers. And keeps 5 people CCed down.

Yea…balanced? Besides they are only nerfing the damage on 2 skills of the hammer, the CC ones. So that even makes perfect sense.

O interesing. As a guy with 98 crit damage, 2600 power my eartshaker olny hits 3-4k, maybe 6,5 at best in upscaled. Also keeps 5 ppl cced down? Care to explain the secret?

I guess he use burst mastery and the added crit damage from discipline.

I got sefl buffed 4.2K ap and 70% crit damage/60% crit chance and my F1 hammer skill hit between 3K to 5.5k ish damage.(Maybe 6k on up level.) I don’t use UF.

I don’t use discipline trait so add the 10% from Burst Mastery and 30% more crit damage from the traits point and you should get close to 7k.

The issue with hammer is that everything stack and the worst is UF bonus applying before the hammer hit.

yanoch.7051:

I guess he use burst mastery and the added crit damage from discipline.

I got sefl buffed 4.2K ap and 70% crit damage/60% crit chance and my F1 hammer skill hit between 3K to 5.5k ish damage.(Maybe 6k on up level.) I don’t use UF.

I don’t use discipline trait so add the 10% from Burst Mastery and 30% more crit damage from the traits point and you should get close to 7k.

The issue with hammer is that everything stack and the worst is UF bonus applying before the hammer hit.

Just a question.How do you believe the poster above you reqched 98 crit damage? Idk just asking since it seems you believe he used 0 points in that tree for some reason.

Sorry.

I trying to answer Scoobaniec since he was wondering how the guy that he quoted was able to hit for 7k dam on hammer.

98% is pretty doable I have seen people with more than that. But you have to sacrifice too much for my taste. I personally like to be able to take damage a little.

Good warriors will be buffed on several levels by the next patch

We’re getting more dps out of the defence 25 trait AND more damage on roll, which is great.

They’re just toning down cheesy builds with limited counters – and these counters are getting buffed too!

yanoch.7051:

I guess he use burst mastery and the added crit damage from discipline.

I got sefl buffed 4.2K ap and 70% crit damage/60% crit chance and my F1 hammer skill hit between 3K to 5.5k ish damage.(Maybe 6k on up level.) I don’t use UF.

I don’t use discipline trait so add the 10% from Burst Mastery and 30% more crit damage from the traits point and you should get close to 7k.

The issue with hammer is that everything stack and the worst is UF bonus applying before the hammer hit.

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/warrior/?8.0|2.5n.h2.0.0.0|0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0|1n.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r.1g.7r|3s.0.2s.0.3s.0.2s.0.3s.0.2s.0|0.a4.u29a.0.u38b|15.1|0.0.0.0.0|e

Was a bit wrong on crit dmg, but here it is, a complete build – olny 2 pieces are knight withmelandru runes, rest zerk fully ascended. UF, Merciless, Burst, DotE +25 bloodlust stack and guard wvw bonuses (total +350 power and 250 vit which count to food %) on without might from signet and theres no way i will ever reach the numbers of what he said.

Its ok if he wanted to sound cool, but getting a numbers out of hat is simply lame. If he want to prove me its possible, no problem. Im actually against his noob server in wvw so im waiting for that “7k” crit from es, 4k autos and so on.