Guild Wars 2

Animation is too long and too easily telegraphed. The CD of 15 seconds is too long. It doesn’t make up for the loss of DPS in swords auto attack at all (both power and bleed builds). Overall it is a terrible skill and truly needs to be reworked.

I agree, and most of all it is useless during 50% of the fights sinds your target has to be low on health to deal its “potential” damage.

And to think we lost Leg Specialist for this crap!

Just 2 shot a dude, flurry into final thrust for 10k, dead.

no more QQ just smash stuff

Yup, sadness for the sword and I was actually looking forward to using it.

Do some math. The AA is still doing same dps in power build, and probably more in condition.
Final thrust should only be used on targets below 50%, even in power build.

Ozzrel.9825:

Do some math. The AA is still doing same dps in power build, and probably more in condition.
Final thrust should only be used on targets below 50%, even in power build.

Dude look up the old chain. It obvious you didn’t use sword before this patch. They actually lowered the dps of the chain. All the skills in the chain currently do the same damage. In the old chain final thrust did double the damage of the first 2 skills in the chain (actually a little more than double). The nerf to the sustained DPS can be felt in both condition builds and power builds due to the fact that direct damage is part of each build. The current final thrust is on a 15 second CD. It does not make up for the lost damage.

You do some math. Old chain took 1.75 seconds to execute. Where the third skill did double the damage of the 2 preceding skills. If you could consistently pull off the chain you have to figure out how much damage your losing compared to the old build over a 15 second period. I am not doing the math for you (your previous statement indicates your good at it). I will tell you this we lost sustained DPS in this change and quite a bit of it.

to add insult to injury the thief auto attack chain still does double the damage on the third hit (actually the power coefficient is higher on Crippling Strike than the rest of the chain so it more than double) Cripples for 2 seconds and weakness for 2 seconds. Mind Spike does not cripple or weaken and doesn’t do double the damage of the 2 preceding skills in the chain. However, it rips boons and does 50% more damage to targets without boons.

Does this all seem really balanced to you? Does it even make sense?

I am not interested in some frivolous argument. The math is there and anybody who understands what just happened would realize we just got a sustained damage nerf on sword. Truly hilarious.

TheGuy.3568:

Ozzrel.9825:

Do some math. The AA is still doing same dps in power build, and probably more in condition.
Final thrust should only be used on targets below 50%, even in power build.

Dude look up the old chain. It obvious you didn’t use sword before this patch. They actually lowered the dps of the chain. All the skills in the chain currently do the same damage. In the old chain final thrust did double the damage of the first 2 skills in the chain (actually a little more than double). The nerf to the sustained DPS can be felt in both condition builds and power builds due to the fact that direct damage is part of each build. The current final thrust is on a 15 second CD. It does not make up for the lost damage.

You do some math. Old chain took 1.75 seconds to execute. Where the third skill did double the damage of the 2 preceding skills. If you could consistently pull off the chain you have to figure out how much damage your losing compared to the old build over a 15 second period. I am not doing the math for you (your previous statement indicates your good at it). I will tell you this we lost sustained DPS in this change and quite a bit of it.

to add insult to injury the thief auto attack chain still does double the damage on the third hit (actually the power coefficient is higher on Crippling Strike than the rest of the chain so it more than double) Cripples for 2 seconds and weakness for 2 seconds. Mind Spike does not cripple or weaken and doesn’t do double the damage of the 2 preceding skills in the chain. However, it rips boons and does 50% more damage to targets without boons.

Does this all seem really balanced to you? Does it even make sense?

I am not interested in some frivolous argument. The math is there and anybody who understands what just happened would realize we just got a sustained damage nerf on sword. Truly hilarious.

What the heck play style are you using?

Billy.1879:

TheGuy.3568:

Ozzrel.9825:

Do some math. The AA is still doing same dps in power build, and probably more in condition.
Final thrust should only be used on targets below 50%, even in power build.

Dude look up the old chain. It obvious you didn’t use sword before this patch. They actually lowered the dps of the chain. All the skills in the chain currently do the same damage. In the old chain final thrust did double the damage of the first 2 skills in the chain (actually a little more than double). The nerf to the sustained DPS can be felt in both condition builds and power builds due to the fact that direct damage is part of each build. The current final thrust is on a 15 second CD. It does not make up for the lost damage.

You do some math. Old chain took 1.75 seconds to execute. Where the third skill did double the damage of the 2 preceding skills. If you could consistently pull off the chain you have to figure out how much damage your losing compared to the old build over a 15 second period. I am not doing the math for you (your previous statement indicates your good at it). I will tell you this we lost sustained DPS in this change and quite a bit of it.

to add insult to injury the thief auto attack chain still does double the damage on the third hit (actually the power coefficient is higher on Crippling Strike than the rest of the chain so it more than double) Cripples for 2 seconds and weakness for 2 seconds. Mind Spike does not cripple or weaken and doesn’t do double the damage of the 2 preceding skills in the chain. However, it rips boons and does 50% more damage to targets without boons.

Does this all seem really balanced to you? Does it even make sense?

I am not interested in some frivolous argument. The math is there and anybody who understands what just happened would realize we just got a sustained damage nerf on sword. Truly hilarious.

What the heck play style are you using?

……….I don’t even understand your question?

The animation is too long that it feels clunky, and the cooldown is way too high. It’s impractical and difficult to use. Also it’s a skill that relies heavy on CC to be able to land it.

Well if you’re a power build you should be to distracted by the big crits final thrust gives, if you’re condition damage your auto attack his likes a wet noodle and should be happy your bleeds get applied faster.

The most obvious animation award is stripped from “Bull’s Charge” and is give too…… drum roll…… FINAL THRUST!

Congratulations! With this, people will dodge most Warrior attacks even more! applause all around

TheGuy.3568:

Old chain took 1.75 seconds to execute.

Old chain took about 2.6sec, then new is ~1.9sec.

Ozzrel.9825:

TheGuy.3568:

Old chain took 1.75 seconds to execute.

Old chain took about 2.6sec, then new is ~1.9sec.

Old one was 2.5m but yah new one is 1.9. Overall the dps is higher in a power build due to the new speed even if the 3rd hit is lower damage.

BTW Final Thrust hits just as hard as a level 3 Eviserate so i don’t know why you guys are complaining about the damage. I do agree it could be a little faster.

I really like it. Granted it is a bit slow but compared to any other spike skill warrior has it’s fast. I hit a thief for 7k crit under half health and I have very close to no bonus crit damage. pair it with mace and you have a great set up. able to knockdown for good damage(usually hits single target twice for me) able to add vulnerability and then bam final thrust.

if I immobilize somebody more often than not it hits and it hits hard.

Once again, someone speaks out about a change in weapons but doesn’t full understand how to use it. When will the mindless "roll face across the keyboard and win" mentality disappear?

It still hits hard above 50% health and awards you further hitting them below 50% health. Just be smart in timing it. Sure you will miss it a few times but when haven’t you ever missed an attack? Should I complain that I can’t land backbreaker 100% of the time because of the televised animation? Hell no, because when I do land it, it’s golden.

0/0/30/20/20 Sword/Shield and Hammer. Loving the patch and loving the new final thrust. Wakittenting people for over 5-6k with it consistently on crits with my build with like 3100 armor, 26k+ hp, etc.

Only thing really disappointing is how Cleansing Ire doesnt cleanse until your burst lands, needs to trigger the moment you activate. Before the animation. But that wont happen bc of the easymode hand holding we STILL have at being able to miss a burst and keep the adrenaline. lolz (very e-sport worthy)

Time the Final Thrust animation to connection with target (it is definitely more than 3/4 of a second). By rough guess, it’s closer to 1.25s – 1.5s (1 second immobilize expires before the animation completes) so either Final Thrust is bugged or it is suppose to be that bad. Sword swing time (auto-attack) animation is already significantly slower than Axe so the weapon is now basically for Savage Leap (which got buffed further).

Between the Axe nerf and the move of Berserker’s Power, Warriors have seen a major nerf to damage output (~19%+ over time) for any build that wants to have condition removal (not condition reduction via Dogged March/Runes/Lemongrass).

In other words, Warriors just became pigeon-holed in build options. Moving on to one of my other 80s. G’luck everyone – the prediction of September timeline is right on track that I’ll return to Warrior (maybe)

Yeah whoever claimed that the old chain could be completed in 1.75 seconds was WAY off. It was much closer to 3 seconds. The speed of the AA chain has been significantly increased, you can tell easily that it’s much faster if you’ve been using the sword for a while.

I still haven’t gotten to play around much with Final Thrust but so far I’m having a good time with the, IMO, upgraded sword. As my favorite weapon I’m glad it got some love.

It was more like 2sec actualy, it had a very small windup before you could use the chain again, it is just a bit sad condition builds took a hit on the sword, I see a lot of people using it with kick now in PVP for burst damage. :/

The current combo is more like 1.25sec sinds Hamstring has 0 windup, but the damage are rather low and once you reach the 25 bleed stack, wich was totaly possible before, you loose a good chunk of your DPS.

I did some PVP today, and as I expected Savage Leap gets always dodged and it becomes almost impossible to track people in melee unless you are using Leg Specialist or a ranged weapon to slow ennemies down. But again, i’m not a big fan of beeing forced into a trait line I dislike.

So yeah Berserker builds have a silly power spike sword now but, as a condition damage Warrior or Rampager, we actualy lost a lot of DPS and control with Mainhand Sword.

Oh, and sorry for my previous post THEmeltor, I was very angry when I wrote, a lot of BS came out of my mouth because I read your post wrong. Hope you accept my sincere apologies.

I don’t understand why all of our skills have to have some sort of huge downside to them. Why can’t we just have a quick animation? I mean we’re already giving up huge survivability to play as a warrior…why can’t we just do our job well in dealing damage quickly and reliably rather than having these huge windups for each skill?

Other classes get to attack from stealth, get instant cast times for huge damage, get teleports —> instant massive single target damage spells such as backstab or condi applications…

We get massive wind-ups and cooldowns attached to anything that deals more than 500 dmg. I swear playing a warrior is like being a training dummy for an enemy’s ability to dodge or press their low-cd stunbreakers, teleports and stealth.

It’s like they designed this class to be a humanized tutorial for other classes to train in the use of their dodge buttons.

I actually like this skill… kindof… still hit it on accident occasionally expecting hamstring to set up the flurry immobilize. I wish they’d make savage leap a two stage ability, would make slotting leg specialist a decent idea again, or just remove the root from flurry. The ‘setup’ for warriors is getting ridiculous… I have to set up my burst with long duration CC, my long duration CC with short duration CC… I mean, come on.

The chain dps of sword is definitely higher now though the animation looks god awful. The damage of final thrust is enough to make 50% into 10% pretty quickly on glassy targets.

Ambrecombe.4398:

It was more like 2sec actualy, it had a very small windup before you could use the chain again, it is just a bit sad condition builds took a hit on the sword, I see a lot of people using it with kick now in PVP for burst damage. :/

The current combo is more like 1.25sec sinds Hamstring has 0 windup, but the damage are rather low and once you reach the 25 bleed stack, wich was totaly possible before, you loose a good chunk of your DPS.

How exactly was condition sword nerfed? The only attack in chain that didn’t have bleed got faster, so you do the bleeding attacks more often. Looks more like a buff to me.
Also, your seconds must be different from mine, because it isn’t anywhere near 1.25 sec.

Keep QQing about the buffs, I keep rolling my warrior in tPvP. Try landing final thrust like you would land your eviscerate.

Ozzrel.9825:

Ambrecombe.4398:

It was more like 2sec actualy, it had a very small windup before you could use the chain again, it is just a bit sad condition builds took a hit on the sword, I see a lot of people using it with kick now in PVP for burst damage. :/

The current combo is more like 1.25sec sinds Hamstring has 0 windup, but the damage are rather low and once you reach the 25 bleed stack, wich was totaly possible before, you loose a good chunk of your DPS.

How exactly was condition sword nerfed? The only attack in chain that didn’t have bleed got faster, so you do the bleeding attacks more often. Looks more like a buff to me.
Also, your seconds must be different from mine, because it isn’t anywhere near 1.25 sec.

Ok after using the clock on my desk its a bit lower to 2sec, but I should try it out later on fraps, this should be capable to give me the exact time needed between each animations. But no it is not an upgrade, Warriors could already get easely to 25 bleed stacks so if you compare a DPS with 25stack with the old Chain and the new one, you actualy loose DPS. And Final Thrust just doesn’t do enough when you don’t stack power or crit damage to be worth using, so in condition builds it is a pretty useless move that will barely add anything to your DPS considering you aren’t stacking or refreshing any bleeds during the animation time.
Our longest cripple is now on a single target leap, leaving it very exposed to dodge and limit our escape options. No more Hamstring followed by a Savage Leap to take distance from an ennemy. That’s not possible anymore. The only upgrade you get is the synergy between Leg Specialist and Opporunist, again if you don’t take those traits you are pretty limited at controlling your ennemies, and it just doesn’t feel fine sinds sword worked pretty well before the change, there was no reason to do those changes at the first place.

Since people seem to miss my post.

Old chain was 2.5s now its 1.9

Final Thrust has a 1 sec cast time for damage and .7 aftercast for a total of 1.7 delay on the skill.

Puandro.3245:

Old chain was 2.5s now its 1.9

Final Thrust has a 1 sec cast time for damage and .7 aftercast for a total of 1.7 delay on the skill.

The old chain had a higher overall DPS, since the final thrust hit was about x2.5 damage, making it as strong as two and a half regular hits. I used to get something like 430/430/1100. So roughly x4.5 damage every 2.5 seconds. Compare that to the new chain, which is x3 damage every 1.9 seconds

Old Chain: 1 hit worth of damage every 0.55 seconds
New Chain: 1 hit worth of damage every 0.63 seconds

It’s not as big a damage nerf as everyone seems to think , but it is there, 10-12% give or take, for a power build.

I actually like the speedier chain, but the overall DPS is lower. I’d like to see the chain sped up even more, maybe something like 1.7, which would bring it up to 0.56.

Also, final thrust #3 is SLOW as anything, it really needs it’s animation sped up quite a bit. Cooldown of 15s is also a bit high.

Puandro.3245:

Since people seem to miss my post.

Old chain was 2.5s now its 1.9

Final Thrust has a 1 sec cast time for damage and .7 aftercast for a total of 1.7 delay on the skill.

Thx for the information Puandro!

Dand.8231:

Puandro.3245:

Old chain was 2.5s now its 1.9

Final Thrust has a 1 sec cast time for damage and .7 aftercast for a total of 1.7 delay on the skill.

The old chain had a higher overall DPS, since the final thrust hit was about x2.5 damage, making it as strong as two and a half regular hits. I used to get something like 430/430/1100. So roughly x4.5 damage every 2.5 seconds. Compare that to the new chain, which is x3 damage every 1.9 seconds

Old Chain: 1 hit worth of damage every 0.55 seconds
New Chain: 1 hit worth of damage every 0.63 seconds

It’s not as big a damage nerf as everyone seems to think , but it is there, 10-12% give or take, for a power build.

I actually like the speedier chain, but the overall DPS is lower. I’d like to see the chain sped up even more, maybe something like 1.7, which would bring it up to 0.56.

Also, final thrust #3 is SLOW as anything, it really needs it’s animation sped up quite a bit. Cooldown of 15s is also a bit high.

5.5% less damage in a power build than before. But more condi damage until you hit the cap. TBH i like the change. Power builds use sword as a CC weapon to setup their burst on their 2nd weapon or to gap close. Both of those aspects have been improved and now you have a #3 that hits as hard as Eviserate below 50%. Condi builds do more damage now too.

If they adjust the casting time I might actually find Final Thrust useful, rather then a gimmicky unreliable skill. Hopefully they’ll address this.

Sephius.2876:

If they adjust the casting time I might actually find Final Thrust useful, rather then a gimmicky unreliable skill. Hopefully they’ll address this.

That F1 skill is there for a reason…

Puandro.3245:

Dand.8231:

Puandro.3245:

Old chain was 2.5s now its 1.9

Final Thrust has a 1 sec cast time for damage and .7 aftercast for a total of 1.7 delay on the skill.

The old chain had a higher overall DPS, since the final thrust hit was about x2.5 damage, making it as strong as two and a half regular hits. I used to get something like 430/430/1100. So roughly x4.5 damage every 2.5 seconds. Compare that to the new chain, which is x3 damage every 1.9 seconds

Old Chain: 1 hit worth of damage every 0.55 seconds
New Chain: 1 hit worth of damage every 0.63 seconds

It’s not as big a damage nerf as everyone seems to think , but it is there, 10-12% give or take, for a power build.

I actually like the speedier chain, but the overall DPS is lower. I’d like to see the chain sped up even more, maybe something like 1.7, which would bring it up to 0.56.

Also, final thrust #3 is SLOW as anything, it really needs it’s animation sped up quite a bit. Cooldown of 15s is also a bit high.

5.5% less damage in a power build than before. But more condi damage until you hit the cap. TBH i like the change. Power builds use sword as a CC weapon to setup their burst on their 2nd weapon or to gap close. Both of those aspects have been improved and now you have a #3 that hits as hard as Eviserate below 50%. Condi builds do more damage now too.

Sword is not only about to gap close, it could also be used to gap away and by putting Hamstring on the chain and adding cripple on Savage leap you remove some of the combat versatility of the sword. You can still use it as an escape but doing so result in wasting your cripple too. Wich was a tool needed if you didn’t want your foes to catch you back. But please, explain me how is reducing the overall DPS and reducing the number of utilities is seen as an improvement? Ok, if you use a specific offensive gameplay with a special setup, but when it comes to a more defensive gameplay and other variety of builds working around ranged weaponery or not using Leg Specialist and Opportunist you start to see the lack of a good and strong cripple.

Yes now we got a power “variant” of the sword (wich can only be used for a burst), but comeone, do you guys don’t have enough power weapons already? Why can’t they just leave the sword the way it was and keep the Mobility, Control and High sustain DPS and leave the Burst option to Greatsword and Axe (or Rifle).

Ambrecombe.4398:

Puandro.3245:

Dand.8231:

Puandro.3245:

Old chain was 2.5s now its 1.9

Final Thrust has a 1 sec cast time for damage and .7 aftercast for a total of 1.7 delay on the skill.

The old chain had a higher overall DPS, since the final thrust hit was about x2.5 damage, making it as strong as two and a half regular hits. I used to get something like 430/430/1100. So roughly x4.5 damage every 2.5 seconds. Compare that to the new chain, which is x3 damage every 1.9 seconds

Old Chain: 1 hit worth of damage every 0.55 seconds
New Chain: 1 hit worth of damage every 0.63 seconds

It’s not as big a damage nerf as everyone seems to think , but it is there, 10-12% give or take, for a power build.

I actually like the speedier chain, but the overall DPS is lower. I’d like to see the chain sped up even more, maybe something like 1.7, which would bring it up to 0.56.

Also, final thrust #3 is SLOW as anything, it really needs it’s animation sped up quite a bit. Cooldown of 15s is also a bit high.

5.5% less damage in a power build than before. But more condi damage until you hit the cap. TBH i like the change. Power builds use sword as a CC weapon to setup their burst on their 2nd weapon or to gap close. Both of those aspects have been improved and now you have a #3 that hits as hard as Eviserate below 50%. Condi builds do more damage now too.

Sword is not only about to gap close, it could also be used to gap away and by putting Hamstring on the chain and adding cripple on Savage leap you remove some of the combat versatility of the sword. You can still use it as an escape but doing so result in wasting your cripple too. Wich was a tool needed if you didn’t want your foes to catch you back. But please, explain me how is reducing the overall DPS and reducing the number of utilities is seen as an improvement? Ok, if you use a specific offensive gameplay with a special setup, but when it comes to a more defensive gameplay and other variety of builds working around ranged weaponery or not using Leg Specialist and Opportunist you start to see the lack of a good and strong cripple.

Yes now we got a power “variant” of the sword (wich can only be used for a burst), but comeone, do you guys don’t have enough power weapons already? Why can’t they just leave the sword the way it was and keep the Mobility, Control and High sustain DPS and leave the Burst option to Greatsword and Axe (or Rifle).

I’ve always (since the beta) used sword with a power build anyway. I havent had to change my spec really to accommodate the new Final Thrust. All I hope is they make the skill more user friendly.

I’m finding it hard to understand what your problem is, you can still use the sword as a condition weapon— no changes has been made for that. If anything it’s now easier to apply bleeds.

To be honest, Final Thrust at the end of the Auto-Chain was always suspect in my book…it just didn’t fit.

I think the entire sword auto-chain needs revamping, but Final Thrust should be it’s own skill (maybe lower the CD a bit (12 sec?), but the 50% condition is just fine (maybe cause a condition if extra damage does not land?). They could work on lowering the animation time a bit, but with the potential damage it can cause, it SHOULD be something that is possible to dodge.

Suggestion for sword auto-chain: Bleeding (more stacks) > Cripple (a bit longer than 1s) > Vulnerability (or some other condition that is not OP).
Just my 2 cents.

Sephius.2876:

I’ve always (since the beta) used sword with a power build anyway. I havent had to change my spec really to accommodate the new Final Thrust. All I hope is they make the skill more user friendly.

I’m finding it hard to understand what your problem is, you can still use the sword as a condition weapon— no changes has been made for that. If anything it’s now easier to apply bleeds.

To understand my position you need to know my build first.
20 Strength : II. Restorative Strength, VII. Distracting Strike
30 Arms : III. Deep Wounds, VII. Crack Shot, XI. Furious
20 Discipline : VI. Signet Mastery, XII. Sweet Revenge or X. Mobile Strike

I use Rifle as a primary weapon, and Sword&Shield as backup weapon.
Gear : Full Rampager with 4 Runes of Kraits and 2 Centaure Runes
Utilities : 6. Mending, 7. Balanced Stance, 8. Kick, 9. Fear Me, 0. Signet of Rage

My primary weapon is my Rifle (condi Rifle wtf would you say), use it mostly to start the fight with Brutal Shot, a good Aimed Shot and build around bleeds while adding some extra burst with my Volley. Rifle but when I need an interupt to make my confusion kick in.

When people get to close of me I used to switch to Sword Shield and always kept my leap use my burst skill interupt him with the shield to get an extra stun and confusion stacks. When my root is almost done I used my “Hamstring and used my Savage Leap to get some distance” (<- my problem is over there), switching back to my Rifle.

The problem now with my sword doesn’t come from the fact I loose DPS (with the new distracting strike I actualy deal a lot of damage), it comes from the fact the new Cripple system doesn’t work for my build anymore. I can’t cripple my ennemies anymore with my sword if I want to take distance, I can only cripple them if I leap at them but if I want to loose distance and switch back to my Rifle, I loose a big part of my previous hindering power.

This wouldn’t have been a problem and my build would actualy have been buffed a lot if this switch between Hamstring and Final Thrust hadn’t occured. The burst is just a gimick for power builds to “surprise” people a bit, but sword was never build around dealing only power damage, even if it could deal some tremendeous damage with power before. Axe Mainhand and Greatsword did those job better.

I also have an issue with Final Thrust sinds I basicaly lost some overall DPS to get instead a burst ability that barely makes up for the sustained pressure I could deal before. Sinds I use a Rampager gear the damage done is barely noticable, around 4K to 4,5K damage.

Melee power builds get some nice extra burst on par with a mobility weapon, but any ranged builds get less effective returns out of sword mainhand with the current situation. While the previous one gave a nice extra mobility weapon with a good chain of attack for melee builds and a good utility and mobility weapon for ranged builds.

Thats why I am against this change because it limits its usefullness with ranged weaponery and I believe that one of the selling point of this game was you could play any profession the way you want. Now they contradict themself and say now you play the weapons the way we devs want and force you into a couple of narrow build or you will not get enough out of it.

Changing sword mainhand to its former template would also allow the use of Leg Specialist back with no icd. They only modified it because it would have made the new sword chain too OP and during the balancing process nerfed its usefullness on certain builds like Hammer and Greatsword (and traited Rifle).

So overall i’m not against more options, but when you add some and remove others, it becomes something I can not accept, even worse when it hits one my builds.

Ozzrel.9825:

That F1 skill is there for a reason…

Agreed

Threw a build in the mist together(was not trying to make a top build or anything close, just wanted to prove this concept)

Note; I have 30% condi duration from trait line.

[img]http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3754/9147921520_6f3590f135_z.jpg[/img]

Final Thrust hit while target was still immobilized.(and I usually killed dummy with the heaviest armor with just flurry and final thrust.)

It’s weird that you’re concerned with Hamstring, as you pretty much already have an on-demand Cripple with your Rifle. Swap, shoot, punt or retreat.

Deus Fatorum.2473:

Ozzrel.9825:

That F1 skill is there for a reason…

Agreed

Threw a build in the mist together(was not trying to make a top build or anything close, just wanted to prove this concept)

Note; I have 30% condi duration from trait line.

[img]http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3754/9147921520_6f3590f135_z.jpg[/img]

Final Thrust hit while target was still immobilized.(and I usually killed dummy with the heaviest armor with just flurry and final thrust.)

Why would you FT on a Condi build? I think two Sword 1 swings would deal more damage. Or you’re using Rampager’s or some other hybrid setup?

A bit faster cast time would be nice but bumping the skill range from 130 to maybe 250-300 will help you land it safer IMO

YuiRS.8129:

Deus Fatorum.2473:

Ozzrel.9825:

That F1 skill is there for a reason…

Agreed

Threw a build in the mist together(was not trying to make a top build or anything close, just wanted to prove this concept)

Note; I have 30% condi duration from trait line.

[img]http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3754/9147921520_6f3590f135_z.jpg[/img]

Final Thrust hit while target was still immobilized.(and I usually killed dummy with the heaviest armor with just flurry and final thrust.)

Why would you FT on a Condi build? I think two Sword 1 swings would deal more damage. Or you’re using Rampager’s or some other hybrid setup?

It was slightly hybrid

I’m a bit torn with the changes to be honest. Being a primary Rifle user and Sword&Shield as my secondary. I personally enjoyed having the second on-demand cripple on #3 especially in WvW, Hamstring was quick and often masked as an autoattack before hitting the final chain. This usually made most of my prey incapable of escaping as my Flurry would immobilize, Hamstring would cripple and Savage Leap would gap close if they managed to get away from either.

Unfortunately, with Hamstring being on autoattack chain, this limits it a bit. Given thakittens not an on-demand cripple anymore and if you don’t pull off all 3 hits on an auto, it never executes (and autos reset fairly quickly too). Having cripple on Savage leap isn’t all that beneficial since it rarely meets the distance I need it for and its not that great when its close range already. I don’t mind the extra damage on Final Thrust, its a nice addition, but I’d take cripple over the extra damage it had. Better circumstantial skill of use. I got other weapons if I want to focus on raw power. This is not taking into account its lackluster speed and terrible animation. (It doesn’t even have the same effect as it did when it was on the auto chain)

I was starting to worry I was the only one seeing that kind of stuff, but it is good to see some people using ranged as primary are getting the same issues I have right now.

Final Thrust imo is decent, usually does 6k dmg under 50% health like a mini Evis but what they should have done also was to add 1 stack of Torment together with the cripple from Hamstring. It fits the concept does it not? This way condi warrriors would be happy as well.

The activation timer needs to be lowered. Except that i love the changes to sword. Dusting off my Bolt for its main hand spot for PvE and smaller scale WvWvW.

Only problem i have now is that i have 3 specs now – 1 for PvE (Sword + axe), 1 for small scale PvP and WvWvW (sword + shield) and one for guild WvWvW (hammer)